Breaking news: POC broken arm and tom court called up!

Just heard on talk sport, POC broke his arm during the game, kept on playing through. It's not 100 % sure he's going home but looks likely.. massive massive loss!!!

Tom court straight into squad for rebels as was at home in Brisbane and mako pulled as likely start on Sat, corbs nursing a calf injury

CONFIRMED: POC's out, Parling straight replacement being pulled from the Rebels game and shoot out between Evans and Gray for the bench with Gray in the lead. No noises coming from camp for a replacement, and i don't think we need one TBH, I would still get a flyhalf out now, one injury to sexton or farrell and we are stuffed !

Paul O'Connell i'd say, he looked pretty distraught in the changing rooms after the game, pretty sure he received treatment on his arm just before the end of the game also.

http://www.theroar.com.au/2013/06/23/paul-oconnell-to-leave-lions-tour-with-injury-reports/

Oh dear.

Sorry mpc, just edited thread as your call has been confirmed, its poc!!! One of the worst people to lose, not sure parling should be starting Tuesday now as he's my replacement for poc, is parling/ alun wyn too light weight though ?

Gray and AWJ. You lose some leadership, but remember AWJ was talked up by lots of fans and a number of pundits and former coaches as a potential captain for the tour so he's no slouch in that area himself.

He received treatment during the game but refused to go off.  That was clear on tv.  If I recall, I saw him receive attention to lower forearm/hand a couple of times and was concerned.  Now that's validated, I suppose.  

Why does he have to go home?  The team is in Australia for only two weeks more and I think his presence with the team should be a benefit, no?

Oh crap

at least Parling and Gray are there to step into the breach.

Parling and Gray are pretty good backups though. At least Paul got to win the last two Lions tests he's been involved in and hopefully has helped contribute to a series win.

Twitter says he's not confirmed out YET, still being assessed

oh jesus, this could shift the series a little! POC had a very good game too

We can deal with losing POC more than Australia can afford to lose Horwill

Worst news possible.... I'd rather we lost on sat then O'Connell out.

Gatland will for with parling not gray as I don't think they see jones and gray as a partnership. Parling is poor scrum time and O'Connell is one of our best come the ruck both in steals and controlling possession.

Most of this stuff is confirmed. He is still in Oz and his hand is being assessed, it's worrying but let's not completely go overboard yet.

ChequeredJersey wrote:We can deal with losing POC more than Australia can afford to lose Horwill

 
Horwill isn't out yet

Isn't this typical, the Lions win a game by the skin of their Teeth. And one of the best players get's injured.

Thomond wrote:Most of this stuff is confirmed. He is still in Oz and his hand is being assessed, it's worrying but let's not completely go overboard yet.

will greenward tweeted that pic is going home.

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:

ChequeredJersey wrote:We can deal with losing POC more than Australia can afford to lose Horwill

 
Horwill isn't out yet

Neither is POC, officially

I think I am more worried that we are down 3 LHPs!

If Corbs isn't fit then I worry

Vunipola was poor off the bench - giving away penalties and beaten in the scrum

Grant on the bench? He hasn't impressed on tour.

Tom Court called up over Paul James!?

Ah, I see Court conveniently happened to be in Brisbane!

According to the British & Irish Lions update, POC is still under assessment for an arm injury.  Nothing about him being sent home or suffering a break.  Tom Court is indeed going though to replace Mako Vunipola on the bench on Tuesday due to Corbiserio suffering a calf injury Mako will be starting.

wales606 wrote:Ah, I see Court conveniently happened to be in Brisbane!

It's his home town. He was visiting family following the Irish US tour.

Shame about Corbs and POC picking up injuries. Both were superb on Saturday.

I would want Paul James to replace Corbs for the tests. He would fit in quickly and do the right job.

Fa, you don't become a mainstay of the Tigers tight five whilst being powder puff in the tight. He's not a weak set piece operator by any stretch of the imagination but he is a classic lineout operator and needs to be paired with someone who can add weight and do the enforcer thing. Stepping in for an all round beast like POC is going to be a big ask though, the Lions just don't have a like for like replacement for the Munster man. Parling will at least run the lineout.

Right now Gats may be concerned about the lack of a real enforcer on tour. Parling, Gray and AWJ are all good mobile props but none of them are old school style 4s and we could do with that if Saturday is anything to go by.

formerly known as Sam wrote:
Right now Gats may be concerned about the lack of a real enforcer on tour. Parling, Gray and AWJ are all good mobile props but none of them are old school style 4s and we could do with that if Saturday is anything to go by.

This would have been the perfect opening for Ian Evans if he had managed to continue his 6Ns form in the warm up games 

wales606 wrote:

formerly known as Sam wrote:
Right now Gats may be concerned about the lack of a real enforcer on tour. Parling, Gray and AWJ are all good mobile props but none of them are old school style 4s and we could do with that if Saturday is anything to go by.

This would have been the perfect opening for Ian Evans if he had managed to continue his 6Ns form in the warm up games 

Strange how he tailed off after the season. I thought he was good vs CC and saw a number of others agree but the weakened opposition argument stood against him.

Fine player though POC is I think loss of Corbs is more serious because we have better alternatives at lock e.g. Gray. 

Mako is a good impact sub but I would not be happy with him starting or Court for that matter. Gatland should send for Sheridan now. It is too late for second test but at least he could play in final test.

Interesting Ian Evans is not picked for Tuesday, he is AWJ team mate for club and Country or am I reading the wrong message in the team selection? I think Parling is lightweight so I expect Gray to come in maybe start.

glamorganalun wrote:Interesting Ian Evans is not picked for Tuesday, he is AWJ team mate for club and Country or am I reading the wrong message in the team selection? I think Parling is lightweight so I expect Gray to come in maybe start.

I was thinking similar thoughts.

maestegmafia wrote:

glamorganalun wrote:Interesting Ian Evans is not picked for Tuesday, he is AWJ team mate for club and Country or am I reading the wrong message in the team selection? I think Parling is lightweight so I expect Gray to come in maybe start.

I was thinking similar thoughts.

I think non-selection has completely ruled Evans out - and this is a straight fight between Gray and Parling for a bench spot, or starting if POC is ruled out.

Exiledinborders wrote:Fine player though POC is I think loss of Corbs is more serious because we have better alternatives at lock e.g. Gray. 

Mako is a good impact sub but I would not be happy with him starting or Court for that matter. Gatland should send for Sheridan now. It is too late for second test but at least he could play in final test.

Agree, absolutely about Sheridan.  Never understood why he was not picked in the first place.  If he is good enough to keep Gethin Jenkins on the bench at Toulon, then why not good enough for Lions?

doctor_grey wrote:

Exiledinborders wrote:Fine player though POC is I think loss of Corbs is more serious because we have better alternatives at lock e.g. Gray. 

Mako is a good impact sub but I would not be happy with him starting or Court for that matter. Gatland should send for Sheridan now. It is too late for second test but at least he could play in final test.

Agree, absolutely about Sheridan.  Never understood why he was not picked in the first place.  If he is good enough to keep Gethin Jenkins on the bench at Toulon, then why not good enough for Lions?

We need someone who can do more than just scrummage. Paul James is ahead of Sheridan. Plus Toulon won't release players to the Lions.

maestegmafia wrote:

doctor_grey wrote:

Exiledinborders wrote:Fine player though POC is I think loss of Corbs is more serious because we have better alternatives at lock e.g. Gray. 

Mako is a good impact sub but I would not be happy with him starting or Court for that matter. Gatland should send for Sheridan now. It is too late for second test but at least he could play in final test.

Agree, absolutely about Sheridan.  Never understood why he was not picked in the first place.  If he is good enough to keep Gethin Jenkins on the bench at Toulon, then why not good enough for Lions?

We need someone who can do more than just scrummage. Paul James is ahead of Sheridan. Plus Toulon won't release players to the Lions.

They have no choice. IRB regulations state "The quadrennial British and Irish Lions Tour is a Designated Event and all Players selected to participate shall be released. The Release Period shall ordinarily commence on 1 June and ordinarily conclude on the second weekend of July in the relevant year."

Paul James is behind Gethin Jenkins in Welsh rugby. This is the same Gethin Jenkins who is kept on the bench by Sheridan for Toulon. Why you think Paul James  is ahead of Sheridan I fail to see.

maestegmafia wrote:

doctor_grey wrote:

Exiledinborders wrote:Fine player though POC is I think loss of Corbs is more serious because we have better alternatives at lock e.g. Gray. 

Mako is a good impact sub but I would not be happy with him starting or Court for that matter. Gatland should send for Sheridan now. It is too late for second test but at least he could play in final test.

Agree, absolutely about Sheridan.  Never understood why he was not picked in the first place.  If he is good enough to keep Gethin Jenkins on the bench at Toulon, then why not good enough for Lions?

We need someone who can do more than just scrummage. Paul James is ahead of Sheridan. Plus Toulon won't release players to the Lions.

Look at the end of the match, mate.  Number One priority is to have a prop who absolutely can scrummage on the bench. 
Lions gave away that scrum penalty precisely because of an inability to scrummage by the front row.  And that could/should have been the match.

Gotta get the basics right first, mate.  Then worry about the other things.

I would be happy with Paul James or Sheridan - we're picking between two good options to be honest.

I can't decide what the omission of Ian Evans from Tuesday's line up means for Saturday's. I suspect nothing as the starting locks for Saturday (if POC's hand is truly feiced) will be AWJ and Parling. As has been pointed out, though - against the likes of Kane Douglas, I would be happier with the extra 4 inches in height and 2 stones in weight that Gray would provide over Parling in the scrum, plus his dynamism in the loose. It is, of course, entirely possible that Evans is preferred to Gray on the bench. I think that would be a bit strange (as Evans is very similar to AWJ), but it's completely possible.

Its not POC's hand, its his arm. This is where it happened.
http://www.tubechop.com/watch/1276523

POC will be missed bigtime for the way he hits every ruck and for his work at the breakdown - incredible at turning over ball. Has brains as well, didn't try it on Saturday because he would have been penalised by that ref (as BOD was). Not sure how good AWJ is at calling lineouts, but the combination of Gray & Evans was a disaster.

Sin é wrote:Its not POC's hand, its his arm. This is where it happened.
http://www.tubechop.com/watch/1276523

POC will be missed bigtime for the way he hits every ruck and for his work at the breakdown - incredible at turning over ball. Has brains as well, didn't try it on Saturday because he would have been penalised by that ref (as BOD was). Not sure how good AWJ is at calling lineouts, but the combination of Gray & Evans was a disaster.

May have been due to Best throwing, just in case it slipped your memory.

glamorganalun wrote:

Sin é wrote:Its not POC's hand, its his arm. This is where it happened.
http://www.tubechop.com/watch/1276523

POC will be missed bigtime for the way he hits every ruck and for his work at the breakdown - incredible at turning over ball. Has brains as well, didn't try it on Saturday because he would have been penalised by that ref (as BOD was). Not sure how good AWJ is at calling lineouts, but the combination of Gray & Evans was a disaster.

May have been due to Best throwing, just in case it slipped your memory.

And those two guys standing still, just in case it slipped yours?

glamorganalun wrote:

Sin é wrote:Its not POC's hand, its his arm. This is where it happened.
http://www.tubechop.com/watch/1276523

POC will be missed bigtime for the way he hits every ruck and for his work at the breakdown - incredible at turning over ball. Has brains as well, didn't try it on Saturday because he would have been penalised by that ref (as BOD was). Not sure how good AWJ is at calling lineouts, but the combination of Gray & Evans was a disaster.

May have been due to Best throwing, just in case it slipped your memory.

Exactly. Who was making the calls to throw to the back of the lineout when the hooker is having a mare?

Sin é wrote: Not sure how good AWJ is at calling lineouts,

He has been calling the Welsh and Ospreys lineout for years.

George Carlin wrote:I would be happy with Paul James or Sheridan - we're picking between two good options to be honest.

I can't decide what the omission of Ian Evans from Tuesday's line up means for Saturday's. I suspect nothing as the starting locks for Saturday (if POC's hand is truly feiced) will be AWJ and Parling. As has been pointed out, though - against the likes of Kane Douglas, I would be happier with the extra 4 inches in height and 2 stones in weight that Gray would provide over Parling in the scrum, plus his dynamism in the loose. It is, of course, entirely possible that Evans is preferred to Gray on the bench. I think that would be a bit strange (as Evans is very similar to AWJ), but it's completely possible.

I wouldn't say AWJ and Evans are very similar. In fact I'd say that Evans is more like POC, which is why AWJ and Evans play together at the Os (I.e. AWJ is the 'athletic' lock and Evans is more of an 'enforcer' type, so the O's and Wales go for the two differing types of lock like many teams do including the lions). Still, I'd personally prefer Gray to Evans.

Alomost unbelievable that no-one thinks that Grant can do a decent job. He hasnt looked brilliant but has had two shots from the bench and clearly knew that he had no chance of making the first 23 with Corbs also called up and Rowntree being the scrum coach.

He has enjoyed a fantastic season and if called upon would let no-one down. He can certainly scrummage better than Vuinopolo. But of course Sheridan the man who can scrummage but cant pass would be the better option as he demolished the Australian scrum in 07 for England. Just as Brad Barrett, who has been on a beach for 3 weeks, was a better option than Matt Scott who has been playing outstanding rugby in South Africa these last 3 weeks for Scotland. 

The lack of trust, shown by the coaching staff, in any player from north of the border has gone beyond being aggravating to simply being the normal state of affairs for fans of Scottish rugby.

Very disappointing if POC is out, thought he had a massive game on Saturday and seems to be a real talisman for the Lions. Parling, Gray and Evans are quality players but don't have the presence of the great man.

That's right. Evans and Gray with Warburton and Tipuric in the back row with SOB. Feck it, were one up, let's run at the bar stewards

I think Lydiate will start Glas. The Lions will want to be watertight in defence. They'll play fairly conservatively and try squeeze out a series win.

Parling has played very well this tour and during the six nations before hand, he isnt very flash so isnt much of a fan favourite but he is a very able replacement for POC. Richie Gray when on form is one of the best locks in the world, with his size (6ft 10, 20stone) and athletism he can do things no other lock can do....at the moment however, he is playing averagly by his standards anyway (return from a long injury layoff i think ? ), therefore i agree Tuesday is a straight shoot out and will expect to see both players get 40 minutes each, the best player gets the shirt. 

For the loosehead spot I think sheridan should have been on this tour a while ago, but noone knows scrummaging and sheri better than rowntree and if he thinks Grant is better then i trust Rowntree. Who knows my scrummaging would probably still look good if i had bakkies botha, danie roussow, simon shaw, and carl hayman pushing with me and perhaps after the phil vickery, beast incident they may be loathed to play a big name prop past there best.

http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/oconnell-ruled-out-of-lions-tour-20130624-2orid.html

Feckless Rogue wrote:I think Lydiate will start Glas. The Lions will want to be watertight in defence. They'll play fairly conservatively and try squeeze out a series win.

Tipuric is getting bench for tomorrow's game so might see him at seven. But I agree that tactically the wisest thing to do is contain the wallabies

sirtidychris wrote:Parling has played very well this tour and during the six nations before hand, he isnt very flash so isnt much of a fan favourite but he is a very able replacement for POC. Richie Gray when on form is one of the best locks in the world, with his size (6ft 10, 20stone) and athletism he can do things no other lock can do....at the moment however, he is playing averagly by his standards anyway (return from a long injury layoff i think ? ), therefore i agree Tuesday is a straight shoot out and will expect to see both players get 40 minutes each, the best player gets the shirt. 

For the loosehead spot I think sheridan should have been on this tour a while ago, but noone knows scrummaging and sheri better than rowntree and if he thinks Grant is better then i trust Rowntree. Who knows my scrummaging would probably still look good if i had bakkies botha, danie roussow, simon shaw, and carl hayman pushing with me and perhaps after the phil vickery, beast incident they may be loathed to play a big name prop past there best.

Agree with all of that STC. With Parling withdrawn from the Rebels game, this has turned into an audition for Gray and Evans, both of whom will do a great job regardless of who is chosen. I think it does mean that we need another lock as cover (if we lose someone else, surely we can't just parachute someone in for three days training in what might be a deciding third test) and I'd be happy with Ryan Jones, Joe Launchbury or (for his experience alone) Nathan Hines.

I also agree with Sensisball - I am assuming that any replacement called up for Corbs will just be as bench cover as I'd rather have Grant than anyone listed above. Some of the comments are a bit odd and I can only assume that some people haven't watched him play. He's been a monster this season - he's packed down opposite Northampton, the All Blacks and the Springboks in the past year and matched or bettered them each time.

It also doesn't make sense to rate Adam Jones so highly as a scrummager (which everyone in the world does) and not make a connection between that and his epic tussles with Grant this season where effectively the two completely cancelled each other out - in the last game of the season, even famously earning each player a simultaneous yellow card. Grant's first cap, incidentally, involved him coming on and winning a scrum penalty which Laidlaw duly kicked to beat a SH team away from home. Who was that team? Australia.

If Corbs is out then I think there's a strong case for starting Ryan Grant against Australia and using Vunipola from the bench again. Same rationale upon which Corbs was preferred to Vunipola in the 1st Test - scrummaging nous.

Hopefully Corbisiero will be fit though - I thought he was outstanding in the 1st Test.

Gray vs Evans for the bench slot is going to be a decent tussle. It show that we have outstanding depth at lock, that these two weren't even in the squad for the 1st Test. Two excellent players.