About v2POC is out of the tour - What now
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The v2 Forum :: Sport :: Rugby Union :: International
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POC is out of the tour - What now
by Goosestepper Mon 24 Jun 2013, 2:24 am
First topic message reminder :
http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/oconnell-ruled-out-of-lions-tour-20130624-2orid.html
http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/union-news/oconnell-ruled-out-of-lions-tour-20130624-2orid.html
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by pete (buachaill on eirne) Mon 24 Jun 2013, 4:33 pm
Looseheaded wrote:If we want decent turnover ball at the breakdown then Lydiate is a must, takes the pressure off the 7 to do the tackling and dirty work so they can focus on poaching. His chopping tackles set players up perfectly to be stolen from, whereas Croft whilst a bit quick just isn't a very good flanker. Also SOB could come in at 6 with Heaslip at 8, and we could look to employ the Irish 'keep the player up' tackling and use our scrum as a weapon
I'd prefer to select a 6 who is good at more than just tackling.
Croft, Warbs, Tipuric, SOB all have a number of strengths where as Lydiate is simply just a tackler, he is not that good at anything else in comparison to the others.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by fa0019 Mon 24 Jun 2013, 4:35 pm
Play SA or the ABs and its lydiate every time.
Play AUS and you can afford to be a little more attack minded be it O'Brien or Croft. Its the same with Phillips over Youngs.
Play AUS and you can afford to be a little more attack minded be it O'Brien or Croft. Its the same with Phillips over Youngs.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by GunsGerms Mon 24 Jun 2013, 4:39 pm
Such a shame. After 1/2p I think POC has been the Lions most key player.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by fa0019 Mon 24 Jun 2013, 4:44 pm
His class will show most of all on Saturday.... as we'll see how much his work in the scrum and at ruck time is missed. Colossal player.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by BlueNote Mon 24 Jun 2013, 5:19 pm
He is the sort of guy you wouldn't really fancy lining up against. Parling is a good forward, but I can't see him striking terror in quite the same way.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by glamorganalun Mon 24 Jun 2013, 6:56 pm
POC has benefited from coming back from injury near the end of the season so has not had a long hard season, to his credit he has played really well shame he is out. As I have stated on another post I am not sure about Parling, great in the line out not sure about power, at least Gray or Evans on the bench.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by funnyExiledScot Mon 24 Jun 2013, 7:02 pm
Parling is a technically astute player. Really good work at the rucks and lineout, and knows how to channel maximum power at the scrum. I'd agree that we lose something in terms of physicality and influence with POC missing out, but Parling is playing really well at the moment and his workrate and mobility is if anything a shade better than POC. I'd rather have POC, but of the remaining three I think Parling is the right partner for AWJ.
Gray and Evans are both excellent options for impact from the bench. Both great athletes who can bring some physicality to the party if either AWJ or Parling were to tire.
I don't really rate the Aussie locks either, not even Horwill. I think we're still stronger in the lock department, even with POC missing.
Gray and Evans are both excellent options for impact from the bench. Both great athletes who can bring some physicality to the party if either AWJ or Parling were to tire.
I don't really rate the Aussie locks either, not even Horwill. I think we're still stronger in the lock department, even with POC missing.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by Feckless Rogue Mon 24 Jun 2013, 8:20 pm
I'd go for Gray. I think he's class. If I was an Aussie he'd cause me more worry than any of the other remaining locks.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by maestegmafia Mon 24 Jun 2013, 9:39 pm
pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:Looseheaded wrote:If we want decent turnover ball at the breakdown then Lydiate is a must, takes the pressure off the 7 to do the tackling and dirty work so they can focus on poaching. His chopping tackles set players up perfectly to be stolen from, whereas Croft whilst a bit quick just isn't a very good flanker. Also SOB could come in at 6 with Heaslip at 8, and we could look to employ the Irish 'keep the player up' tackling and use our scrum as a weapon
I'd prefer to select a 6 who is good at more than just tackling.
Croft, Warbs, Tipuric, SOB all have a number of strengths where as Lydiate is simply just a tackler, he is not that good at anything else in comparison to the others.
It is interesting to watch the highlights of last years grand slam when talking about Lydiates impact on matches.
There are a good number of those, "just tackles" resulted immediately in turnovers and try's. he is far more use than just a defender, works well with Warburton too.
He is definitely the kinda guy we need. Croft doesn't make enough impact.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by RubyGuby Mon 24 Jun 2013, 10:27 pm
I think Ianto will be playing alongside AWJ on Saturday 
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by doctor_grey Tue 25 Jun 2013, 2:25 am
O'Connell played much better than I thought he would considering he was still coming back from injury. But, my concern about picking him in the first place was that he would not survive the tour. An older athlete with recent injuries is always a gamble. Shame. This Lions team needs the grunt and steady leadership that a rare bloke like O'Connell can provide.GunsGerms wrote:Such a shame. After 1/2p I think POC has been the Lions most key player.
Parling is a very good player, but is he going to fill the leadership gap? Doubtful. Who is going to push this team forwards?
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by rodders Tue 25 Jun 2013, 9:05 am
Has to be Parling alongside AWJ. He's in cracking form.
I think we'll notice a big difference without O'Connell though - his workrate, leadership and ability to lift the players around him are irreplacable and he is a real focal point for any pack he plays in.
We are blessed with good locks but none quite have O'Connells talismanic presence.
I think we'll notice a big difference without O'Connell though - his workrate, leadership and ability to lift the players around him are irreplacable and he is a real focal point for any pack he plays in.
We are blessed with good locks but none quite have O'Connells talismanic presence.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by doctor_grey Tue 25 Jun 2013, 9:13 am
Firstly, there are no other locks around with that kind of leadership.
The kind of player the Lions need is a Courtney Lawes type. Big, strong, rangy, physical. Would dominate lineouts and hit the breakdown hard.
Not pumping for Lawes here per se, just saying that's the type of player we need. Not many of them, are there? Which is why he is worth England sticking with. Just rein in the aggression a little.
The kind of player the Lions need is a Courtney Lawes type. Big, strong, rangy, physical. Would dominate lineouts and hit the breakdown hard.
Not pumping for Lawes here per se, just saying that's the type of player we need. Not many of them, are there? Which is why he is worth England sticking with. Just rein in the aggression a little.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by bsando Tue 25 Jun 2013, 9:16 am
"Now the Teest beguns!!!" - captain Gatland
I would say AWJ and Gray with Parling or Evans on bench for impact. However, I expect it will be Parling or AWJ starting. I reckon Gray will get the bench spot but will, have to see how players perform today vs rebels.
I would say AWJ and Gray with Parling or Evans on bench for impact. However, I expect it will be Parling or AWJ starting. I reckon Gray will get the bench spot but will, have to see how players perform today vs rebels.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by doctor_grey Tue 25 Jun 2013, 9:18 am
I'd agree. Rather see Gray than Parling in the Test XV.
Parling on the bench, though.
Parling on the bench, though.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by George Carlin Tue 25 Jun 2013, 9:34 am
Okay. Parling. Fine.
Provided he shaves that scraggy ferret from his face, mind.
Provided he shaves that scraggy ferret from his face, mind.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by Guest Tue 25 Jun 2013, 9:39 am
And what's with Parling's ears? I think he put's good old fashioned pink/flesh coloured plasters on his ears which makes them look like Hobbit ears!
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by Guest Tue 25 Jun 2013, 9:41 am
doctor_grey wrote:O'Connell played much better than I thought he would considering he was still coming back from injury. But, my concern about picking him in the first place was that he would not survive the tour. An older athlete with recent injuries is always a gamble. Shame. This Lions team needs the grunt and steady leadership that a rare bloke like O'Connell can provide.GunsGerms wrote:Such a shame. After 1/2p I think POC has been the Lions most key player.
Parling is a very good player, but is he going to fill the leadership gap? Doubtful. Who is going to push this team forwards?
I agree about the injury risk to O'Connell Doc, but wasn't this an acute injury, i.e. not overuse or breakdown over time? If so, then it could just as easily have not happened, or could have happened to a perfectly fit player too. Just bad luck I s'pose.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by lostinwales Tue 25 Jun 2013, 1:01 pm
I was thinking the same Griff - after all the other issues POC has had this injury was just totally random. Tough losing the Lions captain like that.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by RubyGuby Tue 25 Jun 2013, 3:28 pm
Don't worry LostinHeaven we still have BOD
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by lostinwales Tue 25 Jun 2013, 3:47 pm
RubyGuby wrote:Don't worry LostinHeaven we still have BOD
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by RubyGuby Tue 25 Jun 2013, 3:49 pm
You can't beat good leadership, it's invaluable. You only have to look at this years of 6 Nations to see how important these leaders are
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by glamorganalun Tue 25 Jun 2013, 4:02 pm
RubyGuby wrote:You can't beat good leadership, it's invaluable. You only have to look at this years of 6 Nations to see how important these leaders are
Very good G Jenkins and R Jones are not on the tour.
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by RubyGuby Tue 25 Jun 2013, 4:44 pm
C'mon analun - you don't have to be a Captain to be a leader on the field - you know that one
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by doctor_grey Tue 25 Jun 2013, 5:53 pm
Bad luck, that's true. But older athletes, especially those rushing back from injury always have more than their share of bad luck. We se that a lot. When coming back, a person can start compensating for one injury somewhere else. And when one plays in a physical sport and in the very physical manner, the risk goes up. At least O'Connell played the first test. Gethin Jenkins, another about whom I had serous doubts never made it that far. And, for the record, it seemed to me they rushed back and it cost them. On the other hand, I would do just about anything to play for the Lions, even telling the doc an occasional fib about how I feel.Griff wrote:I agree about the injury risk to O'Connell Doc, but wasn't this an acute injury, i.e. not overuse or breakdown over time? If so, then it could just as easily have not happened, or could have happened to a perfectly fit player too. Just bad luck I s'pose.doctor_grey wrote:O'Connell played much better than I thought he would considering he was still coming back from injury. But, my concern about picking him in the first place was that he would not survive the tour. An older athlete with recent injuries is always a gamble. Shame. This Lions team needs the grunt and steady leadership that a rare bloke like O'Connell can provide.GunsGerms wrote:Such a shame. After 1/2p I think POC has been the Lions most key player.
Parling is a very good player, but is he going to fill the leadership gap? Doubtful. Who is going to push this team forwards?
Wouldn't you?
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Re: POC is out of the tour - What now
by RubyGuby Tue 25 Jun 2013, 6:00 pm
"even telling the doc an occasional fib about how I feel."
I take it that would be a fibula then
I take it that would be a fibula then
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