5th Test - Oval, Weds 21st August

First topic message reminder :

With England having won the series, I wonder what changes we will see to the teams.

England
The batting, barring Ian Bell, is misfiring. Too many times batsmen are getting in, but getting out for cameo scores. Prior is struggling a little with bat and gloves, but as the new boy and without a big innings, Jonny Bairstow is most at risk.
The wickets have been shared amongst the bowlers. Onions was unlucky to miss out at Chester-le-Street, but having now broken a finger is ruled out for two weeks. Monty's well publicised indiscretion will not endear him to the management and Steven Finn will probably be left to regain form and confidence with Middlesex. On his own ground, Chris Tremlett may get a run out, especially if they feel that Anderson or Broad need a rest.

all in all I suspect that changes are unlikely.


Australia
The good news is that they may have found an opening pair. The bad news is that the middle order is desperately fragile unless skipper Clarke scores runs. Khawaja and Smith are both batting at least two positions too high and unless he is able to bowl, Shane Watson looks a waste of a spot. Possible chances of recalls for Hughes or Cowan at 3 - and consideration has to be given to Faulkner lower down as an all-rounder.
Bowling has stood up well, but in another horses for course selection we may well see Starc replace Bird. Australia will be desperate for Harris to stay fit.




England have not played very well so far, especially the batters, yet are 3-0 up. Australia have shown they can compete but seem unable to win, even against a faltering team. If England can actually play well we could see a real thumping, but the money men at Ca will hope their team can sneak a win to create interest for the return series.

I've seen some saying he's similar to woakes and wondering why woakes gets all the stick.

It's because he's English. Someone also compared Woakes to Flintoff, so the comparison game is a dodgy one it seems

also though we can't compare as aussie go on the attack early against new players like him where eng just seem to be taking a slow and steady approach.

btw I like the gambit of letting aussie get the high score and probably win in the dead rubber and ensuring Watson and Smith stay selected.  Very sneaky.

That's a cosy job you've got there , Azzy  

Poor b...ers like me have to work all day and then sit up all night making sure England don't do anything silly  

Ah well ...you'll have that problem in three months or so...while I just need to get the inbox clear early in the day...

i'll be sleeping my way through it alfie.

putting two ashes in one year has killed off any interest in the return for me.

it's greed over the health of the players or the interest of the public.  I can't help feeling it'll be a flop up here coming far too soon.

trebellbobaggins wrote:also though we can't compare as aussie go on the attack early against new players like him where eng just seem to be taking a slow and steady approach.

btw I like the gambit of letting aussie get the high score and probably win in the dead rubber and ensuring Watson and Smith stay selected.  Very sneaky.

Think that is an old Australian trick , trebs. They sometimes made a player they didn't rate look really good when they played his county side , in hopes England would select him for the Test team.
Or so it was claimed...

I was thinking that Alfie.   Good we can learn from the best.

alfie wrote:That's a cosy job you've got there , Azzy  

Poor b...ers like me have to work all day and then sit up all night making sure England don't do anything silly  

Ah well ...you'll have that problem in three months or so...while I just need to get the inbox clear early in the day...

I was trying to work out what on earth you were on about, then saw in the corner of my eye where you're from

Never followed an away Ashes while at work. Could be interesting.

I did last time and I was shattered over that whole new year period.

Disappointing end for Root ! No need for that shot , he was going along fine...
Once again Australia are basically just bowling tight and England batsmen are getting out through boredom ...would do better to just accumulate and get into them after tea , when the bowlers will be getting understandably tired.
Very similar to the pattern at Old Trafford. And in fact a couple of other innings this summer. It is one reason why England haven't managed any really big totals , despite apparently being set up to score heavily on occasion.
They will need to rediscover that "grind 'em down " skill in the return series.

trebellbobaggins wrote:I did last time and I was shattered over that whole new year period.

Takes years of practice , trebs  

Lucky I am an Owl , not a Lark.

alfie wrote:

trebellbobaggins wrote:I did last time and I was shattered over that whole new year period.

Takes years of practice , trebs  

Lucky I am an Owl , not a Lark.

yeah I used to be but years of parenting seem to have rewired me.

these days i'm only part time but i'm still up early each day.  this summer it's been me up and him asleep until I drag him up (he's nearly 15 now, typical teenager).

Chucked away by Root in perfect batting conditions. Australia do seem to have worked out a plan that stifles him

and that's a real shame.

Root under no pressure at all and he flunks out again.

you know I just don't think englands batsmen are good enough.  Massive changes needed in this team if they are to compete in aussie or those "England will never win again" doom mongers will get the whitewash they seem to want this winter.

aussie 90-10 to win this now.  cannot see this line-up reaching the follow on.

part of the reason aussie got good totals when batting first was positive batting.  engs is just negative and handing the game away.  poor side.

For God's sake, another 20mins away and Root goes. I am never leaving my desk again*








*obviously a lie but you get my drift

I don't like Root as an opener, he just doesn't look right there in tests to me.

Cook, Trott, KP and Prior all have proven quality with the bat to be fair, its a matter of getting them back on form really.

Bairstow doesn't look the part.

I'd line up for Aus:

Cook
Compton
Trott
KP
Bell
Root
Prior
Broad
Swann
Anderson
Finn/Tremlett

To be fair, when KP is 7 off 31 you know that the oppo are bowling well/the pitch isn't easy to score on.

And I can't see Eng changing Root from opening before Aus, nor going back to Compton. He'll open at the Gabba, whether Bairstow will bat 6 will probably depend on the warm ups though.

Aye, they won't change it or go back to Compton. Just imo Englands best side.

Either that, or KP is in fact struggling with his supposed injury. I think Australia are bowling quite well.

Australia are definitely bowling well. They haven't got a Kerrigan or, to a lesser extent than Kegs, a Woakes that will let the pressure off.

Not the most proactive game England have ever played. They do tend to get very defensive once they're behind

Does anyone reckon that Flower might take a step back from the Test team after the series in Aus? He's done a great job, but bar a ridiculous achievement in India, we do seem to have stagnated a bit in the past 2 years?

It raises a worry for the future Dizzle. Engs bowling options really do look much weaker than Oz with them having a rich seem of young talent and ours looking very poor.

does suggest they are indeed set to dominate for years to come.

JDizzle wrote:To be fair, when KP is 7 off 31 you know that the oppo are bowling well/the pitch isn't easy to score on.

And I can't see Eng changing Root from opening before Aus, nor going back to Compton. He'll open at the Gabba, whether Bairstow will bat 6 will probably depend on the warm ups though.

it looked easy yesterday. once again England prepared a win the toss and win pitch for aussie.  the plonkers.

I think England are still set well for the future, but I do wonder if someone with some new ideas might do the team well in the long run? And if we win again down under what more is there for Flower to achieve in the Test arena?

Also this: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p01fhb6g

Probably not work sensitive to watch!

Credit to Australia , they have bowled well. Not super threatening on a benign pitch , but just not giving anything away.
And when you are chasing nearly 500 it is not as easy to relax and go for it as when you are batting first...
Even so , I would have preferred to see England a little busier. In truth the main attacking gambit has been some rather risky running  
If these two hang around I think we will see an acceleration eventually as the bowlers tire. Though they have about seven bowlers to share the load in this match. And no one doing a Kerrigan  

This from Vaughn

"
"Since Nathan Lyon came into the side at Old Trafford, he had an iffy first innings there and didn't really get an opportunity in the second innings, but he bowled well at Durham and suddenly Australia look like they have nine of their 11 places secure going into the winter - they just need a number six, and a third seamer to go with Harris and Siddle."
"

My god englands plan has been a masterstroke.  the aussies are now totally certain this is the side.

Well there's nothing else to talk about this afternoon. Dreary or what?

trebellbobaggins wrote:

alfie wrote:

trebellbobaggins wrote:I did last time and I was shattered over that whole new year period.

Takes years of practice , trebs  

Lucky I am an Owl , not a Lark.

yeah I used to be but years of parenting seem to have rewired me.

these days i'm only part time but i'm still up early each day.  this summer it's been me up and him asleep until I drag him up (he's nearly 15 now, typical teenager).

Think they are all like that , trebs. My lad is a similar age and we won't see him until midday tomorrow...but weirdly he doesn't like cricket much...waste of good night owl skills  

Think you're going to have to change your top 3 around......

One stinker out of three isn't bad...But all three.........

Sport is supposed to be entertainment..

Long live t20...

alfie wrote:Credit to Australia , they have bowled well.   Not super threatening on a benign pitch , but just not giving anything away.
And when you are chasing nearly 500 it is not as easy to relax and go for it as when you are batting first...
Even so , I would have preferred to see England a little busier.  In truth the main attacking gambit has been some rather risky running  
If these two hang around I think we will see an acceleration eventually as the bowlers tire. Though they have about seven bowlers to share the load in this match. And no one doing a Kerrigan  

if it rains all day tomorrow then what happens sunday if eng are still batting?  would they just bat on until all out and aussie declare right away and put them back if they're past follow on but still 100 behind?

this aussie side looks good in this match.   this all seems a little too convenient.  you sneaky one Flower.

trebellbobaggins wrote:

alfie wrote:Credit to Australia , they have bowled well.   Not super threatening on a benign pitch , but just not giving anything away.
And when you are chasing nearly 500 it is not as easy to relax and go for it as when you are batting first...
Even so , I would have preferred to see England a little busier.  In truth the main attacking gambit has been some rather risky running  
If these two hang around I think we will see an acceleration eventually as the bowlers tire. Though they have about seven bowlers to share the load in this match. And no one doing a Kerrigan  

if it rains all day tomorrow then what happens sunday if eng are still batting?  would they just bat on until all out and aussie declare right away and put them back if they're past follow on but still 100 behind?

this aussie side looks good in this match.   this all seems a little too convenient.  you sneaky one Flower.

Monty Panesar is looking good in this match also..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Think you're going to have to change your top 3 around......

One stinker out of three isn't bad...But all three.........

Sport is supposed to be entertainment..

Long live t20...

please die t20 more like.

England barely above 2 an over. Feel sorry for those who paid extortionate prices to get into the Oval the past couple of days.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Think you're going to have to change your top 3 around......

One stinker out of three isn't bad...But all three.........

Sport is supposed to be entertainment..

Long live t20...

Don't watch then. Simple.

shut up..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:
Monty Panesar is looking good in this match also..

 

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:shut up..

Yes you probably should.

trebellbobaggins wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:
Monty Panesar is looking good in this match also..

 

Should think he's booked his place to Oz ...no ??

GSC wrote:England barely above 2 an over. Feel sorry for those who paid extortionate prices to get into the Oval the past couple of days.

They shouldn't watch then !! according to some muppets..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:shut up..

nice.

off back to the nursery wee scamp.

trebellbobaggins wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:shut up..

nice.

off back to the nursery wee scamp.

wee scamp ????..............Speak English..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

GSC wrote:England barely above 2 an over. Feel sorry for those who paid extortionate prices to get into the Oval the past couple of days.

They shouldn't watch then !! according to some muppets..

Indeed.

some complete and total Muppet even posted this

"Sport is supposed to be entertainment.."

complaining about the very same thing.

can you imagine?

trebellbobaggins wrote:and that's a real shame.

Root under no pressure at all and he flunks out again.

you know I just don't think englands batsmen are good enough.  Massive changes needed in this team if they are to compete in aussie or those "England will never win again" doom mongers will get the whitewash they seem to want this winter.

aussie 90-10 to win this now.  cannot see this line-up reaching the follow on.

part of the reason aussie got good totals when batting first was positive batting.  engs is just negative and handing the game away.  poor side.

The guy scores 60 odd off about 30 overs and it's a shame...

So many undemanding people on one site....Thank goodness we aim higher in America.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

trebellbobaggins wrote:and that's a real shame.

Root under no pressure at all and he flunks out again.

you know I just don't think englands batsmen are good enough.  Massive changes needed in this team if they are to compete in aussie or those "England will never win again" doom mongers will get the whitewash they seem to want this winter.

aussie 90-10 to win this now.  cannot see this line-up reaching the follow on.

part of the reason aussie got good totals when batting first was positive batting.  engs is just negative and handing the game away.  poor side.

The guy scores 60 odd off about 30 overs and it's a shame...

So many undemanding people on one site....Thank goodness we aim higher in America.

With which sport? Handegg, rounders, or netball?

trebellbobaggins wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

GSC wrote:England barely above 2 an over. Feel sorry for those who paid extortionate prices to get into the Oval the past couple of days.

They shouldn't watch then !! according to some muppets..

Indeed.

some complete and total Muppet even posted this

"Sport is supposed to be entertainment.."

complaining about the very same thing.

can you imagine?

sport is supposed to be entertainment..If no one watched it there would be no atmosphere...wee scamp laddie..

trebellbobaggins wrote:This from Vaughn

"
"Since Nathan Lyon came into the side at Old Trafford, he had an iffy first innings there and didn't really get an opportunity in the second innings, but he bowled well at Durham and suddenly Australia look like they have nine of their 11 places secure going into the winter - they just need a number six, and a third seamer to go with Harris and Siddle."
"

My god englands plan has been a masterstroke.  the aussies are now totally certain this is the side.

Dunno. Lyon is seen as a Hauritz - or Giles type here : the Aussies crave excitement , leggies , a Second Warne...
There will be a push for Fawad Ahmed in the home series for sure.

And Harris is about due to break down again.

But they may well start with this batting group. Which England won't mind , as long as they can get a fit Bresnan , a revived Tremlett and/or a firing Finn into action...


Lyon and Smith bowling quite well here...new ball or wait a bit ?

I think Lyon looks a pretty solid option.  He's not Warne but nobody is.  Looks a good honest bowler.