Did Romain have a point?

Took me 60 minutes to get a dodgy stream to watch the ab/sa game so having an opinion is difficult.

But the number and severity of yellows is being openly questioned, especially the sending off. Steve Hansen says he thinks it was unduly harsh. Most on line live blogs said the ref had "lost the plot completely" and suggested late ab yellows that saw them down to 13 men might've been "evening it up" out of guilt.

Guys who had decent coverage, what's your opinion?

I think it was more TMO as poite asked him about any foul play. First yellow was harsh but du plessi did lead with his elbow so I guess he gave the TMO no choice?

Didn't the tmo say the first incident was ok though? Wasn't he over ruled by poite?

Bismarck was offside and made a huge legal tackle on Carter, then a scuffle broke out and Poite asked if there was any foul play.

TMO said "no foul play, go with your decision" and Poite sent off Bismarck for "not using arms in the tackle", which was nonsense.

First was inexcusable and the second was very much debatable.

I can only think the ref took the reaction of Carter's shoulder and Messam's sternum into consideration. If neither player went down injured, I don't think he'd have reacted that way.

The TMO said there was nothing in the incident and the scuffle afterwards but Poite seemed to have in his mind a high tackle with no arms. In short, he ignored everything the TMO said to him. In the second, he got stitched up by the TMO saying first it was an elbow to the head and then to the neck. It was neither. It was reckless but yellow very much questionable.

In summary GE, it's a red card for Poite and his TMO and they should be stood down for those bumbles.

Shame to let these guys come down and wreck a classic confrontation.

We need the best refs to handle the best competition.

Look out whoever plays the boks next...

For the first Du Plessis yellow, I thought the TMO said he saw no foul play, and any call was Poite's decision.  The commentators wondered whether the direction from TMO to referee was clear enough.  Personally, I didn't think either play was a yellow.  The first was a clean hit with arms up, and no penalty at all.  I thought the second was not yellow either.  Shame because it changed the course of a test match played with high intensity and could have gone either way.

I've got a radio sport stream from NZ. The prevailing opinion matches yours Kia.

Springboks hard done by, game ruined by disastrous calls.

Something MUST be done about this now.

GloriousEmpire wrote:Shame to let these guys come down and wreck a classic confrontation.

We need the best refs to handle the best competition.

Look out whoever plays the boks next...

That's exactly it! It's not that the refs robbed SA of a victory, because the game was very tight when Bissie was on, but it tarnished what was working out to be a great game

I hope Biltong's dog is ok.

Yes, and apologies to Mrs Biltong: you're going to have to buy another TV set!

I'm sure he'll be tickled pink that his prediction of an AB win was correct.

I said 17 points...almost wi Barrett missing that late one.

Also said it would turn on a yellow...although I didn't predict 5 of them

GloriousEmpire wrote:NZ will win by 17 points. Steyn will have a surprisingly off game and the turning point will be a yellow card in which time NZ will score two tries.

 
  not bad GE.

If you make enough guesses eventually one is close.

Alternatively you're a mafia boss who recently concluded a deal with R. Poite!

Not from what I can see. Having watched the tackle I can't see anything wrong with it. Carter was painfully unfortunate but these things happen and there can't always be someone to blame. Poite had no apparent reason to overrule the assistant.

Dan carter tweet this morning says "nothing wrong with the tackle, I just fell awkwardly". 

Says it all doesn't it?

“[ltr]@DanCarter[/ltr]: Nothing wrong with the tackle. Fell awkwardly and popped my AC joint"

But lets not forget there were four debatable yellows in a match that Poite just lost control of. I doubt DC would have been quite so blindsided if Du Plessis was onside - and that's my biggest issue. NH refs in general completely lose the plot on open play because they are so accustomed to spending 80 minutes adjudicating scrum resets and watching shots at goal.

We need to get some cultural diversity into our refereeing. I want to see some Samoan or Tongan or Fijian referees handle SH match ups, because you can bet your bottom dollar they'll be fitter and faster and understand the game better.

1 yellow card that shouldn't have been, 1 debatable card which was given and 1 yellow that probably should have been shown to Conrad Smith when Nonu correctly was. One big mistake but not the worst performance ever. Seeing as you're championing these refs who exactly do you want to see brought in? I assume you're aware of some rather than just making sweeping statements or wumming about the NH?

GloriousEmpire wrote:Dan carter tweet this morning says "nothing wrong with the tackle, I just fell awkwardly". 

Says it all doesn't it?

“
[ltr]@DanCarter[/ltr]
: Nothing wrong with the tackle. Fell awkwardly and popped my AC joint"

But lets not forget there were four debatable yellows in a match that Poite just lost control of. I doubt DC would have been quite so blindsided if Du Plessis was onside - and that's my biggest issue. NH refs in general completely lose the plot on open play because they are so accustomed to spending 80 minutes adjudicating scrum resets and watching shots at goal.

We need to get some cultural diversity into our refereeing. I want to see some Samoan or Tongan or Fijian referees handle SH match ups, because you can bet your bottom dollar they'll be fitter and faster and understand the game better.

Carter is class. On and off the pitch.

Hood83 wrote:

GloriousEmpire wrote:Dan carter tweet this morning says "nothing wrong with the tackle, I just fell awkwardly". 

Says it all doesn't it?

“
[ltr]@DanCarter[/ltr]

: Nothing wrong with the tackle. Fell awkwardly and popped my AC joint"

But lets not forget there were four debatable yellows in a match that Poite just lost control of. I doubt DC would have been quite so blindsided if Du Plessis was onside - and that's my biggest issue. NH refs in general completely lose the plot on open play because they are so accustomed to spending 80 minutes adjudicating scrum resets and watching shots at goal.

We need to get some cultural diversity into our refereeing. I want to see some Samoan or Tongan or Fijian referees handle SH match ups, because you can bet your bottom dollar they'll be fitter and faster and understand the game better.

Carter is class. On and off the pitch.

Agreed, but I'd also say I think SH refs are more guilty of letting offsides go. It seems almost an optional extra as a penalty in SH games. It's an interesting point on Bismarck being offside - if you're offside and as a result manage to clobber someone out of a game, it obviously has a greater significance than simply preventing front foot ball etc. Don't suppose you can do much about that.

GloriousEmpire wrote:Dan carter tweet this morning says "nothing wrong with the tackle, I just fell awkwardly". 

Says it all doesn't it?

“
[ltr]@DanCarter[/ltr]
: Nothing wrong with the tackle. Fell awkwardly and popped my AC joint"

But lets not forget there were four debatable yellows in a match that Poite just lost control of. I doubt DC would have been quite so blindsided if Du Plessis was onside - and that's my biggest issue. NH refs in general completely lose the plot on open play because they are so accustomed to spending 80 minutes adjudicating scrum resets and watching shots at goal.

We need to get some cultural diversity into our refereeing. I want to see some Samoan or Tongan or Fijian referees handle SH match ups, because you can bet your bottom dollar they'll be fitter and faster and understand the game better.

Go on then, I'll bite...Most times I've seen Samoa play and lose it's because they've run out of puff, would refs be any different?

If countries like England can suspiciously end up with Vunipolas and Tuilagis in the starting line up, I wonder why their union doesn't pay similar attention to attracting talented young referees from the region to improve the standard of officiating similarly?

GloriousEmpire wrote:If countries like England can suspiciously end up with Vunipolas and Tuilagis in the starting line up, I wonder why their union doesn't pay similar attention to attracting talented young referees from the region to improve.

Elsewhere, you've claimed that New Zealand has encouraged Maori and Islander referees. Strangely, you haven't found the time to identify them, or to outline what exactly you think the NZRU is doing to promote them to elite level.

Perhaps the reason more Maori and islanders aren't managing southern hemisphere matches is because you are badly mistaken about the efforts made by the NZRU. England doesn't have an older generation of islanders to call on to become referees but New Zealand has had them in the playing base for decades. You need to start your campaign there.

you guys need to watch the game again. Bismarck was NOT offside, it was open play, All BLacks kicked an up and under, it bounced, Owens collected and passed back, Bismarck saw the opportunity to tackle Carter, it was all in open play.

yeah thats right he did. good hit too and poite stuffed up. Interesting to see what sort of approach the boks take in Ellis park. Their general play wasnt as good as it has been- may have been the 14 may have been they werent willing to play the wider game because it was the ABs but amongst all the fuss, not many can say they played well individually outside the pack so in a way they had less than 14, several letting themselves down, the pack keeping them in it.