Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

[JAS]

First topic message reminder :

Well done Jas, I've done it a few times and have applied too. Not heard back yet though.

I did it in 2008 Super and was disappointed not to break 4 hours (I ran Glasgow 3 times in the mid 80s with a PB of 2.52) Huge difference in running marathons from early to mid 20's and late 40's/early 50's though. I said in 2008 that I had one more left and it WOULD be sub 4 hours!! I've applied 3 times without success since but I'm in this time.

Nice one JAS...trust all that training won't interfere with the golf schedule too much!

In reality and coupled with the Captaincy it probably will knock my game backwards a bit. C'est la vie :-/. Ideally the day I'd want to be doing my last long training run is the day of the Captains drive in.

Didn't Kirkygolfer run in it - think some of us helped him raise money?

I'm sure somebody from the boards did Kwini, cant remember the name though.

[super_realist]

No Oakey, I'm simply saying that The Open at St.Andrews apart from the historical gushing that people like it for is frequently an anti climax in terms of the golf. Dreary stuff most of the time. and almost no holes which leave you thinking "Wow" when you see it.

Compare that to nearby Carnoustie, which is 10 times the course TOC is. Always a good challenge and scope for real drama and excitement.

[mystiroakey]

The opens I can remember vividly still are

Daleys win , tigers win and faldos win.

Guess what- All at St Andrews.

The rest are just a dreary mess in my mind.

[mystiroakey]

By the way in terms of playing the courses my self. I would plump for many over the Old course!

But as a spectacle, the reason why i big up St Andrews, isn't really about St Andrews!

Its more about the Open held at many other venues

[raycastleunited]

To be fair to Super, TOC is a really poor course for spectators. I went to the Open in 2000 and it was difficult to get close to the action due to the double greens and fairways - basically means only half the number of people can watch. It doesn't have many dunes either which other venues have that create natural vantage points and turn some greens into amphitheatres.

It's also in the middle of nowhere - St Andrews is a small remote town with terrible transport links. It's so small it doesn't even have a train service! And people complain about poor transport links to Twickenham...

[super_realist]

Of course, if you happen to be dewey eyed about particular golfers and courses then obviously you will remember them over others, probably also nailed into your head due to the fame of the course and also coinciding with that and the time you grew up.

Interesting you didn't mention Oosthuizen's in 2010.

If you'd played a few of the Open courses or a lot of the courses in the area that knock that course for six, then you might see the difference a bit more clearly (that's not meant to be too patronising by the way)

[MustPuttBetter]

You don't think any of the last 3 Opens have had exciting finishes Mysti?!!?
Not even the Els win/Scott not win?!

[mystiroakey]

Well tbh sr that is your problem.

You are not looking at it from the right perspective. You are looking at it from a playing perspective only.(i have already admitted your point above before you made it- I would pick other course to play)

You self admit not to even watching sport.

Why is it interesting I didn't mention oustys win. It was a lame event, just because ST Andrews produces better Opens than other venues doe snot mean it doesn't also produce rubbish ones!

[mystiroakey]

You don't think any of the last 3 Opens have had exciting finishes Mysti?!!?
Not even the Els win/Scott not win?!

3 granddads won

scott blew up , els benefited. I felt sick for him tbh. Not a great experience that one.. And not a memorable open at all. Clarke's win was dismal. Phils was pretty decent tbh. BUt I still can hardly remember it and it was only a few months away!! I can remember the other 3 majors much more vividly!

[MontysMerkin]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2507153/Schoolboy-14-dyed-hair-brown-bid-stop-bullies-attacking-ginger-hanged.html
Over-sensitive, fauxfended, little ginger asshat eh soups?

[super_realist]

Well, you said you remember Opens at St.Andrews more than any others, yet forgot or omitted the most recent one,

I'm still a bit confused as to why you think it produces "better" Opens than the others.

I suppose it depends on what you define a good tournament.

Maybe I'm a bit too close to St.Andrews, maybe I've played it too much, maybe I play more interesting courses than it, I don't know, but I'm certainly not alone in thinking that Opens held at TOC have a history of not producing drama or edge of the seat moments.

TOC for example could never produce the sort of drama that Garcia/Village Idiot produced over the final three holes at Carnoustie.

Horses for courses I realise, but I think you'd be in the minority when you proclaim TOC to be a good venue.

Why do you remember those Opens' more? Well it's played there twice as any other for a start.

[mystiroakey]

"but I think you'd be in the minority when you proclaim TOC to be a good venue."

Its relative to other Venues isn't it.

Take it to ballybunion and I will be happy(yes that's in Ireland- but so what- proper links course)

I have only played St georges on the rota, but ballybunion p!sses all over it playing wise

[incontinentia]

Is anyone getting the new playstation or x-box?

[super_realist]

I wouldn't mind a St.Andrews composite course Oakey, that would be good, TOC though is like a game of football involving 3 goals poached on the six yard line, and other venues like Carnoustie are like a game of football with 3 Le Tissier 40 yard screamers.

[super_realist]

Is anyone getting the new playstation or x-box?

No, I'm a grown up.

[mystiroakey]

Not sure mate- just spent 6 time that on new GPU's and 1440p monitors..

It depends on the quality of games. But I doubt it. Cant go back to 1080p or even 720p !!!! gaming.. And people wonder why the new Xbox wasn't called xbox 720!

I cant wait for 4k screens to become reasonable value.

I can work twice as fast just on my new 1440p screens. So its not just about gaming

[MustPuttBetter]

You don't think any of the last 3 Opens have had exciting finishes Mysti?!!?
Not even the Els win/Scott not win?!

3 granddads won

scott blew up , els benefited. I felt sick for him tbh. Not a great experience that one.. And not a memorable open at all. Clarke's win was dismal. Phils was pretty decent tbh. BUt I still can hardly remember it and it was only a few months away!! I can remember the other 3 majors much more vividly!

Odd
Decent drama at the end in all 3. Granddad's or not doesn't change that. Yes Scott chucked it. Yes Dustbin shanked one OB. That's the drama

[mystiroakey]

I wouldn't mind a St.Andrews composite course Oakey, that would be good, TOC though is like a game of football involving 3 goals poached on the six yard line, and other venues like Carnoustie are like a game of football with 3 Le Tissier 40 yard screamers.

You have played so many links courses so are looking at it from that perspective, And if i was to go Scotland on a trip(probally will next year) you will be the first I ask about what courses to play!!

But from my personal experience I have loved some opens held at St andrews! And I have hated many others that haven't been there.

[mystiroakey]

You don't think any of the last 3 Opens have had exciting finishes Mysti?!!?
Not even the Els win/Scott not win?!

3 granddads won

scott blew up , els benefited. I felt sick for him tbh. Not a great experience that one.. And not a memorable open at all. Clarke's win was dismal. Phils was pretty decent tbh. BUt I still can hardly remember it and it was only a few months away!! I can remember the other 3 majors much more vividly!

Odd
Decent drama at the end in all 3. Granddad's or not doesn't change that. Yes Scott chucked it. Yes Dustbin shanked one OB. That's the drama

Add the open before it as well when a great granddad almost won it and got to a play-off!
(the winner was ranked 1000000000000000000 in the world)

The open is just the new seniors open dude!

[super_realist]

If you're good enough to win it, what does age matter?

Turnberry was really exciting conclusion over the final six holes.

Could never imagine that at the current St.Andrews set up. I'm sure they could reorganise it or play it backwards to make it better.

[mystiroakey]

If you're good enough to win it, what does age matter?

Turnberry was really exciting conclusion over the final six holes.

Could never imagine that at the current St.Andrews set up. I'm sure they could reorganise it or play it backwards to make it better.

I have tried to explain to you about level playing fields..

Many Open winners are not good enough to win it and have only won due to the luck of the timing of tee offs.(half the field get wiped out!!)

St Andrews seems to weather the weather better

[super_realist]

Really? They had a round cancelled this year in the Womens' Open and in the 2010 Open.

[mystiroakey]

we get a higher percentage of top players win the open at st andrews. that's the relevant stat.

[mystiroakey]

BTW talking about gaming and TOC.

I once shot a 44 round TOC on TW

[incontinentia]

Is anyone getting the new playstation or x-box?

No, I'm a grown up.

thought you might like to use them for viewing HD porn.

[super_realist]

we get a higher percentage of top players win the open at st andrews. that's the relevant stat.

Is it a relevant statistic, have you even checked that? Have you normalised the data with the fact it gets played more than twice as often as some of the other courses?
Is a tournament not relevant if it isn't won by a top top player?

A win at St.Andrews is worth exactly the same as one from anywhere else. I'd look at it from another perspective as in X may have won at St.Andrews, but it's only St.Andrews.

[mystiroakey]

ANy Incont- I know this place likes to be adult most of the time. But what system are you going for?

Surely it has to be the PS4?

[MontysMerkin]

just got gta V for ps3 so that'll have to do me for a while. Let the dust settle and then go for the ps4 methinks

[Bob_the_Job]

Mysti - how many times have you played TOC?

[mystiroakey]

we get a higher percentage of top players win the open at st andrews. that's the relevant stat.

Is it a relevant statistic, have you even checked that? Have you normalised the data with the fact it gets played more than twice as often as some of the other courses?
Is a tournament not relevant if it isn't won by a top top player?

A win at St.Andrews is worth exactly the same as one from anywhere else. I'd look at it from another perspective as in X may have won at St.Andrews, but it's only St.Andrews.

We had this discussion during the ousty win (that may have been on the other 606 not sure)

And I worked it out back then.

Off course I worked out a percentage not just specific numbers. I will do it again at some point unless you want to do it!

[mystiroakey]

Mysti - how many times have you played TOC?

300 times minimum....























On a games console

[mystiroakey]

just got gta V for ps3 so that'll have to do me for a while. Let the dust settle and then go for the ps4 methinks

yeah top game.

[super_realist]

I think you could go through most of the courses and say that though Oakey.

Faldo, Els and Mickelson were the last three winners at Muirfield? Are they not top players at the time they won?

[incontinentia]

ANy Incont- I know this place likes to be adult most of the time. But what system are you going for?

Surely it has to be the PS4?

i will be getting neither due to a euro famine, but the x box looks like a tasty piece of kit!

[MustPuttBetter]

The last Open where I can remember the winner being super lucky with the weather and being miles clear because of favour able draws was Oosthuizen, at, err, St Andrews.....

[Bob_the_Job]

Mysti - how many times have you played TOC?

300 times minimum....On a games console

You should watch the episode of Top Gear when Clarkson tries to take an NSX around Laguna Seca in the same time he set on the PS3.

I've played it once and while it was fabulous for the history etc etc.. as a course I found it a bit (just a bit, not totally) flat and featureless, although the greens were pretty intimidating. Hard for me to know what kind of test it sets for professionals as they play a game I'm not familiar with, but I thought at the time that without the elements, it's not a hard course. Same went for Gleneagles PGA too - although I think it actually has more variation.

[mystiroakey]

"1970 J Nicklaus
1978 J Nicklaus
1984 S Ballesterous
1990 Sir N Faldo
1995 J Daley
2000 T Woods
2005 T Woods
2010 l Oosthuizen
"


Quality winners, that surely pips any venue since 1970

[super_realist]

7 shots win MPB, Nine Chins also won by 5 and 8 there and Faldo by 5.
The only one that was close was Daly in 95.

So using the type of stats Oakey likes, there is only a 20% chance of there being a close event.

[MustPuttBetter]

Really??

Muirfield

2013 Mickleson
2002 Els
1992 Faldo
1987 Faldo
1980 Watson
1972 Trevino

Back further

1966 Nicklaus
1959 Player

[MustPuttBetter]

Lytham

2012 Els
2001 Duval
1996 Lehman
1988 Seve
1979 Seve
1974 Player

[mystiroakey]

so what SR

There is still a 7 out of 8 shot(6 if you want to claim Daley wasn't which he wasnt but he was up there!) at the best player in the world winning the event!!

We are not talking about just top winners- We are talking about the BEST at the time winning the event.

[super_realist]

Oakey,
There isn't a course you can compare because since WW2 The Open has been at St.Andrews 13 times.

I'd already given Muirfield a shout. Since 1959
1959 Player
1966 Nicklaus
1972 Trevino
1980 Watson
1987 Faldo
1992 Faldo
2002 Els
2013 Mickelson

How's about that?

[super_realist]

so what SR

There is still a 7 out of 8 shot(6 if you want to claim Daley wasn't which he wasnt but he was up there!) at the best player in the world winning the event!!

We are not talking about just top winners- We are talking about the BEST at the time winning the event.

WHOEVER wins is the best at the tournament.

Tournaments aren't about who is the best overall, it's about who is best over 4 days. THat's what is good about golf. Anyone in the field can win.
How does it diminish the tournament if Darren Clarke wins BECAUSE he is a better player in the conditions than the likes of whoever was considered the overall best or number 1 ranked player at that time?

[mystiroakey]

must putt better/SR many of those players you mention are just very  good- not the best at the given time..

There is no point going back pre 1970 as none of us really know enough and the game wasn't as professional back then(fields were rubbish back then)


all you have to do is get me a 75% win rate(no.1 player in the world) on another Open venue since 1970-(the amount of times played is irrelevant)

[mystiroakey]

so what SR

There is still a 7 out of 8 shot(6 if you want to claim Daley wasn't which he wasnt but he was up there!) at the best player in the world winning the event!!

We are not talking about just top winners- We are talking about the BEST at the time winning the event.

WHOEVER wins is the best at the tournament.

Tournaments aren't about who is the best overall, it's about who is best over 4 days. THat's what is good about golf. Anyone in the field can win.
How does it diminish the tournament if Darren Clarke wins BECAUSE he is a better player in the conditions than the likes of whoever was considered the overall best or number 1 ranked player at that time?

Clarke wasn't the best in those conditions, many played in much worse conditions.

[super_realist]

Oakey are you nuts, the players who won at Lytham/Muirfield were every bit as high in the game as those who won in the years you stated at St.Andrews.

What does that say when a No1 players HASN't performed at one of the other courses? How does that make it a bad tournament or a bad course?

I think you're just arguing for the sake of arguing.

[MustPuttBetter]

The list I gave for Lytham are all world number 1s plus Player and Els!

[super_realist]

so what SR

There is still a 7 out of 8 shot(6 if you want to claim Daley wasn't which he wasnt but he was up there!) at the best player in the world winning the event!!

We are not talking about just top winners- We are talking about the BEST at the time winning the event.

WHOEVER wins is the best at the tournament.

Tournaments aren't about who is the best overall, it's about who is best over 4 days. THat's what is good about golf. Anyone in the field can win.
How does it diminish the tournament if Darren Clarke wins BECAUSE he is a better player in the conditions than the likes of whoever was considered the overall best or number 1 ranked player at that time?

Clarke wasn't the best in those conditions, many played in much worse conditions.

So what do you suggest? They all go out and play in 12 balls?

[mystiroakey]

The list I gave for Lytham are all world number 1s plus Player and Els!

you have totally missed the point mate- its about being NO.1 at the specific time!!

[MustPuttBetter]

must putt better/SR many of those players you mention are just very  good- not the best at the given time.

That's hilarious

[super_realist]

The list I gave for Lytham are all world number 1s plus Player and Els!

you have totally missed the point mate- its about being NO.1 at the specific time!!

Who cares?

[Sponsored content]