Soto-Karass motivated for Thurman, December 14th

Soto Karass Very Motivated To Battle Keith Thurman - Boxing News



Here's a snippet of Thurman, who's bringing three stoppages in his last four bouts and has ambitions to unify 147, in action against Favio Medina, he doesn't much set up his shots, but throws with bad intentions, be interesting to see what happens if the Mexican can drag him into the later rounds:





Keith Thurman v Favio Medina action - YouTube




Could be a good one!

Was a poor clip to show of thurman. Defence looked fairly weak and got hit with some jabs. In fact i think he got hit with every jab that lad threw in his grid.

Soto is a banger so this should be good but i feel that thurman gets outboxed by the welter elite.

To be honest it wasn't the boxing that caught my eye in that clip. Trust you to get the wrong end of the stick. I read it was a good little slugfest actually, was wondering if anybody had seen it, would like to see the fight in it's entirety but couldn't find it.


To be honest, never seen Thurman fight, but have wanted to ever since I saw his confrontation with Paulie, have wanted to see him get whupped. To be fair to Thurman, he didn't condone his outburst, said there was still a lot of adrenaline running through him after his fight. Just got a feeling this could be a good fight much in the same way I had a feeling about Conquest and Camacho even though had never seen Camacho fight. Delighted Conquest got the win.

Will be interesting fight, thurman hits very hard but Soto has a really strong chin and while he can be stopped, it's not normally early and he usually gets his own big shots off before he does crumble

Will be fun but I think Thurman could be a real contender at WW with his power and size advantages, and I think Soro may have taken a few too many heavy shots in his career that he will go down, but we know he will go down fighting

Thurman is a real threat to anybody at WW. expect him to win this one with something to spare

Based on what lance?

Thurman can literally take anyone out and against Chaves he proved his power lasts late, really like Thurman think he can be something very good, would like to see him take on Soto-Karass and also take on Maidana and Berto, those would be great matchups and around his level, real testing fights.

Agree Alex although pacquiao is a power punching quick fighter but can be outboxed with comfort
Maidana was the supposed next beats thing but has been outboxed.

If he met a Bradley, Mayweather he would be outboxed.

He meets a JMM he gets countered.

However, a few tweaks in his armour and like you say, he could be very very good and more importantly exciting to watch.

Would like to see him do the same mate. Take out Karass then a maidana before stepping up to a Alexander or a Rios maybe.

Interesting to gauge who is better at 147 Rios, or Maidana? Maidana I would say at this moment in time, looks to have seriously improved.

Yeh would agree mate. Would be a great matchup should Rios lose against pacman....which i think he will.

Maidana does leave himself open to shots though but has rounded his game a lot more than Rios who is, for me, a one dimensional fighter with a cracking chin.

Id go Maidana UD but will be a slugfest.

Not sure when Maidana was ever considered the next best thing, Khan was a reasonable favourite in their fight if I recall correctly.

Think it was a 50/50 mate but he was once an undefeated power punching machine who people were raving about, namely on his Ortiz fight (who was also highly rated prior to that fight).

Where is Ortiz come to think of it?

mobilemaster8 wrote:Agree Alex although pacquiao is a power punching quick fighter but can be outboxed with comfort
.

Sorry to be pedantic but although I can see why people were upset with the verdict, none of the JMM fights were comfortable for either of them and he hasn't looked like losing to anybody else in years. Can't see any evidence there's anyone to comfortably beat him apart from, arguably, Mayweather.

He'd already lost to Kotelnik, he was only ever considered to be a big punching slugger and nothing more while Khan was a reasonable favourite 11/4.

John....

Morales 1, JMM 1,2,3,4.

You not find it ironic that his fights have been against:

Diaz, Cotto, Margarito, Hatton, Clottey, Hoya, Rios, JMM, Mosley.....all in the past 5 years roughly.

All of the have something in common.

Mosley over the hill with Hoya.

The rest are face first punchers with no defence. Made for pacquiao to look great against.

Stick JMM or an old Morales who chose to actually box rather then slug....and you get yourself a victory.

Pacquiao has had his fights chose VERY wisely in my eyes

mobilemaster8 wrote:John....

Morales 1, JMM 1,2,3,4.

You not find it ironic that his fights have been against:

Diaz, Cotto, Margarito, Hatton, Clottey, Hoya, Rios, JMM, Mosley.....all in the past 5 years roughly.

All of the have something in common.

Mosley over the hill with Hoya.

The rest are face first punchers with no defence. Made for pacquiao to look great against.

Stick JMM or an old Morales who chose to actually box rather then slug....and you get yourself a victory.

Pacquiao has had his fights chose VERY wisely in my eyes

Miguel Cotto is not a face first slugger.

and none of those fights are what I'd call comfortable, although I guess it's subjective. You really call Marquez one comfortable? After almost getting knocked out in the first round?

Pacquiao won number two. It was close, but there was nothing wrong with the decision. Three I can sort of get but it was clearly close and he was ahead on the cards in number 4, so I can't see how it was comfortable for Juan.

Morales II was one year after Morales I. But because Morales lost he was immediately shot, right?

Cotto, Margarito, Hatton, Hoya, Mosely were all actually the best fights out there at the time other than Mayweather. Bradley's proved himself as a good back foot boxer and he still lost. Cotto's shown himself to be an adaptable puncher or boxer and he got leather. Truth is, Pacquiao's actually a great fighter, who has struggled with another great fighter.

One thing that often gets left out of his fights at lightweight and above is that HE IS A FORMER FLYWEIGHT. A FLYWEIGHT. A former flyweight facing any top ranked welter is beyond the cherry picks his recent career's fights have been made out to be.

A Poopie flyweight though - he was 16 at the lowest weights and he was getting finished by crap fighters because he was so dehydrated. That he started a flyweight is not really commendable - he's probably a natural Lightweight. To be honest - since the scrapping of same day weigh ins - the weights tend to be those weights only in name. Pac weighed in at 148 at lightweight - a welter in all but name. I agree that some of the fights at the higher weights were a bit soft (through availability rather than choice) he has some great names on his record.

He had two flyweight losses. One was about a year after his first fight and one was in a title fight. He wasn't great but he certainly wasn't crap. He was a seriously dangerous super bantam and featherweight.

My point is, you can slate him for not facing a virtuoso counter puncher every other fight, but he was coming from way way back to face guys who'd always been around that weight and were damn good fighters in their own right but this is always written off. Pacquiao deserves more respect for his welter exploits. Just like Canelo became an untested plodder after Mayweather, Pacquiao's opponents became shot brawlers after he beat them. De La Hoya was seen as picking on a midget for a sure win until the weigh in.

Well aside from Cotto and Hatton none of his wins above super featherweight are worth much. Clottey, De La Hoya Margarito, Mosley were either finished or just decent. Not all his fault but better fights were available, it all seems to have been cashing in for Arum while he could.

Cotto fought pacman at 145 for his own title having been brutalised by Marg.

He fought Mosley after mayweather had hammered him in a landslide.

Clottey ...look at him....no comment.

Hoya....fought at welter for first time in 10 years for Hoya after having fought Floyd at 154.

Hatton after mayweather had knocked him out for first time in his career, and having come off a very poor performance against Juan Lazcano.....

Rios...alvarado beats him, they choose the loser. According to top rank its because Alvarado can box and does have decent power which is too much (they think) for him after his KO loss. So they chose Rios because "he has the style to give Manny some confidence".


cherry picker Floyd?

3 of the named above fighters were fought by Pacquiao AFTER mayweather had beaten them (Hatton, Mosley and Hoya)

Mayweather fought Cotto at 154lbs not 145lbs, and again, Cotto for me was nowhere near where he is after the marg destruction.

Great career....yes.

legend....no.

Well guided career....absolutely.

The thing is anything you throw at Pacquiao you can throw at Mayweather. His victories over the Mexican triumvirate sealed his legendary status and yes he deserved the second Marquez fight.

Both are legendary and great fighters, no need to dismiss one in favour of the other.

I disagree. One is legendary based on fighting, Imo, the better fighters and getting the better wins.

Corrales, Castillo, Ortiz, Guererro, Alvarez, JMM - all comprehensive victories outshine the only two standout victories for Manny against Morales and Barrera.

just my opinion but there you go.

I wonder what it'll take for Pacquiao's harshest detractors to finally just admit that, when it comes to Cotto, Manny did a better job than Floyd?

Nowt at all on Cotto's record to suggest that he's a better Light-Middle than he was a Welter for starters. Everyone points out that he'd taken a tanning of Margario prior to facing Manny, but an additional tanning from Pacquiao (and an additional three years of age) suddenly becomes inconsequential when Floyd fights him. Mayweather beat Cotto on points in a competitive fight - Manny blasted him out inside-schedule after thoroughly dominating him.

Acting as if Cotto coming in a single pound lighter than he had done for his previous two fights is the sole reason for all of the above is pretty ridiculous, for me.

Also funny how you never mention Pacquiao absolute emasculating a prime, top three pound for pound Barrera in front of a pro-Barrera crowd as well, mobile. That first win over Marco, all things considered, is just about as good a win as any fighter on the planet has managed over the past fifteen years, and last time I checked Barrera wasn't a face-first slugger with no technique, either.

Manny took on Hatton at Ricky's best weight (would hate to think you've overlooked that!). Ricky was beaten and beaten well by Floyd, but he was still the generally recognised toughest assignment at 140. Cracking win for Pacquiao. Whether or not you consider it better or as good as Mayweather's is open to debate, but it was an excellent win all the same.

mobilemaster8 wrote:Cotto fought pacman at 145 for his own title having been brutalised by Marg.

One pound less than Cotto had weighed in at for most of his welter fights.

mobilemaster8 wrote:
He fought Mosley after mayweather had hammered him in a landslide.

I don't really see how either of them get much credit for beating that version of Mosely by such a wide margin.

mobilemaster8 wrote:
Clottey ...look at him....no comment.

I agree it's not a great opponent. Wasn't sold as a great opponent. Just filling a date.

mobilemaster8 wrote:
Hoya....fought at welter for first time in 10 years for Hoya after having fought Floyd at 154.

Hoya was the name here. He could've had it where he wanted it. He put in the catchweight to make it seem less like he was cherry picking Pacquiao.

mobilemaster8 wrote:
Hatton after mayweather had knocked him out for first time in his career, and having come off a very poor performance against Juan Lazcano.....

That's a way of putting it that makes Mayweather's win sound better and Pacquiao's worthless. Saying Hatton was coming off one of his best against Paulie and at his best weight does the opposite.

mobilemaster8 wrote:
Rios...alvarado beats him, they choose the loser. According to top rank its because Alvarado can box and does have decent power which is too much (they think) for him after his KO loss. So they chose Rios because "he has the style to give Manny some confidence".

I'm pretty sure they originally went for the winner but he claimed hand injury? Anyway yeah, you said it, he's coming off a bad loss and wants to rebuild. Not much wrong with it in my opinion.

mobilemaster8 wrote:
cherry picker Floyd?

Nope. Not in my eyes. Mayweather's an all time great too.

mobilemaster8 wrote:
3 of the named above fighters were fought by Pacquiao AFTER mayweather had beaten them (Hatton, Mosley and Hoya)

Mm, they operate in the same weight class they're both the cream, they share opponents.

mobilemaster8 wrote:
Mayweather fought Cotto at 154lbs not 145lbs, and again, Cotto for me was nowhere near where he is after the marg destruction.

So...Cotto was LESS shot when Mayweather fought him? He got less shot over time?  OK then.

mobilemaster8 wrote:
Great career....yes.

legend....no.

Well guided career....absolutely.

You're entitled to your opinion. In my opinion he was put in with most of the name fighters of his weight class while everyone clamoured for Mayweather and smashed most of them.

Er, yah, what Chris said.

Pacquiao has stand out wins over three all time greats in Marquez, Barrera and Morales, Mayweather cannot compete with that. I have Mayweather higher but that's based on talent and more very good wins.

Pacquiao's win over Cotto is also a great one but Marquez does harm his standing overall but he robbed him no more than Mayweather did Castillo.

Chris, i never discredited his win over MAB, not at all. It was a great win.

I never said Mayweather fought a better version than Cotto, either.

i just think that Pacquaios opponents post Hoya are tarnished......thats all.

So anybody that isn't undefeated is tarnished then?

When have i said that Hammer you cretin?

as i said. He fought Hoya, Mosley, Margarito, Clottey, JMM, Rios, Hatton.

mayweather fought Mosley, JMM, Hatton, Alvarez, Cotto, Guerrero, Ortiz.

Im saying that his "victories" have been tarnished by who he fought and when he fought them.....

its not rocket science.

Is the Canelo win tarnished by the catchweight?

You must have been to the Truss school of debating.

The only difference between their opponents is Alvarez. Both fought Cotto post Margarito, both beat Hatton and Mosley. While there's no real difference between any of Clottey, Guererro or Ortiz. They could both have fought better with the bulk of their quality coming in the lower weights.

I must have been? Look at your ridiculous comment and break them down:

"only difference between opponents is Alvarez"

both did indeed fight Cotto post Marg, i never said mayweathers win over him was better, but merely at his weight at the time as he was never a big welter so why?

Mayweather beat an undefeated Hatton still full of confidence having rode out some big wins.

Mayweather fought Mosley when he was coming off one of his best victories by Margarito.

Guerrero was a multi weight world champ and was listed as a P4P fighter prior to fighting Floyd, so yes, he stands up stronger than Clottey if compared.

Ortiz was an awkward southpaw with decent power and had got some good wins under his belt to get to Floyd.

how on earth you have Clottey level with Ortiz or Guerrero is beyond me.

Mayweather fought different versions of Mosley and Hatton and in a way Cotto for the reasons ive stated.

This isn't me bashing Manny because he is clearly quality.

i just said his career post Hoya has been controlled "nicely"

mobilemaster8 wrote:Chris, i never discredited his win over MAB, not at all. It was a great win.

I never said Mayweather fought a better version than Cotto, either.

i just think that Pacquaios opponents post Hoya are tarnished......thats all.

Well apologies if I've got the wrong end of the stick, mate. But when you making sweeping statements that Pacquiao can be outboxed "with comfort" by anyone who isn't a come-forward brawler, and give reasons why all his wins are tarnished for whatever reason but completely neglect to mention his wins (first one being much more significant, of course) over Barrera, you can see why I came to the conclusion that you were being a bit unfair on Manny with that one.

Similarly, you highlighted that Manny fought Cotto at a 145 catchweight, whereas Floyd fought him at 154, and that the beating he took in the second half of the fight against Tony had lessened him as a fighter. Again, I don't see why you'd bring up those issues (particularly the weight) unless you were trying to downplay Pacquiao's win in direct comparison to Mayweather's. If you think Manny's win over Cotto is tarnished, then fair enough, that's what you think. But I know that when you talk of Mayweather, you'll reel off Cotto as a top class win for him. Can't have it both ways, for me.

Clottey vs Guerrero/Ortiz would be interesting fights. You can never rule out a Clottey win via headbutt.

Where did Joshua get to? I looked under my bed but he's not there...

The version of Cotto that Pacquiao beat was younger and less better worn while at welterweight I'd say Clottey is a match for Guererro. Mosley was still old when he fought Mayweather and years past his best beating the one dimensional Margarito just covered it up for a bit.

The one dimensional margarito who was spanked by Mosley, drew with some bandito in a taco bell but yet managed to pull a LMW fight out his backside against Pacquiao to make Manny an 8 weight world champion.

As i said, a very well guided career post Hoya.

You dislike Pacquiao for having a well guided career but love Mayweather for having an equally well guided one. After his struggle with Castillo he followed the path of least resistance to a faded De La Hoya before retiring coming back to face Hatton and then retiring again. After his second retirement he like Pacquiao has fought faded names or money fights with the exception being Alvarez but even then that was only because of the money on offer. You can't hate on one for doing exactly the same as the other, Mayweather is the more talented but he himself is not without fault.

Taking on Cotto and Hatton isn't the sign of a cherry picker, the best fighters at light welterweight and welterweight, he smashed them both with ease, much easier than Mayweather. I would agree that the fights with Mosley, Margarito and Clottey were nothing fights but they were no worse than Guererro, Ortiz or Cotto. The problem at the moment is that all the big names are old and faded living off of past glories but the young guns aren't stepping up to knock them off their perch.