Danny Cipriani's England Future

First topic message reminder :

Danny Cipriani has just had another good game for Sale. He turned 26 the other day so, fitness permitting, he is probably about halfway through his rugby career. Clive Woodward recently called for him to be included in the England set-up, but he's not necessarily the best man to have singing your praises.

Does anyone believe that he will ever have a route back into an international career? Lancaster has never ruled him out but you don't get the impression he really has him on his radar. When asked, the England coach just says Cipriani needs to keep playing well for his club.

Currently, the starter is Farrell, while Burns is seen as our potential flair flyhalf, with Ford also in that frame too. Flood is seen almost as an experienced old lag - although he's still only 28 - who can kick goals reliably, knows the squad's patterns, and has a bagful of caps.

The topic of England's best flyhalf gets discussed on other threads, so I'm not really looking to air that debate. I'm more interested in whether there really is any way for Cipriani to make an impact which would encourage Lancaster to include him at the expense of one of the other 10s.

Mike Catt is on the coaching team, and he was famously critical of Cipriani in 2009, saying he didn't deserve to be in the England team (which was probably right). There were rumblings that some of the players at the time were cheesed off with Cips which didn't help his cause. True, few of them are still involved today but Rowntree would know what went on, and have some opinions on the matter. Sale doesn't have a lot of England representation, so there aren't players near the coaches who can vouch for him today.

His club is another matter. Sale are doing all right this year but they no-one is tipping them for a play-off place, which means he won't have probably many big stages to shine this season. Can there really be any level of performance which will catch the eye?

Perhaps there just is no way back for him. It's unlikely anyone would spell that out but you wonder whether Lancaster would rather exhaust every other option before he though of resorting to Cipriani.

As it stands, Cockerill is giving Lancaster a hard time for not playing Flood more. Since he was inclined to give Tomkins several starts, he doesn't come across as someone who quickly drops players. It's hard to see even Burns and Ford getting enough rope to hang themselves so we are unlikely to start running through a string of 10s any time this season.

Ben Botica is English qualified I think - one to watch for the future.

Ok im going to be a little controversial Prop D....but should we be looking at English Qualified foreigners when we have so many young English lads playing - Farrell, Burns, Flood, Ford (even Cipriani)...

To be fair aside from nationality etc, Botica isn't first choice and hasn't shown anything to get ahead of the others. If he did though i'd have no problem with him playing for Eng as I think he grew up here, or has some other links...

Gatland is sure to pick Botica for the 2017 lions tour. He prefers kiwis whenever possible, distrusts the disruptive influence of prominent English and Irish players. To be fair he's won a lions series, the six nations and three coaching awards so he should know.

GloriousEmpire wrote:Gatland is sure to pick Botica for the 2017 lions tour. He prefers kiwis whenever possible, distrusts the disruptive influence of prominent English and Irish players. To be fair he's won a lions series, the six nations and three coaching awards so he should know.

   

GloriousEmpire wrote:Gatland is sure to pick Botica for the 2017 lions tour. He prefers kiwis whenever possible, distrusts the disruptive influence of prominent English and Irish players. To be fair he's won a lions series, the six nations and three coaching awards so he should know.

GE are you Sonny Bill

I mean, you lost the league, you've lost your belts and now your are losing your ability to WUM

I heard he was going to get Hape and Flutey back as well for the mid week games.

GeordieFalcon wrote:Ok im going to be a little controversial Prop D....but should we be looking at English Qualified foreigners when we have so many young English lads playing - Farrell, Burns, Flood, Ford (even Cipriani)...

Most of us consider the Geordie People as foreign.

propdavid_london wrote:Ben Botica is English qualified I think - one to watch for the future.  

He seems all right but not close to George Ford for example
Also behind Burns and as I mentioned that young lad Slade looks like he could be good.

Botica looks just off the pace, compared to them for me.
To be fair England do have  decent crop of 10's coming through

A small town in Scotland isnt it Peter...  

GeordieFalcon wrote:A small town in Scotland isnt it Peter...  

Small Empire now encompassing South Shields, Gateshead and Bagel of The North.
Has been a good source of England Qualified 10s like Wilko and Flood though. Similar thing to Flutey though it does make you question these plastic English 10s who hightail it to France for the cash.

If only we could get some proper Englishmen like Shane Howarth.

etc etc etc.