Froch Eyes Swansong Fight in Las Vegas

From the BBC:

Carl Froch wants to round off his career by fighting in Las Vegas, with Andre Ward or Julio César Chávez Jr his preferred opponents.
The WBA and IBF super-middleweight world champion stopped fellow Briton George Groves to retain his titles at the Manchester Arena on Saturday night.

Groves wants a re-match, but 36-year-old Froch told BBC East Midlands Today : "Las Vegas is the fight capital.
"To finish in a massive fight would be better than going over old ground."

He continued: "I've boxed in America numerous times, but it would be an honour to fight somewhere like Las Vegas because I've never done that under the big lights with all the glitz and the glamour on the main stage."

Froch was on the floor in the opening round of his fight with Groves, but recovered to win in the ninth - although his younger opponent insisted the referee had been too quick to call a halt. "As much as the fans want to see it reach a natural conclusion against George Groves, with me knocking him out again, I feel personally I gave him his chance and he blew it - he can't cut it at world level," said the champion.
"I've done my job and it's time to move on, but we'll see what happens. I'm not motivated by money, I'm motivated by securing a legacy and the love for my sport that I have."

Froch has won 32 of his 34 professional contests. His two defeats came at the hands of Denmark's Mikkel Kessler and American Ward in 2010 and 2011 respectively. The Nottingham fighter beat Kessler in a re-match in London in May and is now keen to avenge the only other blot on his record. The only other fighter Froch sees as a viable alternative is Chávez Jr, son of four-time world champion Julio César Chávez.
The 27-year-old Mexican has a 47-1-1 record, with his only defeat coming to Argentina's Sergio Martínez last September.
Froch said: "I've had quite a long career and there's only one name on my record that I've not beaten - and that's Andre Ward.

"In terms of goals and what I want to achieve before I retire, Andre Ward is on my hit list.
"There's also a guy in America called Julio César Chávez, who's a great fighter. I have to speak to my promoter and speak to my trainer and see whatever makes the most sense."

Looking back on the end of the Groves fight, Froch said the referee had only had a split second to make his decision and had to be mindful of his duty ot protect the health of boxers at all times.

"Because it's potentially such a dangerous sport, the referee has to make a split-second decision, which is not always what the crowd want to see," said the 2001 World Amaetur Championships bronze medallist.

"At the end of the fight, when I was putting in my final combinations, the ref saw what I saw, that George Groves' eyes were rolling in the back of his head and his arms and head were slumped." He added: "If you're not in a position to defend yourself, then the referee makes an experienced, educated and informed decision. "Blows to the head are not healthy and it's the referee's job to make sure both fighters live to fight another day."

Oh no Chavez jr is a great fighter now..........

Does he really think we are that stupid..........

So, Froch the warrior looks to be bailing out of the rematch then...

I dare you to find one fighter not named Sergio Martinez in the 154-175 range who won't publicly say JCC Jr. is a good fighter.

Can't blame him for wanting to fight in Vegas if I'm honest. Time is a healer, Groves will go on to be a champion and Froch fights in Vegas to bow out. He probably deserves it.

Be sensible to go for Ward before any Geoves rematch. But Chavez is a money fight, can't blame him for that, but it won't add anything to his legacy, unless Chavez goes on to do something after Froch.

I'm glad Froch is having only one more fight because he's coming across like he's got brain damage.

kingraf wrote:I dare you to find one fighter not named Sergio Martinez in the 154-175 range who won't publicly say JCC Jr. is a good fighter.

But we are talking GREAT fighter aren't we !!

He knows Ward wants Chavez too. Maybe he's a lot smarter some people think.

Only Tunes 666 and his family will be going to support him..

against the great JCC jr..

I only box part-time, but I would totally call Chavez the brightest star in the Middleweight constellation, the crown in world boxing jewels, and the greatest threat in the sport today if I thought I could get a shot at him...

The ONLY fight left for Froch is the Groves rematch. He's been told to big up fights with Chavez and Ward just to put him in a better position at the negotiating table. As if Ward, who looks better than ever, is going to rematch Froch, who looks worse than ever, after beating him so easily first time around.

I wonder if this was a verbal interview or a written response. It can't be easy for him to verbally communicate with both feet in his mouth.

milkyboy wrote:I wonder if this was a verbal interview or a written response. It can't be easy for him to verbally communicate with both feet in his mouth.

Carl Froch and can't in the same thread. Slap yourself awake milky.

My bad. Of course he can talk with both feet in his mouth.... probably because he talks out of a different part of his anatomy.

milkyboy wrote:My bad. Of course he can talk with both feet in his mouth.... probably because he talks out of a different part of his anatomy.

Didn't you ever wonder why his nose was so big?

Agree with everything Froch has said. Beaten everyone there is out there apart from Kessler and Ward.

He has beaten Kessler in a rematch and now wants to over turn his other defeat against ward in Vegas.

If not, then a money fight with a big name, again in Vegas.

Nothing left to prove and he deserves to bow out with a nice payday and headline a Vegas show against either Ward (to avenge his defeat) or Chavez (to retire in a nice healthy payday against a name).

Fair play.

I've alway's been a Froch fan,but the comment Groves can't cut it at world level,keep telling yourself that Carl because no-one else is buying it,the kid gave you nightmares,and hit you harder than you've ever been hit.

I'll be disappointed if Froch-Groves 2 doesn't happen,Groves definitely deserves a rematch, and a second fight with Ward will go exactly the same as the first,Ward will only lose the rounds he takes a breather in a good level above anyone in this division.

KingMonkey wrote:Can't blame him for wanting to fight in Vegas if I'm honest.  Time is a healer, Groves will go on to be a champion and Froch fights in Vegas to bow out.  He probably deserves it.

Agree with this.

Nico the gman wrote:I've alway's been a Froch fan,but the comment Groves can't cut it at world level,keep telling yourself that Carl because no-one else is buying it,the kid gave you nightmares,and hit you harder than you've ever been hit.

I'll be disappointed if Froch-Groves 2 doesn't happen,Groves definitely deserves a rematch, and a second fight with Ward will go exactly the same as the first,Ward will only lose the rounds he takes a breather in a good level above anyone in this division.

totally agree and whats more froch said he would after the fight give groves a rematch if that's what was wanted looks like groves was right about froch just wanting to be cheered with that remark instead of booed,

Froch knows deep down that groves would give him fits, he may not admit it in public or even to his inner circle but deep down he knows he would be in for a hard night

Haha ridiculous.

Groves 2......or......

Make a few MILLION against Chavez to retire on......or try and overturn a defeat against P4P number 2 on the planet.

Or fight George groves.

Do the math.

Groves may in effect force Froch to retire. The only fight out there for Froch is Groves and it looks like froch is scared of the rematch and will be forced to retire

Champagne_Socialist wrote:Groves may in effect force Froch to retire. The only fight out there for Froch is Groves and it looks like froch is scared of the rematch and will be forced to retire

If either the Ward or Chavez fights can't be made then yes, Froch should retire. He's what....36 years old?

The irony is, the more he denigrates groves, the more it makes the fact that groves outboxed him and nearly knocked him out look a bit bad on himself. 'It was another great performance from myself'  (being outboxed by) 'George groves isn't an elite level fighter'.

'i box for legacy not money' (so....) 'I'd like to fight another great fighter like Chavez'

Bless him, he really does tie himself in knots.

For the career he's had, he deserves a ward rematch for glory (however remote that is), and a Chavez pay day. It's also possible that he's right about groves not being a 12 round fighter at the highest level... Only time will answer that.

However, if he had a pr guy worth his salt, they'd be telling him to put a sock in it, because every time he opens his mouth he comes across as an arrogant jerk, and he doesn't have the charisma to carry it off. Other guys might be happy playing the panto villain to sell tickets but he's an insecure guy, and he's not going to win the popularity contests he wants to without showing a bit of humility. I won't be holding my breath for it.

I've heard that Groves doesn't really want a rematch. He is no longer contracted to Hearn and will look to sign with Warren and go the WBO route against Steiglitz.

skimpton wrote:I've heard that Groves doesn't really want a rematch. He is no longer contracted to Hearn and will look to sign with Warren and go the WBO route against Steiglitz.

do you have a link where you heard this?

No link. From a source I have found to be reliable previously.

''with me knocking him out again, I feel personally I gave him his chance and he blew it - he can't cut it at world level," said the champion.


"Blows to the head are not healthy and it's the referee's job to make sure both fighters live to fight another day."


Oh dear Oh dear, it's just becoming cringe in the aftermath isn't it. All the hard work done building support and a liking in the UK undone in the space of a few days. Given he spouted time and again that Groves showed a lack of respect in the build up to the fight, I find it appalling that he is being so dismissive of Saturday night as a whole. I would like to think maybe it is the fact he took so many shots to the head, however I feel he has finally just reverted to type now that he feels his legacy is somewhat secured.

Given his fights over the past 5 years I wouldn't begrudge him a shot at Ward in Vegas, but for me Chavez would just be avoiding Groves. I don't think he would bring as much to the table because lets be honest, Froch would not be getting anywhere near a split purse for that one. Groves/Froch 2 however makes more on PPV, probably gets held in a stadium this time meaning more in gate's and Froch would see a larger percentage of it all. 

One thing which Saturday definitely did confirm to me (though I always thought as much), he gets taken apart by Calzaghe, doubt he'd be stopped but would be dissected in much the same manner as Lacy was!

What some website?

skimpton wrote:No link. From a source I have found to be reliable previously.

your mate in the pub?

skimpton wrote:I've heard that Groves doesn't really want a rematch. He is no longer contracted to Hearn and will look to sign with Warren and go the WBO route against Steiglitz.

I have to Say I do like Froch as a fighter and his heart in the ring But in some of his post fight interviews he really has not done his PR any good.

But to be fair, a rematch for groves is not automatically the best option, he has allot of sympathy and have proven he can shine in a world stage despite Froch's silly comment about him not being world level, But there is still a good chance that Froch does not under estimate him and defeats him again if he came in fit again, which would not look good on Groves Record, this way he can walk with credit in defeat and probably get an easier fight for world a world title where he will then hold the cards and set up a massive fight with Ward or Froch again if he has not retired.... or If Degale gets his act together and does end up winning the Bika strap, then another huge British fight could be afoot! to unify the two titles..

As for Froch, he would probably get KOed if he fought Ward again and I dont think he wants that fight, Or McCracken doesn't. Sounds like Froch wants to bow out against Chavez, and to be fair Froch has taken a string of world class fights and even if he does side step a rematch he has paid his dues I think, probably good time for him to retire as I dont think there is anyone out there he can beat that will better his record apart from Ward, who is simply much better.

tunes666 wrote:

skimpton wrote:I've heard that Groves doesn't really want a rematch. He is no longer contracted to Hearn and will look to sign with Warren and go the WBO route against Steiglitz.

I have to Say I do like Froch as a fighter and his heart in the ring But in some of his post fight interviews he really has not done his PR any good.

But to be fair, a rematch for groves is not automatically the best option, he has allot of sympathy and have proven he can shine in a world stage despite Froch's silly comment about him not being world level, But there is still a good chance that Froch does not under estimate him and defeats him again if he came in fit again, which would not look good on Groves Record, this way he can walk with credit in defeat and probably get an easier fight for world a world title where he will then hold the cards and set up a massive fight with Ward or Froch again if he has not retired.... or If Degale gets his act together and does end up winning the Bika strap, then another huge British fight could be afoot! to unify the two titles..

As for Froch, he would probably get KOed if he fought Ward again and I dont think he wants that fight, Or McCracken doesn't. Sounds like Froch wants to bow out against Chavez, and to be fair Froch has taken a string of world class fights and even if he does side step a rematch he has paid his dues I think, probably good time for him to retire as I dont think there is anyone out there he can beat that will better his record apart from Ward, who is simply much better.

You make a good point about Froch possibly not being the best next fight for Groves. But, what route does he take otherwise? For me, it is Stieglitz. This guy is incredibly weak for a world champ, despite his win over a now terribly shot Abraham. Groves would stop him in my opinion. He would then be a world champ with plenty to bring to the Froch table. Thing is this tho. Froch is 36 and showing a lot of wear and tear. He has 2 fights left, tops. Add to that the fat Groves and Froch can prob double their purses in a rematch, how does he not push for it? Even if he lost legitimately to Froch he would still financially secure. Got to be Froch next if he wants him at all. If he wins that he is a double (cough cough) world champ.

mobilemaster8 wrote:Haha ridiculous.

Groves 2......or......

Make  a few MILLION against Chavez to retire on......or try and overturn a defeat against P4P number 2 on the planet.

Or fight George groves.

Do the math.

With the PPV percentage he'd earn just as much fighting Groves as Chavez jr.........No one cares about him stateside.

The rematch would be bigger than the first fight.......

mobilemaster8 wrote:Haha ridiculous.

Groves 2......or......

Make  a few MILLION against Chavez to retire on......or try and overturn a defeat against P4P number 2 on the planet.

Or fight George groves.

Do the math.

GG2 could sell out a big UK arena though. And would be PPV again.

Not sure how Froch makes big money in the States?

Surely he's only known over there for getting beat by Ward, so why would anyone care about that rematch? The Yanks tend to be a slightly myopic and introspective bunch. If they see Froch they see someone that got 'whupped' by Ward, screwed (in their eyes) Dirrell and got lucky in the last few seconds of a fight he was losing against Taylor.

All Carl's top wins have been against Euro and Canadian fighters, he worst performances against Yanks. So I can't see how he sells out a LV venue, unless he's on the undercard of something/someone bigger and I can't see his ego ever buying into that.

It's not about the Yanks is it..........He's thinking of Chavez mexican fan base !!

Still not enough to sell more than groves here..with PPV sales added to purse.

Firstly, Chavez Jr, has problems obtaining a fight licence for Nevada - due to his two failed drugs tests.

Secondly, Chavez Jr, fights mainly out of Texas. As it's easier for Mexicans to come to Texas than Nevada.

Chavez Jr is the money, so if Chavez wants to cash out, he'd fight Ward.

Chavez Jr's legacy wouldn't be that damged if he had losses from Martinez and Ward. Both top 5 P4P and best in their division.

Losing to Froch would embarrassing.

Anyway Chavez Jr has a title shot against Bika/Dirrell, for his godfather's WBC strap, so Chavez Jr knows which side his bread is buttered....

Let's go out on a limb and say Groves beats Stieglitz, beats the WBC holder, then fights Froch for all four belts despite Ward being the man. Madness really.

Hammersmith harrier wrote:Let's go out on a limb and say Groves beats Stieglitz, beats the WBC holder, then fights Froch for all four belts despite Ward being the man. Madness really.

Not likely to happen as Ward is the (Super) WBA Super Middleweight champion, so the real WBA champion.

Whereas Froch is the WBA 'regular' champion, so basically a paper WBA champion.

Gerry SA wrote:

Hammersmith harrier wrote:Let's go out on a limb and say Groves beats Stieglitz, beats the WBC holder, then fights Froch for all four belts despite Ward being the man. Madness really.

Not likely to happen as Ward is the (Super) WBA Super Middleweight champion, so the real WBA champion.

Whereas Froch is the WBA 'regular' champion, so basically a paper WBA champion.

This is making my head hurt.......  

> Losing to Froch would embarrassing

Why would losing to the #2 fighter from the next division up be embarrassing?

smashingstormcrow wrote: > Losing to Froch would embarrassing

Why would losing to the #2 fighter from the next division up be embarrassing?

Julio Cesar Chavez Jr brings the name, the HBO/Mexican PPV millions and the fans.

What does Froch bring? A couple of alphabet titles and no money, so yeah Chavez Jr has everything to lose and not a lot to gain.

Groves is the biggest fight out there for Froch. It would make an awful lot of money in the UK. I dont know if a Ward rematch would even make ppv in the States. Boring enough first fight that doesnt promise anything more in a rematch.

Frochs arguments are full of holes. You could tell almost from the moment the Groves fight ended that he didnt fancy doing it again. Hes more or less saying as much now. Groves cant cut at world level, the ref saved Groves career etc, no point going over old ground. None of it adds up.

Maybe when Hearn sits down and explains the figures with him he might decide Groves is worth it. I cant see Chavez being too interested in Froch and I dont think the money or interest is as high for Ward.

How much Eubank/Benn 2 make despite neither of them being considered "the man" at SM? No-brainer really.

Interesting that when Froch loses, rematches "Have to be made to right a terrible wrong" but when he's the victor, "the right man won and it's time to move on"

The questions is would Ward accept the challenge for a rematch with Froch?

Personally I think that he would reject the challenge because Froch is no challenge

But he'd be happy to beat up on him some more. He always said Froch was nothing

Ward is the champion of the world. He can't be beat and he won't be beat

This time he'll train harder. There won't be no quick knockdowns like Groves

Ward is gonna destroy him. He's gonna torture him...real bad

Ward as good as he certainly is does not bring big money stateside plus the fact he is clearly so much better than Froch most would not even consider it a competitive fight. Chavez v Froch wont make anywhere near the money Froch v Groves makes at a big stadium in London or the 02 plus it does not do massive PPV sales the rematch would. I dont blame Froch for bottling it out of a rematch with Groves though, he is not stupid and knows the score where Groves is concerned now, I dont imagine he wants the final time he is seen by British fight fans to be when he is being schooled and outclassed by a young fellow Englishman his ego and obsession about his legacy could not handle it and at approaching 37 his body might not this time either.

hogey wrote:Ward as good as he certainly is does not bring big money stateside plus the fact he is clearly so much better than Froch most would not even consider it a competitive fight. Chavez v Froch wont make anywhere near the money Froch v Groves makes at a big stadium in London or the 02 plus it does not do massive PPV sales the rematch would. I dont blame Froch for bottling it out of a rematch with Groves though, he is not stupid and knows the score where Groves is concerned now, I dont imagine he wants the final time he is seen by British fight fans to be when he is being schooled and outclassed by a young fellow Englishman his ego and obsession about his legacy could not handle it and at approaching 37 his body might not this time either.

I think that part of his legacy was the fact that he was never scared of a challenge and fougt whoever was put in front of him. Failing to rematch Groves would shatter that fact because it looks as if he is scared of the rematch. He could no longer go down as a fighter who took on every challenge if he bottles out of fighting Groves.

Wonder what kind of deterioration Saturday night will have had on Froch........Certainly was a fight that could make a guy who looked slightly past it look even older next time out...

Maybe he'll retire......It's never easy the older you get to put yourself through the training..

Why people like Hoppo are amazing beasts........

Even though you've been incredibly vocal about how bad he is for the sport.

To be honest I'm sure that there are a number of Froch fans who looked at the Groves fight and realised their man is slipping. I think they'll allso be aware of how good Ward is and I wonder whether they'd be interested in shelling out a lot of money to watch him get humilated again. If Froch was a nailed on cert to win I'm sure they'd be there in a flash but I'm sceptical.

Gerry SA wrote:
What does Froch bring? A couple of alphabet titles and no money, so yeah Chavez Jr has everything to lose and not a lot to gain.

Ah, you seem to be forgetting that he's a massive international superstar.

I would put money on his next, and last, fight being Chavez. It makes so much sense and, IMO, just WILL happen.

1. It will make far more money than Ward, who, albeit brilliant, is not exciting and, let's be honest, he's on the up, Froch seems like he's on the slide and everyone with their head screwed on right knows it'd be the same outcome as the previous fight, probably more one-sided in fact. I really can’t believe anyone but the most demented Froch fan wants to see this fight.

2. It's an instant shot at two SMW belts for Chavez.

3. As Carl will now probably considered to be on the slide, Chavez's people would fancy he could win it.

4. It's a winnable fight for Froch too, so he'd fancy it.

5. It'll likely be a cracking tear-up.

I would be amazed if Froch/Chavez doesn't happen. It just hits all the right notes on all the reasons match-ups get made.