Who will win the Six Nations?

Based on the Autumn Internationals who do you think will win the 2014 Six Nations?

I think Wales will win it although there is the possibility they could lose a game on the way like last year

I went for Ireland. I reckon they'll win 4, France, England and Wales on 3. No real reason, just gut.

I went for Wales. It will help hype them up as if they need anymore hyping up. They do that quite well themselves.

I think Ireland are most likely. Wales will struggle in Dublin. France are definitely a massive improvement on last year. With Dulin, Fritz, Fofana, Tales their backline is the best around...!

Being English i went for England, of course.

But if you are basing the facts on the Ais, then i would say Ireland, (1) England (2) France (3) Wales(4) Scotland(5) Italy (6).

majesticimperialman wrote:Being English i went for England, of course.

But if you are basing the facts on the Ais, then i would say Ireland, (1) England (2) France (3) Wales(4) Scotland(5) Italy (6).

So you actually meant to say that you think ireland will win, not England?

Last year proved that AI form counts for very little come the 6 Nations as does form in the 6 Nations.

With 3 home games we should be there or there abouts but again our record at Twickenham isn't brilliant so who knows

bedfordwelsh wrote:Last year proved that AI form counts for very little come the 6 Nations as does form in the 6 Nations.

With 3 home games we should be there or there abouts but again our record at Twickenham isn't  brilliant so who knows

Recent record is alright Beds... Last loss was prior to the last RWC back in mid August 2011.

If all the teams play to their potential it could be a very close one.

If you look at France, England and Ireland vs New Zealand then all those teams have great performances in them.

If you look at Wales vs Australia you could argue that even when hit hard with pace they find themselves in the mix.

The question is who will bring the good oerformances when it counts.

Having said that, I voted for England.

maestegmafia wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:Last year proved that AI form counts for very little come the 6 Nations as does form in the 6 Nations.

With 3 home games we should be there or there abouts but again our record at Twickenham isn't  brilliant so who knows

Recent record is alright Beds... Last loss was prior to the last RWC back in mid August 2011.

I guess the past still haunts me Maes, all those trips to Twickers in the 80s and 90s still left their scars lol

bedfordwelsh wrote:Last year proved that AI form counts for very little come the 6 Nations as does form in the 6 Nations.

With 3 home games we should be there or there abouts but again our record at Twickenham isn't  brilliant so who knows

I think what you really mean is that 6Ns form counts for zip when it comes to playing the SH sides.

bedfordwelsh wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:Last year proved that AI form counts for very little come the 6 Nations as does form in the 6 Nations.

With 3 home games we should be there or there abouts but again our record at Twickenham isn't  brilliant so who knows

Recent record is alright Beds... Last loss was prior to the last RWC back in mid August 2011.

I guess the past still haunts me Maes, all those trips to Twickers in the 80s and 90s still left their scars lol

Aye

Surely you would remember their thirty years of not winning in Cardiff while we regularly picked up wins away, they must have beaten Wales less than ten times in my life time prior to the 90s...! They doubled that in the last 20 years.

56 games all in the total history of the fixture...

englandglory4ever wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:Last year proved that AI form counts for very little come the 6 Nations as does form in the 6 Nations.

With 3 home games we should be there or there abouts but again our record at Twickenham isn't  brilliant so who knows

I think what you really mean is that 6Ns form counts for zip when it comes to playing the SH sides.

Both I guess

maestegmafia wrote:

majesticimperialman wrote:Being English i went for England, of course.

But if you are basing the facts on the Ais, then i would say Ireland, (1) England (2) France (3) Wales(4) Scotland(5) Italy (6).

So you actually meant to say that you think ireland will win, not England?

Maseyegmafia Yes i did. simply based on the results of the Ais Ireland ran the NO 1 team in the world the closest. I am not saying that Ireland will win. But if the Ais is anything to do with the 6ns. Then that in my opinion is how the results should stand.

I can't see Ireland winning this year, but I do see us in the top 3.

Unfortunately I think one big factor for the winner this year will be which team suffers least from injuries. Injuries are becoming a big issue in the game nowadays, and now teams need to have better depth than ever.

I'm going to go with France this year though.  For once, they are one of the least mentioned teams to win, and I have a feeling they will take many teams by surprise.

I'm going for France too ,a few more games with a settled lineup and they'll win the 6N. Of all the NH teams they looked the most ominous this Autumn . They have a very small but tough pack and the best backline in the NH at the moment .

I seem to remember whocares saying they would have more time in the French camp next year so they might be more settled. Not sure if they'll be kept for the off weekends as well.

majesticimperialman wrote:Being English i went for England, of course.

But if you are basing the facts on the Ais, then i would say Ireland, (1) England (2) France (3) Wales(4) Scotland(5) Italy (6).

What's Ireland finishing first based on if it's based on something from the AIs? And France finishing third?

I'd say England are in the best position to win it. Not too worried from what I've seen from them though, not worried about travelling to Twickenham either, and considering our defence is more than good enough to prevent NH teams from registering a try on most occassions I think Wales will finish in the top 3 too. Personally I'd like to see anyone but France win it post Lions year to put that old wives tail to rest.

The Saint wrote:I'd say England are in the best position to win it. Not too worried from what I've seen from them though, not worried about travelling to Twickenham either, and considering our defence is more than good enough to prevent NH teams from registering a try on most occassions I think Wales will finish in the top 3 too. Personally I'd like to see anyone but France win it post Lions year to put that old wives tail to rest.

From any teams perspective injury is a massive factor.

How well can a team do if injury forces them to use a fourth or fifth choice player in a few positions?

Ireland were massively weakened by injuries to key men last year. Strength and depth in most nations can cover one or two players being injured in one position maybe a couple but more than that and all nations are scraping the barrel.

It is an unfirtunate result of a crowded rugby calendar.

Come the start of the six nations we will all be looking at which nations players have best survived the first half of the year unaffected by injury.

I think that more than ever, it's completely impossible to tell.

England beat Australia by 7.
Ireland lose to them by 17.
Scotland lose to them by 6.
Wales lose to them by 4.

So does that make the 6N table for the home nations:
1. England
2. Wales
3. Scotland
4. Ireland
?

I think England should win it, but then we all know France, Ireland, and Wales can produce something special.

On paper, it's definitely England's - oh why isn't rugby ever played on paper?

George Carlin wrote:I think that more than ever, it's completely impossible to tell.

England beat Australia by 7.
Ireland lose to them by 17.
Scotland lose to them by 6.
Wales lose to them by 4.

So does that make the 6N table for the home nations:
1. England
2. Wales
3. Scotland
4. Ireland
?

Problem with using one opponent is that you negate other results.

Ireland lost to NZ by 2 and England lost to NZ by 8.

I'm assuming that's just England forwards on paper, not backs?

Not sure how on paper it's definitely England's, Duty?

Definitely?! That's a pretty absolute term, especially for something with so many variables. Even the All Blacks were not 'definite' for an Autumn Internationals clean sweep, although they managed it.

Griff wrote:Not sure how on paper it's definitely England's, Duty?

Definitely?! That's a pretty absolute term, especially for something with so many variables. Even the All Blacks were not 'definite' for an Autumn Internationals clean sweep, although they managed it.

You'll get used to Duty in the end...

This is like Top Trumps...

Highest ever winning score vs Romania?

England 134 Romania 0.

Looks like the 6Ns is in the bag

Seriously though, although we can use relative results for comparison, I don't think they will have much impact on the 6Ns.

Biltong wrote:

George Carlin wrote:I think that more than ever, it's completely impossible to tell.

England beat Australia by 7.
Ireland lose to them by 17.
Scotland lose to them by 6.
Wales lose to them by 4.

So does that make the 6N table for the home nations:
1. England
2. Wales
3. Scotland
4. Ireland
?

Problem with using one opponent is that you negate other results.

Ireland lost to NZ by 2 and England lost to NZ by 8.

My point exactly. There's a good aggregate system around, thankfully - it's the hated IRB world rankings. On that basis, it would be:
1. England
2. Wales
3. France
4. Ireland
5. Scotland
6. Italy

So now let's look at the other factors of (a) home advantage and (b) ability to generate momentum:

Round 1

Sat 1st Feb 14 14:30 Wales   v   Italy - Millennium Stadium
Sat 1st Feb 14 18:00 France   v   England - Stade de France
Sun 2nd Feb 14 15:00 Ireland   v   Scotland - Aviva Stadium

Round 2

Sat 8th Feb 14 14:30 Ireland   v   Wales - Aviva Stadium
Sat 8th Feb 14 17:00 Scotland   v   England - Murrayfield
Sun 9th Feb 14 16:00 France   v   Italy - Stade de France

Round 3

Fri 21st Feb 14 20:00 Wales   v   France - Millennium Stadium
Sat 22nd Feb 14 14:30 Italy   v   Scotland - Stadio Olimpico
Sat 22nd Feb 14 16:00 England   v   Ireland - Twickenham

Round 4

Sat 8th Mar 14 14:30 Ireland   v   Italy - Aviva Stadium
Sat 8th Mar 14 17:00 Scotland   v   France - Murrayfield
Sun 9th Mar 14 15:00 England   v   Wales - Twickenham

Round 5

Sat 15th Mar 14 13:30 Italy   v   England - Stadio Olimpico
Sat 15th Mar 14 14:45 Wales   v   Scotland - Millennium Stadium
Sat 15th Mar 14 18:00 France   v   Ireland - Stade de France

You have to figure that if England can take down France in Paris in the first game, they've got a very good chance.

With the guns out for GATS from his own supporters can't see him bothering despite winning his last there major efforts. Win or lose someone seems to have it in for him. France or england for certain. Ireland will face the usual post AB dilemma...not being able to replicate the effort as england did last year.

England or France for me. Probably go for England on points difference.

Wales and Ireland have two massive tests away from home. Twickenham is bad enough but the Irish mental block of winning in Paris is second only to their mental block when it comes to beating New Zealand.

During the Lions I put £2 on Scotland at 80/1. My logic being that they didn't lose many players to the tour. I now off course realist why they didn't and why the odds were so good. Still you never knowu suppose.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:I can't see Ireland winning this year, but I do see us in the top 3.

Unfortunately I think one big factor for the winner this year will be which team suffers least from injuries. Injuries are becoming a big issue in the game nowadays, and now teams need to have better depth than ever.

I'm going to go with France this year though.  For once, they are one of the least mentioned teams to win, and I have a feeling they will take many teams by surprise.

why not?

i think their performance in the first half v NZ was one of the best 40 minutes of total rugby i have seen from any side.

i expect the loss to have been crippling for a few days but when they come back together i think it will have filled them with a terrible resolve

I expect you to start with a win and then Wales come to Dublin…..you travel to both twix and Paris though which will be tough though.

I don't think France have done enough after last years spoon to recover, England have a backs crisis which they cannot sort out in the 6 Nations, IMO it will either be Ireland or Wales who win but i don't think anyone will Slam

It depends on the fixtures but for me England and Wales are a long way ahead of the other sides.

Wales have a better 1st XV and more talent in the outside backs but England more depth in the forwards and maybe are a bit mentally stronger - sorry Wales.

Based on that I think England are favourites but wouldn't be surprised to see Wales win again.

maestegmafia wrote:I think Ireland are most likely. Wales will struggle in Dublin. France are definitely a massive improvement on last year. With Dulin, Fritz, Fofana, Tales their backline is the best around...!

Surprised anyone went for Ireland but it would be great.

The team that performs the most consistently usually wins, Ireland, England, Wales and France are all capable of putting in brilliant performances.

But who will do it against each other?

I must admit, I don't like the manner of the fixtures, having home and away fixtures in alternative years does make for a unique situation.

Scratch wrote:why not?

i think their performance in the first half v NZ was one of the best 40 minutes of total rugby i have seen from any side.

Because they can't play at that level consistently - mentally they struggle against France and more recently physically against Wales and England. Scotland have done well against us recently too.

3 wins for Ireland would be a successful tournament I think - every game will be a big challenge.

Taylorman wrote:With the guns out for GATS from his own supporters can't see him bothering despite winning his last there major efforts. Win or lose someone seems to have it in for him. France or england for certain. Ireland will face the usual post AB dilemma...not being able to replicate the effort as england did last year.

Ireland have a very good record v Wales having beaten them in their last match. These matches are usually quite close so it could go either way Id say.

France will win the tournament though.

Griff wrote:Not sure how on paper it's definitely England's, Duty?

Definitely?! That's a pretty absolute term, especially for something with so many variables. Even the All Blacks were not 'definite' for an Autumn Internationals clean sweep, although they managed it.

Because on paper (which rugby certainly isn't played), England have the best team in the 6Ns.

The variables are taken into account on the pitch.

England are the favourites for outright victory though, that's for sure.

I was going to post on one of the other umpteen discussions involving 6N performances but thought I would make the poing here.

Other teams will Play up vs England... too often the one crucial stat NOT taken into account is both Rugby and Country history.

The celtic nations just LOVE to beat us and don't have anywhere near the motivation against any of the SH teams.


PS: Wales fail to recognise that Playing Like Australia, doesn't work against, erm, Australia. If they play with that intensity during the 6N, without copping any more injuries they should win it, but I don't think they will.

I think France will come out firing too, I fear them more than Ireland or Wales

SA teams? Whats that? Do you mean SH?

I find it interesting that you fear France more when England's record v France is better than against Ireland and Wales. Its fair enough though as I reckon France will be strong too.

England play Ireland and Wales in Twickers too so should make them favorites in those fixtures. In reality although those three teams are quite different there isnt much between them in terms of quality.

they now play different though, it depends on which teams can adjust and maintain their composure.

Can't see England doing that much unless 36 and Thomkins click and Farrell gets told to stand flatter like he was in the Lions (such a sheame he didn't play more as a flat Farrell and BOD and Manu was such a great line up)

GunsGerms it makes sense to fear France more because we are playing them away plus it's just after a Lions tour. Everyone knows the French generally do well in the 6 nations after the Lions tour. Plus they owe us a bit of revenge.

Also our last two matches vs the Irish were wins.

It's about time England get back to winning ways vs Wales at Twickenham - something I think we'll see.

beshocked wrote:GunsGerms it makes sense to fear France more because we are playing them away plus it's just after a Lions tour. Everyone knows the French generally do well in the 6 nations after the Lions tour. Plus they owe us a bit of revenge.

Also our last two matches vs the Irish were wins.

It's about time England get back to winning ways vs Wales at Twickenham - something I think we'll see.

Yes the last two matches were wins but the last one there was very little between the teams. Ireland have strengthened their front row a lot so I dont think there will be much between the two teams. You are right to fear France.

damage_13 wrote:they now play different though, it depends on which teams can adjust and maintain their composure.

Can't see England doing that much unless 36 and Thomkins click and Farrell gets told to stand flatter like he was in the Lions (such a sheame he didn't play more as a flat Farrell and BOD and Manu was such a great line up)

It wont even be Tomkins as he has that knee injury- so we are back to a new combo unless Barritt is fit in time. Barritt/36 did work OK last year vs Scotland. There are so many 'nearly' men around the centers. Assuming that JJ is still out of form and favour, and Eastmond hasnt resolved his issues the favorite for 13 must be Trinder with outside bets on Daly and Burrell.

GunsGerms wrote:

beshocked wrote:GunsGerms it makes sense to fear France more because we are playing them away plus it's just after a Lions tour. Everyone knows the French generally do well in the 6 nations after the Lions tour. Plus they owe us a bit of revenge.

Also our last two matches vs the Irish were wins.

It's about time England get back to winning ways vs Wales at Twickenham - something I think we'll see.

Yes the last two matches were wins but the last one there was very little between the teams. Ireland have strengthened their front row a lot so I dont think there will be much between the two teams. You are right to fear France.

Given the extreme weather its very hard to take anything from that last match up - other than England adapted to the conditions much better than the Irish. The score was tight but from my (admittedly) biased viewpoint the result was seldom if ever in doubt. Who knows what the result would have been had the weather been different.

GunsGerms wrote:

beshocked wrote:GunsGerms it makes sense to fear France more because we are playing them away plus it's just after a Lions tour. Everyone knows the French generally do well in the 6 nations after the Lions tour. Plus they owe us a bit of revenge.

Also our last two matches vs the Irish were wins.

It's about time England get back to winning ways vs Wales at Twickenham - something I think we'll see.

Yes the last two matches were wins but the last one there was very little between the teams. Ireland have strengthened their front row a lot so I dont think there will be much between the two teams. You are right to fear France.

6 point win away in Ireland isn't not bad at all. Ireland will find it a tougher task at Twickenham. England have been strong at home in the last 10 matches or so. England have the Irish monkey off their back.

Only fearing France because it's in France. I am reasonably confident against any side at Twickenham.

After all England were the only NH side to take down the Aussies.

Teams with three Home games must be favourite.

Away in France is going to be a task, especially if the injury list grows bigger.

lostinwales wrote:

damage_13 wrote:they now play different though, it depends on which teams can adjust and maintain their composure.

Can't see England doing that much unless 36 and Thomkins click and Farrell gets told to stand flatter like he was in the Lions (such a sheame he didn't play more as a flat Farrell and BOD and Manu was such a great line up)

It wont even be Tomkins as he has that knee injury- so we are back to a new combo unless Barritt is fit in time. Barritt/36 did work OK last year vs Scotland. There are so many 'nearly' men around the centers. Assuming that JJ is still out of form and favour, and Eastmond hasnt resolved his issues the favorite for 13 must be Trinder with outside bets on Daly and Burrell.

crap..forgot about that.

It also depends on who is actually in the EPS, as without that contract they won't be released by the clubs for England training.