What Is Going On In Wales Pt.2

by ScarletSpiderman Mon 06 Jan 2014, 10:24

First topic message reminder :

Following on from the old thread -: https://www.606v2.com/t50378-what-the-hell-is-going-on-in-wales

Intotouch wrote:Hello knowledgeable Welsh friends. I've read some extraordinary things lately about the war between the regions and the union in Wales, but being an outsider, and not following this closely for years I'm not sure what's real and what's nonsense. Can someone please help clarify a few things for me?

1. I read that the WRU have a deal with the regions that they will each be given the same amount of money annually by the union for the next five years. This was interpreted by some as the union deciding to slowly let the regions go bust so they can set up new regions that they would own. Is this really the case? It sounds completely crazy to me! Wouldn't this be a disaster in Welsh rugby and couldn't they try to buy the regions instead since they have more money now? Could this really be a plan?

2. The WRU is making a profit and with the millenium stadium paid off should have plenty of money to splash about in the future. (Or do they?) As they won't give more money to the regions this suggests that they want the regions to founder (see above).

3. Although the WRU pay millions to the regions annually they have little or no say in how they are run so are deeply frustrated with the regions. Also the regions can't stand the WRU even though they're keeping them afloat. Is this true and why?

4. The WRU offered central contracts to the players in the regions but the regions rejected this. Even though they would have a smaller wage bill if it went ahead. Why?
The regions have the lowest salary cap in Europe and keep losing their best players. But the regions won't let the WRU pay the internationals out of a central contract. As players have to be released anyway to play for Wales I don't see why the clubs wouldn't be delighted to do this. Are they afraid that they would lose them to too many training camps? I don't follow the logic of this. If the WRU paid the players then surely the regions would be able to keep more of their best players playing in Wales which surely would benefit them as they'd have stronger teams. Again I don't get why this is such a problem.

(Please don't include the possible move to the AP on this thread. It's being debated elsewhere.)

The original thread hit 1,000+ posts without descending into a bicker-fest, let's try to keep this thread going in the same manner.

by SecretFly Sun 09 Feb 2014, 11:59

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Ive just been reading about the WRU offering Adam Jones 50,000 more to sign for them than Ospreys have tabled.

That is utter insanity on an epic scale and sums up why the Regions are unanimously opposed to central contracting. its bad enough having to compete with the Franglos for their players services without their own union trying to poach them and driving up costs even more....especially with a player who may not even be first choice in his position next season.

Any thoughts that the Union wants to retain the regions and are supportive of them are laughable. Its be one thing if this was because O's couldnt afford to stand up against an offer from France, but this has come before one is even on the table.

This is cat and mouse. This is civil war. This is "who will be left standing at the end if nobody wants to sleep together". The Regions are playing their part in the continuing battle. It's not like they're not throwing cannon balls at the WRU castle themselves. Let's not be too ready to say one is a victim and the other a rogue.

by wayne Sun 09 Feb 2014, 12:08

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Ive just been reading about the WRU offering Adam Jones 50,000 more to sign for them than Ospreys have tabled.

That is utter insanity on an epic scale and sums up why the Regions are unanimously opposed to central contracting. its bad enough having to compete with the Franglos for their players services without their own union trying to poach them and driving up costs even more....especially with a player who may not even be first choice in his position next season.

Any thoughts that the Union wants to retain the regions and are supportive of them are laughable. Its be one thing if this was because O's couldnt afford to stand up against an offer from France, but this has come before one is even on the table.

Peter, from the time of Lewis, renegotiating the MS loan, to the enlightened this was the obvious end product, HE wanted TOTAL control and wanted these entities (Regions) gone.
We'll see tomorrow what will be the Regions response. What paper did you see this article and could you provide a link please

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Sun 09 Feb 2014, 12:32

wayne wrote:
Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Ive just been reading about the WRU offering Adam Jones 50,000 more to sign for them than Ospreys have tabled.

That is utter insanity on an epic scale and sums up why the Regions are unanimously opposed to central contracting. its bad enough having to compete with the Franglos for their players services without their own union trying to poach them and driving up costs even more....especially with a player who may not even be first choice in his position next season.

Any thoughts that the Union wants to retain the regions and are supportive of them are laughable. Its be one thing if this was because O's couldnt afford to stand up against an offer from France, but this has come before one is even on the table.

Peter, from the time of Lewis, renegotiating the MS loan, to the enlightened this was the obvious end product, HE wanted TOTAL control and wanted these entities (Regions) gone.
We'll see tomorrow what will be the Regions response. What paper did you see this article and could you provide a link please

http://www.espn.co.uk/wales/rugby/story/214089.html

Reports in The Rugby Paper say the WRU has offered Jones £50,000-a-year more than the deal the Ospreys have put together but Jones is yet to decide where his future lies.

Yeah I agree on the comments re Lewis. Its horrible and destructive and I cant believe that Wales havent been affected on the pitch by this. On paper things should have gone their way in this years 6 nations, they have the players , the settled side and the confidence and arent badly hit by injuries. So they struggle vs Italy and get tickled to death by Ireland.
This has been bubbling under for years, I got shouted down for pointing it out when the welsh were crowing over arguments about the new EPS deal ( resolved amicably) and banging on about their perfect integrated system blah blah. Well heres reality. A Union that has just gone through the process of upsetting its second tier and is now trying to destroy its professional game. Big shock the regions are trying to protect their own investments and future.

I hope to god this gets resolved and whatever rises from the ashes can be competitive because all thats good about european union is based on having rivalries between teams that can beat each other. If Welsh rugby goes back to being a laughing stock then everyone suffers.

by wayne Sun 09 Feb 2014, 12:51

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:
wayne wrote:
Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Ive just been reading about the WRU offering Adam Jones 50,000 more to sign for them than Ospreys have tabled.

That is utter insanity on an epic scale and sums up why the Regions are unanimously opposed to central contracting. its bad enough having to compete with the Franglos for their players services without their own union trying to poach them and driving up costs even more....especially with a player who may not even be first choice in his position next season.

Any thoughts that the Union wants to retain the regions and are supportive of them are laughable. Its be one thing if this was because O's couldnt afford to stand up against an offer from France, but this has come before one is even on the table.

Peter, from the time of Lewis, renegotiating the MS loan, to the enlightened this was the obvious end product, HE wanted TOTAL control and wanted these entities (Regions) gone.
We'll see tomorrow what will be the Regions response. What paper did you see this article and could you provide a link please

http://www.espn.co.uk/wales/rugby/story/214089.html

Reports in The Rugby Paper say the WRU has offered Jones £50,000-a-year more than the deal the Ospreys have put together but Jones is yet to decide where his future lies.

Yeah I agree on the comments re Lewis. Its horrible and destructive and I cant believe that Wales havent been affected on the pitch by this. On paper things should have gone their way in this years 6 nations, they have the players , the settled side and the confidence and arent badly hit by injuries. So they struggle vs Italy and get tickled to death by Ireland.
This has been bubbling under for years, I got shouted down for pointing it out when the welsh were crowing over arguments about the new EPS deal ( resolved amicably) and banging on about their perfect integrated system blah blah. Well heres reality. A Union that has just gone through the process of upsetting its second tier and is now trying to destroy its professional game. Big shock the regions are trying to protect their own investments and future.

I hope to god this gets resolved and whatever rises from the ashes can be competitive because all thats good about european union is based on having rivalries between teams that can beat each other. If Welsh rugby goes back to being a laughing stock then everyone suffers.

Thanks for that Peter, I've stated in the past on here and on other forums, I started supporting Regional rugby in 2005 because I could see the opportunity to support the WRU and International Rugby in Wales to get back to where they were in the 70s, everything was going along fine until the Dodger became involved, now because of their antics I'm fully behind the Regions and if they fold, me and thousands like me will be lost, I'm not really that upset over yesterday, 10 years ago I would have been

by Allty Sun 09 Feb 2014, 17:38

Wayne I understand what you are saying but rugby is losing support in Wales

Many I know have switched to the footy or just don't bother with the game at all.

by Guest Mon 10 Feb 2014, 10:39

Allty wrote:Wayne I understand what you are saying but rugby is losing support in Wales

Many I know have switched to the footy or just don't bother with the game at all.

Do you have proof of this, as most regions suggest rises in attendance every season (or so I thought?)

by wayne Mon 10 Feb 2014, 12:54

Risca Rev wrote:
Allty wrote:Wayne I understand what you are saying but rugby is losing support in Wales

Many I know have switched to the footy or just don't bother with the game at all.

Do you have proof of this, as most regions suggest rises in attendance every season (or so I thought?)

Risca Rev, NO he doesn't have proof of this, this topic was brought up a few months ago and it was shown the attendances have gone up, the serious lack of expertise on this Forum about what is going on in Wales is quite alarming, I just wish some of these users actually did some Research before posting.

by Stone Motif Mon 10 Feb 2014, 14:40

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Ive just been reading about the WRU offering Adam Jones 50,000 more to sign for them than Ospreys have tabled.

That is utter insanity on an epic scale and sums up why the Regions are unanimously opposed to central contracting. its bad enough having to compete with the Franglos for their players services without their own union trying to poach them and driving up costs even more....especially with a player who may not even be first choice in his position next season.

Any thoughts that the Union wants to retain the regions and are supportive of them are laughable. Its be one thing if this was because O's couldnt afford to stand up against an offer from France, but this has come before one is even on the table.

Spot on. Even more ludicrous given the player in question looks more and more past it at international level with every game he plays.

by Luckless Pedestrian Wed 12 Feb 2014, 20:45

gcBlues wrote:From Sam Warburton's telegraph column today

got up off the bench and unzipped my jacket, and as I walked up towards the pitch, I heard some rumbling behind me.

There was a bit of cheering and I just thought ‘Ah, that’s what happens with every sub.’

Then my name was announced over the public address system and I could not believe the reaction. It was nuts.

I would never have expected that. All those people cheering for just one person? And that one person was me?

I was walking to that line-out, and even though I was fully focused on the next play, the fantastic support from the Welsh crowd left me totally overwhelmed.

I was having a shower after the game and quite a few of the players mentioned it, and said they had never heard a reception like it for one player.

“You must have been really happy with that,” they said. I was.

It was great to see and feel the nation’s support for my decision to sign a central contract.

The poor guy really is deluded. They weren't cheering because you signed a central contract but because you're the captain. It would have been a bigger reaction if someone, like Leigh Halfpenny, was coming off the bench.

He's really got his head in the clouds, that or this column has to go via Roger Lewis before it's published!

Maybe Derwyn Jones is writing his articles for him now. Another question to ask is whether it was the first time he'd come on a sub at the Millennium Stadium since being made captain (I can't be bothered to check). If so, that would explain his (apparent) shock at being cheered, but in all honesty, peed crowd + well-known player coming on = applause.

by Cardiff Dave Thu 13 Feb 2014, 12:12

David Moffett this morning on Muppet;

"I will be releasing my review of WRU finances sometime today. It shows a recurring increase of an extra 3 mill investment is available now"

"it also shows that a one off investment of over 3 mill is also available now following windfall agreement with HMRC. This the Clubs money"

"Not sure but WRU is sitting on reserves of 11,25 million"

by HammerofThunor Thu 13 Feb 2014, 12:34

Cardiff Dave wrote:David Moffett this morning on Muppet;

"I will be releasing my review of WRU finances sometime today. It shows a recurring increase of an extra 3 mill investment is available now"

"it also shows that a one off investment of over 3 mill is also available now following windfall agreement with HMRC. This the Clubs money"

"Not sure but WRU is sitting on reserves of 11,25 million"

Now that would be interesting. Moffett is snake with an agenda though.

by Cardiff Dave Thu 13 Feb 2014, 12:44

HammerofThunor wrote:
Cardiff Dave wrote:David Moffett this morning on Muppet;

"I will be releasing my review of WRU finances sometime today. It shows a recurring increase of an extra 3 mill investment is available now"

"it also shows that a one off investment of over 3 mill is also available now following windfall agreement with HMRC. This the Clubs money"

"Not sure but WRU is sitting on reserves of 11,25 million"

Now that would be interesting. Moffett is snake with an agenda though.

Maybe, maybe not. Haven't made my mind up yet, but what is interesting also is that he is followed on Muppet by 2 correspondents for the Fail.

by ScarletSpiderman Thu 13 Feb 2014, 12:47

Dai, the jury is still out on Moffet. He was the devil incarnate, but had the balls to admit to it (sort of) when he was the top man, where as Roger doesn't admit to it. I think that is pretty much the difference between the two of them.

by Guest Thu 13 Feb 2014, 15:54

We have to remember that yes, Moffet seemed like the devil at the time for forcing through this mishmash of regional superclub thingies, but as someone else posted (and which is often forgotten or ignored) Moffet's first plan was for 5 proper regions with no ties to clubs. It was the clubs themselves who turned this down, and thus saw through the move to quasi-regional superclub thingies.

So while I don't like his attitude, his face or the way he talks, I don't think he can be solely to blame for what we've got now. The clubs will have you believe it was all him though...

by Scrumpy Thu 13 Feb 2014, 16:00

Griff wrote: The clubs will have you believe it was all him though...

By clubs do you mean Cardiff, Newport and Llanelli!?

or Blues, Gwent and Reds?

by **Notch** Thu 13 Feb 2014, 16:19

11.25 million sounds about right- tbh can't imagine it would be less based on the income streams which are comparable with other unions and their spending, which seems to be much less than unions of similar size.

by Guest Thu 13 Feb 2014, 21:59

Scrumpy wrote:
Griff wrote: The clubs will have you believe it was all him though...

By clubs do you mean Cardiff, Newport and Llanelli!?

or Blues, Gwent and Reds?

No I mean the clubs who believe they've been wronged by regionalisation.

by ScarletSpiderman Thu 13 Feb 2014, 23:46

Yet some clubs have profited from in like Farm Quins, Llandovery, Cross Keys etc who are in the prem now, but never would have made it otherwise.

by Breadvan Fri 14 Feb 2014, 14:04

Watched in documentary last night on s4c, filmed in 08. ( thanks subtitles) about the club/countries fortunes since the start of professionalism. Just a continuous journey of ups and downs, farces, movements of brilliance and sheer ineptitude. Nothing changes eh... Rolling Eyes

by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Fri 14 Feb 2014, 14:13

Hmm, didn't David Moffet use to be the devil

but somehow now he's reinvented himself as an angel

?

by ScarletSpiderman Fri 14 Feb 2014, 14:21

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:Hmm, didn't David Moffet use to be the :devil:but somehow now he's reinvented himself as an ?

He hasn't reinvented himself per ce. He came in and wanted there to be strong regions playing in Wales, but the fans/clubs were not keen, now he has come back and wants strong regions in Wales, and the regions/fans are pleased. Basically it is us fans that have done the reinventing themselves bit (shameful to admit).

by Guest Fri 14 Feb 2014, 14:22

Perceived as the devil, but a I said the CLUBS turned down proper independent regions with no ties to former clubs (Moffett's plan A), so Moffett had to settle for plan B which was mergers and standalone sides. But people either forget this, didn't know or prefer to stay ignorant so they can blame someone for not liking the 'thing' that we're left with!

by AsLongAsBut100ofUs Fri 14 Feb 2014, 14:29

What is it that they say about the victors supposedly writing history, Griff?!

by Guest Fri 14 Feb 2014, 16:27

Hmmm! Got a point there As!

by Cardiff Dave Fri 14 Feb 2014, 19:49

AsLongAsBut100ofUs wrote:Hmm, didn't David Moffet use to be the :devil:but somehow now he's reinvented himself as an ?

Indeed he was considered to be the anti-christ way back and still is to many (see Muppet). But something had to be done as welsh rugby was a basket case, the result being an agreed fudged up provincial type doo-dah which never really went down well and still doesn't to this day. From what i've read he's now pushing for a similar type thing that Andrew Hore of the Os started banging on about 4-ish years ago ie more involvement in the community game etc.

by Cardiff Dave Fri 14 Feb 2014, 19:58

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Yet some clubs have profited from in like Farm Quins, Llandovery, Cross Keys etc who are in the prem now, but never would have made it otherwise.

Some of these clubs also featured in european competitions don't forget, Cross Keys included. Pontypridd even made it to a final.

Pontypridd 22, Sale Sharks 25
http://www.ercrugby.com/matchcentre/13974.php

by Cardiff Dave Fri 14 Feb 2014, 20:16

Griff wrote:
Scrumpy wrote:
Griff wrote: The clubs will have you believe it was all him though...

By clubs do you mean Cardiff, Newport and Llanelli!?

or Blues, Gwent and Reds?

No I mean the clubs who believe they've been wronged by regionalisation.

The clubs or maybe the fans or both for that matter?

by Cardiff Dave Mon 17 Feb 2014, 15:02

Meanwhile, courtesy of Scarletfever;

"CRYS16 officials are meeting, along with the other supporters' groups, RRW tonight at Liberty Stadium for an update on the current situation.

Info. to members a.s.a.p."

and Moffett ups the ante;

http://www.espn.co.uk/wales/rugby/story/214889.html

He has his own website too!
http://moffettrugby.com/

by whocares Mon 17 Feb 2014, 15:07

Cardiff Dave wrote:

He has his own website too!
http://moffettrugby.com/

he certainly knows a thing or two about marketing !

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rOI3KZBRR6w&feature=youtu.be&a

by SecretFly Mon 17 Feb 2014, 15:22

Goddamn it!!! Someone should have warned me there was a close-up on that dedicated site of his!!!! Lucky I haven't had anything to eat yet.

Nice looking man, movie-star appeal. I think it should be Gorgeous George that should play him in the new Welsh Rugby movie coming out: Gareth Thomas International Man of Mystery and Where's the Movie that was Promised Ten Years Ago?

by justified sinner Mon 17 Feb 2014, 20:59

Cardiff Dave wrote:Meanwhile, courtesy of Scarletfever;

"CRYS16 officials are meeting, along with the other supporters' groups, RRW tonight at Liberty Stadium for an update on the current situation.

Info. to members a.s.a.p."

and Moffett ups the ante;

http://www.espn.co.uk/wales/rugby/story/214889.html

He has his own website too!
http://moffettrugby.com/

Just a technical point Moffet's assertion that Wales could release. £6m from reserves now in revenue, not capital spend shows he knows nothing about Finance. That will create an in year loss and cause a serious hit on the balance sheet. This will not go down well with the WRU's creditors i.e. bank(s) they owe the stadium debt to.

by ScarletSpiderman Tue 18 Feb 2014, 13:31

http://www.scarlets.co.uk/eng/news/6536.php

Priest is the latest of the Welsh players to sign on for their region, despite being a target for centralised contracts. Now that just leaves Adam Jones to make his mind up, and he has said he will plump for the Ospreys before the union, so will most likely be playing elsewhere next season (otherwise he would have just signed for the Ospreys right).

by LordDowlais Tue 18 Feb 2014, 15:55

I do not know how far down the road this news is and I do not know if anything has been said on this forum prior, but I have it on very good authority that the regions and the WRU are going to strike a deal imminently. As soon as the six nations is over the farce we have been eagerly hanging on to for the last few months could be at an end and we will see the long term security of our four regions, also we will be hearing a lot more with what is happening with the North Wales region, please do not shoot the messenger because I only know this news from people from within the rugby set-up in Wales, I did not ask questions I just shrugged my shoulders and said I will believe it when I see it, but I was assured that a deal was as good as done. I have checked the interweb and the only news I could find that was anything close to what I was told, I found in this article:-

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/wru-boss-roger-lewis-wants-6719021

by Cardiff Dave Tue 18 Feb 2014, 16:42

LordDowlais wrote:I do not know how far down the road this news is and I do not know if anything has been said on this forum prior, but I have it on very good authority that the regions and the WRU are going to strike a deal imminently. As soon as the six nations is over the farce we have been eagerly hanging on to for the last few months could be at an end and we will see the long term security of our four regions, also we will be hearing a lot more with what is happening with the North Wales region, please do not shoot the messenger because I only know this news from people from within the rugby set-up in Wales, I did not ask questions I just shrugged my shoulders and said I will believe it when I see it, but I was assured that a deal was as good as done. I have checked the interweb and the only news I could find that was anything close to what I was told, I found in this article:-

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/wru-boss-roger-lewis-wants-6719021

Wouldn't surprise me if they did. There again it wouldn't surprise me if they didn't either.
Anyway there's some Dai-namite news to be revealed by the supporters' clubs soon according to Scarletfever.
Oh and agreement or not, Moffett is still prowling the perimeter. More fun and games to come methinks.

by wayne Tue 18 Feb 2014, 16:45

Cardiff Dave wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:I do not know how far down the road this news is and I do not know if anything has been said on this forum prior, but I have it on very good authority that the regions and the WRU are going to strike a deal imminently. As soon as the six nations is over the farce we have been eagerly hanging on to for the last few months could be at an end and we will see the long term security of our four regions, also we will be hearing a lot more with what is happening with the North Wales region, please do not shoot the messenger because I only know this news from people from within the rugby set-up in Wales, I did not ask questions I just shrugged my shoulders and said I will believe it when I see it, but I was assured that a deal was as good as done. I have checked the interweb and the only news I could find that was anything close to what I was told, I found in this article:-

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/wru-boss-roger-lewis-wants-6719021

Wouldn't surprise me if they did. There again it wouldn't surprise me if they didn't either.
Anyway there's some Dai-namite news to be revealed by the supporters' clubs soon according to Scarletfever.
Oh and agreement or not, Moffett is still prowling the perimeter. More fun and games to come methinks.

Yes Dave, on the Os site the supporters who met with RRW yesterday, hope to have a statement out tonight.

by Cardiff Dave Tue 18 Feb 2014, 16:55

wayne wrote:
Cardiff Dave wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:I do not know how far down the road this news is and I do not know if anything has been said on this forum prior, but I have it on very good authority that the regions and the WRU are going to strike a deal imminently. As soon as the six nations is over the farce we have been eagerly hanging on to for the last few months could be at an end and we will see the long term security of our four regions, also we will be hearing a lot more with what is happening with the North Wales region, please do not shoot the messenger because I only know this news from people from within the rugby set-up in Wales, I did not ask questions I just shrugged my shoulders and said I will believe it when I see it, but I was assured that a deal was as good as done. I have checked the interweb and the only news I could find that was anything close to what I was told, I found in this article:-

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/wru-boss-roger-lewis-wants-6719021

Wouldn't surprise me if they did. There again it wouldn't surprise me if they didn't either.
Anyway there's some Dai-namite news to be revealed by the supporters' clubs soon according to Scarletfever.
Oh and agreement or not, Moffett is still prowling the perimeter. More fun and games to come methinks.
Yes Dave, on the Os site the supporters who met with RRW yesterday, hope to have a statement out tonight.

Good show.
Just been reading the latest about this WRU loan. Apparently RRW only found out about it via the internet. Surely not?;

"Welsh Rugby Union approves emergency loan to Welsh regions
The Welsh Rugby Union has agreed an interest-free loan of £660,000 to be shared between the four Welsh regions."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/26244071

by Seagultaf Tue 18 Feb 2014, 19:11

Cardiff Dave wrote:
wayne wrote:
Cardiff Dave wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:I do not know how far down the road this news is and I do not know if anything has been said on this forum prior, but I have it on very good authority that the regions and the WRU are going to strike a deal imminently. As soon as the six nations is over the farce we have been eagerly hanging on to for the last few months could be at an end and we will see the long term security of our four regions, also we will be hearing a lot more with what is happening with the North Wales region, please do not shoot the messenger because I only know this news from people from within the rugby set-up in Wales, I did not ask questions I just shrugged my shoulders and said I will believe it when I see it, but I was assured that a deal was as good as done. I have checked the interweb and the only news I could find that was anything close to what I was told, I found in this article:-

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/wru-boss-roger-lewis-wants-6719021

Wouldn't surprise me if they did. There again it wouldn't surprise me if they didn't either.
Anyway there's some Dai-namite news to be revealed by the supporters' clubs soon according to Scarletfever.
Oh and agreement or not, Moffett is still prowling the perimeter. More fun and games to come methinks.
Yes Dave, on the Os site the supporters who met with RRW yesterday, hope to have a statement out tonight.

Good show.
Just been reading the latest about this WRU loan. Apparently RRW only found out about it via the internet. Surely not?;

"Welsh Rugby Union approves emergency loan to Welsh regions
The Welsh Rugby Union has agreed an interest-free loan of £660,000 to be shared between the four Welsh regions."
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/26244071

Is this part of the money that is granted to the Regions by the benevolent WRU. Is it part of the Regions agreement with the WRU for playing in the Euro tournaments? Or part of the money earned by the Regions, that just passes through the WRU hands?

by ScarletSpiderman Wed 19 Feb 2014, 09:29

Dai - the Dai-namyte news was the resigning of Mr Priestland, as he was being circled by vultures from within and the other side of the bridge. Or at least that is what has been claimed to be the big news.

by Cardiff Dave Wed 19 Feb 2014, 09:36

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Dai - the Dai-namyte news was the resigning of Mr Priestland, as he was being circled by vultures from within and the other side of the bridge. Or at least that is what has been claimed to be the big news.

Not the news that RRW threatened to sue?

"The regions approached the WRU at the start of the week and asked for loans if they did not receive the ERC money and threatened to sue the union, under the terms of the current participation agreement, if it did not oblige."
http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2014/feb/18/welsh-rugby-union-loans-wales-regions

The Fail, fails to mention the threatening to sue bit;
http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/welsh-rugby-union-agree-loan-6722990

by Cardiff Dave Wed 19 Feb 2014, 09:39

Seagultaf wrote:

Is this part of the money that is granted to the Regions by the benevolent WRU. Is it part of the Regions agreement with the WRU for playing in the Euro tournaments? Or part of the money earned by the Regions, that just passes through the WRU hands?

The latter.

by ScarletSpiderman Wed 19 Feb 2014, 09:48

Dai - unless I read it wrong, Priest was the big news. I think we all knew that RRW would threaten to sue, so it was not big news as such.

by Cardiff Dave Wed 19 Feb 2014, 10:02

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Dai - unless I read it wrong, Priest was the big news. I think we all knew that RRW would threaten to sue, so it was not big news as such.

There's a disappointment. So what other news are we expecting from the supporters' clubs/RRW meeting? Any idea?

by Chunky Norwich Wed 19 Feb 2014, 10:53

Cardiff Dave wrote:
Seagultaf wrote:

Is this part of the money that is granted to the Regions by the benevolent WRU. Is it part of the Regions agreement with the WRU for playing in the Euro tournaments? Or part of the money earned by the Regions, that just passes through the WRU hands?

The latter.

So if the WRU get ERC monies are paid to them, and divvy out that competition money to the regions, it shouldn't be the regions suffering. The WRU run that money through their own accounts and count it as turnover. Why on earth are the WRU not obliged to pay the regions this money that is due to them under contract (participation agreement)?

The slimy WRU have offered to loan the regions their own money (presumably after legal advice) - and in return they get painted in the press as do-gooders who are helping the failing regions out.

Pathetic state of affairs. The WRU are a national embarrassment.

by Stone Motif Wed 19 Feb 2014, 10:58

Chunky Norwich wrote:
Cardiff Dave wrote:
Seagultaf wrote:

Is this part of the money that is granted to the Regions by the benevolent WRU. Is it part of the Regions agreement with the WRU for playing in the Euro tournaments? Or part of the money earned by the Regions, that just passes through the WRU hands?

The latter.

So if the WRU get ERC monies are paid to them, and divvy out that competition money to the regions, it shouldn't be the regions suffering. The WRU run that money through their own accounts and count it as turnover. Why on earth are the WRU not obliged to pay the regions this money that is due to them under contract (participation agreement)?

The slimy WRU have offered to loan the regions their own money (presumably after legal advice) - and in return they get painted in the press as do-gooders who are helping the failing regions out.

Pathetic state of affairs. The WRU are a national embarrassment.

Directly linked to the Chief Exec's renumeration, if I'm not mistaken.

The guy is a crook.

by Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler Wed 19 Feb 2014, 12:30

Now you understand why the WRU are such one eyed staunch supporters of the ERC ... that arrangement ensures the money from Euro competitions is theirs to dish out or keep as they see fit. The clubs conversely loved the Wanglo cup because the money went direct to them.

by SecretFly Wed 19 Feb 2014, 13:01

The WRU didn't 'support the ERC', they were part owners of ERC! How come you guys always can't work that one out? ERC competitions Owned by WRU amongst others. Profits go to owners, divided between them...profits then trickled down to workers (regions/provinces/clubs/managers/players/coaches) Wink

It's so simple.

by HammerofThunor Wed 19 Feb 2014, 13:31

Would you prefer "WRU backed the ERC set-up"?

by SecretFly Wed 19 Feb 2014, 13:42

Nope.. WRU part-owned the ERC set-up would do me.
They ain't stealing anyone's money when it comes through their hands first. Employers get the profit cheques, then they pay their workers

The new system might be the workers buying out the owners, wanting to become genuine co-owners.......... or indeed stealing the entire factory from the owners Wink

But the workers didn't build the factory - least of all under-performing Regions.

by HammerofThunor Wed 19 Feb 2014, 14:20

Yes, the WRU back the current set-up which includes them being partial owners of the competition. So they can funnel the funds through themselves giving them a larger turnover than if they did what the RFU did and have it go directly to the clubs (same with league TV/sponsorship).

by SecretFly Wed 19 Feb 2014, 15:00

HammerofThunor wrote:Yes, the WRU back the current set-up which includes them being partial owners of the competition. So they can funnel the funds through themselves giving them a larger turnover than if they did what the RFU did and have it go directly to the clubs (same with league TV/sponsorship).

Hammer..the RFU is the RFU not Jesus walking again upon the Earth.

This things I'm hearing about the RFU all the way through these months - it's like they're the old grandfather with all the knowledge and all the proper answers.

The RFU are and were a player in 'the game' - every bit as double-speak and double-think as any of the rest of the combatants. They want what is best for them and they themelves are victims of the 'power' of their own clubs (that very same power which the rest of us don't want crawling unopposed into Europe too).

The RFU have no choice but to play ball with its clubs (PRL as overloards) to an extent. But they are the English Union. Nothing more. They're not the perfect role-model. They're not the shining example of how rugby is done. They handle their business their way under the contraints of their unique domestic structures. The rest handle their business their way.... and that won't always coincide with the English way.

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