tyson fury verses frank bruno?

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i think tyson fury would of knocked severn bells out of frank,an easy knockout for fury the fight would have lasted 3 rounds.

You think any of those LOSE gamely to Bowe as Golota did..

think not my friend.

'lose' gamely being the harshest way to put it.

throw away a well earned win more like it.

Certainly two wins to add to Bowe's legacy..

Top 20 for me.

Golota was very erratic. Looked good one fight and absolutely shocking in the next.
Take out the Bowe fights and the rest of his record is pretty average.

To be fair, Lewis beat a lot crap as well. He came in as champ when the division began to die on its ass.

Tua was good on his day but he was a disgusting fat mess against Lewis. McCall, Akinwade and Golota were mental cases and Tyson was shot to sh1t (and a mental head case) by the time he fought Lewis.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:You think any of those LOSE gamely to Bowe as Golota did..

think not my friend.

Riddick 'Big Daddy' Bowe was more Riddick 'Brain Damaged' Bowe by the time Golota fought him.

Golota lost to a host of guys far worse than Chagaev, who was a decent fighter.

Taking out a fighters two best wins always seems an obscure way to assess them.

If anything, the fact he did it twice showed how capable he was.

And no, Trussy, those two wins don't add a jot to his 'legacy'. He was twice beat, only to escape with DQ's, by a guy Lewis wiped out in a round.

catchweight wrote:To be fair, Lewis beat a lot crap as well. He came in as champ when the division began to die on its ass.

Tua was good on his day but he was a disgusting fat mess against Lewis. McCall, Akinwade and Golota were mental cases and Tyson was shot to sh1t (and a mental head case) by the time he fought Lewis.

Have to agree Lewis timing was excellent...........However saying that..........I'd pick a Steward Lewis before he got old.......

To beat Bowe, Holy and Larry Holmes........He'd give any heavy nightmares to be honest..........

Head to head ...........Apart from Foreman and Ali I'd pick Lewis to beat all of them........Too big for Frazier..and could push him back...

catchweight wrote:To be fair, Lewis beat a lot crap as well. He came in as champ when the division began to die on its ass.

Tua was good on his day but he was a disgusting fat mess against Lewis. McCall, Akinwade and Golota were mental cases and Tyson was shot to sh1t (and a mental head case) by the time he fought Lewis.

The f*****g guy is Samoan, what do you expect? Lewis nullified every aspect of Tua's game when people expected Tua power to be relevant in that fight. Lewis toyed with him and everyone's abiding memory of that fight is Tua running head first into the ringpost such was his desperation to land a shot on Lewis.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

catchweight wrote:To be fair, Lewis beat a lot crap as well. He came in as champ when the division began to die on its ass.

Tua was good on his day but he was a disgusting fat mess against Lewis. McCall, Akinwade and Golota were mental cases and Tyson was shot to sh1t (and a mental head case) by the time he fought Lewis.

Have to agree Lewis timing was excellent...........However saying that..........I'd pick a Steward Lewis before he got old.......

To beat Bowe, Holy and Larry Holmes........He'd give any heavy nightmares to be honest..........

Head to head bar Ali.............Apart from Foreman and Ali I'd pick Lewis to beat all of them........Too big for Frazier..and could push him back...

Have to disagree, given the amount of sh!t Lewis gets on here I don't think his timing could have been worse. Born in any other era there's every possibility that whilst he has a few more losses on his record, there's also less argument about his final standing in the great scheme of things.

Lewis was a top heavyweight but the division was in decline when he came in. He said it himself. "My job is to get rid of these heavyweight msifits" or something like that.

I think NFL has robbed all the potential American heavyweights. They havent produced talent since the 80s. Boxers like Dokes, Tubbs or Witherspoon that get accused of being crap were talented boxers. They would kick ass today.

The way he fought Tua was too small at 5'10 for Lewis. He spent the whole fight trying to get in range. In desperation he resorted to trying to jump up in the air to land on Lewis's head.

Lewis and Tua were also too cautious for a lot of the fight which made for a dull spectacle.

Tua v Ibeabuchi - Great fight. Still the record for punches thrown/landed in a HW fight I think.

Tua was a slob against Lewis

catchweight wrote:

I think NFL has robbed all the potential American heavyweights. They havent produced talent since the 80s. Boxers like Dokes, Tubbs or Witherspoon that get accused of being crap were talented boxers. They would kick ass today.

Never a truer word written............Funny thing is fat slobs today are slow and ponderous and clueless..............When Tubbs, Page and the like were fat......they were quick on their feet and could punch fast.........and fight for 15 at a decent pace..

No excuse for these knobs these days.

catchweight wrote:Lewis was a top heavyweight but the division was in decline when he came in. He said it himself. "My job is to get rid of these heavyweight msifits" or something like that.

I think NFL has robbed all the potential American heavyweights. They havent produced talent since the 80s. Boxers like Dokes, Tubbs or Witherspoon that get accused of being crap were talented boxers. They would kick ass today.

Think they could get their fat legs up that high?

Of course the NFL didn't exist before 1990.

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

catchweight wrote:Lewis was a top heavyweight but the division was in decline when he came in. He said it himself. "My job is to get rid of these heavyweight msifits" or something like that.

I think NFL has robbed all the potential American heavyweights. They havent produced talent since the 80s. Boxers like Dokes, Tubbs or Witherspoon that get accused of being crap were talented boxers. They would kick ass today.

Think they could get their fat legs up that high?

Of course the NFL didn't exist before 1990.

Perhaps try watching......Tubbs vs Smith................Page vs Tubbs..........Holmes v witherspoon...........Page v witherspoon

Instead of spouting ignorant tripe.........

It existed before the 1990s but the commercial element of it exploded then and the teams could spend outrageous money.

No top athlete in their right mind would choose a living of being punched in the head and taking years to start earning big money when the can get a straight up offer of millions of dollars for signing up to other pro sports.

You cant recognise talent by the way. I thought you were having a laugh earlier but if not sweet jesus, your in need of help.

What can we expect of you next? Enzo Maccarinelli knocking out Sonny Liston for the WBCIBOFU world cruiserweight title on the undercard of a Joe Louis v Rocky Marciano shot drinking contest?

DAVE667 wrote:

catchweight wrote:To be fair, Lewis beat a lot crap as well. He came in as champ when the division began to die on its ass.

Tua was good on his day but he was a disgusting fat mess against Lewis. McCall, Akinwade and Golota were mental cases and Tyson was shot to sh1t (and a mental head case) by the time he fought Lewis.

The f*****g guy is Samoan, what do you expect? Lewis nullified every aspect of Tua's gamewhen people expected Tua power to be relevant in that fight.

But how difficult was this to do? A small HW like Byrd outboxed a leaner and lighter Tua.
Rahman (hardly an ATG) also nullified every aspect of Tua's game up until he got caught with an (illegal) punch. Even Maskaev was doing a number on him until his dodgy chin let him down.

Point is, Catchweight is suggesting that Tua's only bad day was against Lewis and that's the reason he was beaten not that Lewis did anything to faciliate the loss

DAVE667 wrote:Point is, Catchweight is suggesting that Tua's only bad day was against Lewis and that's the reason he was beaten not that Lewis did anything to faciliate the loss

Fair enough. I agree that Lewis would have beaten any version of Tua in a similar manner. The extra weight wouldnt have helped but it was more a lack of ability that lost him the fight with Lewis, not the lack of condition.

No DAVE, misquoting yet again. Tua was an out of shape slob against Lewis the same way Tyson was shot to sh1t against Lewis. Neither were near their best. Not Lewis' fault, like he said himself, he was getting rid of the misfits. But he fought a lardass Tua who plainly couldnt have trained hard for the fight.

Post Klit.............A Tua type is just what the heavies need..........

Timing is everything though..

Tua was good when he was in shape but he became a morbidly obese stationary fatso and was then average henceforth.

Really as a Golota who had just given Bowe absolute hell for two fights, I'd like to see either of them do that.

Benson, you think Byrd is as dangerous and highly regarded as Tua is? Wlad would soil himself being in against a puncher like him.

Wlad - Tua............Is a bit like Wlad-Bruno.............If either lands it's over but if Wlad can smother till the steam leaves.........Then It's his fight..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Wlad - Tua............Is a bit like Wlad-Bruno.............If either lands it's over but if Wlad can smother till the steam leaves.........Then It's his fight..

Not so sure, Tua could take a decent shot whereas Wlad would be on silly street but that would only be pre-Manny version of Wlad. The Steward version ekes out an absolute stinker by, as you say, looking to play piggy back for 12 rounds

An in shape Tua would probably splatter Klitschko at some point. A lardass Tua would just provide target practice to someone of Klitschko disposition.

I don't think Wlad stands much chance of stopping Tua, far more cautious than Lewis who landed some sickening right hands to no effect.

Tua was Ok. He was never an A grade heavyweight - I'd take someone like Ray Mercer to tan him, for example.

Golota looked a monster against Bowe but he collapsed mentally against Lewis. This was a guy that boxed in the 190s as an amateur (and then bulked up to 244 pounds ). Lewis was naturally much bigger and stronger, as Golota had found out while serving as his sparring partner in '93.

The Klitschko's competition has been dreadful. Apart from Lewis, Brewster, Peter, Sanders and maybe Povetkin I'd be struggling to name one fighter that went in with them intent on giving it a go.

hazharrison wrote:Tua was Ok. He was never an A grade heavyweight - I'd take someone like Ray Mercer to tan him, for example.

Golota looked a monster against Bowe but he collapsed mentally against Lewis. This was a guy that boxed in the 190s as an amateur (and then bulked up to 244 pounds ). Lewis was naturally much bigger and stronger, as Golota had found out while serving as his sparring partner in '93.

The Klitschko's competition has been dreadful. Apart from Lewis, Brewster, Peter, Sanders and maybe Povetkin I'd be struggling to name one fighter that went in with them intent on giving it a go.

Mercer lost to Jesse Ferguson and a 80 year old Larry Holmes..

Tua has a punchers chance. Against VK that means no chance at all, and against WK it means one chance in a hundred.

This isn't a Lewis love in but it more demonstrates how damn awful the brother opponents have been. The manner in which Lewis dealt with those of similar stature to him is also telling.

Haz, Ali was a light heavyweight as an amateur, I don't place much stock on an amateur record really. Golota had grown into being a genuine heavyweight, am enjoying all the excuses for all Lewis' wins though.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

hazharrison wrote:Tua was Ok. He was never an A grade heavyweight - I'd take someone like Ray Mercer to tan him, for example.

Golota looked a monster against Bowe but he collapsed mentally against Lewis. This was a guy that boxed in the 190s as an amateur (and then bulked up to 244 pounds ). Lewis was naturally much bigger and stronger, as Golota had found out while serving as his sparring partner in '93.

The Klitschko's competition has been dreadful. Apart from Lewis, Brewster, Peter, Sanders and maybe Povetkin I'd be struggling to name one fighter that went in with them intent on giving it a go.

Mercer lost to Jesse Ferguson and a 80 year old Larry Holmes..

Yep. But when he was motivated under Parks he went more or less evens up over 30 rounds with Lewis, Holyfield and a rejuvenated Witherspoon.

catchweight wrote:It existed before the 1990s but the commercial element of it exploded then and the teams could spend outrageous money.

No top athlete in their right mind would choose a living of being punched in the head and taking years to start earning big money when the can get a straight up offer of millions of dollars for signing up to other pro sports.

You cant recognise talent by the way. I thought you were having a laugh earlier but if not sweet jesus, your in need of help.

What can we expect of you next? Enzo Maccarinelli knocking out Sonny Liston for the WBCIBOFU world cruiserweight title on the undercard of a Joe Louis v Rocky Marciano shot drinking contest?

The NFL excuse is just that - an excuse. It's like the little kid who starts getting beaten at his own game saying that he's not trying anymore.

What next? Ricky Hatton lost to Mayweather because football is so popular over here.

The rest of the world caught up and surpassed the US in boxing. It is hardly surprising seeing as there are 5 billion people outside the US.

Next you'll be saying boxing is the only sport that has gone backwards over the last 50 years.

Enzo Macca has a weak chin but I've never seen him KO'd by fresh air...the good ol' days eh?

"a Joe Louis v Rocky Marciano shot drinking contest?"

They were both alcoholics anyway weren't they? fitted in with the training those days.

Hammersmith harrier wrote:This isn't a Lewis love in but it more demonstrates how damn awful the brother opponents have been. The manner in which Lewis dealt with those of similar stature to him is also telling.

Haz, Ali was a light heavyweight as an amateur, I don't place much stock on an amateur record really. Golota had grown into being a genuine heavyweight, am enjoying all the excuses for all Lewis' wins though.

I think the board's had enough unsubstantiated PED accusations today and, loathe as I am to add to them, both Lewis (well, his team) and Bowe accused Golota of using anabolic steroids.

Nah you just wouldnt know a good heavyweight if one punched you in face. Its obvious to anyone with even the basic understanding of boxing that the U.S just isnt producing talented heavyweights for whatever the reason (I think the larger Americans are going into other sports). Its stark staring obvious. They have gone from Ali, Frazier and Foreman to Chris Arreola and Tony Thompson. Boxing evolution of the highest order no doubt.

As for the rest of the stuff, keep it coming. Comedy gold.

Louis and Marciano alcoholics, now that's funny, imagine what the Rocks engine would have been like were tee total.

Typical Haz..............Duran wasn't motivated for the return v Leonard.........Liston wasn't against Ali....Chavez was peed off with the sport against Oscar....Now Mercer...

Excuses always for the guys he likes...The once he doesn't well they always lost when they were at their best..

catchweight wrote:Nah you just wouldnt know a good heavyweight if one punched you in face. Its obvious to anyone with even the basic understanding of boxing that the U.S just isnt producing talented heavyweights for whatever the reason (I think the larger Americans are going into other sports). Its stark staring obvious. They have gone from Ali, Frazier, Tubbs and Foreman to Chris Arreola and Tony Thompson. Boxing evolution of the highest order no doubt.

As for the rest of the stuff, keep it coming. Comedy gold.

I've corrected it for you

Maybe Wilder can reignite the HW division cos he's really good isn't he, nothing to do with him being American.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Typical Haz..............Duran wasn't motivated for the return v Leonard.........Liston wasn't against Ali....Chavez was peed off with the sport against Oscar....Now Mercer...

Excuses always for the guys he likes...The once he doesn't well they always lost when they were at their best..

Do you make these quotes up?

Mercer rededicated himself to the sport after the Ferguson fiasco. Plain fact and common knowledge.

They aren't quotes they are arguments you have made....

You made excuses for Duran for the 2nd fight.........When he only won the first by 1 point and Leonard fought the wrong fight...

You did say Chavez was peed off with the sport when he lost tO Oscar...

You remarked to Rowley...Liston said he fell over against Ali........and thought that enough rebuttal.........I mean If a fighter says it......it must be true..

You make up excuses for your little faves............

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

catchweight wrote:Nah you just wouldnt know a good heavyweight if one punched you in face. Its obvious to anyone with even the basic understanding of boxing that the U.S just isnt producing talented heavyweights for whatever the reason (I think the larger Americans are going into other sports). Its stark staring obvious. They have gone from Ali, Frazier, Tubbs and Foreman to Chris Arreola and Tony Thompson. Boxing evolution of the highest order no doubt.

As for the rest of the stuff, keep it coming. Comedy gold.

I've corrected it for you

Maybe Wilder can reignite the HW division cos he's really good isn't he, nothing to do with him being American.

Come on, thats weak. What else you got?

How about Roy Jones beating Ali at cruiserweight with David Haye bombing out George Foreman at heavyweight?

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:They aren't quotes they are arguments you have made....

You made excuses for Duran for the 2nd fight.........When he only won the first by 1 point and Leonard fought the wrong fight...

You did say Chavez was peed off with the sport when he lost tO Oscar...

You remarked to Rowley...Liston said he fell over against Ali........and thought that enough rebuttal.........I mean If a fighter says it......it must be true..

You make up excuses for your little faves............

What a sad man you are. I've already substantiated those views - why you continually need me to repeat myself is beyond me.

So, in your head, no fighter was ever more or less motivated for different fights in their career? Sound logic.

How can you substantiate those views........

They are complete crap...........

I might be sad..........But I'm not as BITTER as some muppet that hates on the youth of today...

Jones gets hammered off Louis........."170" pound Conn however was a master boxer..

Just shut up..

It's no excuse though Haz, it is something within their control.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:How can you substantiate those views........

They are complete crap...........

I might be sad..........But  I'm not as BITTER as some muppet that hates on the youth of today...

Jones gets hammered off Louis........."170" pound Conn however was a master boxer..

Just shut up..

Again, never claimed Conn was anything.

So, Mercer was just as motivated for Jesse Ferguson as he was Lewis yeah? So you'd rate Ferguson just as tough?

And Liston didn't dive against Ali? That's you and Rowley (in the entire world). Right on.

catchweight wrote:

Mayweathers cellmate wrote:

catchweight wrote:Nah you just wouldnt know a good heavyweight if one punched you in face. Its obvious to anyone with even the basic understanding of boxing that the U.S just isnt producing talented heavyweights for whatever the reason (I think the larger Americans are going into other sports). Its stark staring obvious. They have gone from Ali, Frazier, Tubbs and Foreman to Chris Arreola and Tony Thompson. Boxing evolution of the highest order no doubt.

As for the rest of the stuff, keep it coming. Comedy gold.

I've corrected it for you

Maybe Wilder can reignite the HW division cos he's really good isn't he, nothing to do with him being American.

Come on, thats weak. What else you got?

How about Roy Jones beating Ali at cruiserweight with David Haye bombing out George Foreman at heavyweight?

If only Foreman brought out his fat reducing grill in the 80's, think what it could've done for those lard ass HW's.

Hammersmith harrier wrote:It's no excuse though Haz, it is something within their control.

What is? I've lost my thread dealing with FLUFFMAN.

Are we talking Duran? Quite agree. He chose the lifestyle he chose - I haven't made excuses for him. I've merely stated the obvious: He wasn't the same fighter from the first fight.

You "never claimed Conn was anything."........But Jones gets hammered...

Even worse.........

Let's not insult eachother but do admit........

1. You make up silly excuses for all the guys you like........

2. You don't give modern fighters their due..

3. That I've seen more of Mercer than you...