Sean O'Brien - the best no.7 in the world?

Serious question, SOB has been in incredible form recently and seems unstoppable!
His ball carrying is without doubt better than any other back rower in the world.
He has diversified his game now and is able to read attacking and defensive situations better.
His work at the breakdown is now a big part of his game.If you think this is still a weakness you haven't watched him this season!
So I pose the question to you, is he the complete out and out best no.7 or even back rower in the world?
If not, who is better?
May I remind you he played McCaw off the park in the Aviva!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SZtgohRij5k
A 5 tribute of him, from just 1 game!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BDTmdDhGO50
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aN75j0BiIX0
Hand off!

this is a ridiculous thread.

the flaws in your OP are just too numerous even to start.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umDr0mPuyQc

quinsforever wrote:this is a ridiculous thread.

the flaws in your OP are just too numerous even to start.

Please start!

His ball carrying is without doubt better than any other back rower in the world.

- plenty of doubt there

He has diversified his game now and is able to read attacking and defensive situations better.

- hardly a ringing endorsement, more a recognition of past weakness

May I remind you he played McCaw off the park in the Aviva!

- any given day. and mccaw is getting on a bit.

good luck with your thread, sorry if i was a bit abrupt, have had an irritating evening.

am off to bed now, for real this time.

quinsforever wrote:His ball carrying is without doubt better than any other back rower in the world.

- plenty of doubt there

He has diversified his game now and is able to read attacking and defensive situations better.

- hardly a ringing endorsement, more a recognition of past weakness

May I remind you he played McCaw off the park in the Aviva!

- any given day. and mccaw is getting on a bit.

Please suggest a better 7 , I dare you!

I remember Mike Phillips a good few years ago being described as a great player but not a great scrumhalf. You could say O'Brien is a great player but not a great 7. But even so, he's become a pretty bloody good 7.

The forward momentum he can give a team in attack is priceless and makes him among Ireland's most important players. It's a big blow that he's injured. Would any Irish player be missed more at the moment?

Feckless Rogue wrote:I remember Mike Phillips a good few years ago being described as a great player but not a great scrumhalf. You could say O'Brien is a great player but not a great 7. But even so, he's become a pretty bloody good 7.

The forward momentum he can give a team in attack is priceless and makes him among Ireland's most important players. It's a big blow that he's injured. Would any Irish player be missed more at the moment?

Invalid point

He would be in contention for the title at very least, I agree!

PredictorofTeams wrote:

Feckless Rogue wrote:I remember Mike Phillips a good few years ago being described as a great player but not a great scrumhalf. You could say O'Brien is a great player but not a great 7. But even so, he's become a pretty bloody good 7.

The forward momentum he can give a team in attack is priceless and makes him among Ireland's most important players. It's a big blow that he's injured. Would any Irish player be missed more at the moment?

Invalid point

Ok, you win fair and square.

Feckless Rogue wrote:Would any Irish player be missed more at the moment?

Seanie and Healy, for me, are probably the two go-to players at the moment. Both are invaluable in the loose and at the breakdown, and are amongst the best in their respective positions in the world.

I prefer Dusautoir, Hooper, McCaw.

He spends too much time in the gym, makes breaks with little support, and is getting more prone to injury. Another Stephen Ferris in the making.

Warburton is miles ahead of O'Brien

Feckless Rogue wrote:I remember Mike Phillips a good few years ago being described as a great player but not a great scrumhalf. You could say O'Brien is a great player but not a great 7. But even so, he's become a pretty bloody good 7.

The forward momentum he can give a team in attack is priceless and makes him among Ireland's most important players. It's a big blow that he's injured. Would any Irish player be missed more at the moment?

I like your point. One could say MP is a 8.5 while SOB is a great 7.5 with his ball carrying abilities

I'd say at this point in time SOB is near the top of the tree. Perhaps not clearly the no.1 but with McCaw fading and not many obvious standouts in terms of current form ( last few months) pretty close I'd say.

he played a good part in the third lions test. id say he's one of the top sevens in the north . has a Welsh fan Im not not too unhappy hes not fit when Wales play Ireland .is he going to miss the entire 6 nations .

I think its a fair thread, O'Brien for me is one of the best back rowers in world rugby for sure. Watch his performances against NZ over the last 4 games if you doubt it.

He's excellent on the deck, a powerful ball carrier and has an incredible work rate.

Is he the best 7.... hmm I think there are better specialist opensides, and McCaw is still the best - Alberts too is a phenomenal player and there are some excellent players in Europe like Robshaw, Armitage, Warburton.....

Personally I wouldn't swap O'Brien for anyone though.

Scratch wrote:Warburton is miles ahead of O'Brien

Thats pretty funny. I think you meant it to be funny yeah?

Warburton is quality though but in a slump.

Pot Hale wrote:I prefer Dusautoir, Hooper, McCaw.

He spends too much time in the gym, makes breaks with little support, and is getting more prone to injury. Another Stephen Ferris in the making.  

"He spends too much time in the gym"

How do you know? I doubt it, Id say he is just an Ox because he grew up on a farm and wrestled bulls for fun.

"Breaks with little support"

Hardly his fault if someone isnt there to support him. Not sure if this is true anyway.

"Injury prone"

Time will tell. Ferris has a chronic knee injury so his case is a little different.

PredictorofTeams wrote:

quinsforever wrote:His ball carrying is without doubt better than any other back rower in the world.

- plenty of doubt there

He has diversified his game now and is able to read attacking and defensive situations better.

- hardly a ringing endorsement, more a recognition of past weakness

May I remind you he played McCaw off the park in the Aviva!

- any given day. and mccaw is getting on a bit.

Please suggest a better 7 , I dare you!

He dared you. You can't back down from that or you will be a chicken.   

Robshaw

Robshaw +1

McCaw, Louw, Dusatoir, Robshaw, O'Brien would be my top 5 in some order (probably going to upset our Welsh cousins but its my top 5 )

Followed by Warbutron, Hooper, Tipuric, and all the young pretenders like Cane, Gill etc

Scrumpy wrote:Robshaw +1

I agree... 2 Robshaws would probably be better than O'Brien ....

Harsh rodders. 

Tipuric has potential but is being held back by Warbs/Gats at the top level.

GunsGerms wrote:

Scratch wrote:Warburton is miles ahead of O'Brien

Thats pretty funny. I think you meant it to be funny yeah?

Warburton is quality though but in a slump.

SOB always makes an impact. Doesn't often have bad games. Warburton these days seems to have the odd amazing game and too many quiet games. He also appears to be made out of glass.

Its very difficult to ultimately say who is best because of how they fit into the team they are in. In the England team I'd love to have SOB but not at the expense of Robshaw

Is Robshaw not best suited to being an 8 in reality? SOB tends to play 6 or 7.

So just reading the last post denotes the view that both Warburton and Robshaw is better than him?

Valid opinions.... everyone has one.

I ask people though. Would Warburton be the difference that might unlock France for the Irish...or would O'Brien be more likely the difference that might unlock Australia for the Welsh?

Louw's pretty good too.

GunsGerms wrote:Is Robshaw not best suited to being an 8 in reality? SOB tends to play 6 or 7.

Robshaw is pretty big and can play right across the back row but he doesnt have that kind of dynamic hole punching power carrying game that we at the moment need from that position.

If I was picking a Lions backrow I'd try and include both SOB and Robshaw. I'd think about Brown but national bias or not would need a lot of convincing to consider Warburton

There's a decent argument that Tipuric is the better Welsh 7, certainly on current form.

If the Lions was now - SOB, Wood, Robshaw and Tipuric would be a pretty good starting point at the flanker position

I am a Robshaw fan too. I think some of his great strengths are intangibles such as attitude, unselfishness, leadership etc. Maybe this is why he didnt get a Lions call up? He is also very consistent and effective at the breakdown. I too would like to see him line out beside SOB.

quinsforever wrote:His ball carrying is without doubt better than any other back rower in the world.

- plenty of doubt there

He has diversified his game now and is able to read attacking and defensive situations better.

- hardly a ringing endorsement, more a recognition of past weakness

May I remind you he played McCaw off the park in the Aviva!

- any given day. and mccaw is getting on a bit.

When Robshaw played McCaw off the park (and then followed it up by matching him the next time they met), he still "wasn't a real 7".

SOB is up there but there's lots of competition at 7, each of McCaw, Cane, Louw (my favourite for the best actually), Robshaw, Warburton, Tipuric, SOB, J Burger, Hooper and then injured players or or those who have been off the int scene for a while like Pocock, Barclay, Rennie and I assume someone Frenchbthat I'm missing - they all have their qualities and of every position, it is IMO one of the most flexible. I personally would love a SOB - Robshaw or SOB- Louw or SOB- Burger backrow as I think SOB is int class at least at 6 and 7, but to definitively say the best is pretty hard to back up

It's one of those players where he's as good as the others in that category, so the team with him wouldn't swap him out, the team without him doesn't need to swap him in. Like if I made a Quins- Leinster 23, mine would be:

15- Brown
14- Williams
13- Lowe when fit, but now BOD
12- Darcy
11- Fitzgerald, with Monye and Walker close behind
10- Nev
9- Care
8- Easter
7- Robshaw
6- SOB
5- Cullen
4- Toner
3- Ross
2- Ward
1- Healy, just

Marler, Strauss, Collier, Robson, Heaslip, Reddan, Madigan, Kearney

I expect nd accept that a Leinster fan would probably pick a vastly different squad!

Yeah would probably just pick the Leinster team plus Care and Robshaw. Brown is decent too and with Marler would easily make the bench or be used for rotation. Maybe I just dont know the rest of the Quins team well enough.

I dont think Tom Williams would be allowed play for/with Leinster.  

I actually rate SOB as oneof the best flankers in the world, I wouldn't say he IS the best, I think that title generally varies at any time as there's a group of players who have the ability to shine amongst their peers dependant on form and injuries (there's too many variables to really judge who IS the best).

I'll list my top flankers below, in no particular order.

SOB
McCaw
Alberts
Louw
Dussatoir
Lobbe
Barbieri
Tupiric
Hooper
Wood

Is SOB not best suited to a 6 or 8 role?

He's right up there in back row stakes - 6 or 8 (given a good run there)...but im not sure id have him as the best 7.

ChequeredJersey wrote:
8- Easter

ah Here!

I thought you were serious until I saw that.   

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:

ChequeredJersey wrote:
8- Easter

ah Here!

I thought you were serious until I saw that.   

Guess you don't watch much AP?

ChequeredJersey wrote:

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:

ChequeredJersey wrote:
8- Easter

ah Here!

I thought you were serious until I saw that.   

Guess you don't watch much AP?

I did until this year. Quins would actually be my favourite English team. Easter is a fine club player. But when you dig out the list of best 8s in the world.... He ain't in the top 10 or even close. Heaslip is in the top 5. (2nd currently for me but not everyone agrees) Faletau is the only one from the 4 Lions nations that comes close.

If Easter was 5 years younger he'd be one of the 1st names on SL team sheet

I respectfully but vehemently disagree

With Jennifer, not Scrumpy

Scrumpy wrote:If Easter was 5 years younger he'd be one of the 1st names on SL team sheet

However, whilst Easter is worthy of much discussion, he definitely doesn't play 7, so let's ]not derail this thread

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:

ChequeredJersey wrote:

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:

ChequeredJersey wrote:
8- Easter

ah Here!

I thought you were serious until I saw that.   

Guess you don't watch much AP?

I did until this year. Quins would actually be my favourite English team. Easter is a fine club player. But when you dig out the list of best 8s in the world.... He ain't in the top 10 or even close. Heaslip is in the top 5. (2nd currently for me but not everyone agrees) Faletau is the only one from the 4 Lions nations that comes close.

Have you been on the guiness...!?  

GeordieFalcon wrote:

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:

ChequeredJersey wrote:

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:

ChequeredJersey wrote:
8- Easter

ah Here!

I thought you were serious until I saw that.   

Guess you don't watch much AP?

I did until this year. Quins would actually be my favourite English team. Easter is a fine club player. But when you dig out the list of best 8s in the world.... He ain't in the top 10 or even close. Heaslip is in the top 5. (2nd currently for me but not everyone agrees) Faletau is the only one from the 4 Lions nations that comes close.

Have you been on the guiness...!?  

Most under rated back row player in Ireland. Gets feck all respect for dragging Leinster and Ireland through games kicking and screaming. (Feck it De rail the thread if we like, not a massively important thread)

Read, Vermeulen, Parisse, Picamoles, Faletau - all over Heaslip for me. Then there's guys like Morgan, Vunipola who I think will show they are outstanding in the next year or so, but as yet haven't done so consistently so for now I would have to put them behind Heaslip

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:

GeordieFalcon wrote:

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:

ChequeredJersey wrote:

Jenifer McLadyboy wrote:

ChequeredJersey wrote:
8- Easter

ah Here!

I thought you were serious until I saw that.   

Guess you don't watch much AP?

I did until this year. Quins would actually be my favourite English team. Easter is a fine club player. But when you dig out the list of best 8s in the world.... He ain't in the top 10 or even close. Heaslip is in the top 5. (2nd currently for me but not everyone agrees) Faletau is the only one from the 4 Lions nations that comes close.

Have you been on the guiness...!?  

Most under rated back row player in Ireland. Gets feck all respect for dragging Leinster and Ireland through games kicking and screaming. (Feck it De rail the thread if we like, not a massively important thread)

I see a resemblance to a certain other 8 whose Club performances have only improved since he was dropped by England...

BamBam wrote:Read, Vermeulen, Parisse, Picamoles, Faletau - all over Heaslip for me. Then there's guys like Morgan, Vunipola who I think will show they are outstanding in the next year or so, but as yet haven't done so consistently so for now I would have to put them behind Heaslip

Don't forget the currently injured JMF!

That's because he is a great club player.    And as slow a glacier....