France v England - Paris - 01/02/2014

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French XXIII

1. T Domingo 2. B Kayser 3. N Mas
4. A Flanquart 5. P Pape
6. Y Nyanga 7. B Le Roux 8. L Picamoles
9. J-M Doussin 10. J Plisson
12. W Fofana 13. M Basteraud
11. M Medard 15. B Dulin 14. Y Huget

16. D Sarzewski 17. Y Forestier 18. R Slimani 19. Y Maestri 20. A Burban 21. D Chouly 22. M Machenaud 23. G Fickou

England XXIII

1. J Marler
2. D Hartley
3. D Cole
4. J Launchbury
5. C Lawes
6. T Wood
7. C Robshaw
8. B Vunipola
9. D Care
10. O Farrell
11. J May
12. B Twelvetrees
13. L Burrell
14. J Nowell
15. M Brown

16. T Youngs 17. M Vunipola 18. H Thomas 19. D Attwood 20. B Morgan 21. L Dickson 22. B Barritt 23. A Goode

We'll be mid table this season if we're lucky.

BamBam wrote:French are all over the ball at the ruck.

I hope that those missed 3 points at the end when we had pen advantage doesn't come back to haunt us. A Gregan style accidental knock on could have been useful

I've been right far too often for my own liking today

yappysnap wrote:Don't want to start a witch hunt but another game where a key Tom Youngs error makes a huge potential difference.

Your an idiot. What about all the other errors by some of the players or you just going to highlight Tom Youngs?

Lancaster's 60mins subs made us lose our way there, not the only reason we lost but that seemed to take the purpose out of our come back.

England need to look at their handling and how they attack right from the start. Still far too many sloppy passes and dropped balls.

england were very very unlucky. they dug deep, and were tremendous up front.

great game to watch. amazingly clean, no niggle.

was on my turbo trainer during the whole match and my heart rate was 20 beats higher for 2 hours...

really well played england. lots of positives.

Great game. England can be proud of that fightback but were stunned early on. France had to find something special and they looked bereft of ideas on attack for much of that second half and I hope PSA looks at that play and with speed and offloading scored against the run of play. That sets up their season but England showed they look good and possibly the lack of experience out wide told in the end but these are lessons that are learned hard but if taken on will make England a more formidable unit.

We're short a lot of first choice players and several debutants/inexperienced ones. Absolutely gutted, but well done France.

we just thought we won the game and took our feet of the gas..

Oh well. the play was promising enough..

the tourny is very much still on..

Congrats whocares. A fine win in the end.  

nathan wrote:

yappysnap wrote:Don't want to start a witch hunt but another game where a key Tom Youngs error makes a huge potential difference.

What about all the other errors by some of the players or you just going to highlight Tom Youngs?

Definitely there were lots of other errors but that one in particular is a recurring theme. Chill out.

Terrible handling, dodgy scrummaging and some amazing French flair at the end all did for us as well. But when you've just got ahead and you have a 5m scrum you must get something from it, and that's the second time in two games Youngs has blown that exact position for us. Literally carbon copies.

thought we played ok, got better during the game but thats to be expected with them being a bit rusty.

yappysnap wrote:Don't want to start a witch hunt but another game where a key Tom Youngs error makes a huge potential difference.

 The two first try wihich were gifted were more to blame.

 Also the tactics were poor. Why Burrell on the wing. Twelvetrees was poor the backs cant finish by themselves the forwards carriers carry them.

 Brown and Care were immense

I blame lancs for that loss! Subs when not needed!

Lancaster busy writting his own obituary.

Defence from the backs has just been abysmal, and far too many errors. We are now look at a side with even more injuries and even further away from knowing who should play in the backs and how.

Even big games from Vunipola, Lawes and Brown not enough to matter. Burrell and 36 got better after bad start but really the new kids havent covered themselves in glory.

What a brilliant game of rugby!! Just so entertaining. Well done to both teams.

Well done France  

this side's fluency and communication will only improve in the backs over the campaign. shame May broke his nose after 8 minutes. wanted to see how he went.

was glad to see nowell at least try to make breaks. he gave away some possession, but almost made acouple of try-scoring breaks.

am v encouraged.

also didnt read any of this thread during the entire match so feeling quite happy

GeordieFalcon wrote:I blame lancs for that loss! Subs when not needed!

 Agreed why take off laws and Dickson in particular. Barrett should of been on for 36. and left Burrell in centre.

yappysnap wrote:

nathan wrote:

yappysnap wrote:Don't want to start a witch hunt but another game where a key Tom Youngs error makes a huge potential difference.

What about all the other errors by some of the players or you just going to highlight Tom Youngs?

Definitely there were lots of other errors but that one in particular is a recurring theme. Chill out.

Terrible handling, dodgy scrummaging and some amazing French flair at the end all did for us as well. But when you've just got ahead and you have a 5m scrum you must get something from it, and that's the second time in two games Youngs has blown that exact position for us. Literally carbon copies.

Well to blame just one single player for an error and ignore every other mistake is stupid. What about the mistakes that actually led to points for France.

To be fair Morgan was brilliant and Vunipola was also hurting France. Any news on Farrell? What will England do if he's out for a few games?

Well played France and commiserations England - so close.

Thoroughly entertaining game for the neutral. Nice to see Lawes really making good on his promise. Launchberry as well. Care showed why I think he is the best option for England - why was he subbed? Goode is another I thought looked good. Mixed bag from 36. Nowell and Farrell. I thought Farrell kicked good ball away a few times but also did some good stuff.

France - I think thy tried to defend their halftime lead and failed - insted of putting England away but never gave up when they went behind and won the game with the best bit of Rugby of the day.

Yea bringing Barrett on just for the sake of muddying his shirt and so having to move Burrell to the wing was a terrible idea. Why does Lancaster hate having wingers on the wing?!

Likewise Dicksons arrival was like clockwork just when Care had got into his groove.

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:To be fair Morgan was brilliant and Vunipola was also hurting France. Any news on Farrell? What will England do if he's out for a few games?

only cramp I think

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Lancaster busy writting his own obituary.

Defence from the backs has just been abysmal, and far too many errors. We are now look at a side with even more injuries and even further away from knowing who should play in the backs and how.

Even big games from Vunipola, Lawes and Brown not enough to matter. Burrell and 36 got better after bad start but really the new kids havent covered themselves in glory.

what game were you watching?

If I wasn't so hungover I'd go and get wasted now

I was thinking that the subs would win the match and was certain it would be Englands subs. Never for one second did I think about the positioning of the subs, SL made huge mistakes with the positioning of his subs.

Owens is brilliant other then when it comes to scrum time. Perhaps it's time for him to actually ready the law book instead of doing his promotional stuff.

thought Care should have stayed on, but to be fair to lancs, morgan and t youngs were awesome in the loose, mako too. and they didnt exactly make the scrum any worse than it had been

great game. really enjoyed it, in spite of the result.

france will feel very very relieved.

Did Lamcaster bring Barritt on for the sake of it or is Nowell injured? Cause if it's the former, that's enough reason for him to go and beat his head against a wall for a year.

TJ wrote: Goode is another I thought looked good.

Are you right in the head?   

i think the bomber wants to build experience in more than 15 players to spread the experience. Longer term it might be the right thing, but short term it doesnt half urine you off.

i thought goode and 36 were unremarkable at best.

Good news oakey!

You could argue that England took the foot off the throat near the end there but that's exactly what France did 16 3 up. Hopefully PSA sees the sense in attacking rugby because for much of that second half it was pretty awful stuff, albeit credit must be given to England who disrupted French ball at the breakdown.

When I see the pace that France has, there's no need not to have that pack doing the work up front but how many times were the French backs standing deep and not getting over the advantage line. Stand up flatter and attack the line and look to offload and there the space can be found and the speed utilised. For much of that second half it was standing deep and shifting predictably laterally and getting closed down in the midfield.

First of all Well done France. A cracking game. Although when England went 16-3 down in the first half, i thought England was in for a thrashing.

But well done England for turning the game around and even taking the Lead for a few minutes any way.

Like i said well done France.

quinsforever wrote:

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Lancaster busy writting his own obituary.

Defence from the backs has just been abysmal, and far too many errors. We are now look at a side with even more injuries and even further away from knowing who should play in the backs and how.

Even big games from Vunipola, Lawes and Brown not enough to matter. Burrell and 36 got better after bad start but really the new kids havent covered themselves in glory.

what game were you watching?

The one where he has already decided he hates Lancaster

ChequeredJersey wrote:

quinsforever wrote:

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Lancaster busy writting his own obituary.

Defence from the backs has just been abysmal, and far too many errors. We are now look at a side with even more injuries and even further away from knowing who should play in the backs and how.

Even big games from Vunipola, Lawes and Brown not enough to matter. Burrell and 36 got better after bad start but really the new kids havent covered themselves in glory.

what game were you watching?

The one where he has already decided he hates Lancaster

you can almost guess what some people are going to say on here, they'll find every reason possible to try and justify there opinion too.

Cracking game!

Disappointed with the result obviously but fair play to France they didn't crack under pressure (or maybe England didn't quite close them out they have in the past).

Thought Farrell played very well and seems to have added a useful dummy to his play Care and Billy V were also excellent.

Twelvetrees' passing was way off at times.

Nowell certainly had an interesting debut but, fair play, he didn't let his head drop. Shame for May getting a bash on the conk so early but Goode stepped in well enough.

Nice to see Burrell get a try.

Too many handling errors and missed tackles as a team though. The scrum wasn't great either.

Morgan was excellent off the bench but, as pointed out above, there was certain loss of momentum with some other substitutions.

formerly known as Sam wrote:Dire first half might cost us here.

Can't blame Goode for that try, he doesn't do well with the two on one but It's Burrell stepping in that leaves the two on one open for France.

People would have had fits if that had been Ashton.
That very much was a case of others being spooned first leaving him totally exposed, woudlve been nice if hed made the tackle but if your defence is reliant on desperation cover then theres something wrong elsewhere. The one where he was rounded earlier was worse.
But by no means the only player to make mistakes, Nowell had some real howlers and covered the entire spectrum of new kid mistakes ... including some horrible ball watching and not bothering to watch where his teammates where.

Its all a bit predictable really. Far too much pressure on England from their own lack of experience. The lack of trust in those around them seemed to encourage players to go alone whether in attack or defence.

France barely saw the ball yet shouldve won that more comfortably if theyd converted more chances.

I feel like Im being harsh on England as they were a borderline TMO call from a win with the care touchdown but I dont feel they in any way deserved a victory and France for the most part were really poor and utterly shut off.

Englands injury crisis is getting worse too. Hopefuly Lawes was just a bit beat up and tired rather than seriously hurt. Farrell the same. Mays face should be OK in a couple of weeks.

But really they have a lot to work on to become a good side. The forwards may look flashy making barnstorming carries and some big hits but they arent doing the basics right.

No excuses, this is 3 years on from when the same happened in the world cup.

Yeah well done France, took their opportunities plus Nyanga, Pickles and the 15 were very good. But I will loudly be supporting everyone against you now

Good game to watch, exciting finish

I knew Fickou would try something when he came on!

So far then in this 6N no one has actually played well yet. Lets see what tomorrows game shows us

Fickou changed his name to Fu ckou with minutes remaining in the match.

Really enjoyable game & could have gone either way. Quite often first games are boring & full of even more errors but this was good entertainment.

France have now been installed as 6N favourites & England are still triple crown favourites but who knows?

quinsforever wrote:

Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:Lancaster busy writting his own obituary.

Defence from the backs has just been abysmal, and far too many errors. We are now look at a side with even more injuries and even further away from knowing who should play in the backs and how.

Even big games from Vunipola, Lawes and Brown not enough to matter. Burrell and 36 got better after bad start but really the new kids havent covered themselves in glory.

what game were you watching?

He prepared that post about 2 years ago. I wouldn't pay much attention.

BigTrevsbigmac wrote:Really enjoyable game & could have gone either way. Quite often first games are boring & full of even more errors but this was good entertainment.

France have now been installed as 6N favourites & England are still triple crown favourites but who knows?

You haven't even seen two of the teams England will need to beat for that Triple Crown play yet.....

The thing that must worry England is that this was a replay of the All Blacks game.

Slow start conceding a huge deficit.

A fight back into the lead.

A loss when the bench players lose all composure.

Also I thought the new English 14 was dismal. The only way he should be near an England shirt again is when he's washing the only he got today.

Steffan wrote:So far then in this 6N no one has actually played well yet. Lets see what tomorrows game shows us

Not for a whole match but in spells they have

For those looking at me...I'm blaming Lancaster because I truly believe his Management of subs etc cost us that game.

However regardless of this game...we're gonna get royal humped off the Welsh!!!

Well I thought that was England's best 6 Nations performance for years. We actually looked dangerous ball in hand. We were unlucky to lose both wings injured, and to conceded two tries from lucky kicks. Still, the way the forwards gained dominance against a French side in France in the loose and the threat we posed ball in hand was very promising. Lots to work on, but a step forward.