Six Nations 2014

First topic message reminder :

Plain and simple, it's the best time of the year. Who will win and why?

Tough call as alway & I'm sure It will be close as usual.
Who would have predicted last years result after the first round of matches?
Now I'm going to contradict myself.....
I think if England beat France in the first game we will be the team to beat with Ireland & Wales at home.

I think Ireland will be targeting the Wales and England games, not to forget Scotland or that Ireland are away from home against England. Schmidt has somewhat alluded to this when he said he wants us to win all of our home games. The idea very much looks like lets win our first two home games and use that momentum + form + confidence to beat England at twickenham.

Thats not to say Ireland will beat Wales or England, however if Ireland beat Wales I think we have a real shot at winning the championship. I'm not going to say a Grand slam because knowing Ireland we will end up losing to France in the last round, whom will have already lost to England and Wales. In the end I do think something like this is going to happen and it's going to come down to points difference between Ireland and Wales, I would put England in there too but Ireland and Wales have far more fire power in the backs.

Ireland (could be 1st or 2nd)
Wales (could be 1st or 2nd)
England
France
Scotland
Italy

So, I take it no one really has more of a clue about this year's tournament than I do.  I can easily see scenarios where France, Wales, Ireland, or England could win it.  I hope we have a clear cut winner and one not based on points differential.  And if that winner wears a red rose then not too bad at all.

France has as only one vote guess 19 persons will be embarassed come saturday night   

3 days to go... Break out the grand slam DVD !!

Too easy an OP.

R1
Wales v Italy
France v England
Ireland v Scotland

R2
Ireland v Wales
Scotland v England
France v Italy

R3
Wales v France
Italy v Scotland
England v Ireland

R4
Ireland v Italy
Scotland v France
England v Wales

R5
Italy v England
Wales v Scotland
France v Ireland


France 10pts (GS)
England 8pts (TC)
Ireland 6pts
Wales 4pts
Scotland 2pts
Italy 0pts (WS & WW)

RugbyFan182 wrote:3 days to go... Break out the grand slam DVD !!

Singular ? God love ya  

Come on, who picked Italy?     

Most tries - France
Most penalty points - Wales
Stingiest defence - Ireland (by a country mile)

1st Ireland
2nd Wales
3rd France
4th England
5th Scotland
6th Italy

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:Too easy an OP.

R1
Wales v Italy
France v England
Ireland v Scotland

R2
Ireland v Wales
Scotland v England
France v Italy

R3
Wales v France
Italy v Scotland
England v Ireland

R4
Ireland v Italy
Scotland v France
England v Wales

R5
Italy v England
Wales v Scotland
France v Ireland


France 10pts (GS)
England 8pts (TC)
Ireland 6pts
Wales 4pts
Scotland 2pts
Italy 0pts (WS & WW)

Didnt you say you thought Ireland would win the 6n?

GunsGerms wrote:

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:Too easy an OP.

R1
Wales v Italy
France v England
Ireland v Scotland

R2
Ireland v Wales
Scotland v England
France v Italy

R3
Wales v France
Italy v Scotland
England v Ireland

R4
Ireland v Italy
Scotland v France
England v Wales

R5
Italy v England
Wales v Scotland
France v Ireland


France 10pts (GS)
England 8pts (TC)
Ireland 6pts
Wales 4pts
Scotland 2pts
Italy 0pts (WS & WW)

Didnt you say you thought Ireland would win the 6n?

Yep. But then I just looked at the games one by one. Had it been an odd year I'd have stuck with Hibernia and their 22m trench warfare policy 100 years on.

Most tries - France
Most penalty points - Wales
Stingiest defence (least tries conceded) - Ireland

Stingiest defence Ireland ? Wales only conceded 3 tries last tournament..I think

And we'll kick the most penalties in a close tournament yet come 4th ?

You think England will suddenly start scoring tries, more than Wales ?

I don't understand your reasoning

munkian wrote:Stingiest defence Ireland ? Wales only conceded 3 tries last tournament..I think

And we'll kick the most penalties in a close tournament yet come 4th ?

You think England will suddenly start scoring tries, more than Wales ?

I don't  understand your reasoning

I expect (as evidenced in my predictions) a return of France to 6Ns interest and form. Unlike last year.
Wales don't have the home games to win.
And I certainly don't expect Ireland to be exciting as an attacking force.

England I expect to be dull and pragmatic with Farrell knocking over plenty of points from the opponents half as they play a grizzly forward game.

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:

munkian wrote:Stingiest defence Ireland ? Wales only conceded 3 tries last tournament..I think

And we'll kick the most penalties in a close tournament yet come 4th ?

You think England will suddenly start scoring tries, more than Wales ?

I don't  understand your reasoning

I expect (as evidenced in my predictions) a return of France to 6Ns interest and form. Unlike last year.
Wales don't have the home games to win.
And I certainly don't expect Ireland to be exciting as an attacking force.

England I expect to be dull and pragmatic with Farrell knocking over plenty of points from the opponents half as they play a grizzly forward game.

But your predictions don't quite make sense -

Most tries - France - fair enough
Most penalty points - Wales - Ok again
Stingiest defence (least tries conceded) - Ireland - Possibly but Wales usually concede the least tries

France 10pts (GS) - Ok - they score most tries, makes sense
England 8pts (TC) - Not sure how England are 2nd - You say Wales will kick more points so you think England will score more tries than Wales
Ireland 6pts - If they have the stingiest defense I thought they would be higher
Wales 4pts - If Wales kick more points than anyone else you think Ireland, England and France will score significantly more tries than Wales which is a complete turnaround from the last few tournaments
Scotland 2pts
Italy 0pts (WS & WW)

I really have no idea this year. I could easily see England, France, Ireland, or Wales winning. I think I can just as easily make a case why each of those 4 teams won't win, as they would be to win. Should be close.

doctor_grey wrote:I really have no idea this year.  I could easily see England, France, Ireland, or Wales winning.  I think I can just as easily make a case why each of those 4 teams won't win, as they would be to win.  Should be close.

That about sums it up to be fair.

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:
And I certainly don't expect Ireland to be exciting as an attacking force.

Your prerogative of course but why so adamant on that one? You do realise we have a new coach who is famous for having his teams play fast attacking rugby? I mean it might not materialise but you have to expect his instincts as a coach to strategise for it.

SecretFly wrote:

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:
And I certainly don't expect Ireland to be exciting as an attacking force.

Your prerogative of course but why so adamant on that one?  You do realise we have a new coach who is famous for having his teams play fast attacking rugby?  I mean it might not materialise but you have to expect his instincts as a coach to strategise for it.

Does he have the players for it ? (Genuine question - not sure on Ireland's injuries)

None of the 6Ns sides are particularly exciting in attack.

He has the bulk of his old Leinster team for the speed work.... nobody can say they're not up to it (All Blacks last year, and first half against Wales last year) They can do steamroll with the best of them if they get into a rhythm.  And then they have the grit and earthiness of Munster and Ulster for the muscle and forward arts

I just can't see how anyone who has looked at Ireland in the last number of years (when they were the highest try scorers in both 6N and I seem to recall highest home nations scoring side in the AIs only two seasons ago when everyone knew we were playing some terribly uninventive rugby under Kidney.) I don't see how anyone can look at the players and not see the potential they have under Schmidt.

He might need longer than this 6N to get his systems fully up and running or to make a massive impact, but there will be some sharp sharp rugby played by them in periods - of that I have no doubt.

SecretFly wrote:He has the bulk of his old Leinster team for the speed work.... nobody can say they're not up to it (All Blacks last year, and first half against Wales last year) They can do steamroll with the best of them if they get into a rhythm.  And then they have the grit and earthiness of Munster and Ulster for the muscle and forward arts

I just can't see how anyone who has looked at Ireland in the last number of years (when they were the highest try scorers in both 6N and I seem to recall highest home nations scoring side in the AIs only two seasons ago when everyone knew we were playing some terribly uninventive rugby under Kidney.) I don't see how anyone can look at the players and not see the potential they have under Schmidt.

He might need longer than this 6N to get his systems fully up and running or to make a massive impact, but there will be some sharp sharp rugby played by them in periods - of that I have no doubt.

So from what you are saying, SF, is that on their day Ireland can beat anyone. That is true.

But not this year - and certainly not everyone imo.
I love their co-ordinated defence as produced from the top three provinces, but I don't expect scorch marks on the field from blistering Irish fliers.
Sound, solid (stolid?) and dependable is how I rate them at the moment but without a rapier attack.

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:
Sound, solid (stolid?) and dependable is how I rate them at the moment but without a rapier attack.

You'll be disappointed that they let you down a few times this season then, Portnoy. It's simply a little funny that a seasoned rugby watcher such as yourself see plod as the name of a Schmidt team - even after so little time in the job and already evidence of the opposite being the case.

So be it - let's see what cooks over the weeks.

SecretFly wrote:

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:
Sound, solid (stolid?) and dependable is how I rate them at the moment but without a rapier attack.

You'll be disappointed that they let you down a few times this season then, Portnoy.  It's simply a little funny that a seasoned rugby watcher such as yourself see plod as the name of a Schmidt team - even after so little time in the job and already evidence of the opposite being the case.  

So be it - let's see what cooks over the weeks.

It's quite possible, SF that Ireland can set the tournament on fire. But the home fixtures just aren't there imo.

But I agree with other posters above, any of England, France, Ireland or Wales could win the tournament.

My predictions are, like everyone else's: just punts (laced with favouritism).

France have the same amount of votes as Scotland

We are not biased here are we lads!!!

Anyway.

Heart Says England,

Head says- impossible call between England and wales , with France coming very close as well.

Wales are favourites but the pressure is on them so who knows, also they don't have the depth of others if they pick up injuries, France, England and Ireland could all take the title this year and it wouldn't be a surprise to see any of them win it

Can't wait to watch it.

Every Time Ref wrote:Wales are favourites but the pressure is on them so who knows, also they don't have the depth of others if they pick up injuries, France, England and Ireland could all take the title this year and it wouldn't be a surprise to see any of them win it

Can't wait to watch it.

Marginally http://www.oddschecker.com/rugby-union/six-nations/winner And it represents what it is - a close contest.

westisbest wrote:1st Ireland
2nd Wales
3rd France
4th England
5th Scotland
6th Italy

+1

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:
Marginally.

 
Thats true but if their players can reach their peak then they have a real chance of winning their third in a row, I can't see anyone stopping them if they stay fit.

Cyril wrote:None of the 6Ns sides are particularly exciting in attack.

Sadly in the last 6N Ireland came last in the amount of clean breaks made, defenders beaten and meters gained out of all teams. I expect this to change this time round though.

Saw this on ESPN:

Lions Tour Year       Following year Six Nations Winners
1997                     1998   France
2001                     2002   France
2005                     2006   France
2009                     2010   France
2013                      

so only the Welsh boys be tired   

RugbyFan182 wrote:Hand on head not heart I think.....

Now secretfly...

1)wales
2)Ireland
3)England
4)Scotland
5)France
6)Italy

Could easily be Ireland 1st tho if they perform....

I can't see France being that far down the table...

I couldn't see France being that far down either last year and they were last!!!

What is it with France and kit designs? They seem to launch a new one every year. I know in this day and age kits are altered frequently but seriously, they'll have had 3 in the last 3 tournaments!

Knowsit17 wrote:What is it with France and kit designs? They seem to launch a new one every year. I know in this day and age kits are altered frequently but seriously, they'll have had 3 in the last 3 tournaments!

They need to pay for all our players somehow...

Biltong wrote:

GunsGerms wrote:

Biltong wrote:Ireland, because I am supporting them this year.

Why?

why not?

I picked Scotland last year, and I want to pick a different team that is either a dark horse or an underdog.

france and Italy doesn't really come into my equation as I don't know any Italians or Frenchmen.

Ireland are my dark horse outside bet, but everything else in me says it will be England.
Unless we get reffed by Walsh.
Anyone know if he is on the schedule ?

That man should never Ref a top game again.

BBC
Did you know? England have scored 200 tries in Six Nations history, 25 more than second-placed France

Boring old England eh ?

I am in two minds about Wales. What they have is big game players and a lot of fitness and mental toughness. On the other hand a couple more injuries could really derail them. They are also still dependent on a few players (e.g. the Phillips and the Adam Jones's) who are not what they used to be.

And other than a certain win at the MS last year they haven't exactly played very well (just a little bit better than most of their 6N competition)

gregortree wrote:

Biltong wrote:

GunsGerms wrote:

Biltong wrote:Ireland, because I am supporting them this year.

Why?

why not?

I picked Scotland last year, and I want to pick a different team that is either a dark horse or an underdog.

france and Italy doesn't really come into my equation as I don't know any Italians or Frenchmen.

Ireland are my dark horse outside bet, but everything else in me says it will be England.
Unless we get reffed by Walsh.
Anyone know if he is on the schedule ?

According to Wikipedia, the great Steve Walsh is only reffing Italy v Scotland (Week 3) and France v Ireland (Week 5) this year.

gregortree wrote:BBC
Did you know? England have scored 200 tries in Six Nations history, 25 more than second-placed France

Boring old England eh ?

well a lot of that is due to a certain period a few years back, and isnt being helped much by the current performances. What I would say though, is that we are so prone to dumb moves and dropped passes that on the odd occasion when the passes stick England can and do score quick tries. Sort of blink and you miss it kind of things, not so much of the slow build up and lots of running side to side that make people think you are good at running the ball.

lostinwales wrote:I am in two minds about Wales. What they have is big game players and a lot of fitness and mental toughness. On the other hand a couple more injuries could really derail them. They are also still dependent on a few players (e.g. the Phillips and the Adam Jones's) who are not what they used to be.

And other than a certain win at the MS last year they haven't exactly played very well (just a little bit better than most of their 6N competition)

i agree with this.

i also think their scrum is going to get mullered by england and france. new rules do not seem to favour an aging Adam Jones and all his experience and nous. plus gethink jenkins well reported knee problems.

and it's going to be very very hard to beat any team that is killing you in the scrum.

I think mullered is pushing it slightly....

George Carlin wrote:Head says England, who will edge Wales out.

Heart says that Ireland are going to rampage through this tournament with their young players really showing what they've got.

See you? You've got a good heart.   

I'm going with Ireland - partly because they are due a good run in the 6N and the autumn indicates it may be coming. Also because other teams are imo having problems at the moment.

gregortree wrote:BBC
Did you know? England have scored 200 tries in Six Nations history, 25 more than second-placed France

Boring old England eh ?

Joint top with games won too.

Whoever wins out of England and Wales wins. France could gatecrash the party in the home nations suffer Lions fatigue.

The Ye Olde Lions Fatigue is a fair old excuse sure enough. It's in the muzzle, ready for instant use.