GEORGE GROVES - Starting mind games early?

Just hearing on the radio that George Groves is petitioning the BBBC to have his fight with Froch declared a No Contest due to Howard Foster's error (essentially a view upheld by the IBF)

Now I'm sure there ar any number of posters who will simply see this as sheer desperation on the part of Groves and a clear indicator that he lacks the emotional maturity to accept defeat and move on with his life and career.

However, a part of me thinks that this is simply the start of a sustained and prolonged psychological warfare campaign designed to upset Froch and get under his skin once again. We all saw how Groves reduced Froch to tears during the Sky Sports interview with his unwillingness to bend in the face of Froch's verbal assault and his ability to match and beat Carl at his own game.

I think George is playing a very clever game here and come fight night, Froch won't know (to quote my Dad) whether to sh!t or go blind.

I look forward to seeing what George has up his sleeve next.

Haha, my thoughts exactly Dave, think Groves is playign the wind up merchant to be honest, I don't think for one second he believes that the actual decision would be overturned.

Of course Groves should just sign the contract and stop being an effing twerp and stop being an annoying balding ginger... Is some other peoples thoughts on the matter. Thought I'd get there before them.

Imagine the decision is overturned though Alex, the chairman of the BBBoC said at the time that the stoppage was fine, well the IBF disagree with you mate so it'll be interesting to see if they suddenly feel the same way.

If it does get overturned I will be looking forward to what Froch comes out with.

AlexHuckerby wrote:Of course Groves should just sign the contract .

Pretty much where I am Alex. Get bored with all this build up, mind games and twitter drivel we seemingly have to endure in the build up to any fight. Think the Manny Floyd situation has misguidedly created a belief that unless we endure six months of BS and bickering in the run up to the fight it is not a big event. Guess it helps shift PPV’s to morons who have only just graduated from the wrestling but it bores me rigid.

The first fight was controversial and entertaining, as such the rematch sells itself, sign the contracts, shut up and turn up when you’re meant to and have a fight. That applies to both of them I should add.

Rowley wrote:

AlexHuckerby wrote:Of course Groves should just sign the contract .

Pretty much where I am Alex. Get bored with all this build up, mind games and twitter drivel we seemingly have to endure in the build up to any fight. Think the Manny Floyd situation has misguidedly created a belief that unless we endure six months of BS and bickering in the run up to the fight it is not a big event. Guess it helps shift PPV’s to morons who have only just graduated from the wrestling but it bores me rigid.

The first fight was controversial and entertaining, as such the rematch sells itself, sign the contracts, shut up and turn up when you’re meant to and have a fight. That applies to both of them I should add.

Deary me, where would the sport be if people just got on with doing what they were supposed to a stopped piddling about?

Groves is as likely to talk himself out of a fight than into a second. He is starting to annoy the cr** out of me with his whinging. He was about to be stopped, IMO. Foster did him a favour. Just sign the rematch and shut up.

Nah, Froch is already aware that he's in danger of being labelled a ducker (rightly or wrongly, I don't really care) by idiots on internet forums (hang on....) and he'll sign to face Groves again.

He fought tooth and nail to get Kessler again, he's desperate to get the sh!t kicked out of him by rematch Ward again and it just looks a bit fishy if he doesn't give the same consideration to a fellow fighter who was arguably closer to winning his fight than Froch was in his two losses.

Would like to echo Sean and ask the little ginger kid to just sign the bloody contract. This isn't mind games, to suggest so makes absolutely no sense.... By phishing off Froch he could just drive him to going to GGG and America which leaves the little ginger twit up brownarse creek without a paddle.

Froch hasn't exactly been all over the media, think he's the one being smart by letting Groves run his mouth and get some support back in his favour.

And Dave. Froch knows he can take the best Gingerroves has to give, the latter now knows if he doesn't get him out of there early he's gonna get his head kicked in around the championship rounds and trying to keep him off for the final 12 minutes will be like trying to stop a king cobra from swallowing your dong after you've painted it to make it look like a bunny rabbit - whilst being strapped naked in a chair.

To me Groves just can't accept he got beaten and the fight was slipping away. He's the one jeapordising the fight, not Froch - he's had Hearn make an offer that would earn Gingertittie over twice what he earned first time round.

Nothing from Froch??

He seems remarkably quiet.


Gorges likes the money, he saw what uncle David earned and wants a piece of that action.

Froch hasn't been all over the media as his stock fell pretty sharply after the fight. He was as ungracious in victory as he was in defeat and refused to acknowledge that Groves had come close to beating him and beating him convincingly (something that Froch didn't do...having been ably assisted by Howard Foster).

As for Froch taking the best Groves can give...how do you know what Groves has to give? Of the two fighters there's only one of them going to be getting any better and it isn't Froch. Had that first round been another thirty seconds long, Froch would have been stopped and damn near everyone who saw the fight believes it.

The only thing stopping Groves from beating Froch is the arrogance of youth but I think that 2nd time around he'll keep his head and get the job done in convincing fashion.

Disagree.

Groves knows if he starts that quick again and doesn't stop him he's got Froch coming at him like a tank in the second half of the fight and didn't cope when he started walking through his punches.

To me we saw Froch not on top of his game and then only warm to the task as the fight drew on. Yes, disservice to Groves as I believe he may have pulled out a defining performance and won't hit that level again - certainly not in the rematch which for me Froch wins.

Gatti beats Ward first time round, gets comprehensively beaten in the 2 rubbers. Taylor makes Chavez look foolish to get caught up with and stopped (very very very!) late. Point is both losers then dominated their opponents in the second fights, sweeping assumptions based on one fight should be looked at in more detail... Froch neutralises Groves right hand (by coming round the side of Groves jab) and you'll see a much different fight, Froch for me negated the effectiveness of his jab and paid a few prices for it. Can't see Rob Mac letting him fall in to the same mistake twice and if you gave me a Froch firing or Groves firing I'd back the former. Heavily.

Izzi wrote:Disagree.

Groves knows if he starts that quick again and doesn't stop him he's got Froch coming at him like a tank in the second half of the fight and didn't cope when he started walking through his punches.

To me we saw Froch not on top of his game and then only warm to the task as the fight drew on. Yes, disservice to Groves as I believe he may have pulled out a defining performance and won't hit that level again - certainly not in the rematch which for me Froch wins.

Gatti beats Ward first time round, gets comprehensively beaten in the 2 rubbers. Taylor makes Chavez look foolish to get caught up with and stopped (very very very!) late. Point is both losers then dominated their opponents in the second fights, sweeping assumptions based on one fight should be looked at in more detail... Froch neutralises Groves right hand (by coming round the side of Groves jab) and you'll see a much different fight, Froch for me negated the effectiveness of his jab and paid a few prices for it. Can't see Rob Mac letting him fall in to the same mistake twice and if you gave me a Froch firing or Groves firing I'd back the former. Heavily.

You sure about that? In the rematch Ward had his ear-drum burst after a couple of rounds and was never in the fight, not because Gatti was brilliant. Third fight Gatti broke his hand and had to box one-handed for ages.

You talk about making sweeping asumptions and then talk about Froch coming around the side of Groves' jab having A/ Never done that in his career and B/ Not been given this seeming obvious bit of advice by his super smart coach Robert McCracken in the first place. Aside from the AA fight, Froch has essentially relied on being tougher than the other guy...not smarter. People talk about Froch being unprepared which has got to be the biggest load of rubbish I've ever heard. Froch always trains diligently...or are you expecting us to believe he gave Yusef Mack more of a chance than Groves?

Face it, Froch dodged a bullet and he's being forced back into the firing line.

Froch seems to be rather fine with fighting Groves again, not exactly heard him putting a deadline for him to sign.. Has he? Happy with his slice, whereas George having now complained about his offer is now complaining about getting the decision overturned.

And Groves used the jab admittedly very well, but it's not exactly I the same league as someone like Wlads. A guy who's only lost two fights (and fought pretty much everyone at the weight) I expect to not walk in to punches the way he was against a 20 fight euro fighter. You assume Froch will come back the same fighter, he's fought better guys who haven't peppered him so much - smacks of him being mentally off the pace or thinking he would just bulldoze him.

First off though Groves has to sign the contract, if this were vice a versa am sure it'd upset you a lot more this hasn't yet happened Davey.

Past this disagreement I can't wait for it.

Fine?

Where do you get 'fine' from?

'Happy with his slice' is a pretty dumb statement too, who wouldn't be happy getting everything as opposed to almost nothing?

Izzi wrote:Disagree.

Groves knows if he starts that quick again and doesn't stop him he's got Froch coming at him like a tank in the second half of the fight and didn't cope when he started walking through his punches.

To me we saw Froch not on top of his game and then only warm to the task as the fight drew on. Yes, disservice to Groves as I believe he may have pulled out a defining performance and won't hit that level again - certainly not in the rematch which for me Froch wins.

Gatti beats Ward first time round, gets comprehensively beaten in the 2 rubbers. Taylor makes Chavez look foolish to get caught up with and stopped (very very very!) late. Point is both losers then dominated their opponents in the second fights, sweeping assumptions based on one fight should be looked at in more detail... Froch neutralises Groves right hand (by coming round the side of Groves jab) and you'll see a much different fight, Froch for me negated the effectiveness of his jab and paid a few prices for it. Can't see Rob Mac letting him fall in to the same mistake twice and if you gave me a Froch firing or Groves firing I'd back the former. Heavily.

This makes the assumption that Froch is some kind of clever boxer who can actual change what he does....he can't. If his ability to come round the side of the jab was there he would have used it by now. He never does....Ward, Taylor, Dirrel all made Carl look pedestrian off the jab; mainly because Carl has such fundamentally poor footwork & George just followed suit. It's also not just a case of him simply using better footwork either, his hands are also so low the openings are already there without anyone actually having to penetrate his defence.

Carl has been a credit to British boxing inside the ring & I wouldn't for one minute belittle anything he has done, however lets not start going overboard with our assertions of how good he actually is as a boxer. He is an old fashioned fighter plane and simple...his chin, spirit and determination has dragged him to his biggest victories but he has also almost always been completely outboxed in his big fights....even in victory.

Ward - Outboxed & lost
Taylor - Outboxed for almost whole fight but dug in & knocked him out
Dirrell - Outboxed but the American didn't force the pace in the same way Froch did and that cost him
Kessler I - Beaten to the punch when Kessler kept it at range; but Froch dragged him into a fight (credit to him) which kept the scorecards close
Groves - Outboxed and outsmarted for 80% of the fight...success saw Groves begin to stay in the pocket too long which aided Froch who took advantage.

If were honest there is only one man with the tools to actually box to a different tune next time around & it's not Froch. He will have to do what he always does...hang in, hope to start much quicker and turn the fight into a close quarters battle. Groves can outbox him all night; this time he needs to stick to it and not let success get to him.

A big factor which I actually saw no one mention in the build up or aftermath was the ring size. On the night Hearn managed to negotiate the smallest ring size allowed in a professional contest....this without a doubt played into Carl's hands. I wonder whether the same will occur 2nd time round.

It's clear to me that Groves is playing the waiting game here, whether that's right or wrong you can't blame him. Carl looked slower in his last fight than he ever has (which is saying something in itself)...the thinking will be that get him in the ring 8 months down the line rather than 4 and the complexion of any fight changes again.

Also it's unusual people are saying Froch has gone quite and are taking this as a sign that he's happy to fight etc....are we forgetting how vocal he was a mere 2 weeks ago. He was at that time discrediting Groves performance, his 'whining' about a rematch & declaring he didn't need the fight as he had other options. The only reason Carl has gone quiet is because he made a statement saying the Chavez fight was close to done then a press release declaring Groves had rejected a fight...only for other things to come to fruition a mere 24 hours later...those being Groves had been made mandatory by the IBF thus forcing the fight or belt to be relinquished & Chavez was fighting Vera in March. Carl has gone quite because he's been shown up simple as that. Groves at this time isn't doing himself any favours mind.

Izzi wrote:Froch seems to be rather fine with fighting Groves again, not exactly heard him putting a deadline for him to sign.. Has he? Happy with his slice, whereas George having now complained about his offer is now complaining about getting the decision overturned.

And Groves used the jab admittedly very well, but it's not exactly I the same league as someone like Wlads. A guy who's only lost two fights (and fought pretty much everyone at the weight) I expect to not walk in to punches the way he was against a 20 fight euro fighter. You assume Froch will come back the same fighter, he's fought better guys who haven't peppered him so much - smacks of him being mentally off the pace or thinking he would just bulldoze him. First off though Groves has to sign the contract, if this were vice a versa am sure it'd upset you a lot more this hasn't yet happened Davey.

Past this disagreement I can't wait for it.

Or more realistically, Froch is on the slide. Froch has pretty much always walked into punches his entire career. Way back when he fought Pascal for the title he was standing and having a bloody shoot-out with the guy instead of boxing. Even old man Johnson was landing right hands for fun because FROCH CARRIES HIS LEFT HAND FAR TOO LOW and it's too ingrained in him to change.

And if Groves is just a 20 fight Euro fighter who put Froch on his backside and gave him a boxing lesson at times...what does that make Froch? Oh I forgot, Froch wasn't prepared properly was he? Handy excuse to have though and one he keeps trotting out when it goes wrong. Ash clouds prevented him from beating Kessler and jet lag prevented him from beating Ward...and blah blah blah.

Does anyone really think a slowish 37 yr old coming off the worst physical beating of his career is going to improve and suddenly develop the speed and skills he never even had before. All Froch can do is hope to catch Groves with something big and ending it at the first opportunity, because he is clearly outgunned in every department other than toughness and chin and both of them will be a little weaker after the first fight.
Groves is playing games no doubt, but as the IBF say the Referee acted in an "unusual manner" in his handling of the fight then he does have a point in questioning the outcome. To be honest i would prefer if he just concentrated on getting himself in top shape so he can win the title with no questions asked about the result.

owen10ozzy wrote:

A big factor which I actually saw no one mention in the build up or aftermath was the ring size. On the night Hearn managed to negotiate the smallest ring size allowed in a professional contest....this without a doubt played into Carl's hands. I wonder whether the same will occur 2nd time round.

I mentioned this way back on the podcast

hogey wrote:Does anyone really think a slowish 37 yr old coming off the worst beating physical beating of his career is going to improve and suddenly develop the speed and skills he never even had before. All Froch can do is hope to catch Groves with something big and ending it at the first opportunity, because he is clearly outgunned in every department other than toughness and chin and both of them will be a little weaker after the first fight.
Groves is playing games no doubt, but as the IBF say the Referee acted in an "unusual manner" in his handling of the fight then he does have a point in questioning the outcome. To be honest i would prefer if he just concentrated on getting himself in top shape so he can win the title with no questions asked about the result.

Yeah, IZZY does

Its just three parties scrapping to get the best deal possible for themselves. Not much else They are all aware that they dont have any other options remotely as profitable.

Hearn wants to get Groves locked into a deal with him. Groves wants the best deal he can get and Froch has slowly come round to the reality that his nest fight is going to be Groves and Chavez was a bit of Eddie Hearn porky pies.

If I were Groves Id be worried that if I didnt sign up with Hearn I would be getting another set of bent officials again.

I wouldn't be surprised if the fight is already signed & sealed and the PR machine rolls on.

Hearn will probably have Ian John Lewis to replace Howard Foster , who stops Groves when the fighters touch gloves in the centre of the ring.

Cheers Rodders

TopHat24/7 wrote:Fine?

Where do you get 'fine' from?

'Happy with his slice' is a pretty dumb statement too, who wouldn't be happy getting everything as opposed to almost nothing?

He's getting 75%, who is the guy who's the name fighter here? Who if they fought Kessler for a 3rd time would be a draw on PPV?

Almost nothing? The guy is getting a 7 figure sum offered to him, if he went and fought someone like Mack how much would he get? I'll answer for your idiotic self - a fraction of that. Froch on the other hand could call out GGG, fight in America and it'd be on HBO/Showtime and do half decent numbers which would still earn him a fortune.

So you little dimwit, read the above then try to avoid calling people dumb when you're too wrapped up in your worthless life to read between the lines.

Floyd offers Khan the same, why? Because he's the draw. It's pretty bloody simple.. Did I dumb it down enough for you?

Izzi there's no need to resort to personal insults.

Some people are just lovely on here.

Cheers Rodders

hampo171 wrote:

owen10ozzy wrote:

A big factor which I actually saw no one mention in the build up or aftermath was the ring size. On the night Hearn managed to negotiate the smallest ring size allowed in a professional contest....this without a doubt played into Carl's hands. I wonder whether the same will occur 2nd time round.

I mentioned this way back on the podcast

When he's taking a supposed pasting how does a small ring help..? Groves didn't exactly have to chase him much, did he? Or Froch was able to dance around after getting dropped until he got his legs back because the ring was so big?!

Tbh, I think 75% was fair, but not the K-bot style promotional lock-in.

Who cares about how much he'd get fighting someone else? What difference does that make to anything??!!?

Floyd is the world's largest PPV star, so again that's a stupid and irrelevant red herring.  The rematch is 'on' not because Froch is a PPV star (which he pretty much isn't anyway) but because he got a beating and lucked out with dodgy reffing.

He got a shellacking off Ward - do you think he'd take 15-25% for that rematch he's been clamouring for (which nobody wants to see because it wasn't and never will be competitive)??

I think you're the one that needs a re-read.  Maybe finish school before you go round hurling clueless insults.

hampo171 wrote:Izzi there's no need to resort to personal insults.

Merely retorting after being called dumb. I will refrain as long as that poster does the same.

Izzi wrote:

hampo171 wrote:

owen10ozzy wrote:

A big factor which I actually saw no one mention in the build up or aftermath was the ring size. On the night Hearn managed to negotiate the smallest ring size allowed in a professional contest....this without a doubt played into Carl's hands. I wonder whether the same will occur 2nd time round.

I mentioned this way back on the podcast

When he's taking a supposed pasting how does a small ring help..? Groves didn't exactly have to chase him much, did he? Or Froch was able to dance around after getting dropped until he got his legs back because the ring was so big?!

Come on Izzi, Eddie wouldn't have known that Groves would turn Froch's legs to jelly would he? Or can he see the future?

Izzi wrote:

hampo171 wrote:Izzi there's no need to resort to personal insults.

Merely retorting after being called dumb. I will refrain as long as that poster does the same.

He didn't call you dumb, he said what you said was pretty dumb. Big difference.

Izzi wrote:

hampo171 wrote:Izzi there's no need to resort to personal insults.

Merely retorting after being called dumb. I will refrain as long as that poster does the same.

Didn't call you dumb, called the statement dumb. Not my fault you're the one that made it.

Izzi wrote:

hampo171 wrote:

owen10ozzy wrote:

A big factor which I actually saw no one mention in the build up or aftermath was the ring size. On the night Hearn managed to negotiate the smallest ring size allowed in a professional contest....this without a doubt played into Carl's hands. I wonder whether the same will occur 2nd time round.

I mentioned this way back on the podcast

When he's taking a supposed pasting how does a small ring help..? Groves didn't exactly have to chase him much, did he? Or Froch was able to dance around after getting dropped until he got his legs back because the ring was so big?!

Count to 10 and think before you post. Maybe try using the preview button.

As Hampo pointed out, Hearn isn't Mystic Meg, he had no idea Froch would be the one in trouble and needing to get on his bike.

Pre-fight all that was known is that Groves is an elusive fighter with good foodwork and movement, whilst Froch is the opposite - therefore shrinking the ring would be of greatest predicted assistance to Froch.

hampo171 wrote:

Izzi wrote:

hampo171 wrote:

owen10ozzy wrote:

A big factor which I actually saw no one mention in the build up or aftermath was the ring size. On the night Hearn managed to negotiate the smallest ring size allowed in a professional contest....this without a doubt played into Carl's hands. I wonder whether the same will occur 2nd time round.

I mentioned this way back on the podcast

When he's taking a supposed pasting how does a small ring help..? Groves didn't exactly have to chase him much, did he? Or Froch was able to dance around after getting dropped until he got his legs back because the ring was so big?!

Come on Izzi, Eddie wouldn't have known that Groves would turn Froch's legs to jelly would he? Or can he see the future?

"This without a doubt played into Carls hands"

That would insinuate Froch had the advantage during the fight, hence my comment.

Well its pretty obvious a smaller ring is an advantage for a flat footed 37 yr old plodder when he is fighting a much more mobile younger fighter.

Izzi wrote:

hampo171 wrote:

Izzi wrote:

hampo171 wrote:

owen10ozzy wrote:

A big factor which I actually saw no one mention in the build up or aftermath was the ring size. On the night Hearn managed to negotiate the smallest ring size allowed in a professional contest....this without a doubt played into Carl's hands. I wonder whether the same will occur 2nd time round.

I mentioned this way back on the podcast

When he's taking a supposed pasting how does a small ring help..? Groves didn't exactly have to chase him much, did he? Or Froch was able to dance around after getting dropped until he got his legs back because the ring was so big?!

Come on Izzi, Eddie wouldn't have known that Groves would turn Froch's legs to jelly would he? Or can he see the future?

"This without a doubt played into Carls hands"

That would insinuate Froch had the advantage during the fight, hence my comment.

Actually it does play into Carls hands; given the fact that Carl eventually began to catch up with him and close the ring down. Had the ring been larger Groves would have had more space to play with and ultimately a larger area to fleet in and out of when raiding Carl with shots.

As the fight got into the second half the ring most definitely would have played a factor and the advantage of it's size was firmly with Froch because Groves stopped being able to back pedal from him as he'd find himself on the ropes which is where you don't want to be against him.

Rodney wrote:Some people are just lovely on here.

Cheers Rodders

Whilst others just appear to be gits.

Groves didn't show signs of backpeddling. Was apparent to me he quite fancied getting Froch out of there most times he loaded up with his right hand. On the other hand Froch could've gone on the run and got his legs back quicker and finished Groves sooner

In all seriousness the size of the ring is the least of my worries with this getting made

Izzi wrote:
In all seriousness the size of the ring is the least of my worries with this getting made

I think we probably already worked that out Izzi, those of us that want to see a fight on even terms though can see plainly why a bigger ring would be better for Groves.

hogey wrote:

Izzi wrote:
In all seriousness the size of the ring is the least of my worries with this getting made

I think we probably already worked that out Izzi, those of us that want to see a fight on even terms though can see plainly why a bigger ring would be better for Groves.

Hogey, ruddy wum - I highly doubt either guy will start running round like Ali. Many here seem to think Groves is going to knock seven bells out of Froch so surely they'd want a small ring so he can't go in to reverse and run away from the inevitable beating he's apparently going to receive?

Think a Mayweather Sr quote might be applicable soon........

hogey wrote:

Izzi wrote:
In all seriousness the size of the ring is the least of my worries with this getting made

I think we probably already worked that out Izzi, those of us that want to see a fight on even terms though can see plainly why a bigger ring would be better for Groves.

It probably is, and to be honest it's not one of mine; however for all we know it could have been a sticking point on the contract, which you suggested that Groves should just be happy with...yet you don't have any clue as to structure of it:

For all we know it could be a 7 figure sum which is £1 million...while Froch gets £6 million...would that seem fair to you?! It could also included Froch picking ring size, gloves, etc etc....the fact is it's far to easy to say Groves should just be happy with his lot without actually knowing the ins & outs of it.

He can knock seven bells out of him without bum rushing him; which is exactly what he did in their first encounter..he worked his way in with the jab, landed right hands at will and got back out of range again. That's why he dominated the first 6 rounds of the action. You seem to be under the impression Groves was simply walking him down therefore the small ring played into his hands...when that wasn't the case.

Can we all agree that the most important thing is that this fight happens? I mean, Dave can as lick Groves all he wants, but this fight needs to go ahead. It has captured the public, not just ours, but mass public attention and it has to happen. Only one person is holding this fight up now, and that is Groves and his demands. Froch didn't want it, maybe, but he will do it so long as he gets the majority of the purse, and he should. Like or loathe Froch, he is the champ and he DID WIN the first fight, whether you think it a poor stoppage or not.
 
DAVE667 can slag Froch all he wants, but this fight needs to happen and Groves is the oen making it tricky right now. All this talk of options. Get real, George. You have no belt and no other world champ lined up at SM. Even if you did, good luck making 7 figures v Bika or Ward, and Ward would bosh you like a boshy faced bishbosher

owen10ozzy wrote:

hogey wrote:

Izzi wrote:
In all seriousness the size of the ring is the least of my worries with this getting made

I think we probably already worked that out Izzi, those of us that want to see a fight on even terms though can see plainly why a bigger ring would be better for Groves.

It probably is, and to be honest it's not one of mine; however for all we know it could have been a sticking point on the contract, which you suggested that Groves should just be happy with...yet you don't have any clue as to structure of it:

For all we know it could be a 7 figure sum which is £1 million...while Froch gets £6 million...would that seem fair to you?! It could also included Froch picking ring size, gloves, etc etc....the fact is it's far to easy to say Groves should just be happy with his lot without actually knowing the ins & outs of it.

He can knock seven bells out of him without bum rushing him; which is exactly what he did in their first encounter..he worked his way in with the jab, landed right hands at will and got back out of range again. That's why he dominated the first 6 rounds of the action. You seem to be under the impression Groves was simply walking him down therefore the small ring played into his hands...when that wasn't the case.

No, Izzy is convinced Froch was simply unprepared and it had nothing to do wit Groves' boxig ability of the gameplan laid out by Booth in the first instance (I do recall certain anti-Booth posters saying Groves had no chance following a Booth game-plan - namely circling and pot-shotting?

Seanusarrilius wrote:Can we all agree that he most important thing is that this fight happens? I mean, Dave can as lick Groves all he wants, but this fight needs to go ahead. It has captured the public, not just ours, but mass public attention and it has to happen. Only one person is holding this fight up now, and that is Groves and his demands. Froch didn't want it, maybe, but he will do it so long as he gets the majority of the purse, and he should. Like or loathe Froch, he is the champ and he DID WIN the first fight, whether you think it a poor stoppage or not.

DAVE667 can slag Froch all he wants, but this fight needs to happen and Groves is the oen making it tricky right now. All this talk of options. Get real, George. You have no belt and no other world champ lined up at SM. Even if you did, good luck making 7 figures v Bika or Ward, and Ward would bosh you like a boshy faced bishbosher

Perhaps Groves is wanting something appraoching a fair/reasonable split....although as none of us knows exactly who has been offered what, we've no way of knowing who if anyone is being greedy or unreasonable.

Seanusarrilius wrote:Can we all agree that the most important thing is that this fight happens? I mean, Dave can as lick Groves all he wants, but this fight needs to go ahead. It has captured the public, not just ours, but mass public attention and it has to happen. Only one person is holding this fight up now, and that is Groves and his demands. Froch didn't want it, maybe, but he will do it so long as he gets the majority of the purse, and he should. Like or loathe Froch, he is the champ and he DID WIN the first fight, whether you think it a poor stoppage or not.
 
DAVE667 can slag Froch all he wants, but this fight needs to happen and Groves is the oen making it tricky right now. All this talk of options. Get real, George. You have no belt and no other world champ lined up at SM. Even if you did, good luck making 7 figures v Bika or Ward, and Ward would bosh you like a boshy faced bishbosher

How far over, exactly, do you think GG should bend? Should he lube himself up or let Hearn or Froch do it for him.......?

Can I ask if any of you Grove arris lickers will be so kind to eat humble pie after the fight? All well and good to accuse me of saying Froch was mentally not quite at the races so in return I look forwards to seeing the excuses after Froch knocks Grove out....

And ring size, gloves - god, it's almost excuse sounding from the first fight. Let one of them choose his favourite toy and the other choose his favourite toy and be done with it.

And also, I'm none the more privy to the contract than yourself. Not sure why Groves is fighting to get the fight overturned... The BBBoC can't make Hearn change his stipulations for future fights by changing the outcome of the fight to a NC.

To spin it around, what if Froch was refusing to get it on because of money or that he didn't like the ref Hearn had lined up - god some of the above posters who be frothing at the mouth whilst knocking one off over how George has put the olive branch out there etc. very quiet about Georgey boy not signing the bloody thing

Froch has no choice but to sign it. The IBF made the decision for him. If they hadnt ruled on it, he would still be waffling about Chavez and how Groves shouldnt get a rematch.

Now the pair of them are just scrapping for the best deal they can get. The fight is essentially made already. Its just a game of poker over terms.

Izzi wrote:Can I ask if any of you Grove arris lickers will be so kind to eat humble pie after the fight? All well and good to accuse me of saying Froch was mentally not quite at the races so in return I look forwards to seeing the excuses after Froch knocks Grove out....

And ring size, gloves - god, it's almost excuse sounding from the first fight. Let one of them choose his favourite toy and the other choose his favourite toy and be done with it.

And also, I'm none the more privy to the contract than yourself. Not sure why Groves is fighting to get the fight overturned... The BBBoC can't make Hearn change his stipulations for future fights by changing the outcome of the fight to a NC.

To spin it around, what if Froch was refusing to get it on because of money or that he didn't like the ref Hearn had lined up - god some of the above posters who be frothing at the mouth whilst knocking one off over how George has put the olive branch out there etc. very quiet about Georgey boy not signing the bloody thing

Can I ask if you'll do the same?

Can anyone translate Izzi's last post? Thanks.

Izzi wrote:Can I ask if any of you Grove arris lickers will be so kind to eat humble pie after the fight? All well and good to accuse me of saying Froch was mentally not quite at the races so in return I look forwards to seeing the excuses after Froch knocks Grove out....

And ring size, gloves - god, it's almost excuse sounding from the first fight. Let one of them choose his favourite toy and the other choose his favourite toy and be done with it.

And also, I'm none the more privy to the contract than yourself. Not sure why Groves is fighting to get the fight overturned... The BBBoC can't make Hearn change his stipulations for future fights by changing the outcome of the fight to a NC.

To spin it around, what if Froch was refusing to get it on because of money or that he didn't like the ref Hearn had lined up - god some of the above posters who be frothing at the mouth whilst knocking one off over how George has put the olive branch out there etc. very quiet about Georgey boy not signing the bloody thing

Yes I would be Izzi, I wonder whether you would be given your so adamant that Froch had an off day, wasn't prepared etc etc. Lest we forget that the way Carl harped on about Groves not belonging at his level in the first place you'd have thought he should have been able to turn up on his C game and beat him.

I agree regards ring gloves etc...the point I was making is your pointing the finger at it being Groves who is kicking up a fuss but have you thought as to why that may be the case.

Froch was refusing to fight up until 3 weeks ago; he wanted nothing to do with it, that's public knowledge. He fancied a shot at Chavez or a rematch with Ward. Now that he has basically been told he has to fight Groves he suddenly declares he wants it and always has!? Cod Wallop! Groves certainly shouldn't just roll over and give in to any demands made just because Froch has realised he has sod all place to go; Groves may need Froch to get that big pay day...however he's the one who has a few years left in the game. Its Carl whose into the twilight of his career and him who will be wanting to put as much in the bank as possible....he doesn't make a fraction of what he can against Groves against anyone else in the world!

Don't say he could get GGG; because that fight simply isn't happening.