Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

[super_realist]

First topic message reminder :

Rugby players are too fat to catch us Davie.

[kwinigolfer]

Good exercise for the Navy; they had a vessel in the general vicinity - why not deploy it for something practical?
You never know mysti, it might be you on the next missing plane.

[mystiroakey]

Ok if we have vessesl there fine- But SR you did state that they had to travel 2000 miles

[mystiroakey]

Good exercise for the Navy; they had a vessel in the general vicinity - why not deploy it for something practical?
You never know mysti, it might be you on the next missing plane.

easy..... you are scaring me know- But in fairness I have allways wanted to get on to the island that is in the show 'LOST'

[pedro]

I never understand why we get involved in something nothing to do with us unless its for other reasons

Good to see humanity is alive and well.

Mysti, does your statement also refer to Poland 1939?

[mystiroakey]

my statement is just an off the cuff remark based on the brits getting involved in things when we should be worrying about our own and close neighbours a bit more. We get involved in to many things to try and pretend we are some kind of hero/big time country of the world.

Its a plane in the sea with zero survivors FFS. get the feick over it.. We cant turn the clock back

Time to look into things that are seriously more important tbh. the whole Russian situation would be one, but even then lets start at home with the unemployed.

[super_realist]

my statement is just an off the cuff remark based on the brits getting involved in things when we should be worrying about our own and close neighbours a bit more. We get involved in to many  things to try and pretend we are some kind of hero/big time country of the world.

Its a plane in the sea with zero survivors FFS. get the feick over it.. We cant turn the clock back

Time to look into things that are seriously more important tbh. the whole Russian situation would be one, but even then lets start at home with the unemployed.

It's true Oakey, that this in inevitably a recovery operation. However even if you take out the humanitarian aspect of corpse finding, it's good practice for whoever is involved.
I'd much rather that the tax payers money went to this than paying for something like the Scottish Referendum, which is where your tax pounds are going. I'd be more annoyed about that if I was you than ONE Navy Seismic vessel doing a bit of work when they were already getting paid to do something similar, so I don't know if they were 2000 miles away or not, but all it is costing is the price of diesel.

[mystiroakey]

Yeah I suppose. I agree this isnt really a good example of something we are throwing money over unnecessarily to enforce ourselves as a big nation. I was being a bit harsh with this example. But we could go on all day about the unnecesary money wasted on the wars we are involved in.

[super_realist]

True Oakey, I'd say some of the money we give away in aid is rather questionable too.

Be careful when talking about wars though as you'll start sounding like George Galloway, or worse...............Mac.

[mystiroakey]

haha

[pedro]

I get you mysti, was just wumming.

With that being said , UK could easily slash half its military budget and nobody would notice. (apart fron those living directly off it)

PS. I heard that the Putin is deploying the Battleship Potemkin to look for the missing plane...with himself as captain.

[super_realist]

I get you mysti, was just wumming.

With that being said , UK could easily slash half its military budget and nobody would notice. (apart fron those living directly off it)

PS. I heard that the Putin is deploying the Battleship Potemkin to look for the missing plane...with himself as captain.

no doubt with John Terry as first mate? He likes to take credit where it isn't due.

[pedro]

Now that's an interesting combo... I wonder if we can squeeze in Arsene Wenger to complain about something.

[incontinentia]

Yeah I suppose. I agree this isnt really a good example of something we are throwing money over unnecessarily to enforce ourselves as a big nation. I was being a bit harsh with this example. But we could go on all day about the unnecesary money wasted on the wars we are involved in.

Why don't ye give back northern Ireland? I'm sure that costs a lot of money to heat etc

[super_realist]

I've always wondered what the Norn Irn brought to the Union. Don't seem to do much.

[incontinentia]

I've always wondered what the Norn Irn brought to the Union. Don't seem to do much.

The charming accent?

[super_realist]

I've always wondered what the Norn Irn brought to the Union. Don't seem to do much.

The charming accent?

I don't mind the southern ireland accent but the NI one grates like the Glaswegian and Scouse ones.

All they ever seem to say is "what about ye" or "there's your man there"

[incontinentia]

"Situation" is the funniest. Is it true that Glaswegians can't say "burglar alarm"?

[pedro]

Now here's a hypothetical question: according to Putin's analogy, would it then be allright for East Birmingham to unilaterally secede and join Pakistan?

[incontinentia]

Wasn't Crimea once part of Russia though?

[super_realist]

Indeed, it's where the charge of the light brigade was in the battle of balaclava and where the cannon metal used to make Victoria Crosses come from.

[pedro]

I guess you could make a similar analogy about why the West Bank should belong to Israel then. On top of that it was outright lost in war.

[super_realist]

Always though Kalinigrad was a strange annexe of Russia. Looks interesting though.

[mystiroakey]

Yeah I suppose. I agree this isnt really a good example of something we are throwing money over unnecessarily to enforce ourselves as a big nation. I was being a bit harsh with this example. But we could go on all day about the unnecesary money wasted on the wars we are involved in.

Why don't ye give back northern Ireland? I'm sure that costs a lot of money to heat etc

You are irish and you don't understand that its up to the northern irish? How can we give up something that isnt ours ?

I have heard that sort of talk from yanks before but not an Irishman... If northern Ireland wants independendance it just like Scotland could. Then it could join Ireland if it wanted to.

[super_realist]

Why would anyone want it should be the question Oakey surely?

[mystiroakey]

Why would anyone want it should be the question Oakey surely?

It really isn't about that. Its up to the northern Irish only.

[incontinentia]

Ye gave back Hong Kong. And northern Ireland isn't as simple as having a referendum.

[super_realist]

Yeah I suppose. I agree this isnt really a good example of something we are throwing money over unnecessarily to enforce ourselves as a big nation. I was being a bit harsh with this example. But we could go on all day about the unnecesary money wasted on the wars we are involved in.

Why don't ye give back northern Ireland? I'm sure that costs a lot of money to heat etc

You are irish and you don't understand that its up to the northern irish? How can we give up something that isnt ours ?

I have heard that sort of talk from yanks before but not an Irishman... If northern Ireland wants independendance it just like Scotland could. Then it could join Ireland if it wanted to.

Ha ha, how bad would life in NI have to be to want to be part of Oirland?

[mystiroakey]

Ye gave back Hong Kong. And northern Ireland isn't as simple as having a referendum.

We didn't give anything back. We had it on a 'lease'The timing ended. Seriously do you not understand its about the people that live in the country.

We do not own NI... They do . its there decision if they want to be part of a union or not.

And yes if they want independence it is 100% that simple...

But we 100% cant give you something that isn't ours to give. Its up to them

[incontinentia]

Mysti- you can't handle the truth

[mystiroakey]

What truth.

I think its quite clear to all you are the one lacking in any knoedge on this.

Northern Ireland is for northern Ireland. And they do not want to be part if Ireland. Until that day happens deal with it.

[kwinigolfer]

Anyone else having trouble accessing the BBC website? Haven't been able to get on since Spurs lost last night.
Do you suppose Tim Sherwood has hacked it?

[McLaren]

Kwini

Maybe one of your various security agencies have blocked access to it, to stop people straying from fox news.

[kwinigolfer]

Possibly Mac,

Strange though, have tried to get in via three different browsers and no luck.

[Bob_the_Job]

Northern Ireland is for northern Ireland."

Mysti for Prime Minister! His logic is infallible.

Seriously though, it's a fairly complex and tricky area and declaring "ownership" of a country is too simplistic an approach.  I've no axe to grind as it happens, but if you are interested in understanding just the tip of the iceberg when it comes to why the "Irish Problem" is so errr.. problematic, you could do worse than just read the two following paragraphs (taken directly from Wikipedia - I'm not claiming to be the font of knowledge, but at least I know what to go and look for).  However, if you're not interested, just go about your day and have a good one.

The Plantation of Ulster was the organised colonisation (plantation) of Ulster – a province of Ireland – by people from Britain during the reign of King James I. Most of the colonists came from Scotland and England. Small private plantation by wealthy landowners began in 1606, while the official plantation began in 1609. An estimated half a million acres (2,000 km²) spanning counties Tyrconnell, Tyrone, Fermanagh, Cavan, Coleraine and Armagh, was confiscated from Gaelic chiefs.  Arthur Chichester, also saw the Plantation as a scheme to anglicise the Irish. Accordingly the colonists (or "British tenants") were required to be English-speaking and Protestant.

The partition of Ireland was the division of the island of Ireland into two distinct territories, Northern Ireland, a part of the United Kingdom, and the now Republic of Ireland, an independent state. Partition occurred when the British Parliament passed the Government of Ireland Act 1920 creating Northern Ireland and what was then Southern Ireland. From 1801 to 1920 the whole island had formed a constituent country of the United Kingdom. Before then it was the separate Kingdom of Ireland.

[mystiroakey]

Bob

History is History

Today is today.

Today Northern Ireland is Northern Ireland for the Northern Irsih

If Northern Ireland wants to stay in the UK, become independent or join on to the republic it can.. But Ireland or the UK can not take or give.

[Bob_the_Job]

Bob

History is History

Today is today.

Today Northern Ireland is Northern Ireland for the Northern Irsih

If Northern Ireland wants to stay in the UK, become independent or join on to the republic it can.. But Ireland or the UK can not take or give.

Yes.  I agreed with that part.  That's why I said your logic was infallible.  But you're also wrong - the UK can give and take.  It took Northern Ireland and gave it to the world.

My point was that understanding the history is vital to understanding why it's not a simple situation.  Northern Ireland was created by deliberately and purposely importing a different cultural identity and establishing it as the dominant group for a while in a partitioned area of a foreign state.  This had a profound and divisive effect which is still being felt today (I'm not saying it should be, but it's a fact that it is).  The repair of that has been a very gradual process - you talk in grand terms about our ability to decide our own future - well did you know that the devolution of Justice in Northern Ireland only happened in April 2010 - i.e. 4 years ago?  So up until 4 years ago we couldn't make our own decisions on a whole range of social and life impacting matters?  So try to be better informed and more understanding when you think it's black and white.  It's not, and it's not entirely of our own making. I agree now that any change should be supported by a democratic process, but to ignore the history of how we ended up in this sorry state is irresponsible and stupid.

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it"

[mystiroakey]

I am sorry how can the UK give what isnt theres- the Uk is a union. England or England and wales or England Wales and scotland cant just give ireland the land if the people on that land dont want to be part of Ireland.


Its up to you and your fellow northern irish mate.. It really is.

If you want this to become a soapbox for the evils that my and other brit forefathers did to ireland then fine. But I really dont want to get into that. Its way to sensitive an issue for here and has absoloutly nothing to do with people from my age group.

[Bob_the_Job]

I am sorry how can the UK give what isnt theres- the Uk is a union. England or England and wales or England Wales and scotland cant just give ireland the land if the people on that land dont want to be part of Ireland.


Its up to you and your fellow northern irish mate.. It really is.

If you want this to become a soapbox for the evils that my and other brit forefathers did to ireland then fine. But I really dont want to get into that. Its way to sensitive an issue for here and has absoloutly nothing to do with people from my age group.

Once again, yes I agree it's up to us. How many times are you going to make the same point as if you've just announced the most profound vision of all time? And who said anything about evils? I just talked facts, but it's interesting where your mind took you.

Oh, and for the record "nothing to do with people from my age group" - genius! I'm not 400 years old so.. err... you know.. ditto.

[mystiroakey]

So you agree yet you want to argue?

What's the problem mate?

Do you have a problem with a Brit talking about matters you think are only Irish? Do you honestly think I didn't know the history?

I just dont want to bring up the history and want to talk about today and the future..

[GunsGerms]

Not sure how many people in ROI want NI back as part of a united Ireland anymore anyway. The UK takes part of your country, does a massive dump on it, its a complete mess then passes it back. Great deal.

Betfast riots cost a fortune, cant imagine that would be anything but even worse if it was part of Ireland again.

[mystiroakey]

That attitude is a problem though isnt it.

I am not going to say that the UK doesn't want NI, but if we could give it away I wouldn't exactly mind.

The fact is we cant- Its up to the NI if they want independence first and then up to NI and Ireland if they want to come together again.

[GunsGerms]

Id imagine the majority in the UK would vote to get rid of it and the rest probably dont realise it is a part of the UK.

[Bob_the_Job]

So you agree yet you want to argue?

What's the problem mate?

Do you have a problem with a Brit talking about matters you think are only Irish? Do you honestly think I didn't know the history?

I just dont want to bring up the history and want to talk about today and the future..

I've no problem mate - I was stating my views and position same as you. That's allowed isn't it?

I don't know if you know the history or not, but I don't understand why you ask - you said it's got nothing to do with history?

If you don't want to argue (I'm discussing - I don't care about you enough to be moved at an emotional level to argue), why are you asking me questions?

[mystiroakey]

I haven't really asked you any questions mate. You have just dragged a current situation that can only be resolved in the now and the future into the past which i have no wish to discuss.

[Bob_the_Job]

I haven't really asked you any questions mate. You have just dragged a current situation that can only be resolved in the now and the future into the past which i have no wish to discuss.

OK.. but I tend to take the "?" as meaning you're asking a question.. of which there were 3 in your previous post.

[super_realist]

All this talk of Ireland and no one has mentioned potatoes once.............ooops.  

[mystiroakey]

Yes but they are kind of rhetorical.

"you said it's got nothing to do with history?"

that was one of your questions- it isn't even one!

[navyblueshorts]

Ye gave back Hong Kong. And northern Ireland isn't as simple as having a referendum.

Hong Kong wasn't ours. 99 year lease from the Chinese so we were only borrowing it.

[navyblueshorts]

Why would anyone want it should be the question Oakey surely?

It really isn't about that. Its up to the northern Irish only.

No, it's not. Just as the Scottish referendum isn't only up to the Scots. That's where Putin's little joke doesn't wash - it needs the agreement of the Government of the country you're trying to get independence from.

[Bob_the_Job]

Yes but they are kind of rhetorical.

"you said it's got nothing to do with history?"

that was one of your questions- it isn't even one!

Rhetorical doesn't really work when we can't hear the tone - it's just the written words.

No - my question was "I don't know if you know the history or not, but I don't understand why you ask - you said it's got nothing to do with history?" I.e. why are you asking me the question when you've already stated a position which implied it didn't matter?

Please don't misquote me or chop bits out to try and make me look thick - it reflects more badly on you. Discuss honestly, or if you don't want to discuss at all, stop replying.

[Sponsored content]