Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

by super_realist Tue Feb 25, 2014 4:16 pm

First topic message reminder :

Rugby players are too fat to catch us Davie.

by super_realist Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:26 pm

GunsGerms wrote:
super_realist wrote:

Why am I so strident against religion? If people make claims and try and force their views on society and politics, when there is no reason for them to hold those views, damned right I'm going to be furious about it.

Does your government not force their views on you to a certain extent? Do you hate politicians too?

They aren't trying to do it on the basis of no reason or no evidence like religion does, so whether or not I disagree is a matter of my political view.

My entire issue with religion is that it has no basis in facts, proof or evidence, and as such should have ZERO influence on anything.

by GunsGerms Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:29 pm

super_realist wrote:]

Nobody is forcing a priest or church to hold a gay wedding. Just like the R&A can not admit Women members, a "club" can exclude who it likes.
THe issue is whether religion can try and influence law, and obviously it shouldn't.

I kinda agree on right of exclusion of women in clubs. There are plenty of women only clubs in Ireland and the UK too and they never inspire any debate. Sometimes I think feminism has gone too far.

Was listening to a woman talk about feminism on the radio recently and she joked how she had to house train her husband. Just a joke of course and I couldnt care less I just feel the womens lib orgs would have a field day if any man made a similar quip about their wife in the media.

by skyeman Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:30 pm

GunsGerms wrote:
skyeman wrote:

100% ghastly, when others have NO evidence to their views. Incomprehensible to me.

Gents with respect you seem to have convinced yourselves that it is much more a factor than it really is. Religion is just a set of beliefs or morals. Some of these beliefs may have shaped the collective Irish psyche but no laws can be passed without logical debate and due legal process which has no religious basis.

But for the last two millenia, how many have died in the name of religion. BILLIONS.

All throughout time they have been fanatical, just that now the muslim religion is at the forefront.

by westisbest Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:33 pm

skyeman wrote:
westisbest wrote:
super_realist wrote:Bit like how it was mostly religious against gay marriage the other week.

Why do they think their opinions matter and should shape policy based on a fairytale fictional book? Mind your own bloody business. If you don't like gay marriage, here's an idea. Don't marry a gay person.

Think you should do the same mate.

Calm down dude.

Why does it bother you so much if you hate it, dont care about it.

I dont care for religion much, but I dont bang on about it all the time.

C'mon super duper, whats the real issue.

You can share it with us, we wont tell:)

You sound like my psychologist

He/she talk sense aswell then:)

by GunsGerms Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:33 pm

Did you know that in terms of the overall population of the world wars have never had a significant effect on world population figures.

Im certain in any case that it is human nature to find something to argue about anyway religion or not.

Arent we all doomed to sin. Remember what happened in the garden of Eden lads?

by super_realist Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:39 pm

GunsGerms wrote:Did you know that in terms of the overall population of the world wars have never had a significant effect on world population figures.

Im certain in any case that it is human nature to find something to argue about anyway religion or not.

Arent we all doomed to sin. Remember what happened in the garden of Eden lads?

Yeah, "God" created a situation where incest was the only option. What a genius.

by skyeman Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:48 pm

GunsGerms wrote:Did you know that in terms of the overall population of the world wars have never had a significant effect on world population figures.

Im certain in any case that it is human nature to find something to argue about anyway religion or not.

Arent we all doomed to sin. Remember what happened in the garden of Eden lads?

Obviously for me the garden of eden never existed.

But i do agree, even without religion, mankind would have still behaved like the apes in 2001 (space odyssey) and try to destroy themselves. As you say "human nature"

But did we need a manmade story to give people hope to quicken it up?

by super_realist Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:49 pm

Without it though, how much more technically advanced would we be. It has retarded progress in many fields.

by skyeman Thu Apr 24, 2014 4:50 pm

Poopie. I have to paint the weather beaten outside walls.

So long guys.

by GunsGerms Thu Apr 24, 2014 5:24 pm

super_realist wrote:Without it though, how much more technically advanced would we be. It has retarded progress in many fields.

In many ways the more technologically advanced the world becomes the more difficult life becomes. If the goal of technology was to make life easier it has been a massive failure.

Also if as has been claimed religion is the cause of all war it can also be said that war has had more positive influence on technology that anything else.

by super_realist Thu Apr 24, 2014 5:35 pm

Yet, the more technological we become the fewer people are killed in war.

We have become more economical in times of war.

As for life being easier. Technology has certainly made life easier. I have central heating, cooking facilities indoors, wireless communication, secure, draught proof windows.

Life may have become more complicated, but you can't argue that the standard of living in the developed world has increased for most.

How many people do you know that don't have a car compared to 50 years ago?

by GunsGerms Thu Apr 24, 2014 5:45 pm

To be honest I'm just arguing with you for the sake of it now. I love my life but it seems to get more and more complicated all the time.

I think there is a lot to be said for keeping things simple. On the subject of golf I suspect that may even be the difference between the Rory McIlroy who was winning majors and the one now.

by super_realist Thu Apr 24, 2014 5:47 pm

Could be guns. Certain things are best kept simple.

by pedro Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:21 am

There is no rational jusification for being anti gay marriage. Opposition is purely religious or morally founded. Marriage is a civil act which doesn't neccessarily have something to do with religion/the church.

Denying a same sex civil marriage is clearly discriminating and should be shoe-in for a human rights court cases (maybe there has been several?) as you clearly deny gay people equal rights.

by skyeman Fri Apr 25, 2014 1:02 pm

Or marriage for (quite) some time was/is seen as a man/woman thing only and which is therefore normal. Anything other by it's very definition is thus abnormal.

Give it a few hundred years, like most things and the future generations won't see what the fuss was about because it would then seem like a normal thing to happen.

by Diggers Fri Apr 25, 2014 1:08 pm

The vast majority of people I know..in fact everyone I know... all accept gay marriage as being normal, including my mum and dad who are in their 70's. My daughter goes to a faith school (because its at the end of my road and is a good school) and I don't know any parents of kids there, actually religious parents as opposed to me, who have an issue with it.
Then again, I don't really know any UKIP supporters, a scenario that is not likely to change any time soon.

by skyeman Fri Apr 25, 2014 1:25 pm

Diggers wrote:The vast majority of people I know..in fact everyone I know... all accept gay marriage as being normal, including my mum and dad who are in their 70's. My daughter goes to a faith school (because its at the end of my road and is a good school) and I don't know any parents of kids there, actually religious parents as opposed to me, who have an issue with it.
Then again, I don't really know any UKIP supporters, a scenario that is not likely to change any time soon.

I won't be voting UKIP, but to put that in the same bracket as to gay marriage speaks volumes for your political stance.

by Diggers Fri Apr 25, 2014 1:58 pm

Not sure what you mean?

by skyeman Fri Apr 25, 2014 2:11 pm

skyeman wrote:
Diggers wrote:The vast majority of people I know..in fact everyone I know... all accept gay marriage as being normal, including my mum and dad who are in their 70's. My daughter goes to a faith school (because its at the end of my road and is a good school) and I don't know any parents of kids there, actually religious parents as opposed to me, who have an issue with it.
Then again, I don't really know any UKIP supporters, a scenario that is not likely to change any time soon.

I won't be voting UKIP, but to put that in the same bracket as to gay marriage speaks volumes for your political stance.

Sorry if i read it wrong, but bringing UKIP into it, it looked like you were comparing their supporters to anti-gay marriage.

by Diggers Fri Apr 25, 2014 2:16 pm

I mentioned them because they are anti gay marriage. Amongst many other moronic, half baked policies. Actually policy is stretching it a bit, vagueish idea is a probably a better wording.

by skyeman Fri Apr 25, 2014 2:22 pm

So i was right then Laugh

You make the mistake of tarring all supporters of a particcular party with the same brush whether they agree with some polices or not.

Your way or the by-way.

Glad this is a democratic country.

by Diggers Fri Apr 25, 2014 2:27 pm

I'm glad its democratic country, I wouldn't change that in a million years.
The fact remains that UKIP has an anti gay marriage stance, it and being anti Europe, anti immigration are probably their three main soundbites...along with repealing the smoking ban. It stands to reason most of their support share these views does it not?
This is my honest view though, anyone who thinks voting UKIP is a good idea is an idiot. Simple as that.

by GunsGerms Fri Apr 25, 2014 2:29 pm

skyeman wrote:So i was right then

You make the mistake of tarring all supporters of a particcular party with the same brush whether they agree with some polices or not.

Your way or the by-way.

Glad this is a democratic country.

Or tarring anyone who considers themselves to be religious as being a quack?

by Diggers Fri Apr 25, 2014 2:30 pm

Id tar anyone who thinks abortion is a bad idea a quack.

by incontinentia Fri Apr 25, 2014 2:37 pm

Diggers wrote:Id tar anyone who thinks abortion is a bad idea a quack.

Why? It's not an extreme opinion to think that the ending of an unborn life is wrong, is it?

by GunsGerms Fri Apr 25, 2014 2:37 pm

Diggers wrote:Id tar anyone who thinks abortion is a bad idea a quack.

Sounds like you are quite intolerant of other views. Maybe you should open your mind a little and accept that not everyone thinks the same way as you nor should they?

by MontysMerkin Fri Apr 25, 2014 2:44 pm

Democracy? Ha! Nice one, and so the parties we can actually vote for live up to their 'manifestos'? Hardly. All governments since Thatcher have represented big business against your everyman. There is no choice, we have a democracy in name only. Biggest con since Mr Ponzi asked to borrow a few quid for a great idea he just had!

by Diggers Fri Apr 25, 2014 3:38 pm

GunsGerms wrote:
Diggers wrote:Id tar anyone who thinks abortion is a bad idea a quack.

Sounds like you are quite intolerant of other views. Maybe you should open your mind a little and accept that not everyone thinks the same way as you nor should they?

Where have I said that they are not entitled to a view? Odd comment.
Tolerance though, for me that isn't making a girl have a baby that's unwanted. Clearly you can see the pro's in that scenario though.

by mystiroakey Fri Apr 25, 2014 3:40 pm

Something recently came up.

A girl supposedly who was pregnant aborted because she was picked for big brother. Therefore her choice was.big brother or a baby.

Abortion for me should be a right and a legal choice.
But That can't stop us judging certain people that have made the choice for certain reasons.

by MontysMerkin Fri Apr 25, 2014 3:43 pm

The baby is better off out of it in that case!

by Diggers Fri Apr 25, 2014 3:45 pm

I could understand it if it was for a place in The great British Bake Off...but Big Brother, really..

by MontysMerkin Fri Apr 25, 2014 3:53 pm

Or Splash. Diving in this country is really under represented and we should all be encouraging the young to leap head first of high ledges. However might be better if they empty the pool first.

by incontinentia Fri Apr 25, 2014 4:05 pm

Diggers wrote:Tolerance though, for me that isn't making a girl have a baby that's unwanted.

There's many ways to avoid getting pregnant if you don't want a baby.

by Diggers Fri Apr 25, 2014 4:16 pm

incontinentia wrote:
Diggers wrote:Tolerance though, for me that isn't making a girl have a baby that's unwanted.
There's many ways to avoid getting pregnant if you don't want a baby.

Obviously. But if for whatever reason that doesn't work then you force a girl to have a baby she doesn't want and probably can't afford. Result, unhappy people. Where's the logic in that?
I'm sure the vast majority of abortions take place very early. Personally my wife has miscarriaged early in a pregnancy, it was a shame but it wasn't the end of the world. There is no comparison to how I would feel if I lost one of my children, not even remotely. Clearly there should be a sensible cut off point, as I've said before 24 weeks seems good to me.
Its really the classic argument from an intolerant person. They say,, "look I would not tolerate this girl having an abortion, I'll force her to have a child, I'll impose my morals over her freedom of choice."
Then...when people say they don't agree...they accuse them off being intolerant to others views. It would be funny if it wasn't quite so pathetic.

by Duty281 Fri Apr 25, 2014 4:24 pm

Diggers wrote:I'm glad its democratic country, I wouldn't change that in a million years.
The fact remains that UKIP has an anti gay marriage stance, it and being anti Europe, anti immigration are probably their three main soundbites...along with repealing the smoking ban. It stands to reason most of their support share these views does it not?
This is my honest view though, anyone who thinks voting UKIP is a good idea is an idiot. Simple as that.

What if it's purely a protest vote?

by golfermartin Fri Apr 25, 2014 4:26 pm

The female in question, as I understand it, got pregnant whilst working as a prostitute (having first come to public notice by being given a breast enlargement on the NHS). She knows who the father is. He is reasonably well off and has said he would provide financially for the child. Then the Big Brother offer came up and she decided that she might have an abortion so she could do the show. I blame the producers of Big Brother as much as the female!

by Diggers Fri Apr 25, 2014 4:27 pm

Its still idiocy as it adds credibility to UKIP. Better off abstaining.

by Duty281 Fri Apr 25, 2014 4:30 pm

As you wish, dear fellow.

by Diggers Fri Apr 25, 2014 4:36 pm

To be straight about UKIP. I admire the fact that a bunch of people have got involved in the democratic process, that they have got together to form a (semi) coherent body that represents the views of a fair amount of people in the UK. I would never dream of preventing that, in many ways its fantastic and does show that the democratic process is alive and well.
It doesn't however change my views on either the party itself or indeed the people who vote for them.

by Duty281 Fri Apr 25, 2014 4:38 pm

Especially as they've become Britain's 3rd political party, overtaking Cleggy and the Liberals, and are on course to win the European elections.

by beninho Fri Apr 25, 2014 4:42 pm

Instead of a protest vote, then its better to spoil your ballot.

Ukip are dangerous because some people actually believe what they say, and they target the middle classes in areas of law multi culturalism - ( if thats a word). And as gets shown every now and then, the Councillors they put up have been shown as a bit racist. But its easy for them to make grand statements, because realistically they will not get voted in and have to back up the statements they have made.

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