Amlin Final - Saints vs Bath - 23rd May Cardiff

Should be a good game on paper but I really can't see Saints losing this one as Bath appear to be running out of steam as the season comes to an end.
I'm sure it will be a great evening in Cardiff win or lose.

Sad fact is many fans of both Bath and Saints will not get tickets for the final as they have only been allocated a very small number of tickets if you believe this to be wrong then please sign the petition below. (typical ERC not thinking ahead!  )


Bath Rugby team to face Northampton Saints

15 Nick Abendanon
14 Semesa Rokoduguni
13 Jonathan Joseph
12 Ollie Devoto
11 Anthony Watson
10 George Ford
9 Micky Young

1 Paul James
2 Tom Dunn
3 David Wilson
4 Stuart Hooper (c)
5 Dave Attwood
6 Carl Fearns
7 Francois Louw
8 Leroy Houston

Replacements
16 Eusebio Guinazu
17 Nathan Catt
18 Anthony Perenise
19 Dominic Day
20 Guy Mercer
21 Peter Stringer
22 Gavin Henson
23 Horacio Agulla

Saints

15 Ben FODEN
14 Ken PISI
13 George PISI
12 Luther BURRELL
11 George NORTH
10 Stephen MYLER
9 Lee DICKSON
1 Alex CORBISIERO
2 Mike HAYWOOD
3 Tom MERCEY
4 Samu MANOA
5 Courtney LAWES
6 Calum CLARK
7 Tom WOOD (capt)
8 Sam DICKINSON

Replacements
16 Ross MCMILLAN
17 Alex WALLER
18 Gareth DENMAN
19 Christian DAY
20 Phil DOWSON
21 Kahn FOTUALI’I
22 James WILSON
23 Tom STEPHENSON

http://www.petitions24.com/move_the_2014_amlin_challenge_cup_to_a_bigger_venue

Should Saints be in the AP final, then Bath could have a real chance.

Planning on being home for the HC weekend and will look forward to watching both games as a neutral

As a Bath fan i had to vote Bath. I think we have a real chance IF Garvey and Louw are fit, against wasps we didn't start Attwood, Wilson, James, Louw, Agulla, Watson, so I think we have some more room for improvement, Saints have a habit of freezing in these phases as well. Hopefully we will have fit again Joseph and Eastmond clicking again and banahan well away from the wings then we will have some serious muscle upfront and some electric backs !!!

Banners is no longer a winger IMO he just looks awkward and unbalanced out there. We have better options.

Given the choice, I'll go for any team I do feel that is not cheating the cap.

Ergo Saints.

bedfordwelsh wrote:Planning on being home for the HC weekend and will look forward to watching both games as a neutral

Again    

HammerofThunor wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:Planning on being home for the HC weekend and will look forward to watching both games as a neutral

Again    

???

bedfordwelsh wrote:

HammerofThunor wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:Planning on being home for the HC weekend and will look forward to watching both games as a neutral

Again    

???

Sorry, again as a neutral I meant. It was meant as light hearted banter, but clearly completely missed   

Hope you enjoy the games

Hammer,

As a Dragons fan I watch every game at this late stage in the season as a neutral

Sad fact is many fans of both Bath and Saints will not get tickets for the final as they have only been allocated a very small number of tickets if you believe this to be wrong then please sign the petition below. (typical ERC not thinking ahead! )


http://www.petitions24.com/move_the_2014_amlin_challenge_cup_to_a_bigger_venue

Scrumpy wrote:Sad fact is many fans of both Bath and Saints will not get tickets for the final as they have only been allocated a very small number of tickets if you believe this to be wrong then please sign the petition below. (typical ERC not thinking ahead! )


http://www.petitions24.com/move_the_2014_amlin_challenge_cup_to_a_bigger_venue

Isn't that the same problem every year, if supporters wait until they see if their gets to the final then they run risk of not getting ticket or you buy it anyway and hope they get there. If they don't you either sell it on or go for the day out anyway.

The problem is that there isn't many tickets for two of the best supported teams in the AP, at the end of the day the Arms park isn't big enough, ERC have shown once again why they have to go imo.

Scrumpy wrote:The problem is that there isn't many tickets for two of the best supported teams in the AP, at the end of the day the Arms park isn't big enough, ERC have shown once again why they have to go imo.

These arrangements are unlikely to change next season. As someone already said to guarantee maximum revenue they need to sell as many seats as possible before the finalists are announced. Even then, these games have often not been sold out. Moving them to the same city as the main final helps as you get people doing both.

Scrumpy wrote:The problem is that there isn't many tickets for two of the best supported teams in the AP, at the end of the day the Arms park isn't big enough, ERC have shown once again why they have to go imo.

I agree on the size issue and would have thought it be better at the CCS rather than the Arms Park though not sure of Cardiffs fixture this weekend. Least that way there would have been the possibility of 'spare' tickets but like mentioned a lot of tickets for both games are sold way in advance of people knowing what teams are in the finals.

Why, how did the combined brain-power (not exactly a dangerous weapon) of the ERC come to the conclusion that committing the Euro finals to a smallish, neutral city was a good idea?

Wouldn't it always have been preferable to assign the venues after the completion of the pool games?

Last year France played France in Dublin.  

ERC have given another 400 tickets to Bath and Saints (200 a piece) simply not good enough.

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:Why, how did the combined brain-power (not exactly a dangerous weapon) of the ERC come to the conclusion that committing the Euro finals to a smallish, neutral city was a good idea?

Wouldn't it always have been preferable to assign the venues after the completion of the pool games?

Last year France played France in Dublin.  

If you want a sell-out you have to start selling tickets early.

I went to 10 finals between 2001 and 2011, only missing the 2010 final in Paris. the whole occasion is fantastic and it is the mix of fans that makes it so great. Unless you are a partisan fan and bought from your club, you never know who will be sat around you. In fact ever since the 2001 final, we bought our tickets in advance, hoping that Leicester would be there, but knowing it was great if they were not.

I slate ERC for many things but marketing the final is not one of them (wish they would move it around more though).

Moving the Amlin final to the same city as big brother, was for me another great idea.

i had ticket for the HC final Munster v Toulouse in the MS and it was a fantastic day and a lot of that was due to the mixture of fans.

It's a shame but the thing with the Amlin final is if it's two French sides or even just one French side the ground is actually too big. I doubt any French side would sell the allocation Saints and Bath have been given.

When Stade Francais played Harlequins in the Cardiff City stadium in the 2011 final it had a massive number of empty seats. As in, it was less than half full. So the move makes sense although it would be good if they could use the City Stadium if the demand outstrips supply but I doubt that that is possible this close to the game.

Feel sorry for the fans of the two clubs who won't get to go though.

Deciding that Cardiff was a suitable place to stage the EC finals was based on pretty much buggin's'turn.

Of the Quarter finalists this year, there were three Irish, four French and five English.

Any of those countries could have held a big bash week-end at 'short notice'.

HQ could (should?) have hosted Amlin and a straight draw between the others to nominate their preferences in the moribund HEQ.

Some of the best ever Heineken Cup final weekends have been in Cardiff in terms of atmosphere and crowds. Given the French pulling out at the last minute it's not a bad choice.

Would the Donkey Sanctuary have been filled had Leinster or another province not made the final last year, Notch?

It's a no win situation in some ways, they could have booked the Cardiff City stadium, the final could have turned out to be Begles against Stade and they'd be getting criticised for booking an over sized stadium and not filling it.
Given the acceesibilty of Cardiff if was a Bath/Saints fan once the team had got to the quarters or semis, I think I'd have taken a punt on tickets at that point and if someone else got there would have put them on Ebay/StubHub or offered them to a fan via this very forum.

Scrumpy wrote:ERC have given another 400 tickets to Bath and Saints (200 a piece) simply not good enough.

Are you shipping in ringers to act as supporters? You'll never sell that number of tickets!

Seriously though, it's a farce the ERC are still holding the final at such small grounds. When we where in the final against Irish in 2006 it was held at the Stoop and the demand for tickets from sides could have filled the ground 2 or 3 times over. The petition is signed and genuinely good luck in moving venues and for the final itself

Well done good boy.  

The ERC should have had a back up plan if two well supported teams got to the final of the Amlin, I understand if two French clubs got there or maybe even one as there wouldn't be the numbers, but its not like Cardiff doesn't have a soon to be Championship standard stadium up the road that could take 20k fans. Oh and it will be empty on that weekend.

So long ERC, Lets hope the new lot are a little bit more forward thinking.

Scrumpy wrote:So long ERC, Lets hope the new lot are a little bit more forward thinking.

Scrumpy - just for once I agree with you on this one.

It willl be interesting to see how the ECC manage this sort of thing, they will have three finals to manage as well so the holding the whole thing in one city may have to change - although there is also room for innovation, maybe have the third and second tier games as a "Double Header" on one day, or do a joint ticket for all the finals as one package.

As long as they think outside the box they will do fine.

Portnoy's Complaint wrote:Would the Donkey Sanctuary have been filled had Leinster or another province  not made the final last year, Notch?

I'm quite confused. Is the Donkey Sanctuary the Aviva or the Millennium Stadium? Or the RDS? The final in Dublin did sell out, the venue is smaller than Twickenham or the MS though. I think last year ERC was very lucky that Leinster got 'parachuted' into the Amlin and then the Amlin Final was in their home ground! Because if Leinster weren't there I do think they would have struggled. So no... if that is what you were asking?

I do think that having the two finals in the same stadium is a good idea, to encourage people to make a weekend of it- I know a good few people who do this but it is expensive.

Notch, I think the double or even triple "header" idea has legs - given that ECC are generating significantly more income than ERC did, the ticket price should be kept to a reasonable price - I presume you hire a mega stadium on a daily basis so there would be economies of scale wth regards to ancilliary costs like, policing, staffing the concessions, etc.

I'm not sure that a triple header would work IL. the teams in the Tier 3competition are likely to be Italian, Georgian, Portuguese, Russian etc.

Why have the final outside those countries? They need big events to raise the profile of the game.

I was able to get 4 tix for the match but they were a beyotch to acquire.  I called a guy who knew a guy who knew someone in low places.  Took a bloody week and a bunch of phone calls.  And I am not sure I will be going.  Cannot see any reason this was necessary.

Hi Notch, equally they would get good exposure by playing on the same "bill" as the top club sides, I'm sure that nice Mr. McCafferty will have it all thought out though.....

http://www.espn.co.uk/amlin-challenge-cup-2013-14/rugby/story/223727.html

Ridiculous decision to host the Amlin final here. Denying so many fans chance to see a final.

Join the petition.

According to that report though the attendances from the 2009, 11 and 12 haven't warranted a bigger venue.

These games have to be organised a fair way in advance of knowing what teams are in the finals so its always hard to judge, is it to late to re-arrange at this stage. guess it wouldn't take much to move it to the CCS.

It's not the size of the stadium that's the problem. It's completely reasonable given previous years. But 1000 tickets for the teams? That's ridiculous

HammerofThunor wrote:It's not the size of the stadium that's the problem. It's completely reasonable given previous years. But 1000 tickets for the teams? That's ridiculous

Agree, this is the biggest issue. As I said, I had to pull out a lot of favours and work pretty hard to grab my 4 tix. Didn't get them through the team.

HammerofThunor wrote:It's not the size of the stadium that's the problem. It's completely reasonable given previous years. But 1000 tickets for the teams? That's ridiculous

Ah right I thought people has issues with the size of the stadium, have there been similar problems with ticket allocation in the past then or isi t simply because there two English sides in it both (Bath especially) within easy reach of Cardiff?

Don't know. You would think it's always 1000 per team, otherwise it would be pretty weird as a one off. You'd think it's pretty low as they could always return unclaimed ones if the clubs were given too many. 17% of the tickets to the clubs in the final.

If only 1000 tix go to each team, then who are the other people attending the match?

doctor_grey wrote:If only 1000 tix go to each team, then who are the other people attending the match?  

People who bought tickets at the start of the season in the hope their team make the final will make up a fair decent percentage then there is the coporate cling ons

Supposedly more than 2000 were retained for the ERC. Not sure where that came from or if it's true.

HammerofThunor wrote:Supposedly more than 2000 were retained for the ERC. Not sure where that came from or if it's true.

Sounds about right. 3000 tickets for the ERC semi-final at Ravenhill, out of 17000, and those basically go to sponsors to do with as they wish not fans. Some find their way into the hands of touts or are passed on in other ways

If the ERcC end that they'd have my support on one thing at least.

Petition. Signed

is there any logical reason why it can't be moved to the millennium stadium?
The game is 3 weeks away you would think it would be possible to arrange staffing of the venu and reissue tickets
that's assuming they could be bothered to get the finger out in the first place!

The fact is the ERC aren't listening, just like when they choose not to listen to English and French clubs.

The sooner we are rid of them the better.

dubh_linn wrote:Petition. Signed

is there any logical reason why it can't be moved to the millennium stadium?
The game is 3 weeks away you would think it would be possible to arrange staffing of the venu and reissue tickets
that's assuming they could be bothered to get the finger out in the first place!

You've seen the MS stadium after a game right? That would be way too big. The suggestion is move it to Cardiff City Stadium but can't see that happening.

dubh_linn wrote:Petition. Signed

is there any logical reason why it can't be moved to the millennium stadium?
The game is 3 weeks away you would think it would be possible to arrange staffing of the venu and reissue tickets
that's assuming they could be bothered to get the finger out in the first place!

I wouldn't have thought the MS would be an option given the HC there the next day but moving it to CCS shouldn't be that big an issue.

A quick google suggests that there is a difference in capacity of about 15,000 between CAP and CCS.
If there is a genuine demand for additional tickets why not offer 7,500 tickets each to Bath/Quins with a deal that they pay upfront for them and sell them directly. If the demand is there there's no issue. This is how most "away" tickets are sold in football - the club buy them in bulk and resell.
Also like the Saracens game at Twickenham why are ERC getting the blame for this? The call on where to play would be with the WRU who I presume have chosen to "keep the money within rugby" just as the RFU did with Saracens.

The WRU ? This one has gone off on a tangent somewhat

Munkian, as the decision to play the Saracens semi at Twickenham was an RFU one it would be fair to assume that the decision to hold the Amlin final at CAP was a WRU as the host union.