Wimbledon Day 5

First topic message reminder :

Centre Court

Novak Djokovic (SRB) [1] v Gilles Simon (FRA)
Petra Kvitova (CZE) [6] v Venus Williams (USA) [30]
Andy Murray (GBR) [3] v Roberto Bautista Agut (ESP) [27]

No.1 Court

Barbora Zahlavova Strycova (CZE) v Na Li (CHN) [2]
Grigor Dimitrov (BUL) [11] v Alexandr Dolgopolov (UKR) [21]
Marin Cilic (CRO) [26] v Tomas Berdych (CZE) [6]

No.2 Court
11:30am

Simona Halep (ROU) [3] v Lesia Tsurenko (UKR)
Jerzy Janowicz (POL) [15] 7-5 4-4 Lleyton Hewitt (AUS) To Finish
Michelle Larcher De Brito (POR) v Agnieszka Radwanska (POL) [4]
Jamie Murray (GBR) [14]
John Peers (AUS) [14]
v
Jamie Delgado (GBR)
Gilles Muller (LUX)

Come on Andy!

Let's be honest it is only Djokovic who has faced tricky early round opponents.

Nadal, Murray and Federer yet to be really tested.

lydian with a predictable anti-Murray post, sigh... Odd as before the first round he was describing Goffin as a big match-player who'd be a real threat to Murray, with the Brit needing to be on his game to avoid an upset. After he was summararily dismissed, he's become a "grasscourt novice walkover", oh well. As pointed out BA won a tournament on grass last week, and has probably won more matches on grass in the last two weeks than Rosol and Klizan in their entire careers put together, but hey, you keep believing that Murray is only looking good because he's playing rubbish opposition, if it makes you feel better

HM Murdoch wrote:Wow, SB, you surprise me with that. I think Novak would have to produce his absolute top level A-game to have a decent chance of beating Murray on grass.

And Novak doesn't seem to be particularly near his absolute top level A-game so far.

Murray, by contrast, is looking great. Not just good tennis but a real swagger in his attitude and demeanour too.

It is early days and whether you look good now does not matter much - as long as you advance without spending too much energy. And they both have done that. The first match that could tell us whether Andy is playing as well as he looks is in QF if he plays Grigor there. I would not be shocked if we are getting ready to watch Nole play Dimi next Friday. If Andy plays and dismesses Grigor easily (straights or easy four sets) I will start rethinking my position.

Actually, I suppose Andy vs Anderson could also tell us if Andy is playing well. But only if Andy loses or struggles badly. Kevin is not good on grass so Andy should dismiss him easily.

Anderson will be an interesting one, if only because he's a different type of player to what Murray's had to deal with so far (in fact it's quite a while since Andy last played a big server at a slam). He usually deals with this type with few problems, and his returning game has looked plenty sharp enough so far, so I expect him to cruise through with few problems.

A few people (and not only Murray fans) have mentionned his on-court demeanour this year. I think HM used the word "strut". I can only concur: I don't think I've ever seen Murray look so supremely confident on a tennis court as he has done this week. "Strut" is a very good word: he looks as if he owns the place, and you're going to have to be pretty d@mn amazing to take it away from him. People may say these things aren't important, but I think they are...

Of course the form of the here and now is immaterial but it is always important to get through the opening rounds with the minimum fuss and time on court and Andy has done that. A good indicator of what form he is truly in will be how (if that is how it pans out) he deals with Dimitrov in the quarters.

My big doubt about Andy retaining his title hinges more on having to quite possibly beat Rafa in the final. Andy has an infuriating habit of being too passive against Rafa. He'll try to play his way into rallies instead of taking the initiative and that is a recipe for disaster against Rafa as he will always get a big shot in before Andy to take control of the rallies. Andy (even if it isn't to be in final here) in future matches against Rafa needs to be more pro-active and less reactive.

Anderson is a poor man's Berdych and whilst Murray does have difficulties with the real thing, he shouldn't struggle against the lesser version if his return game is working. Anderson's done well and always seems to live up to his ranking in these big tournaments but I think he goes home here. I can't see how he can win 1 set (unless it goes to a TB) never mind 3 so it's probably game over for him here.

I agree with MfC and HM, Murray is giving the impression he's the "Rooster of the walk" at Wimbledon and finally looks like a major champion. Long gone are the days he'd stumble on court with the messy shirt, the unkept hair and the unshaven stubble.

I can't see Dimitrov beating Murray on grass in a BO5. Good luck to him if he gets through, but not gonna happen against Andy.

Anti-Murray moi? Lol

Bautista won a title on grass last week but the highest ranked player he faced was #49...another cakewalk draw...highly the stuff of legend in winning a low key grass event in an unpronounceable place. If he'd beaten a couple of top 10'ers, or even top 20'ers, on the way I'd be all ears.

Nadal's draw hasn't been the stuff of legend either so far but all guys faced have been able to hit very hard and flat, not only that but nearly all guys that face Nadal are seemingly inspired to raise their game beyond normal knowing there is no other way they can play against him. The problem is they can't usually sustain it.

The point is Murray hasn't faced anything near a test yet before people start gushing and anointing him for the title.

lydian wrote:Anti-Murray moi? Lol

Bautista won a title on grass last week but the highest ranked player he faced was #49...another cakewalk draw...highly the stuff of legend in winning a low key grass event in an unpronounceable place. If he'd beaten a couple of top 10'ers, or even top 20'ers, on the way I'd be all ears.

Nadal's draw hasn't been the stuff of legend either so far but all guys faced have been able to hit very hard and flat, not only that but nearly all guys that face Nadal are seemingly inspired to raise their game beyond normal knowing there is no other way they can play against him. The problem is they can't usually sustain it.

The point is Murray hasn't faced anything near a test yet before people start gushing and anointing him for the title.

I agree with you lydian. However, who exactly is gushing on the forum? I can't see any Murray fans doing that in fact most gushing is coming from a Nadal fan (not you) despite him dropping sets in each of his three matches against players ranked 50+ in the world. At least Agut is well up amongst the seeds unlike Klizan, Rosol and Kukushkin.

By gushing I mean people are saying he'll reach the semis at least, playing the best tennis, etc.

Those 3 players vs Nadal all had the ability to hit very hard and flat. Agut doesn't. His game is built off consistency not lethal power. To be honest, I'm glad Nadal has had these tests as it's sharpening his grass game no end. Today the conditions were quick, humid and low bouncing and I thought Nadal was returning very well and as the match went on he was becoming more incisive in his play. It can only help him for week 2. If I was a Murray fan I'd be worried he hasn't faced hard hitting quality yet and the difference when he does could possibly catch him cold ...not that I expect Anderson to beat him. But I think people are dismissing Dimitrov far too quickly, the guy is the real deal and if he plays a blinder could beat Murray in straights, his serve alone if on is a nightmare as it's 130+, so 5 set fitness may not come into it. Of course, Murray is favourite for that no doubt but I see that as a very stern test, not a pushover. Then it's semis and final against likely 2 very tough opponents whoever they end up being...it'll be a tougher draw at the back end than last year.

I am smart enough to realise what a tough ask it will be for Murray to defend his crown. I haven't made any predictions about things. At least Andy is getting through his matches without any sets dropped and no real lapses in concentration. Come the bigger challenges he will be mentally and physically fresher than he was last year. My real worry is Nadal (if he meets him in the final). Murray has the game to beat Rafa but if he sticks to his blueprint game plan he stands little chance but if he can throw some heavy, aggressive hitting in there he will be in with a chance.

lydian wrote:Anti-Murray moi? Lol

Bautista won a title on grass last week but the highest ranked player he faced was #49...another cakewalk draw...highly the stuff of legend in winning a low key grass event in an unpronounceable place. If he'd beaten a couple of top 10'ers, or even top 20'ers, on the way I'd be all ears.

Nadal's draw hasn't been the stuff of legend either so far but all guys faced have been able to hit very hard and flat, not only that but nearly all guys that face Nadal are seemingly inspired to raise their game beyond normal knowing there is no other way they can play against him. The problem is they can't usually sustain it.

The point is Murray hasn't faced anything near a test yet before people start gushing and anointing him for the title.

Lydian, we have a Rafa fan on here who already has Rafa 'locked on' for Wimby, and also for 3 more USO titles. Isn't that a wee bit more gushing than anything any Murray fans have come up with?

JuliusHMarx wrote:

lydian wrote:Anti-Murray moi? Lol

Bautista won a title on grass last week but the highest ranked player he faced was #49...another cakewalk draw...highly the stuff of legend in winning a low key grass event in an unpronounceable place. If he'd beaten a couple of top 10'ers, or even top 20'ers, on the way I'd be all ears.

Nadal's draw hasn't been the stuff of legend either so far but all guys faced have been able to hit very hard and flat, not only that but nearly all guys that face Nadal are seemingly inspired to raise their game beyond normal knowing there is no other way they can play against him. The problem is they can't usually sustain it.

The point is Murray hasn't faced anything near a test yet before people start gushing and anointing him for the title.

Lydian, we have a Rafa fan on here who already has Rafa 'locked on' for Wimby, and also for 3 more USO titles. Isn't that a wee bit more gushing than anything any Murray fans have come up with?

Thats it?   

Let's be honest. Nadal hasn't had tests. I agree with LF that he is making a hash of his draw which is a cakewalk.

Why do Murray fans need to be worried?

I would be more worried if Murray was dropping sets to lower ranked players.