Glasgow and Edinburgh: Ongoing Banter Thread IV

[George Carlin]

First topic message reminder :

Historical Banter:

https://www.606v2.com/t48240-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread
https://www.606v2.com/t51313-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-ii
https://www.606v2.com/t53119-glasgow-and-edinburgh-ongoing-banter-thread-iii

A new thread for the 2014/5 season.

A. Edinburgh Rugby


1. Coaching Team

Alan Solomons - head coach
Stevie Scott -  assistant coach
Omar Mouneimne - assistant coach

2. Players In

Neil Cochrane from London Wasps
John Andress from Worcester Warriors
Rory Sutherland from Gala RFC
Tom Heathcote from Bath Rugby
Michael Tait from Newcastle Falcons
Fraser McKenzie from Newcastle Falcons
Phil Burleigh from the Highlanders
Anton Bresler from the Sharks
Brett Thompson from USA 7s

3. Players Out

Steven Lawrie retired
Alun Walker released
Alex Allan to Glasgow Warriors
Geoff Cross to London Irish
Lewis Niven released
Sean Cox to London Irish
Robert McAlpine released
Perry Parker to Rotherham Titans
Izak van der Westhuizen released
Ross Rennie to Bristol Rugby
Dimitri Basilaia released
Alex Black released
Greig Laidlaw to Gloucester Rugby
Chris Leck released
Piers Francis released
Gregor Hunter released
Harry Leonard to Leeds Carnegie
Ben Atiga retired
Ben Cairns retired
Nick De Luca to Biarritz Olympique
Lee Jones released
Aleki Lutui to Gloucester Rugby

4. Pre-season Fixtures

Leicester Tigers v Edinburgh
Saturday 23 August, 14:00
Welford Road

Edinburgh v Newcastle Falcons
Friday 29 August, 19:45
Mansfield Park, Hawick

B. Glasgow Warriors


1. Coaching Team

Gregor Townsend – Head Coach
Shade Munro – Forwards Coach
Matt Taylor – Defence Coach

2. Players In

Alex Allan from Edinburgh
Murray McConnell from Ayr RFC
Euan Murray from Worcester Warriors
James Downey from Munster
Rossouw de Klerk from the Cheetahs

3. Players Out

Moray Low to Exeter Chiefs
Chris Cusiter to Sale Sharks
Ruaridh Jackson to London Wasps
Ed Kalman retired
Byron McGuigan released
Finlay Gillies released
Scott Wight to Melrose RFC
Gabriel Ascárate released
Folau Niua released
Carlin Isles to USA 7s

4. Pre-season Fixtures

Glasgow Warriors v Harlequins
Saturday 23 August, 14:30
Scotstoun Stadium

London Scottish v Glasgow Warriors
Saturday 30 August, 15:00
Richmond Athletic Ground

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

I've tickets to both sessions of the group games - it's not the split that really bothers me (although it is a right pain in the cornhole), but the fact that it wasn't possible to buy the same seats.

My folks are coming up for this, and we'll have to shift ourselves (that's 'shift', with an 'f') to new seats.

Small things, and we're not exactly in Gaza, but I'm still not happy.

Gaza left Ibrox some time ago.....

Damn that was bad!

I can't believe they make you leave the ground and change seats. Completely ridiculous. That cannot be a decision made by anyone involved in rugby. Not even Scott Johnson is that daft.

Actually for you that was quite funny - almost living up to the name!

Congrats btw, didn't realise a little Sneddon was on the way - top news   

[funnyExiledScot]

I've tickets to both sessions of the group games - it's not the split that really bothers me (although it is a right pain in the cornhole), but the fact that it wasn't possible to buy the same seats.

My folks are coming up for this, and we'll have to shift ourselves (that's 'shift', with an 'f') to new seats.

Small things, and we're not exactly in Gaza, but I'm still not happy.

Gaza left Ibrox some time ago.....

Damn that was bad!

I can't believe they make you leave the ground and change seats. Completely ridiculous. That cannot be a decision made by anyone involved in rugby. Not even Scott Johnson is that daft.

Why sell a seat once when you can sell the same one twice. They have opted to go for the same model as the London Olympics and I guess have been vindicated in that it has sold out, as London did. Apart from the fact that they are making a few quid, running Commonwealth Games is not cheap at the end of the day, I suppose it can be seen as a good thing that lots of people are able to get tickets and see events. Living in London, I was dissapointed to only get tickets for one event at the OG and I know of plenty other people who got none. Its not a typical rugby event at the end of the day, but maybe one that will be more memorable, especially if Scotland beat the All Blacks while i am there watchng!

From a commercial perspective it makes sense. It's just extremely annoying for rugby fans, and in my opinion will detract from the occasion. As you say, it's a one off event and the organisers won't care whether it's a decent event or not, as long as they've made enough money.

[funnyExiledScot]

I've tickets to both sessions of the group games - it's not the split that really bothers me (although it is a right pain in the cornhole), but the fact that it wasn't possible to buy the same seats.

My folks are coming up for this, and we'll have to shift ourselves (that's 'shift', with an 'f') to new seats.

Small things, and we're not exactly in Gaza, but I'm still not happy.

Gaza left Ibrox some time ago.....

Damn that was bad!

I can't believe they make you leave the ground and change seats. Completely ridiculous. That cannot be a decision made by anyone involved in rugby. Not even Scott Johnson is that daft.

Actually for you that was quite funny - almost living up to the name!

Congrats btw, didn't realise a little Sneddon was on the way - top news    

Cheers -   

Going to be a little Miss fES - a terrifying thought!

[RDW]

Anyone with Sky - the Sharks and Highlanders are fighting it out tomorrow and both Phil Burleigh and Anton Bresler are starting.

Good opportunity to see what they're like!

[George Carlin]

I've tickets to both sessions of the group games - it's not the split that really bothers me (although it is a right pain in the cornhole), but the fact that it wasn't possible to buy the same seats.

My folks are coming up for this, and we'll have to shift ourselves (that's 'shift', with an 'f') to new seats.

Small things, and we're not exactly in Gaza, but I'm still not happy.

Gaza left Ibrox some time ago.....

Damn that was bad!

I can't believe they make you leave the ground and change seats. Completely ridiculous. That cannot be a decision made by anyone involved in rugby. Not even Scott Johnson is that daft.

Actually for you that was quite funny - almost living up to the name!

Congrats btw, didn't realise a little Sneddon was on the way - top news    

Cheers -   

Going to be a little Miss fES - a terrifying thought!

Congratulations - little girls are the best, although you'll have realised by now that between her and Mrs FES you're going to be hideously henpecked in future.

When she was 18 months old, I let my daughter choose which of the 2 ties I offered her I was going to wear that day. She gleefully did. Now that she's 2 and a half, both choices get sneerily rejected with a disgusted "noooooo, daddy". A portent for the future if there ever was one...

[jimbopip]

Spot on GC, next summer Princess Daughter gets wed: take my advice start putting your empty Irn Bru bottles in the garage because you'll be needing the deposits back to pay for the dress, the photographer, the reception, the list goes on...

[RDW]

If I ever have a daughter I always envisage this happening before her first date

[funnyExiledScot]

Dates?? My daughter won't be having any of those. Absolutely not.

I suspect I'm going to have issues.

[Tattie Scones RRN]

I have two sons.......but only after I swapped the girls at birth in the hospital.

Having daughters with the cost, hormones and boys sniffing around?

Nah.

[funnyExiledScot]

 

Thanks for that Tattie - tell it like it is!

[IanBru]

The last girl I went out with, her father pretended to be a drug dealer. He really went all-out on it, with the police coming to his house and arresting him.

Ah, fun times.

[funnyExiledScot]

Ah the perils of the Glasgow dating scene!!

[RDW]

First time I went to my girlfriend's house her dad was cleaning shotguns on the kitchen table (for shooting pheasants).

9 years later I've treated her perfectly every day!

[RuggerRadge2611]

Congrats FES, great news. The thought of a daughter is frankly terrifying for me. Mrs Ragde's mum is a bit Grumpy and Mrs Radge isn't much better.

The thought of dealing with multiple PMT women in the house doesn't sound good at all.

[jimbopip]

Stayed away from her have you, then?

[funnyExiledScot]

Congrats FES, great news. The thought of a daughter is frankly terrifying for me. Mrs Ragde's mum is a bit Grumpy and Mrs Radge isn't much better.

The thought of dealing with multiple PMT women in the house doesn't sound good at all.

Thanks - although I'm assured PMT is a wee while away yet!

My sister effectively shunned by Dad between 12 and 28 (her current age) - something to do with him being insensitive, embarrasing and lacking "generosity of the wallet". I see my Dad as a role model.

[George Carlin]

If you want a good start, search for "Jimmy Fallon History of Dad Dancing" on YouTube. I can do all of those now.

[IanBru]

Ah the perils of the Glasgow dating scene!!

Ha, not even in Glasgow FES! No, those were my days at uni in Southampton. A friend of mine described it as the 'Dundee of the south'. I'm inclined to agree!

[IanBru]

I'm watching the Sharks v Highlanders S15 qualifying match (aka, the Bresler v Burleigh Potentially World Class Showdown).

Sharks absolutely destroying up front, scoring a pushover try, with Bresler a big part of everything. He hits rucks with such impact, it's really very impressive.

[RDW]

Good to hear.

Keep us updated on what you think of them Bru!

[cakeordeath]

FFS Bresler just went off injured

[IanBru]

Aaaand... Bresler goes off after 30 minutes clutching his lower-left rib cage - looks like a broken rib.

Well that was fun while it lasted!

I wonder if van der Westhuizen can be attracted back?   

[IanBru]

I was just writing that Burleigh has been running some nice support lines and... he runs a nice line, receives an offload, and scores a nice try. All in all, pretty nice.

Sharks 25-27 Highlanders. 16 minutes to play.

[RDW]

Broken rib isn't a disaster - might mean he can come to Edinburgh sooner too!

[IanBru]

Ha ha, RDW, I'm just messing with you!

He looked in a bit of discomfort, but really nothing to be worried about.

[IanBru]

I could watch the Highlanders' attacking play all day long - if they work really hard at it, they could be as good as Glasgow.

[RDW]

Sounds like a cracking game - what was your overall impression of the two players?

[jimbopip]

I watched the highlights of the Sevens and the City last night. Vernon, Bennett, Hogg and Jedi. Oh but I am looking forward to the festive season.
p.s. Medical Update on Bernard Bresler: apparently his ribs are fine - he busted a stay in his corsetry.

[funnyExiledScot]

I could watch the Highlanders' attacking play all day long - if they work really hard at it, they could be as good as Glasgow.

That good?! NZ rugby really is coming along.

[funnyExiledScot]

I watched the highlights of the Sevens and the City last night. Vernon, Bennett, Hogg and Jedi. Oh but I am looking forward to the festive season.
p.s. Medical Update on Bernard Bresler: apparently his ribs are fine - he busted a stay in his corsetry.

  

[jimbopip]

Anton Bresler trying on the new MFL training kit, with Knuckles McGlumpher the kit man in attendance.



Bernard Breslaw about to throw himself from a high promontory after being told that there would be no more Carry Ons but there was a pantomime villain's part going in Edinburgh.

[EWT Spoons]

There’s a piece in the Scotsman a couple of days ago (included below), about getting youngsters game time.  There is nothing new really being discussed, but one thing that caught my eye was in the comments section, in and amongst the clamour for another pro team, was someone who claims to have priced the cost of an under 20s league to sit alongside the regular pro12 league, which apparently would work out at an additional £100k per annum.

Now, I think this persons costings only considered travel & accommodation to make this work, so there are other costs to consider here, namely that both Edinburgh & Glasgow (and potentially the other 10 clubs in the pro 12) would need to increase their number of u20 players to make this work.  Which would therefore see an increase in players wages.

Still if we can get the numbers of young players to set up youth sides then it might be a consideration, especially if these academies come to fruition.

Here’s a sentence for the SRU’s chef executive, Mark Dobson, and his director of rugby, Scott Johnson, to ponder: “If we do not find a solution to the problem of our young players being denied the opportunity to play a high level of football between the ages of 17 and 21, we can forget about replicating Germany’s success.”


Different sport, of course; this was Michael Owen writing in The Daily Telegraph about the problem for which English football must find a solution if their national team is again to be a serious competitor. Different sport, but same problem.

The problem has been recognised for a long time now. Our young players are not exposed to a high level of rugby. Some of them don’t even get much game-time after they have left school. They may spend hours in the gym or on the practice pitches, but many don’t actually play much rugby, and often, when they do, it’s for a club side that they haven’t spent much time with. Our age-group teams don’t often win, no matter how hard they try, how well-prepared they have been and, indeed, how much natural talent they may possess. Because our structure is inadequate, young players either don’t get enough rugby at a level which is demanding but suited to their age and the stage of their development, or, occasionally, they may find themselves pitch-forked into the professional game before they are ready.

Everyone knows this. The four new regionally-based national academies may lead to an improvement. But it’s not easy to see how they will provide their students with the requisite amount of high-level competitive rugby.

So here are a couple of suggestions. (Any readers who can think of better ones should bring them forward.) The first recognises that, to some extent anyway, our partners and rivals in what is now the Guinness Pro 12 have the same problem, and have certainly the same interest in ensuring that U-21 players have the opportunity to play high-level games. So why not propose an U-21 league for the four unions that have teams in the Guinness League? They might either be attached to the professional clubs already represented in it, or might be formed independently of them, drawn from each union’s academy structures. Even if it didn‘t prove practical for home and away matches to be played, this would still offer these players what they don’t now get: at least 11 matches of intense competitive rugby against teams drawn from their own age-group.

Second, to back this up – and even if such a league isn’t possible – the SRU should organise an annual summer tour of one of the southern hemisphere countries for a squad of players drawn from the academies and U-21 players attached to Edinburgh and Glasgow. Arranging such a tour would, of course, require co-operation from the host countries but, given that there have been expressions of willingness among the IRB members to see a revival of Scottish rugby, one might hope that this would be forthcoming. Certainly the SRU would have nothing to lose in setting this target.

“Nothing to lose” may be putting it a bit strongly. Taken literally, there would be quite a lot to lose. Both these ventures would be expensive. Neither could come near to being self-financing. However, thanks to the BT deal, the SRU’s financial position would appear to be much healthier than at any time since the game went professional. Both the U-21 league and the suggested summer tour would have to be regarded as investments. But it’s a truism that, without investment, you are unlikely to profit.

No doubt other people may have better suggestions than mine. They may, for all I know, be mulling over brighter ideas themselves in the SRU offices. All I’m hoping to do is kick off a debate. The starting point is clear. Despite a number of marginally better performances (sometimes) by the national team, and despite Glasgow’s good play and splendid record last season, our game remains becalmed in the doldrums – at best – while other countries continue to thrive. Something must be done, for it’s clear that what Owen says of English football applies at least equally to Scottish rugby. Who knows? It might even be worth sending someone to Germany to learn how they bring on young players capable of forming a team that humiliates Brazil and then goes on to win the World Cup. For a European team to do that in South America is at least equivalent to one of the Six 
Nations winning a three-Test series in New Zealand or South Africa.

Comment I was referring to above

I have already advised the Pro 12 league with a similar plan but it seems to fall on deaf ears.I worked out that there could be a second team league.On away matches the two teams would travel together and stay in the same hotels.The management and back up team are already there for the first team.

I also costed the whole programme and about 100k per year would be all it would cost. Seems a bargain to me.

[RDW]

I like the sound of a reserve or 'youth' league, but not sure a full season long fixture list is practical or justified.

Do the AP reserve teams play a full season fixture list? I know they have reserve team games.

I have to say, I'd much rather meaningful reserve team fixtures for Glasgow and Edinburgh than a 3rd pro team just now. They will be playing at a higher level than they currently get but not so high a level that they get pumped week in week out while pretending to be a 'proper' pro team.

As Allan Massie says though this will have to be viewed as an investment as they won't make any money from it.

First step is easy - put them in the bloody B&I cup since we've withdrawn the club teams!

[EWT Spoons]

Aye maybe a full season is a bit much, but could easily be half a season, swapping between home and away on alternating seasons.

Would just need to tie it into the first teams fixtures, so that they are travelling together and therefore saving costs.

[EWT Spoons]

Good news for the coming season for Edinburgh

Manager Ronny Deila says the new surface at Murrayfield is "perfect" as Celtic prepare to face KR Reykjavik in Champions League qualifying

"It is a very good pitch," he said. "I don't think there will be any problem."

[RDW]

It pains me that the pitch with be christened with a football match, but given it is pretty much paying for the pitch it is a necessary evil.

Let's just hope the fans behave themselves and don't start ripping up seats and peeing on the walls - we get enough of that when Glasgow come to Murrayfield!   

[funnyExiledScot]

It pains me that the pitch with be christened with a football match, but given it is pretty much paying for the pitch it is a necessary evil.

Let's just hope the fans behave themselves and don't start ripping up seats and peeing on the walls - we get enough of that when Glasgow come to Murrayfield!   

You cannot tar all the Glasgow fans with the Schizoid brush. I know at least five Glaswegians and one chap is perfectly civilised.

[jimbopip]

Fes if ever you were alone in a confined space with five Glaswegians one perfectly civilised chap would not be enough to protect the sanctity of your hand made silken undergarments. The contents of your Karen Millen alpaca skin purse would keep Schiz in Duechars for a year.

[funnyExiledScot]

Fes if ever you were alone in a confined space with five Glaswegians one perfectly civilised chap would not be enough to protect the sanctity of your hand made silken undergarments. The contents of your Karen Millen alpaca skin purse would keep Schiz in Duechars for a year.

  

What are you saying about Glaswegians???

I have long suspected Al Kellock and James Eddie were "close".

[funnyExiledScot]

I see that Edinburgh has announced the annual pre-season BBQ.

With both Chunk and Atiga gone, there's a fighting chance of there actually being enough food to go round this year!

[jimbopip]

I'm not so sure Fes, this Burly fella sounds if he can tackle his weight in spare ribs. As opposed to McVisser, obviously.

[Dorothy_Mantooth]

Glasgow announcing a signing today, according to twitter.

[RDW]

Bresler is out for 4-6 weeks with a broken rib.

[jimbopip]

That's what you get for trying to squeeze into corsetry that's too tight. As Knuckles McGlumpher said to me over a pint of Ferrt's Patina in The Stockbroker's Arms last night, "Yon fella's never a 10. He'll be lucky to get into a 14. Huv ye seen his hips?"

[funnyExiledScot]

4-6 weeks isn't a big issue - Atkins and MacKenzie deserve some gametime as well. Both are very capable.

Looking forward to seeing the new Glasgow signing. Any ideas which position?

[Dorothy_Mantooth]

Looking forward to seeing the new Glasgow signing. Any ideas which position?

No idea, there was just the usual "teaser" about a signing on the clubs twitter account. With all the EDP and Re-Signings done, I would imagine its a new signing.

[EWT Spoons]

24 year old prop Rossouw de Klerk from Cheetahs is Glasgow's new signing according to the official twitter feed

[RuggerRadge2611]

I didn't really think the soap dodgers needed much in the way of props.

On another note am I the only person in Scotland distinctly underwhelmed with the commie games?

Without Russia, China and the US it seems a bit like the Amlin of the athletics world.

[Dorothy_Mantooth]

24 year old prop Rossouw de Klerk from Cheetahs is Glasgow's new signing according to the official twitter feed

Another TH, didn't see that coming.

With Murray, Welsh already there, does not sound promising for Cusack's fitness, or unless Welsh is getting moved back to LH. Can't see them needing 4 experienced THs

Rossouw de Klerk he's only 24 and signed on a two year deal, he has played 20 times in Super Rugby.

[Notch]

On another note am I the only person in Scotland distinctly underwhelmed with the commie games?

It's the only competition where we (Northern Ireland) actually get to compete as a nation in our own right and not just get subsumed into the wider British team or the wider Irish team, so thats why I like it. Thats very important! But I'm not in Scotland so that doesn't help you.

What I came on here to say is Glasgow are developing a remarkable amount of depth. They'll be a big threat. De Klerk is obviously coming over to play on Sundays.

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