England v India 3rd Test, Ageas Bowl

First topic message reminder :

Lets get in the thread early enough.
India 1-0 up and now is the time to keep up the leel of intensity.
For England a few careers might depend on a quick turnaround in fortune here.
The pitch is reported to have some green on it and is expected to be in between the ugly pathetic track for the Trent Bridge and a lively track for the 2nd test at the HQ.
Not many reports on the England xi, but there are indications that Stuart Binny will be out for India, and by reports coming in now, its Rohit Sharma who might come in.

Stella wrote:

Duty281 wrote:I hope Moeen Ali gets banned for a test or two. Disgraceful stuff.

Now how's today going to go? I had a dream that India were 89/4 at lunch, so I'll hope for that!

Why disgraceful?

We probably wouldn't be allowed to go into that here, otherwise I would answer.

Sorry.

Duty281 wrote:

Stella wrote:

Duty281 wrote:I hope Moeen Ali gets banned for a test or two. Disgraceful stuff.

Now how's today going to go? I had a dream that India were 89/4 at lunch, so I'll hope for that!

Why disgraceful?

We probably wouldn't be allowed to go into that here, otherwise I would answer.

Sorry.

Aah, the bait was there   

Duty281 wrote:I hope Moeen Ali gets banned for a test or two. Disgraceful stuff.

Now how's today going to go? I had a dream that India were 89/4 at lunch, so I'll hope for that!

Can't see anything disgraceful there, and for a change even the ECB has acted with sensibility and sensitivity in the matter.

Is he going to be wearing the armband for the rest of the Test?

If so, I'll engage in some of my own protesting and completely ignore the rest of this game.

Very, very wrong for the ECB to support Ali over this. A sporting field is no place to make statements on ongoing conflicts.

Yes, he'll be wearing it the whole test, and so he should. Free Gaza, whatever your opinion, is a humanitarian matter, and asking player's to ignore it is stupidity. The sports world isn't a vacuum. David Haye fights with a Turkish Cypriot flag on his shorts. How is this different?

So, the cricket then...To coin a golf phrase 'moving day' I think. Whatever happens today will go along way to deciding the outcome of the Test match and quite possibly the series.
 
England need to bowl India out in reasonabley quick time - probably before the end of today (or early tomorrow at the latest). Bat a bit - 30/40 overs and then unleash the bowlers again. Lets hope Broad bowls as he can (why is there always questions over his fitness? Can he not be rested if injured?) and the 2 bowling changes prove to be the right ones.
 
Interesting to see how Ali gets on here today. There is spin and bounce here which he needs to takle advantage of. Being Yorkshire-bias I'm fairly sure Adil Rashid would love to bowl at the Indians on this deck, this is the sort he loves. But we'll see.
 
India will just have to bat and bat, and bat. Simple?

kingraf wrote:Yes, he'll be wearing it the whole test, and so he should. Free Gaza, whatever your opinion, is a humanitarian matter, and asking player's to ignore it is stupidity. The sports world isn't a vacuum. David Haye fights with a Turkish Cypriot flag on his shorts. How is this different?

I've heard he won't be?

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2014/jul/28/moeen-ali-england-wristbands-save-gaza-free-palestine

kingraf wrote:http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2014/jul/28/moeen-ali-england-wristbands-save-gaza-free-palestine

England are happy. That doesn't mean he'll be allowed to wear it.

He wont wear it for the rest of the test- the England team have backed him  but will say any punishment isn't up to them so dont put your place under risk and take it off.

Just the fact it has been pulled up on will give it more publicity anyway- SO he has made his point. If no one spoke of it- his message wouldn't have got out there
.,.


edit- ok maybe not seeing the above link. Maybe he will continue wearing it

ICC have to put a case forwArd and and and... they can't stop him from wearing it until it's been heard. I hope he wears it as well. It's about time some serious attention is being put on that area. It's ridiculous that we're just watching.

I don't exactly think that supporting terrorists is a good idea.

I am shocked and disappointed by the views of some on here.

To those saying Ali should be fined/banned, I repeat: should Flower and Olonga have been banned for their black armband stand? If not, what is the difference, apart from the fact that you personally agreed with one stand but not the other? In what way are Ali's wristbands offensive? Would you also ban somebody wearing a wristband with say "Israel has a right to defend itself"?

All these questions are independent of what you make of the actual mess in Gaza - they are points of principle, so there is no reason to dodge the questions.

I appreciate that had he worn wristbands saying "Hitler should have finished the job" that is one thing. "Save Gaza" and "Free Palestine" cannot in my view possibly be construed as anti-semitic.

As for KPF's feelings that Ali is more in the wrong because his views disagree with the position of the country (debateable) or the popular view of the people (probably wrong, I would say there is the usual split along polarised lines here) coming from someone who has until now been supportive of anybody speaking against the establishment, I find the statement astoundingly hypocritical. On the point of principle I find it plain wrong - making a public stand is surely only useful and effective IF it disagrees with the point of view of the establishment.

For once I have no desire to return to the cricket. Some matters are more important.

[quote="Duty281"]I don't exactly think that supporting terrorists is a good idea.[/quote

Hamas aren't te only people in Gaza. Regardless of whether he's right to wear it, it's not in anyway indicative of supporting Hamas.

I am happy to go back to the Cricket tbh.

I think countries like the USA and us(as a sheep to them) are highly hypocritical by going to places like Afghanistan and Iraq, and arming syrian rebels but not doing anything in gaza or Ukraine.(in gaza its more messy as there seem to be no clear right or wrong- so we would only be pushing piece in an ideal world and trying to help them find a resolution).

I think we need to help peace everywhere or back out everywhere.

back to the cricket.

Maybe he could wear them inside out; thereby still carrying the message on person still?

(by now the whole world will know what it says - therefore subliminally reinforcing his message)

Would be weird however - if the other side said "and Free Paul Gascoigne too!"  

In all seriousness though, I believe it was a brave and perhaps even necessary statement for him to make by bringing the situation to the attention of himself and many others who are now even more aware of it. He has succeeded in that regard.

Whether a Test match is the right place to express himself (and others) is another thing... but I certainly cannot say I'm offended or anything.
Just where do we draw the line though? Maybe dedicate each big match to a particular cause or recent event? Too much overkill? (excuse the pun)

I'm not so sure about that particular way of doing things but I don't mind if they have a few minutes silence or even prayer if there is some major tragic or pertinent event which affects the host nation or even a majority of the spectators assembled either directly or indirectly (e.g. disaster or loss of a cricketing Hall of Famer, etc) Those sort of gestures tend to bring people together and enable us to sit back (after the ceremony is over) and get set for the subsequent action on the field.

However, one mustn't also lose sight of the bigger picture of that conflict - and all other wars currently going on for that matter.
We could end up with lots of perfectly viable messages on a regular basis.

The message should be the same and all-encompassing every time if possible so that there is always space to accommodate all kinds of conflicts.

I don't think we should discuss the situation in Gaza because political discussion on these boards is frowned upon/banned and I don't want to see this thread locked. I believe we could discuss the principle of the gesture without talking about the contents, but maybe not, and we're better off reverting to the cricket.

Mike Selig wrote:I don't think we should discuss the situation in Gaza because political discussion on these boards is frowned upon/banned and I don't want to see this thread locked. I believe we could discuss the principle of the gesture without talking about the contents, but maybe not, and we're better off reverting to the cricket.

Yeah Mike. That is all I wanted to say.

Time to switch over from the CG swimming and watch England serve up some spice to their Indian counterparts!

http://www.standard.co.uk/sport/cricket/england-test-star-moeen-ali-banned-from-wearing-free-gaza-wristbands-by-icc-9634663.html

Well done to the match referee.

Making contentious political statements like that has no place on a cricket field. That is the difference between Ali and what Flower and Olonga did; the former was political, the latter was drawing attention to horrific human rights abuses.

If Ali was making a humanitarian statement, it would have been something along the lines of "stop the bloodshed" or "peace in the Middle East".

That was close but good decision!

we're discussing whether or not calling for a free Gaza is correct, not whether or not Hamas is a terrorist organisation. The fact that the Palestine might be run by an illegitimate regime doesn't make a bloodbath anymore acceptable.

Probably not what Ali intended, but "Free Palestine" is a Political statement and as such I agree with the ICC that Political statements have no place on a Cricket Field.

I dont think Ali is stupid enough to wear something like that but doesn't understand it- That is insulting the lads intellgence- But I agree on principle.

Just dont allow any of it(being right or wrong is immaterial) then there is no confusion.

Wasn't England's Poppy football shirt banned by FIFA?

Massive, massive wickets, Pujara it is, India in early trouble on day 3.
Who all will play those big innings?

Broad gets the break...easy catch for Buttler off Pujara's gloves.

Needed that. Not going to be easy on this rather warm day. Though I quite like the way England have bowled so far this morning.
Important Cook doesn't overbowl Jimmy early on - will need him later. Tempting when he beats the edge like last over ...

Pujara is a good scalp - looked OK today ; although Vijay seems to be the latest Wall.

Massive wicket for England!

Dare I say that Cook's captaincy - withholding Broad for the first half-hour, and letting him simmer in the outfield, before unleashing him in a fired-up state - had a part to play?

Great Wicket!! 

Keep the pressure on.

ANderson is making the ball move!! There is a lot of swing and pace here. Ishant is a huge miss this test for India

Good ball from Broad to get a crucial breakthrough.

Pressure on Kohli who has yet to really make an impact on this series.

Decent captaincy from Cook with his bowling changes so far. Started with Woakes looking for a bit of swing but switched to Broad after only 3 overs as not much happening for Woakes.

Anderson about a foot too short so far I would say.

Its a great work out for Buttler...

Virat Kohli has been attracting some very good balls and has been runless in the series so far. His confidence would be down because of that, but India need their prime batsman to get going in the series here.

Jordan's radar not switched on yet then ?

Hope he gets it right quickly and keeps the pressure on.

Impressed by Woakes so far, has added pace and looks a threat when it's nipping about.

MSP quick question:

Would will replace Dhawan in Old Trafford?

Could Pujara open and Ashwin come in as the all rounder?

msp83 wrote:Virat Kohli has been attracting some very good balls and has been runless in the series so far. His confidence would be down because of that, but India need their prime batsman to get going in the series here.

He has had a rotten run so far , hasn't he ? Wouldn't be surprised to see him get a big one here though ; too good a player to keep failing.

Chris Woakes looks to have improved since his Test debut, but his problem is when he swings the ball it's from the hand. So the batsmen can line him up. 

What the hell's happemed to Chris Jordan? Seems to have lost all confidence.

With the Pujara wicket, the first hour belongs to England.

Duty281 wrote:I don't exactly think that supporting terrorists is a good idea.

I agree with you here.

Gaza is a breeding ground for terrorism and terrorist organizations like Hamas given official patronage there.

If political opinions are allowed to be mixed with sports.....then I also do have an opinion......as above.

and since ECB backs expression of opinions......so nobody has problems...life is good.

Its nothing to do with the ECB.  This is an international game and its governed by the ICC.

Also this forum hates politics.. Best never to get involved..

So let's just kill a thousand because it's a breeding ground, yeah?

Gerry SA wrote:MSP quick question:

Would will replace Dhawan in Old Trafford?

Could Pujara open and Ashwin come in as the all rounder?

Think it will be determined by the result of the game and also Shikhar's performance in the one innings he's left with to save his place. But if the call has to be made on Dhawan, I feel it'll be Gambhir coming in.

kingraf wrote:So let's just kill a thousand because it's a breeding ground, yeah?  

Israel are trying to terrorise Palestine.
Palestine are trying to terrorise Israel.
Both are killing, and trying to kill, innocent civilians.

Supporting either regime is barbaric.

Get in.. 3rd wicket down

Good fast bowling.. Broad stepping up.

I did say four down at lunch! Not too far away from that.

You suspect England would've taken removing Pujara and Vijay before lunch

Broad in the middle of a very good spell here, one nips in, the next nips away and that creates enough doubt in Vijay's mind who then plays on trying to leave one too late. Nice bowling from Broad, deserved that.

Broad on a roll ...Vijay has been very hard to shift so that is a big wicket.

One more before lunch and England would be delighted with the session.

kingraf wrote:So let's just kill a thousand because it's a breeding ground, yeah?  

collateral damage...the term was coined to describe this situation

Rahane is the danger man..

Ind needs a partnership now......India is in a hole now and moving no-where

Come jordan- Line and length. thats all