GUINNESS PRO 12 - Preview courtesy of Planet Rugby

First topic message reminder :

http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_9451543,00.html

In a nutshell

1 – Leinster
2 - Glasgow
3 - Blues
4 - Munster
5 - Ulster
6 - Scarlets
7 - Ospreys
8 - Dragons
9 – Edinburgh
10 -Connacht
11 - Zebre
12 – Benetton Treviso

I read in the Sunday Times (can’t post a link as I don’t subscribe to the online edition) they had the Ospreys as 10th. Long season ahead I think  

Given the two options of watching a relegation battle or an exhibition game I'd take the relegation battle every time.

But I'm an old Prop who loved the tough stuff, Paterson was basically a goal kicker more suited to NFL than rugby so his opinion is not that important anyway.

Scrumpy wrote:Given the two options of watching a relegation battle or an exhibition game I'd take the relegation battle every time.

But I'm an old Prop who loved the tough stuff, Paterson was basically a goal kicker more suited to NFL than rugby so his opinion is not that important anyway.  

But his opinion does have a 100 times more sense than your opinion on AWJ (which is actually the opinion that doesn't matter!).

I'm sorry it's the 1st game of the season at home in front of your own rugby starved fans and the Club Captain decides he needs a Rest!

Oh yeah I see how that makes sense!

Show some frecking leadership AWJ,
Remember the fans who pay towards your wages when you've got you feet up.

I have to say that the opening game of the season should be where you look to lay down a marker and set the tone for what's to come over the next 9 months.  That being the case I can't agree that leaving out you captain because 'he needs a rest' is the right thing to do.  It's a home game for the O's, and given the whole RRW/WRU debacle they should be trying to draw the fans back in.  'Resting' you captain when he's not played a game for at least a couple of months is a bit daft to be honest.

I guess the Ospreys have bought into the idea that Treviso, having more or less built a new team over the Summer, will be pretty poor this season.

As a Blues fan I love the idea that they could come 3rd but, although its possible, I think they will struggle during the international window and if any injuries occur. Apart from Cory Allen we still have soft or inexperienced centres and apart from Cuthbert the wings are unproven. Our minimum aim should be top six in the league and also we should been in with a shout of a second trophy in the lower tier Euro Cup(whatever its called now).

Scarlets have a fairly settled and strong team so I expect them to get a top four place plus Leinster, Munster and Glasgow or Ulster.

Scrumpy wrote:I'm sorry it's the 1st game of the season at home in front of your own rugby starved fans and the Club Captain decides he needs a Rest!

Oh yeah I see how that makes sense!

Show some frecking leadership AWJ,
Remember the fans who pay towards your wages when you've got you feet up.

Something tells me that if it was left to Alun Wyn himself, he'd be playing. Either way, it just looks like added ammunition for Treviso to me. "Look, this lot think they can rest their captain and still beat us." I'm not sure that's wise.

The Saint wrote:

Scrumpy wrote:

The Saint wrote:Remember when Chris Patterson left Gloucester claiming the premiership was rubbish?

No.

Link please.

I couldn't remember what he said, but I've found out what I was referring to. He says the celtic league is better, more attacking and better to watch.

Chris Paterson wrote:
He said: "I genuinely think the Magners League is better, certainly for my game and the game Edinburgh play.


"The Premiership is physically dominated and there are a lot of slower games and relegation sometimes strangles the spectacle.


"You get two or three great games at the top end of the league undoubtedly, but towards the bottom there are tough, tough games.

"The threat of relegation and the amount of money you could lose in relegation sometimes strangles it.

"The Magners League is more positive, more attacking and certainly better to watch."

Edinburgh enjoyed one of their best seasons in the league last year under new head coach Andy Robinson.

And 30-year-old Paterson said he was "delighted" to be coming home.

"This is where I want to play, this is where I can get the best out of me.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/club/2419170/Chris-Paterson-attacks-Guinness-Premiership.html

I'm 100% with Chris on this one .

I 100% disagree with Chris.

Is it miss the point, wrong end of the stick day, today or what?

I used to watch the Aukland Blues because Spencer played for them. I will watch teams like Exeter and London Irish to see how the IQ players are performing. I would have watched Racing to see how Sexton was getting on, but now he's injured I'm not sot sure... I don't support any of these teams because I'm just a casual observer of individual players.

The team I follow comprise a squad of individuals and coaches but it is the entity I support not the individuals. The truth is that the Irish teams rotate players for the success of the team rather than second guessing what each individual in the crowd may want to see. Their attendance levels show that the policy of rotation is not turning crowds away - could it be the success of the 'team' that is drawing the youngsters in?

Clubs with low attendances imply a lack of team support rather than suggest that a plethora of casual observers might once in a while turn up to see a particular player.

I think the point is though, that the game is well supported in Ireland at provincial level, so ultimately team selection is secondary in terms of selling the product.  The product in this case is twofold, rugby as a sport and the Pro12 as a league.  The regions in Wales are not well supported and in order to rebuild the game there and sell the league as a product, they need to be doing what they can to sell themselves.  'Resting' your captain and star player from the opening game of the season at home is not the way the way to do that.  Even if they started him and brought him off at half time it would be better.  I realise that you cannot play your best players in every game and there are tougher battles ahead for the Ospreys, but I think this is a poor decision in the overall scheme of things

Peter O'Mahony (an international player like AWJ and club captain), played his first game last season at the end of September (4 games into the season).

International players come back later because of their SH tour and AWJ probably has not completed his preseason yet.

Looks to me like some of you have just found another excuse not to support the Regions.

Maybe he should stand down as Captain.

Sin é wrote:Looks to me like some of you have just found another excuse not to support the Regions.

Is the fact they're English not enough? Not many Ospreys fans (or people from the Ospreys region) saying much about this.

Plenty of English supported the Regions, Hammer................... well, until they didn't need them no more in the infamous 'negotiations' on De Future. Then of course, they woz dropped like hot Irish spuds to fend for themselves against the big bad WRU.

Actually sounds a little like Bushonian American Foreign Policy!

Ozzy3213 wrote:I think the point is though, that the game is well supported in Ireland at provincial level, so ultimately team selection is secondary in terms of selling the product.  The product in this case is twofold, rugby as a sport and the Pro12 as a league.  The regions in Wales are not well supported and in order to rebuild the game there and sell the league as a product, they need to be doing what they can to sell themselves.  'Resting' your captain and star player from the opening game of the season at home is not the way the way to do that.  Even if they started him and brought him off at half time it would be better.  I realise that you cannot play your best players in every game and there are tougher battles ahead for the Ospreys, but I think this is a poor decision in the overall scheme of things

This is conjecture but I'd say if you put your point o the O's coaches they would say that in the overall scheme of things a successful season will do far more to increase interest and attendances than having AWJ play in this fixture.Having him fit and as fresh as possible when the big games come round gives the team a better chance at having a successful season.There is definitely merit to both arguments but I don't think either decision can be definitively correct.

It's just a sad fact that the modern Rugby players are beginning to act more like footballers with each passing day.

They’ll be biting each other next!

Rubberised gumshields are the only way rugby will be saved.

..so it might mean you don't got no teeth left as a player... but...so what?! - many of them don't got no ears left and they don't complain.

It's amazing how some footballers always get injured just before a friendly international.

I hope rugby players don't start doing that!

Scrumpy wrote:It's amazing how some footballers always get injured just before a friendly international.

I hope rugby players don't start doing that!

That will come down the line if the English and French club owners get their way.The Union run teams are set up to benefit their national sides but the rich owner model is at odds with their national team.

For the first time I'm actually sort of with Scrumpy on this one - of course the Ospreys see this as a game they don't need him for but it might be good if he was named in the squad and maybe given a few minutes towards the end of the game just for a run out "ladies and gentlemen, your captain Alan Wynn Jones", cue applause and cheers etc.

On the other hand long term I don't think having marquee players at every game makes sense from player managment and I'd be surprised if it actually affected attendance - success is what feeds crowds not players.

I think he has a fair point. There are pluses and minuses you could argue.

However given his track record people are going to assume he is on the wind up.

That's what happened to the boy who cried wolf.

I have never tried to wind anyone up.

A different viewpoint which doesn't fall into line with others believes doesn't mean it is a wind up!


AWJ (c) sitting out the 1st game of the season due to him needing a rest (due to it being a big rugby year!) is a poor decision.

Scrumpy wrote:I have never tried to wind anyone up.

We lol'd and lol'd

Scrumpy wrote:A different viewpoint which doesn't fall into line with others believes doesn't mean it is a wind up!

Of course not and I agreed you had a point......... This time.

Scrumpy wrote:
AWJ (c) sitting out the 1st game of the season due to him needing a rest (due to it being a big rugby year!) is a poor decision.

In your (possibly correct) opinion.

Without all the years of Hershness people would be less inclined to disregard your opinions on (just for example) the pro 12

Scrumpy wrote:It's amazing how some footballers always get injured just before a friendly international.

I hope rugby players don't start doing that!

It's not amazing, it's shorthand.  Everyone from top coaches to the media to the supporters know what's being said and everyone plays along because everyone wants to make themselves believe the myths of football.  
The myths are that every player would die to play for his country.  Well, the truth (that everyone knows) is that professional players are pragmatic.  They only want the money and the glory.  Glory don't come from friendlies and in actual fact, friendlies are a bit beneath the egos of first teamers.  They like to think of themselves as the Special Forces who come in to do the big jobs - no marching to order, no silly shouting sergeants - just a mission, some cigarettes and a nightime parachute drop behind enemy lines. Cool.

Sin é wrote:Peter O'Mahony (an international player like AWJ and club captain), played his first game last season at the end of September (4 games into the season).

International players come back later because of their SH tour and AWJ probably has not completed his preseason yet.

Looks to me like some of you have just found another excuse not to support the Regions.

Taulupe Faletau hasn't played any games yet, but should be on the bench in Galway, having recovered (hopefully) from a back injury. They have a big derby the following Friday, so I'd have thought that their captain could've done with some minutes on the paddock before that. I don't see that harm in him leading his region out, then being rested after an hour (or even at halftime).

For you devotees of AWJ, since taking over as Ospreys captain in 2010/11 season he has led us out as captain in 2010/11 versus Munster in the 3rd game of the then Magners League, in 2011/12 it was against Scarlets in our 8th game, in 2012/13 it was the 1st game against Ulster and last season it was the 3rd game against Edinburgh. So therefore is it a big deal that he will be missing on Friday? Obviously NOT. This is yet another WUM topic about the Ospreys and unlike a couple of the other ones where I contributed, this will not be happening after this initial response.

Scrumpy wrote:I have never tried to wind anyone up.

A different viewpoint which doesn't fall into line with others believes doesn't mean it is a wind up!


AWJ (c) sitting out the 1st game of the season due to him needing a rest (due to it being a big rugby year!) is a poor decision.

Everybody rests players, it's just a question of when and good game management.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/29011483