My Wales 23 for AIs (SQUAD ANNOUNCED)

First topic message reminder :

I'm picking my current Wales 23 based on form, though I accept it is maybe too soon because we still have the European rugby cup to be played.

15. Liam Williams
14. Hallam Amos
13. Cory Allen
12. Scott Williams
11. George North
10. Dan Biggar

9. Rhys Webb

8. Dan Baker
7. Sam Warburton
6. Taulupe Faletau
5. AWJ (c)
4. Ball
3. Lee
2. Hibbard
1. Jenkins

Reps: Baldwin, James, A.Jones, Charteris/Davies/Evans, Navidi/Tipuric, G.Davies, Patchell, J.Davies.

Not sure who is injured atm, so have included a few options. The rest of the squad though will be the usual. I also think Cuthbert will be picked on the other wing, but he is in some bad form right now, hence being left out of my squad.

Feel free to add and pick apart. We've a few weeks yet.

______________________________________________________________________________________________

Forwards:
Gethin Jenkins, Paul James, Nicky Smith, Aaron Jarvis, Rhodri Jones, Samson Lee, Scott Baldwin, Richard Hibbard, Emyr Phillips, Jake Ball, AWJ, Luke Charteris, Bradley Davies, James King, Dan Lydiate, Justin Tipuric, Sam Warburton (c), Dan Baker, Taulupe Faletau.

Backs:
Mike Phillips, Rhys Webb, Rhodri Williams, Dan Biggar, Rhys Priestland, Cory Allen, JD2, JAmie Roberts, Scott Williams, Hallam Amos, Alex Cuthbert, George North, Tom Prydie, Leigh Halfpenny, Liam Williams.

No Adam Jones, Rhys Patchell, James Hook. Nicky Thomas is the only new face.

whocares wrote:JD2 out for 2 to 3 weeks. might just be back for some of he AIs?

NZ game by the sounds of it. I wouldn't want him to start against those after 2-3 weeks off.

Especially when he wont be around for the SA game.  Its not beneficial to him or team Wales to risk him for no significant gain

SO which Welsh team is likely to face the Springboks?

Biltong wrote:SO which Welsh team is likely to face the Springboks?

It's dependent on injuries. We will be without P.James, Hibbard, B.Davies, Phillips, Roberts, Halfpenny and probably North (don't know if he's released this year). So a fair few faces to you, mostly like the one I selected in the OP.

The Saint wrote:

Biltong wrote:SO which Welsh team is likely to face the Springboks?

It's dependent on injuries. We will be without P.James, Hibbard, B.Davies, Phillips, Roberts, Halfpenny and probably North (don't know if he's released this year). So a fair few faces to you, mostly like the one I selected in the OP.

I am looking forward to this match as we won't have or overseas players. It will all be local players and something I ben wanting to see for a while

North should be available, Northampton paid that 60k fine which covers his entire contract.

Bok team will likely look something like this.

Mtwarira
Strauss
Redelinghuys
Eben Etzebeth
Lood de Jager/Matfield
Nizaam Carr
Oupa Mohoje
Warren Whiteley
Hougaard
Pollard
De ALlende
Jean de Villiers
Jan Serfontein
Seobelo Senatla
Willie le ROux

IronMike wrote:North should be available, Northampton paid that 60k fine which covers his entire contract.

The entire contract? Pretty good of them.

The Saint wrote:

IronMike wrote:North should be available, Northampton paid that 60k fine which covers his entire contract.

The entire contract? Pretty good of them.

It was, especially considering they could have flat out said "No". But I believe that North is now available for ALL Welsh games, even those outside of the international window for the remainder of his Northampton contract.

Be nice to see the other club owners in England do the same now too. Looks like the new deals are encouraging welsh players to return to the regions.

IronMike wrote:

The Saint wrote:

IronMike wrote:North should be available, Northampton paid that 60k fine which covers his entire contract.

The entire contract? Pretty good of them.

It was, especially considering they could have flat out said "No". But I believe that North is now available for ALL Welsh games, even those outside of the international window for the remainder of his Northampton contract.

They had no choice... It was down to the sharp contract negotiated by North, his Agent, his management team or a combination of them...

Trueth isNorthampton, once agreed the contract can do nothing about it, yet they didnt consider their wider contractual obigation, ie to the PRL and hence got fined. So its not so much "nice" of Northampton as that of "school boy error" on their part.

Dont think other teams have been so silly in their contract negotiations. Wish rhey had been though, we my be able to field a competative side aginst the Boks then

Back to North's position. The contract will mean he is available, Northampton cant do anythng to stop that. Whether they will get further fined is down to the PRL and I'm not aware if that fine was to cover one release or to cover their contratual breach and all subsequent possible breaches due tot he same clause. But that's their problem. But if they are likely to be fined £60k again, they could just give North a £50k purse to pull out of the Boks game and save themselves £10k... Not that they would because we all know that would be unethical...

Well he is proving a valuable investment for Saints. Made all the difference last week.

Injury permiting

Li Williams
North
Allen
Sc Williams
Amos
Biggar
Webb

Jenkins
Baldwin/Phillips
Lee/Rh Jones
Ball
Aw Jones
Warburton/Faletau
Tipuric/Warburton
Faletau/Baker

I'd go for

Williams
Halfpenny
Davies
Roberts
North
Biggar
Webb
Smith
Hibbard
Lee
AWJ
Charteris
Warburton
Tipuric
Faletau

Mass I mean vrs South Africa.

Against SA..

1. Jenkins
2. Baldwin
3. Lee
4. Ball
5. AWJ
6. Warburton
7. Tipuric
8. Faletau
9. Webb
10. Biggar
11. North
12. Williams
13. Allen
14. Cuthbert
15. Williams

How do you think you would compete against the boks. I still think mobility is the key to combating SA. They are big but heavy and if you tire them out, gaps will appear.

The good thing for Wales is that it will be the last game of a long season and some players may already be on vacation time mentally. The boks may draw Wales into a dogfight but I think that would be a mistake.

Run them to the ground, make them chase the game. I certainly think a Tipuric/Warburton 6&7 would be best. A spritely 9 to nip around the rucks and proper attacking from the 3/4s rather than try and play territory and set pieces (the bread and butter of the boks).

Keep the ball out of the setpiece for as long as possible. Its a strategy which some in the SH feel is the best way to counter the boks and I think it would be Wales' best chance of victory.

Last autumn we saw that they couldn't match the boks upfront... they simply got beat up. Evolve.

FA, the Boks are getting lighter mate, they are becoming more mobile.

fa0019 wrote:How do you think you would compete against the boks. I still think mobility is the key to combating SA. They are big but heavy and if you tire them out, gaps will appear.

The good thing for Wales is that it will be the last game of a long season and some players may already be on vacation time mentally. The boks may draw Wales into a dogfight but I think that would be a mistake.

Run them to the ground, make them chase the game. I certainly think a Tipuric/Warburton 6&7 would be best. A spritely 9 to nip around the rucks and proper attacking from the 3/4s rather than try and play territory and set pieces (the bread and butter of the boks).

Keep the ball out of the setpiece for as long as possible. Its a strategy which some in the SH feel is the best way to counter the boks and I think it would be Wales' best chance of victory.

Last autumn we saw that they couldn't match the boks upfront... they simply got beat up. Evolve.

The biggest concern for Wales for this game is the new combinations we'll be forced to try out as our first choice centre pairing wont be available, likewise we'll have to draft in some new forwards. This isn't an excuse however, the Springboks are doing the same. But I can't see this match being a classic, most likely error strewn and in the end come down to penalties.

Biltong wrote:FA, the Boks are getting lighter mate, they are becoming more mobile.

Their pack has still be weighing in around 915kg and bar Coetzee it ain't the most mobile. Once the first teamers come back and it will be back to 920-930kg.

Jannie, Bissie, Vermeulen, Mahoje, Eben, Beast are all tight players. Victor is old... the only mobile forward is Coetzee.

Then look at the backs. De Villiers, De Allende (probable starter for me), Pietersen. Big guys.... and if you run at them but not necessarily through them I think you can do a lot of damage come the 60 min mark.

All I'm saying that for me... this is the best way for a team with a lesser pack to counter the boks. You don't get into a dogfight if you can't win.

Last game in a season for the boks will be a struggle... they're professional but you run out of steam. It happens to everyone and the boks are no different.

See NZ in 2012, ENG in 2014, teams tend to have 1 eye on the plane home. The last thing they want is a manic open game. They want a tight, mauling slow, territorial match... don't give it to them.

fa0019 wrote:

Biltong wrote:FA, the Boks are getting lighter mate, they are becoming more mobile.

Their pack has still be weighing in around 915kg and bar Coetzee it ain't the most mobile. Once the first teamers come back and it will be back to 920-930kg.

Jannie, Bissie, Vermeulen, Mahoje, Eben, Beast are all tight players. Victor is old... the only mobile forward is Coetzee.

Then look at the backs. De Villiers, De Allende (probable starter for me), Pietersen. Big guys.... and if you run at them but not necessarily through them I think you can do a lot of damage come the 60 min mark.

All I'm saying that for me... this is the best way for a team with a lesser pack to counter the boks. You don't get into a dogfight if you can't win.

More than likely you will see Rdelinghuys in stead of Jannie, more mobile, Eben is mobile, Strauss is mobile, Mohoje is mobile, Schalk BUrger will most likely sub and he is mobile, more so than before his long break, Hougaard is very fast, Pollard has pace, Willie has pace, Senatla has pace, de Allende is not slow, Jan Serfontein is not slow, remember overseas players aren't available.

Look at the new selections, Warren Whitely is mobile, Jaco Kriel is mobile and actually quite pacey.

Forget the oldies,

Biltong wrote:

fa0019 wrote:

Biltong wrote:FA, the Boks are getting lighter mate, they are becoming more mobile.

Their pack has still be weighing in around 915kg and bar Coetzee it ain't the most mobile. Once the first teamers come back and it will be back to 920-930kg.

Jannie, Bissie, Vermeulen, Mahoje, Eben, Beast are all tight players. Victor is old... the only mobile forward is Coetzee.

Then look at the backs. De Villiers, De Allende (probable starter for me), Pietersen. Big guys.... and if you run at them but not necessarily through them I think you can do a lot of damage come the 60 min mark.

All I'm saying that for me... this is the best way for a team with a lesser pack to counter the boks. You don't get into a dogfight if you can't win.

More than likely you will see Rdelinghuys in stead of Jannie, more mobile, Eben is mobile, Strauss is mobile, Mohoje is mobile, Schalk BUrger will most likely sub and he is mobile, more so than before his long break, Hougaard is very fast, Pollard has pace, Willie has pace, Senatla has pace, de Allende is not slow, Jan Serfontein is not slow, remember overseas players aren't available.

Look at the new selections, Warren Whitely is mobile, Jaco Kriel is mobile and actually quite pacey.

Forget the oldies,

I wouldn't call Strauss or Mohoje mobile.

Eben is athletic yes... but it takes a lot of energy to lug 120kg around the park.

I like Whitely, very good utitlity player in mould of Smith for me. I reckon he could force his way onto the flanks as 6 is open for the RWC.

Serfontein... fast. Well I guess so.. in a foot race with Kobus Weise!!!

Anyhow, dude how would you combat this bok side.... surely trying to front them up is the wrong idea... you don't out muscle the boks. I've only ever seen it happen once or twice (England 04 at Twickenham was the last time I really saw it, Schalk said that was the toughest game he ever played during the last world cup[)

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Mass I mean vrs South Africa.

I see.

I haven't heard that our French players are un-available so I guess Hibbard would be the only issue. Gatland should tell him to tell the PRL to get stuffed...!

It's about time some one did...

fa0019 wrote:

Biltong wrote:

fa0019 wrote:

Biltong wrote:FA, the Boks are getting lighter mate, they are becoming more mobile.

Their pack has still be weighing in around 915kg and bar Coetzee it ain't the most mobile. Once the first teamers come back and it will be back to 920-930kg.

Jannie, Bissie, Vermeulen, Mahoje, Eben, Beast are all tight players. Victor is old... the only mobile forward is Coetzee.

Then look at the backs. De Villiers, De Allende (probable starter for me), Pietersen. Big guys.... and if you run at them but not necessarily through them I think you can do a lot of damage come the 60 min mark.

All I'm saying that for me... this is the best way for a team with a lesser pack to counter the boks. You don't get into a dogfight if you can't win.

More than likely you will see Rdelinghuys in stead of Jannie, more mobile, Eben is mobile, Strauss is mobile, Mohoje is mobile, Schalk BUrger will most likely sub and he is mobile, more so than before his long break, Hougaard is very fast, Pollard has pace, Willie has pace, Senatla has pace, de Allende is not slow, Jan Serfontein is not slow, remember overseas players aren't available.

Look at the new selections, Warren Whitely is mobile, Jaco Kriel is mobile and actually quite pacey.

Forget the oldies,

I wouldn't call Strauss or Mohoje mobile.

Eben is athletic yes... but it takes a lot of energy to lug 120kg around the park.

I like Whitely, very good utitlity player in mould of Smith for me. I reckon he could force his way onto the flanks as 6 is open for the RWC.

Serfontein... fast. Well I guess so.. in a foot race with Kobus Weise!!!

Anyhow, dude how would you combat this bok side.... surely trying to front them up is the wrong idea... you don't out muscle the boks. I've only ever seen it happen once or twice (England 04 at Twickenham was the last time I really saw it, Schalk said that was the toughest game he ever played during the last world cup[)

You beat them by avoiding the contact area, by offloading into space, this myth of running them off their feet is just tat, a myth.

Biltong wrote:

fa0019 wrote:

Biltong wrote:

fa0019 wrote:

Biltong wrote:FA, the Boks are getting lighter mate, they are becoming more mobile.

Their pack has still be weighing in around 915kg and bar Coetzee it ain't the most mobile. Once the first teamers come back and it will be back to 920-930kg.

Jannie, Bissie, Vermeulen, Mahoje, Eben, Beast are all tight players. Victor is old... the only mobile forward is Coetzee.

Then look at the backs. De Villiers, De Allende (probable starter for me), Pietersen. Big guys.... and if you run at them but not necessarily through them I think you can do a lot of damage come the 60 min mark.

All I'm saying that for me... this is the best way for a team with a lesser pack to counter the boks. You don't get into a dogfight if you can't win.

More than likely you will see Rdelinghuys in stead of Jannie, more mobile, Eben is mobile, Strauss is mobile, Mohoje is mobile, Schalk BUrger will most likely sub and he is mobile, more so than before his long break, Hougaard is very fast, Pollard has pace, Willie has pace, Senatla has pace, de Allende is not slow, Jan Serfontein is not slow, remember overseas players aren't available.

Look at the new selections, Warren Whitely is mobile, Jaco Kriel is mobile and actually quite pacey.

Forget the oldies,

I wouldn't call Strauss or Mohoje mobile.

Eben is athletic yes... but it takes a lot of energy to lug 120kg around the park.

I like Whitely, very good utitlity player in mould of Smith for me. I reckon he could force his way onto the flanks as 6 is open for the RWC.

Serfontein... fast. Well I guess so.. in a foot race with Kobus Weise!!!

Anyhow, dude how would you combat this bok side.... surely trying to front them up is the wrong idea... you don't out muscle the boks. I've only ever seen it happen once or twice (England 04 at Twickenham was the last time I really saw it, Schalk said that was the toughest game he ever played during the last world cup[)

You beat them by avoiding the contact area, by offloading into space, this myth of running them off their feet is just tat, a myth.

Well avoiding the set piece, avoiding contact, offloading into space.... sounds like playing an open game to me.

Don't get me wrong I don't advocate running from their own 22 every time. But I've read many in NZ & AUS who see it as the way to play the boks... you don't play to their strengths.

fa0019 wrote:

Biltong wrote:

fa0019 wrote:

Biltong wrote:

fa0019 wrote:

Biltong wrote:FA, the Boks are getting lighter mate, they are becoming more mobile.

Their pack has still be weighing in around 915kg and bar Coetzee it ain't the most mobile. Once the first teamers come back and it will be back to 920-930kg.

Jannie, Bissie, Vermeulen, Mahoje, Eben, Beast are all tight players. Victor is old... the only mobile forward is Coetzee.

Then look at the backs. De Villiers, De Allende (probable starter for me), Pietersen. Big guys.... and if you run at them but not necessarily through them I think you can do a lot of damage come the 60 min mark.

All I'm saying that for me... this is the best way for a team with a lesser pack to counter the boks. You don't get into a dogfight if you can't win.

More than likely you will see Rdelinghuys in stead of Jannie, more mobile, Eben is mobile, Strauss is mobile, Mohoje is mobile, Schalk BUrger will most likely sub and he is mobile, more so than before his long break, Hougaard is very fast, Pollard has pace, Willie has pace, Senatla has pace, de Allende is not slow, Jan Serfontein is not slow, remember overseas players aren't available.

Look at the new selections, Warren Whitely is mobile, Jaco Kriel is mobile and actually quite pacey.

Forget the oldies,

I wouldn't call Strauss or Mohoje mobile.

Eben is athletic yes... but it takes a lot of energy to lug 120kg around the park.

I like Whitely, very good utitlity player in mould of Smith for me. I reckon he could force his way onto the flanks as 6 is open for the RWC.

Serfontein... fast. Well I guess so.. in a foot race with Kobus Weise!!!

Anyhow, dude how would you combat this bok side.... surely trying to front them up is the wrong idea... you don't out muscle the boks. I've only ever seen it happen once or twice (England 04 at Twickenham was the last time I really saw it, Schalk said that was the toughest game he ever played during the last world cup[)

You beat them by avoiding the contact area, by offloading into space, this myth of running them off their feet is just tat, a myth.

Well avoiding the set piece, avoiding contact, offloading into space.... sounds like playing an open game to me.

Don't get me wrong I don't advocate running from their own 22 every time. But I've read many in NZ & AUS who see it as the way to play the boks... you don't play to their strengths.

Well, it isn't necessarily an open game, but a fluid game. You can't avoid the set piece, line outs will occur, the scrum will occur. BUt that is not where Wales' problem or challenge lies against the Boks, New Zealand is the only team that can "run the boks off their feet" other teams have to outsmart them, Like AUstralia who negates scrums by collapsing them, The All Blacks avoid line outs by quick throw ins, each team must decide how they will negate any opponent.

The biggest challenge for teams these days s the breakdown, you have between 150-200 defensive and attacking rucks per match, on attack if you have 50% possession you will hit 75 attacking rucks, but you can avoid a number of them with offloading in the tackle, not being isolated, etc.

Get enough numbers to the ball, Wales showed in the second test they know what to do, both teams will have different personnel in the final game, so the question is not what must they do, but can the new guys do it, the same question applies to SA

Bill

It would be great to see Wales play as well as they did vs the boks in that second test from the start this autumn. Despite injuries there is a good squad there and we should be competitive.

JD2 will certainly miss the Wallabies game, but probably be back for the Fiji game, so we can rest others like Williams for that one. Cuthbert will probably play in that one as well.

Who do you lot reckon we'll see in the team for Fiji?

IF JD isn't available until the ABs game then I see no point in playing him in that game as he won't be available for the Boks.

Were possible the side that is likely to play against the Boks then they have to be given game time against the ABs as well rather than just changing 6-8 players.

I agree, we should be building some continuity, its not great to drop players in for random games based on reputation. Given some time The Williams/Allen combination could work, both have varied skillsets and can play either direct (Roberts) or more skilful (Davies).

Considering the others are carrying niggles you'd expect to see them rested/rotated at some point, but let's assume they do make it and play against Australia. Most of the ones in the team for Fiji won't be involved there-after, so it makes sense to have the French boys play in that game, then have others return for the All Blacks. Least that's the way I'm seeing it.

Biltong wrote:

fa0019 wrote:

Biltong wrote:

fa0019 wrote:

Biltong wrote:

fa0019 wrote:

Biltong wrote:FA, the Boks are getting lighter mate, they are becoming more mobile.

Their pack has still be weighing in around 915kg and bar Coetzee it ain't the most mobile. Once the first teamers come back and it will be back to 920-930kg.

Jannie, Bissie, Vermeulen, Mahoje, Eben, Beast are all tight players. Victor is old... the only mobile forward is Coetzee.

Then look at the backs. De Villiers, De Allende (probable starter for me), Pietersen. Big guys.... and if you run at them but not necessarily through them I think you can do a lot of damage come the 60 min mark.

All I'm saying that for me... this is the best way for a team with a lesser pack to counter the boks. You don't get into a dogfight if you can't win.

More than likely you will see Rdelinghuys in stead of Jannie, more mobile, Eben is mobile, Strauss is mobile, Mohoje is mobile, Schalk BUrger will most likely sub and he is mobile, more so than before his long break, Hougaard is very fast, Pollard has pace, Willie has pace, Senatla has pace, de Allende is not slow, Jan Serfontein is not slow, remember overseas players aren't available.

Look at the new selections, Warren Whitely is mobile, Jaco Kriel is mobile and actually quite pacey.

Forget the oldies,

I wouldn't call Strauss or Mohoje mobile.

Eben is athletic yes... but it takes a lot of energy to lug 120kg around the park.

I like Whitely, very good utitlity player in mould of Smith for me. I reckon he could force his way onto the flanks as 6 is open for the RWC.

Serfontein... fast. Well I guess so.. in a foot race with Kobus Weise!!!

Anyhow, dude how would you combat this bok side.... surely trying to front them up is the wrong idea... you don't out muscle the boks. I've only ever seen it happen once or twice (England 04 at Twickenham was the last time I really saw it, Schalk said that was the toughest game he ever played during the last world cup[)

You beat them by avoiding the contact area, by offloading into space, this myth of running them off their feet is just tat, a myth.

Well avoiding the set piece, avoiding contact, offloading into space.... sounds like playing an open game to me.

Don't get me wrong I don't advocate running from their own 22 every time. But I've read many in NZ & AUS who see it as the way to play the boks... you don't play to their strengths.

Well, it isn't necessarily an open game, but a fluid game. You can't avoid the set piece, line outs will occur, the scrum will occur. BUt that is not where Wales' problem or challenge lies against the Boks, New Zealand is the only team that can "run the boks off their feet" other teams have to outsmart them, Like AUstralia who negates scrums by collapsing them, The All Blacks avoid line outs by quick throw ins, each team must decide how they will negate any opponent.

The biggest challenge for teams these days s the breakdown, you have between 150-200 defensive and attacking rucks per match, on attack if you have 50% possession you will hit 75 attacking rucks, but you can avoid a number of them with offloading in the tackle, not being isolated, etc.

Get enough numbers to the ball, Wales showed in the second test they know what to do, both teams will have different personnel in the final game, so the question is not what must they do, but can the new guys do it, the same question applies to SA

Bottom line is Wales need to be at absolute 100% to be in the game at all, then if we are in the lead in the final 5-10 minutes I bloody well hope we learn the lessons of the last test and keep playing, because the minute you start trying to go defensive against the Boks (or any SH team for that matter) they will score

IronMike wrote:Against SA..

1. Jenkins
2. Baldwin
3. Lee
4. Ball
5. AWJ
6. Warburton
7. Tipuric
8. Faletau
9. Webb
10. Biggar
11. North
12. Williams
13. Allen
14. Cuthbert
15. Williams

That would be mine to and I would play them against the ABs as weel.

Why would you pick Baldwin over Hibbard...? Ball over Charteris or not pick Davies and Roberts I the centre????

maestegmafia wrote:Why would you pick Baldwin over Hibbard...? Ball over Charteris or not pick Davies and Roberts I the centre????

Because against SA Hibbard, Charteris, Davies or Roberts are available. Yes I know we have a godd rapport with the French clubs but nothing has been said yet about them being released and with the fuss kicked up by Toulon who knows what will happen.

maestegmafia wrote:Why would you pick Baldwin over Hibbard...? Ball over Charteris or not pick Davies and Roberts I the centre????

Because they were clearly discussing the game being played outside the IRB window (SA). It makes sense to field an identical team against NZ the week before, which is what BF was getting at.

Yeah it's something I have said for a while now otherwise we could end up going into the Boks game with possibly 8 changes. When Gatland has made that many changes in the past for the 'smaller' game he has been slated.

The performance hasn't been great either. If he selects the players I'm expecting, the team for SA won't be so vastly different. The bench will be though.

The Saint wrote:The performance hasn't been great either. If he selects the players I'm expecting, the team for SA won't be so vastly different. The bench will be though.

Who you expecting to see Saint?

BF something like this:
15. Liam Williams
14. Hallam Amos/Tom Prydie
13. Cory Allen/George North
12. Scott Williams
11. George North/Alex Cuthbert
10. Dan Biggar

9. Rhys Webb

8. Dan Baker/Taulupe Faletau
7. Sam Warburton/Justin Tipruic
6. Taulupe Faletau/Sam Warburton
5. AWJ (c)
4. Ball
3. Lee/Rhodri Jones
2. Baldwin/Phillips
1. Jenkins/Nicky Thomas

That's kind of the starting team with replacements, except the back-row which just represents different combo. The other replacements are obvious (Priest...., Rhodri Williams). Also, I myself am still uncertain over North's availability.

you see that it is similar to my team in OP.

Well North has full release but I am wondering whether the WRU may not request it this AI series and sort of keep it as a trump card in the run up to the WC.

Thats pretty much what I would go for but I would play Toby at 8 or off the bench I don't think he's a 6 but I guess if you don't try these things you don't know.

bedfordwelsh wrote:Well North has full release but I am wondering whether the WRU may not request it this AI series and sort of keep it as a trump card in the run up to the WC.

Thats pretty much what I would go for but I would play Toby at 8 or off the bench I don't think he's a 6 but I guess if you don't try these things you don't know.

I need more proof that taking your word for it, I'd feel a lot better.

IMO Toby would be good 6 considering he's good at tackling and good at the breakdown. May give us extra carrying options in the back-row too (assuming Baker is at 8).

The Saint wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:Well North has full release but I am wondering whether the WRU may not request it this AI series and sort of keep it as a trump card in the run up to the WC.

Thats pretty much what I would go for but I would play Toby at 8 or off the bench I don't think he's a 6 but I guess if you don't try these things you don't know.

I need more proof that taking your word for it, I'd feel a lot better.

IMO Toby would be good 6 considering he's good at tackling and good at the breakdown. May give us extra carrying options in the back-row too (assuming Baker is at 8).

It was produced last year both North and Saints announced that he has full release for all Wales training and matches, whether they will get fined everytime they release him I am not sure but he can then sue for breach of contract if he wanted to.

If Lydiate isn't at 6 for whatever reason then for me I think we would be better suited playin Warburton there with Tipuric at 7 then just pick the form 8 out Baker or Faletau but like said wouldn't hurt to try Faletau at 6 sometime.

Tipuric had a very good game yesterday but I didn't think he was at his best.

I wouldn't be surprised to see him on the bench.

[quote="maestegmafia"]Tipuric had a very good game yesterday but I didn't think he was at his best.

Whens that ever stopped Gatland picking players

bedfordwelsh wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Tipuric had a very good game yesterday but I didn't think he was at his best.

Whens that ever stopped Gatland picking players

Rather a catty comment their mate...???

Again and again supporters deride his decisions and inevitably he proves you wrong.

Yeah, he was clearly correct picking an unfit back-row against SA in last years opening Autumn game. Totally blown off the park. Well done Gats.

The Saint wrote:Yeah, he was clearly correct picking an unfit back-row against SA in last years opening Autumn game. Totally blown off the park. Well done Gats.

VS three grand slams and a lions tour under his belt, as well as his European rugby successes with wasps...!

I think the series of injuries cost us more against SA last year.

I would concur that his lack of winning over the Southern Hemisphere big three is a stick you can beat him with but would anyone else have done better?

maestegmafia wrote:

The Saint wrote:Yeah, he was clearly correct picking an unfit back-row against SA in last years opening Autumn game. Totally blown off the park. Well done Gats.

VS three grand slams and a lions tour under his belt, as well as his European rugby successes with wasps...!

I think the series of injuries cost us more against SA last year.

I would concur that his lack of winning over the Southern Hemisphere big three is a stick you can beat him with but would anyone else have done better?

I don't think anyone questioned him during his 'two grand slams', and if you're going to be that petty about it, remind us how many games an unfit Lydiate was involved in during those two campaigns? Not many, because he was either injured or unfit. Don't see what Wasps has got to do with this.

An unfit Lydiate versus SA last season was a big factor in us getting completely blown away by a straight-forward Bokke game plan.

I'm not beating anyone with a stick so stop talking rubbish. We know you rate every single welsh player and coach highly maes, so I don't think anyone would rely on you for getting an unbiased opinion.