Wales vs NZ

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Team announced
15. Leigh Halfpenny (Toulon)
14. Alex Cuthbert (Cardiff Blues)
13. Jonathan Davies (Clermont Auvergne)
12. Jamie Roberts (Racing Metro)
11. George North (Northampton Saints)
10. Dan Biggar (Ospreys)
9. Rhys Webb (Ospreys)

1. Paul James (Bath)
2. Richard Hibbard (Gloucester)
3. Samson Lee (Scarlets)
4. Jake Ball (Scarlets)
5. Alun Wyn Jones (Ospreys)
6. Dan Lydiate (Unattached)
7. Sam Warburton (Cardiff Blues, CAPT)
8. Taulupe Faletau (Newport Gwent Dragons)

Replacements:
16. Scott Baldwin (Ospreys)
17. Nicky Smith (Ospreys)
18. Rhodri Jones (Scarlets)
19. Luke Charteris (Racing Metro)
20. Justin Tipuric (Ospreys)
21. Mike Phillips (Racing Metro)
22. James Hook (Gloucester)
23. Liam Williams (Scarlets)

Taylorman wrote:Wales ability to close out matches vs the SH3 has let them down terribly last few years, particularly when theyve been able to match all 3 until 60 minutes, and thats gotta go back to those game finishing issues- fitness- mentally and physically through to 80 and the quality and continuity of the bench.

Undoubtedly true, but another way of looking at it is that we just don't do enough in that first hour / 70 minutes when we are matching sides physically. Our lack of penetration has been an issue for years and the question still remains what exactly Rob Howley is getting paid for. Running hard and straight won't cut it against any side that simply makes its tackles.

The turning point for me was right after Barretts try, I still thought we had a chance if we can get down their end of the field, but what does James Hook do? He kicks it out on the full. It was then I KNEW we were going to lose, we handed possession straight to them and they just kept us in our 22 for the rest of the game.

It's all about being clinical when you need to be and we bottled it, Read's try was an absolute gift as well.

We have gym monkeys who need rugby brains.

A coaching system that is stale.

Only 19/20 players of international level and no back up.

Wales seemed to run out of steam IMO. The ABs made Wales work so hard that by the 60 minute mark you could see the fatigue in the Welsh players plus the physicality took its toll. With Wales fading, NZ cranked it up a notch in intensity. Matching NZ simply isn't good enough as they generally finish strong. Need to hit NZ early and hard to stand a chance.

As for Barnes - he penalised Mccaw a few times - surely that should please Welsh fans, also he didn't YC a welsh player for a deliberate knock on.

First off before the game I never thought we would win and said even if we played well there would still be 15-20 points in it at the end so that bit I got right.

However as the game dragged on I did stupidly allow myself the belief that hang on we might sneak this, even when they went ahead we sneaked back in to lead at 16-15.

Then 3 basic stupid errors and bang 18 points adrift which is why they are the best in the World.

1, Both wings (yes even St George the un-droppable) proved their defence is as bad as each others by rushing in which eventually lead to Kainos try.

2, Halfpenny letting the ball bounce is basic schoolboy stuff why didn't he just hack the thing into touch or take it over line with him, I think Williams wouldn't have let it happen and that's why he should be at XV.

3, Phillips and his oh so slow box kick, surely that now has to be the death nail in his carear.

Also with relation to the original now locked post about players ratings from Andy Bowell I said the only one he had close was the Roberts v SBW match up.

For me Roberts outshone him all day today with a top notch performance, thought Warburton has also proved a lot of critics wrong with another strong performance against the best in the World.

Paul James seemed to get on the wrong side of Barnes from the off and with Smith going off injured virtually as soon as he came on it will be interesting to see who starts next week if Jenkins is still injured.

Pretty gutted, we were really pressurising NZ until 70 minutes when we fell apart.

Phillips needs to be dropped entirely, with Webb injured i'm worried he will start against SA which will be a disaster. Webb, Rhodri and G.Davies should be our 3 SHs

Lineout has been a problem with Baldwin (who will play next week) but I wasn't expecting such a bad day from Hibbard. We need Ken Owens back to put some pressure on the shirt.

Webb and Biggar were fantastic, the best game from a pair of welsh halfbacks since Stephen Jones and Phillips during the Lions games.

Roberts has really improved for Wales over the last 12 months following people calling for him to be replaced by Williams

North's worst game in a Welsh shirt,

Paul James was very poor, the scrum improved both times he was replaced this autumn. I think Gethin will have the starting shirt come the 6Ns, and Nicky Smith is already pushing him - pity he got injured.

Lydiate and Warburton both played well, but Faletau hasn't had a good game for Wales for ages, his work for the try excluded, he was very poor. Would like to see Baker given a chance before the WC.


Still, a lot of positives from the losses against Aus and NZ, mainly around the defence and kicking game and structure of the halfbacks - I had almost forgotten what a good box kick looked like after watching Phillips in the 9 shirt for so long.

Riskysports wrote:

Otagolad wrote:

RDSguru wrote:

Otagolad wrote:Very well played Wales, however the Refs have had a shocker on this Northern tour - if Barnes isn't relegated to club rugby after that I don't know how bad he has to get. The refs have gone out looking to get opposition teams a win and it's just been the AB's ability that has nullified the refs influence on this tour.

I'm not sure that one "in front of the kicker" call has been made all tour and today Barnes tried his best to favour Wales - he was looking right at the tackled in the air incident and it took Joubert making a call from the sideline to get it right, Warburton's big break came from a Welh knock-onand penalising the AB's scrum when they had caused the Welsh front row to pop up just showed how much Barnes was looking to help Wales.

I could go on, however the post would be the length of a novel - I just hope that the IRB get the reffing right in time for the World Cup.

Jeepers.. I think you need to see that this is a thread about the game, not this is a paranoid AB supporter thread!

Not paranoid - just calling it as it is and I have commented on the match, just on a specific aspect of it i.e. the poor reffing - this game shouldn't have been anywhere near as close as it was and that is due to some pretty poor officiating. Fair play to Wales for playing to the ref, however a lot of huff and puff for 65 mins and the advantage of the ref will only get you so far.

Maybe you did not see the Scotland Vs NZ match then - Scotland - the only team to get called for a squint feed into the scrum all AI

It goes both ways - and in fact often the better team gets the rub of the ref - and fans tend to only see / remember the ones that go against their team

Or Owens saying McCaw was 'on his feet' when he was horizontal as he scooped a ball out of a ruck when England were attacking in the NZ 22 which ultimately lead to a NZ try ... was funny to see his disbelief yesterday when Barnes pinged him for one of the most blatant 'in at the sides' - maybe the batteries failed on his invisibly cloak.  

Having said that I do agree some refereeing has been generally poor in all matches, but I don't think the ABs have any more to complain about than anyone else in particular.

Heaf wrote:

Riskysports wrote:

Otagolad wrote:

RDSguru wrote:

Otagolad wrote:Very well played Wales, however the Refs have had a shocker on this Northern tour - if Barnes isn't relegated to club rugby after that I don't know how bad he has to get. The refs have gone out looking to get opposition teams a win and it's just been the AB's ability that has nullified the refs influence on this tour.

I'm not sure that one "in front of the kicker" call has been made all tour and today Barnes tried his best to favour Wales - he was looking right at the tackled in the air incident and it took Joubert making a call from the sideline to get it right, Warburton's big break came from a Welh knock-onand penalising the AB's scrum when they had caused the Welsh front row to pop up just showed how much Barnes was looking to help Wales.

I could go on, however the post would be the length of a novel - I just hope that the IRB get the reffing right in time for the World Cup.

Jeepers.. I think you need to see that this is a thread about the game, not this is a paranoid AB supporter thread!

Not paranoid - just calling it as it is and I have commented on the match, just on a specific aspect of it i.e. the poor reffing - this game shouldn't have been anywhere near as close as it was and that is due to some pretty poor officiating. Fair play to Wales for playing to the ref, however a lot of huff and puff for 65 mins and the advantage of the ref will only get you so far.

Maybe you did not see the Scotland Vs NZ match then - Scotland - the only team to get called for a squint feed into the scrum all AI

It goes both ways - and in fact often the better team gets the rub of the ref - and fans tend to only see / remember the ones that go against their team

Or Owens saying McCaw was 'on his feet' when he was horizontal as he scooped a ball out of a ruck when England were attacking in the NZ 22 which ultimately lead to a NZ try ... was funny to see his disbelief yesterday when Barnes pinged him for one of the most blatant 'in at the sides' - maybe the batteries failed on his invisibly cloak.  

Having said that I do agree some refereeing has been generally poor in all matches, but I don't think the ABs have any more to complain about than anyone else in particular.

I actually shouted at the TV that McCaw was coming in at the side, at the time Barnes did nothing and I thought theyd gotten away with it.

Wales attack lacks patience. When we played in the RWC the players seemed so much more confident in possession during phase play. Yesterday after five or six phases in attack Wales changed style and tried a kick, rather than patiently continuing the attacking phase ruck play and consuming the defence until the gaps open up.

The kiwis were the opposite and a great example of that was the try that I think Kaino scored where after a relentless series of phases eventually Barrett kicked cross field where Alex Cuthbert had been left to mark four players.

Wales appeared to run out of steam because they were too willing to concede possession. The All Blacks style has always been about maintaining the ball causing the defending side to tire as they defend for ten or more phases. The all blacks also don't give possession away with kicks from turnover ball.

Although Biggar and Webb played well, they both lacked patience, confidence and gave away possession from halfback too much.

Even more unfortunately for Wales, Mike Phillips appeared to be playing, more for the kiwis than for Wales.

The sooner Gareth Davies is fit, the better Wales options at nine will be.

I am proud of Wales performance. I am annoyed at their mistakes. I did think that the kiwis looked tired and we missed a good opportunity to break our bad run against them.

I thought the lack of ability coming off our bench made a difference. Hook and Phillips looked out of place, they didn't look good enough.

We have lads like Rhys Patchell and Gareth Davies to recover from injury to replace them on the bench.
There is also Ken Owens, Adam Jones and Gethin Jenkins to bolster our bench when they either recover from injury or find their best form.

wales606 wrote:Pretty gutted, we were really pressurising NZ until 70 minutes when we fell apart.

Phillips needs to be dropped entirely, with Webb injured i'm worried he will start against SA which will be a disaster. Webb, Rhodri and G.Davies should be our 3 SHs

Lineout has been a problem with Baldwin (who will play next week) but I wasn't expecting such a bad day from Hibbard. We need Ken Owens back to put some pressure on the shirt.

Webb and Biggar were fantastic, the best game from a pair of welsh halfbacks since Stephen Jones and Phillips during the Lions games.

Roberts has really improved for Wales over the last 12 months following people calling for him to be replaced by Williams

North's worst game in a Welsh shirt,

Paul James was very poor, the scrum improved both times he was replaced this autumn. I think Gethin will have the starting shirt come the 6Ns, and Nicky Smith is already pushing him - pity he got injured.

Lydiate and Warburton both played well, but Faletau hasn't had a good game for Wales for ages, his work for the try excluded, he was very poor. Would like to see Baker given a chance before the WC.


Still, a lot of positives from the losses against Aus and NZ, mainly around the defence and kicking game and structure of the halfbacks - I had almost forgotten what a good box kick looked like after watching Phillips in the 9 shirt for so long.

606,

I thought Faletau had a decent game though uncharacteristically for him his hands have let him down a few times, that said it would have been good to see Baker have a run this series just to put pressure on him.

I still think James should be ahead of Jenkins but agree he had poor start yesterday.

Roberts, Lydiate and Warburton have proved their critics wrong and whilst I questioned the decision to start JD after his injury he had a solid enough game given his lay off and not much game time for Clermont.

Li Williams has to start at XV for me which then leaves Halfpenny to fight for a wing spot with North and Cuthbert.

bedfordwelsh wrote:

I still think James should be ahead of Jenkins but agree he had poor start yesterday.

I don't think James is half the player Gethin Jenkins is. What makes you think so differently...?

Who do we go for next week, thinking most will be same but front row will be interesting given James and Hibbard not available and Jenkins and Smith injured.

maestegmafia wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:

I still think James should be ahead of Jenkins but agree he had poor start yesterday.

I don't think James is half the player Gethin Jenkins is. What makes you think so differently...?

Because Jenkins isn't half the players he was anymore, that's why. Jenkins of years gone by then not many could touch him but his wrokrate isn't anywhere near the level it was and he has struggled over the last few years with injuries and nagging calf problems.

bedfordwelsh wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:

I still think James should be ahead of Jenkins but agree he had poor start yesterday.

I don't think James is half the player Gethin Jenkins is. What makes you think so differently...?

Because Jenkins isn't half the players he was anymore, that's why.  Jenkins of years gone by then not many could touch him but his wrokrate isn't anywhere near the level it was and he has struggled over the last few years with injuries and nagging calf problems.

But he still a better player the James who scrummages and little else. Wales desperately need more players with rugby intelligence, game readers. Jenkins is that James is not.

What worries me is that neither is Samson Lee. Nicky Smith looks good, but Lee is never going to be a smart player. A scrummaging workhorse for sure but little more.

Props are there to do the main job first and foremost anything else is an advantage. Jenkins proved against Fiji he brings very little to the leadership table, it was always is extra workrate that made him stand out from the rest but that isn't there anymore.

It seems Smiths injury is likely to rule him out next week so Jenkins will get another chance if his own injury clears up, if not then who is there. Gatland has said he's likely to call up cover and my other fear is if Webb is injured then Phillips will start next week.

.

With regards to props for Wales as Adam Jones retired from international rugby?

Is he injured?

Or as simply been dropped from the Welsh team?

majesticimperialman wrote:With regards to props for Wales as Adam Jones retired from international rugby?

Is he injured?

Or as simply been dropped from the Welsh team?

He's been dropped

Looks like he has dropped a bit of weight, looking very good for the Blues vs Edinburgh

Adam Jones would be my No.2 choice at TH. Rhodri Jones the LH/TH, like Paul James, have never flattered in my view.

bedfordwelsh wrote:Props are there to do the main job first and foremost anything else is an advantage.  Jenkins proved against Fiji he brings very little to the leadership table, it was always is extra workrate that made him stand out from the rest but that isn't there anymore.

It seems Smiths injury is likely to rule him out next week so Jenkins will get another chance if his own injury clears up, if not then who is there.  Gatland has said he's likely to call up cover and my other fear is if Webb is injured then Phillips will start next week.

Leadership was not really relevant to the Fiji match. The ref lead that game and the rest were merely players...!

But Jenkins has lead Wales and the blues to victory many times before. You can't write off a player because of one awful game vs Fiji. Particularly when Jenkins was one of our best players until injury struck.

Leadership is not what I value of his attributes. It is his skill in seeing advantages. The amount of times Jenkins has turned over ball, passed a quick ball, he makes great decisions. So does Nicky Smith, looking forward to seeing him in the future.

Paul james is a very basic player

maestegmafia wrote:Looks like he has dropped a bit of weight, looking very good for the Blues vs Edinburgh

Yeah, he has been better over the last month or so

wales606 wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:Looks like he has dropped a bit of weight, looking very good for the Blues vs Edinburgh

Yeah, he has been better over the last month or so

I think Gatland omitting him from the squad will have given him the much needed reminder of what is expected of Jones

bedfordwelsh wrote:Props are there to do the main job first and foremost anything else is an advantage.  Jenkins proved against Fiji he brings very little to the leadership table, it was always is extra workrate that made him stand out from the rest but that isn't there anymore.

It seems Smiths injury is likely to rule him out next week so Jenkins will get another chance if his own injury clears up, if not then who is there.  Gatland has said he's likely to call up cover and my other fear is if Webb is injured then Phillips will start next week.

As I see it: Halfpenny, JD2, Roberts, Hook, Phillips, James, & Hibbard are unavailable. Jenkins, Smith, North, Webb injured.

So it seems likely that at loose head, Rob Evans of the Scarlets will be called up, he is a very promising prospect and has displaced Phil John as first choice this season. If Jenkins is not fit then Rhodri Jones may be asked to cover the loose head (IMO he is a much better loose head than tight head) with Jarvis covering Lee on the other side. Its likely that Emyr Phillips will be on the bench covering Baldwin.

Scrum half and centre are an issue. With Webb injured and Phillips unavailable, young Rhodri Williams is likely to start with possibly Lloyd Williams or Aled Davies called up as bench cover. Scott and Cory will start at centre but there is no further cover in the squad. Amos will probably replace North (injured?), Liam Williams at full back and Priestand and Prydie as the outfied back cover on the bench?

Not sure about the Springboks, are their European based players available?

Seagultaf wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:Props are there to do the main job first and foremost anything else is an advantage.  Jenkins proved against Fiji he brings very little to the leadership table, it was always is extra workrate that made him stand out from the rest but that isn't there anymore.

It seems Smiths injury is likely to rule him out next week so Jenkins will get another chance if his own injury clears up, if not then who is there.  Gatland has said he's likely to call up cover and my other fear is if Webb is injured then Phillips will start next week.

As I see it: Halfpenny, JD2, Roberts, Hook, Phillips, James, & Hibbard are unavailable. Jenkins, Smith, North, Webb injured.

Halfpenny, JD2, Roberts and Phillips are all available

We don't know how bad Jenkins, Smith, North and Webb will be out for. North has a bad cut, dont see how that will keep him out of next week.

Only ones ruled out through non availability are Hibbard and James with Jenkins, Smith, Webb and North all currently injured but no time scale yet

wales606 wrote:

Seagultaf wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:Props are there to do the main job first and foremost anything else is an advantage.  Jenkins proved against Fiji he brings very little to the leadership table, it was always is extra workrate that made him stand out from the rest but that isn't there anymore.

It seems Smiths injury is likely to rule him out next week so Jenkins will get another chance if his own injury clears up, if not then who is there.  Gatland has said he's likely to call up cover and my other fear is if Webb is injured then Phillips will start next week.

As I see it: Halfpenny, JD2, Roberts, Hook, Phillips, James, & Hibbard are unavailable. Jenkins, Smith, North, Webb injured.

Halfpenny, JD2, Roberts and Phillips are all available

We don't know how bad Jenkins, Smith, North and Webb will be out for. North has a bad cut, dont see how that will keep him out of next week.

Have the WRU done a deal with the French clubs? I am aware that Charteris was released back to his club for the Australia game so that he would be available for the SA game which is outside the IRB window but I have not heard about any deals having been done for the other French based players.

Smith looked to have torn a pectoral muscle, that a long recovery. Webb looked in trouble when he went off and North looked concussed. I would be delighted but very suprised if any of those three are available next week. Not sure about Jenkins, i guess we will find out next week!

Seagultaf wrote:

wales606 wrote:

Seagultaf wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:Props are there to do the main job first and foremost anything else is an advantage.  Jenkins proved against Fiji he brings very little to the leadership table, it was always is extra workrate that made him stand out from the rest but that isn't there anymore.

It seems Smiths injury is likely to rule him out next week so Jenkins will get another chance if his own injury clears up, if not then who is there.  Gatland has said he's likely to call up cover and my other fear is if Webb is injured then Phillips will start next week.

As I see it: Halfpenny, JD2, Roberts, Hook, Phillips, James, & Hibbard are unavailable. Jenkins, Smith, North, Webb injured.

Halfpenny, JD2, Roberts and Phillips are all available

We don't know how bad Jenkins, Smith, North and Webb will be out for. North has a bad cut, dont see how that will keep him out of next week.

Have the WRU done a deal with the French clubs?

Yes

wales606 wrote:

Seagultaf wrote:

wales606 wrote:

Seagultaf wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:Props are there to do the main job first and foremost anything else is an advantage.  Jenkins proved against Fiji he brings very little to the leadership table, it was always is extra workrate that made him stand out from the rest but that isn't there anymore.

It seems Smiths injury is likely to rule him out next week so Jenkins will get another chance if his own injury clears up, if not then who is there.  Gatland has said he's likely to call up cover and my other fear is if Webb is injured then Phillips will start next week.

As I see it: Halfpenny, JD2, Roberts, Hook, Phillips, James, & Hibbard are unavailable. Jenkins, Smith, North, Webb injured.

Halfpenny, JD2, Roberts and Phillips are all available

We don't know how bad Jenkins, Smith, North and Webb will be out for. North has a bad cut, dont see how that will keep him out of next week.

Have the WRU done a deal with the French clubs?

Yes

We'll be missing Habana from the starting lineup

Apparently all the French based Welsh players will be available but none of the French based SA players will be.

maestegmafia wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:Props are there to do the main job first and foremost anything else is an advantage.  Jenkins proved against Fiji he brings very little to the leadership table, it was always is extra workrate that made him stand out from the rest but that isn't there anymore.

It seems Smiths injury is likely to rule him out next week so Jenkins will get another chance if his own injury clears up, if not then who is there.  Gatland has said he's likely to call up cover and my other fear is if Webb is injured then Phillips will start next week.

Leadership was not really relevant to the Fiji match. The ref lead that game and the rest were merely players...!

But Jenkins has lead Wales and the blues to victory many times before. You can't write off a player because of one awful game vs Fiji. Particularly when Jenkins was one of our best players until injury struck.

Leadership is not what I value of his attributes. It is his skill in seeing advantages. The amount of times Jenkins has turned over ball, passed a quick ball, he makes great decisions. So does Nicky Smith, looking forward to seeing him in the future.

Paul james is a very basic player

Maes,

Am not basing it on the Fiji am basing it over a fair period now and those things you mention he hasn't done for sometime and we can't keep picking on past form as for leadership it was one thing we needed against Fiji and he didn't deliver it.

Warburton has been slated in the past about his lack of leadership and if he had been skipper last week I bet there would have been loads of calls for him to stand aside

Seagultaf wrote:

As I see it: Halfpenny, JD2, Roberts, Hook, Phillips, James, & Hibbard are unavailable. Jenkins, Smith, North, Webb injured.

They are going to be missing a few players too right?

If halfpenny has to go back to Toulon so will Habana and Botha...

maestegmafia wrote:

Seagultaf wrote:

As I see it: Halfpenny, JD2, Roberts, Hook, Phillips, James, & Hibbard are unavailable. Jenkins, Smith, North, Webb injured.

They are going to be missing a few players too right?

If halfpenny has to go back to Toulon so will Habana and Botha...

The Welsh French players will the available,

The SA French players will not be available

It does seem strange though that the Welsh players will be freed but not the SA.

bedfordwelsh wrote:It does seem strange though that the Welsh players will be freed but not the SA.

The WRU negotiated/paid for it

wales606 wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:It does seem strange though that the Welsh players will be freed but not the SA.

The WRU negotiated/paid for it

So the money generated by this 4th game is given to the French then

SA didn't deal for their players on...                     principle?  

Paying for player release becomes an income stream for private rugby businesses.  And it then becomes linked to price inflation to test how lucrative their foreign International players really are.  You pay once, they up the price the next time, and on and on.  These deals might become exorbitant pretty damn quick.

Fly,

I agree guess the WRU don't have any principles

wales606 wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:

Seagultaf wrote:

As I see it: Halfpenny, JD2, Roberts, Hook, Phillips, James, & Hibbard are unavailable. Jenkins, Smith, North, Webb injured.

They are going to be missing a few players too right?

If halfpenny has to go back to Toulon so will Habana and Botha...

The Welsh French players will the available,

The SA French players will not be available

What's that then, like one or two of their players?

I think we need more ball players for this game. Biggar, Williams and Halfpenny to start. I'd also put Amos on the other wing. North and Cuthbert haven't been very good all autumn tbh and could do with a reality check. I wouldn't complain about Faletau being replaced either as I can see a few others want that.

Well for a fair few of those players they had agreements to be released, the WRU hasn't said they have paid any money, it could just be that all have release clauses

I wouldn't be upset to see Baker given a start though I do think Faletau has been better than some of the reviews he's had.

I think we will see

Jenkins (if he's fit)
Baldwin
Lee
AWJ
Ball
Lydiate
Faletau (Baker could be given a shot)
Warburton

Webb
Biggar
North
Roberts
JD
Cuthbert

Halfpenny

Though I would rather see Williams at XV with the wing slots decided between North, Cuthbert and Halfpenny

Bedford I'd go with that pack. I would alter the backline though; Webb, Biggar, Williams, Roberts, S.Williams, Amos, Halfpenny. North or JD2 on the bench along with R.Williams and.... I'm not sure who should be 10 cover actually.

JD2 was another one who was unimpressive, and shouldn't have been fast tracked into the starting team. Hopefully Scott has been working on his fitness during the week.

If Webb isn't fit we are screwed

Saint,

Wouldn't argue with that but just can't see him dropping North and Cuthbert, one of them might make way for Williams (we all know which one it will be) and unless he goes into the match without a 10 on the bench then it will be Priestland.

I thought JD done ok but like you said I wouldn't have rushed him back though can't now see him being dropped next week.

Hope he does go with R Williams on the bench to

wales606 wrote:If Webb isn't fit we are screwed

Rh Williams to start with ummmmmmmmmm on the bench.

More likely slow coach to start with Williams on the bench.

If Cuthbert and North start it will be the Boks by a good 20 points. Their halfbacks along with the back 3 will just kick down their corner each opportunity they get and either build on their mistakes or win our lineout should it go into touch.

ABs v Wales player ratings

http://m.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11363508

surprisingly reasonable

ebop wrote:ABs v Wales player ratings

http://m.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11363508

Love the ratings of our subs, and they're spot on. Roberts was probably 7 or 8 going by that criteria.