Rugby’s Challenge Cup will provide a route into the Champions Cup after all

http://www.the42.ie/champions-cup-challenge-qualification-winners-qualify-1903336-Jan2015/


Plenty of changes seam to be coming in the new tournaments halfway through....

This was announced ages ago. It's not a change, it just didn't get added to the website due to the Wee weeing about the celtic unions did before caving in.

Was debated on these boards a few months ago.

It's been the case since the new competition was confirmed last April, reported in at least the UK & Irish press at the time.  A number of us tried to highlight it when the qualification prospects of the Challenge Cup winner were being discussed on here last year.

http://www.espn.co.uk/heineken-cup-2013-14/rugby/story/221419.html

http://www.independent.ie/sport/rugby/champions-cup/money-talks-as-euro-rugby-elite-look-to-fill-their-boots-30176006.html

From the 2015 season, if the previous season's European Rugby Challenge Cup winner has not already qualified through its finishing position in its league, it will participate in the play-off by taking a place given to its league.

I do now recall this having forgotten about it. That's a big carrot certainly for Gloucester, Falcons and Irish, who are unlikely to finish high enough in the Premiership to bag a Champions Cup play off place.

And the dragons and blues who are in the same boat

I wasn't sure what the Pro 12 teams chances through the league were Gavin. Where do Edinburgh and Connacht sit in that? Are they in with a chance of making it in through league position?

Edinburgh 7th and connaught 6th

So could well still be in with a shout of making it in via league position when the quarters role round. I wonder how, if at all, the relative league positions of the teams will affect selection and mindset for the games.

If blues or Dragons qualify by winning the Challenge Cup the Scarlets are not allowed to play in a play off with the lowest English and French club should they finish seventh in the Pro 12...

This competition is interesting...?

I'm confused.

"If the winner of this season’s Challenge Cup has not qualified for the 2015/16 Champions Cup, they will go into the play-off matches in place of either the seventh highest finishing club from the Premiership or Top 14, or if from the PRO12, in place of the lower of the two highest finishing clubs from the PRO12 which have not already qualified for the Champions Cup."

This could be intresting and create a bit of bad blood in the league, which would add spice to games.

Imagine Edinburgh finish in 7th and think they have a playoff spot for big cup, but Blues win it and take the spot away from them by finishing lower in the League?

Only as much bad blood as 1st in the league not winning in the final.

You're going on as if this only adversely affects the Pro12...It affects all three leagues*. 4 of the 6 nations competing could still win the ECC. With 4 teams from the Pro12 and AP still in, it is anyone's guess who may lose out, and from which league.

* Obviously not the T14 this season.

Certainly more incentive for Dragons or Blues to win it. Pains me to say it but Blues probably have the best chance, they just need to get their act together. Glaws and Exeter look pretty strong, probably a bit too much for Dragons on this year's form. Blues have the firepower though.

The Saint wrote:Certainly more incentive for Dragons or Blues to win it. Pains me to say it but Blues probably have the best chance, they just need to get their act together. Glaws and Exeter look pretty strong, probably a bit too much for Dragons on this year's form. Blues have the firepower though.

Rocking Dave Parade confirmed, so advantage Drags i'd say.

This playoff concept is quite involved. To me, the Challenge Cup winner should get into the the top tier comp automatically. If the Challenge Cup winner would qualify for the top tier by virtue of league standing, then I would give that spot to the next team in their league. I think the playoff will generate some crowds and tv money so a simple solution will likely never happen.

doctor_grey wrote:This playoff concept is quite involved.  To me, the Challenge Cup winner should get into the the top tier comp automatically.  If the Challenge Cup winner would qualify for the top tier by virtue of league standing, then I would give that spot to the next team in their league.   I think the playoff will generate some crowds and tv money so a simple solution will likely never happen.

I completely agree that the Challenge Cup winner should automatically qualify for the Champions, but if they've already qualified by league position (which I expect to happen frequently) I struggle with just handing the last spot to the next side in their league.  Simple for sure, but what are the notable benefits of that?  It's not an earnt privilege by the benefiting club and could well be denying better sides from the other two leagues.  It would be rewarding leagues rather than teams, which if you were going to do you might as well give the 20th spot to the league who produced the Champions Cup winner rather than the Challenge.

I think an already qualified English club will win the Challenge Cup this year and I wouldn't want our 7th placed side getting a freebie by virtue of another higher placed club's achievements.  As long as the Challenge Cup winner has qualified, give the best of the rest from each league the chance to win the spot via a play-off, their supporters get tense knock-out matches to attend and the clubs earn additional revenues that most sides would surely welcome.