Tonights Action SPOILERS

First topic message reminder :

Two Brits involved in world title fights tonight then;

Martin Murray vs GGG on C5, Hughie Fury on the undercard as well. Paul Smith vs Abraham on Sky with David Price and Josh Warrington on the undercard as well.

Who's everyone watching?

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

Herman Jaggery wrote:Ward's favourite to beat this guy without a shadow of doubt, takes him out of his rythm and roughs him up. Take him out of his rythm Ward's a master of that. Or counterpunch him to death ala Ray Leonard.

Froch Golovkin is more of a 50/50 but I'd be more sweet on Froch's chances after last night. Yet to see Golovkin in a battle of wills, yet to see him in a dark place.

Another impressive display last night over a very tough opponent but not the towering one we had come to expect. Too early to put him up there with the Hagler's of this world, but with his style soon enough, someone's going to test his resolve. Clearly though he needs to move to super middle.

Love to see him fight Abraham next(what a fight that would be,) and then Froch or Ward.

Very professional but he showed he was flawed !!........Very very like Chavez...The way he cuts off the ring and works the body.....and he's always on top of you............................Chavez/Nelson !!

We saw what a skilled operator like Whittaker could do..........to both of those............Made them both look ordinary..

Can't see him stopping Ward...Murray took his shots and lasted 11........I see him being outpointed by his awkward style and made to look ordinary..

I can see Froch beating him with his power too............He wouldn't take liberties against Carl and the extra weight may mean he concedes the ring center.....

Back this guy up I'll bet he's a completely different fighter.........

Before last night I thought he could beat Marv........But he did suck it up after 7/8...........

Pick Marv to wear him down and stop him late........In a fantasy matchup...

Andre Ward - fine fighter that he is - is no Pernell Whitaker. Golovkin does remind me of Chavez, though. An absolute tough-as-nails machine.

Chavez beat the crap out of Rosario who lay on the ropes all night......

So that means he beats the crap out of types like Pernell Whittaker and Frankie Randall.........Oh wait a minute !!

Murray may be the second best middle in the World...........

My Wife is the second best fighter in my house............

Will say though that Murray should have been pulled out earlier..........He was still contributing gamely but a decision should have been called around the 8th because he wasn't going to win that fight !!

He's probably finished now at the top level.........Bad corner work for me !!

GGG is yet to beat a top fighter....

The Macklin that fought Martinez and the Murray that fought last night is pickem for me!!........So the jury should be out to objective types !!

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Chavez beat the crap out of Rosario who lay on the ropes all night......

So that means he beats the crap out of types like Pernell Whittaker and Frankie Randall.........Oh wait a minute !!

Murray may be the second best middle in the World...........

My Wife is the second best fighter in my house............

Will say though that Murray should have been pulled out earlier..........He was still contributing gamely but a decision should have been called around the 8th because he wasn't going to win that fight !!

He's probably finished now at the top level.........Bad corner work for me !!

GGG is yet to beat a top fighter....

The Macklin that fought Martinez and the Murray that fought last night is pickem for me!!........So the jury should be out to objective types !!

Chavez was above his best weight and a shade past his best against both Whitaker and Randall. Golovkin appears to be in his prime.

So, should we not bestow praise upon Golovkin until a name dares to fight him? No-one is claiming he's the greatest but he certainly looks a great fighter.

Would Cotto have beaten the Murray Golovkin fought last night? Would Alvarez?

Flaws seem to be relative though. Like I said earlier Golovkin did seem to gas... but he also showed he has a second wind.

Froch was in a world of trouble in Groves I, and I suspect in a similar position, Golovkin wouldn't toy with his prey like Groves did. All really about how Golovkin carries eight pounds. If he's the same fighter, more or less, Froch would be in trouble.

Overall I like Golovkin, and I hope he isn't too hung up over the "0" (easy to call everyone out when you know you could beat them on two days notice mind you!). His 30 days out weigh in 175ish, and he rehydrates to only slightly below that level, so there's a chance be makes a reasonably sized SMW.

kingraf wrote:Flaws seem to be relative though. Like I said earlier Golovkin did seem to gas... but he also showed he has a second wind.

Froch was in a world of trouble in Groves I, and I suspect in a similar position, Golovkin wouldn't toy with his prey like Groves did. All really about how Golovkin carries eight pounds. If he's the same fighter, more or less, Froch would be in trouble.

Overall I like Golovkin, and I hope he isn't too hung up over the "0" (easy to call everyone out when you know you could beat them on two days notice mind you!). His 30 days out weigh in 175ish, and he rehydrates to only slightly below that level, so there's a chance be makes a reasonably sized SMW.

Froch's problem is that he's easy to hit. Not great against this guy - 8 lbs or not.

I was impressed with him.............

But Murray is ordinary.......and he exposed flaws..........

A bigger hitter like Froch or an awkward type like Ward who can both take his shots...

He could look ordinary........

He may be the real deal..............But Murray, Geale, Macklin are Euro standard in any other era.......

Froch and Ward are bigger and World class...........

Plenty back home including me had given Curry the Hagler win.............and boy were we wrong....

Until he fights a guy with skill and a shot we don't know........What we got !!

hazharrison wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Chavez beat the crap out of Rosario who lay on the ropes all night......

So that means he beats the crap out of types like Pernell Whittaker and Frankie Randall.........Oh wait a minute !!

Murray may be the second best middle in the World...........

My Wife is the second best fighter in my house............

Will say though that Murray should have been pulled out earlier..........He was still contributing gamely but a decision should have been called around the 8th because he wasn't going to win that fight !!

He's probably finished now at the top level.........Bad corner work for me !!

GGG is yet to beat a top fighter....

The Macklin that fought Martinez and the Murray that fought last night is pickem for me!!........So the jury should be out to objective types !!

Chavez was above his best weight and a shade past his best against both Whitaker and Randall. Golovkin appears to be in his prime.

So, should we not bestow praise upon Golovkin until a name dares to fight him? No-one is claiming he's the greatest but he certainly looks a great fighter.

Would Cotto have beaten the Murray Golovkin fought last night? Would Alvarez?

Yes.

Dipper Brown wrote:

hazharrison wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Chavez beat the crap out of Rosario who lay on the ropes all night......

So that means he beats the crap out of types like Pernell Whittaker and Frankie Randall.........Oh wait a minute !!

Murray may be the second best middle in the World...........

My Wife is the second best fighter in my house............

Will say though that Murray should have been pulled out earlier..........He was still contributing gamely but a decision should have been called around the 8th because he wasn't going to win that fight !!

He's probably finished now at the top level.........Bad corner work for me !!

GGG is yet to beat a top fighter....

The Macklin that fought Martinez and the Murray that fought last night is pickem for me!!........So the jury should be out to objective types !!

Chavez was above his best weight and a shade past his best against both Whitaker and Randall. Golovkin appears to be in his prime.

So, should we not bestow praise upon Golovkin until a name dares to fight him? No-one is claiming he's the greatest but he certainly looks a great fighter.

Would Cotto have beaten the Murray Golovkin fought last night? Would Alvarez?

Yes.

Manny is a useless opponent on another thread...................Murray is a great one now apparently !!!........

You know someone is a completely lost fan boy when he makes such stupid statements !!

Wouldn't put my house on it, Dipper. Miguel got successful against an old Martínez, and could take hold of the centre and spin the one legged man....

With Cotto's style... A much much bigger man, with a decent chin, and good fundamentals... I don't think he bests Murray. Can't see how.

Álvarez, maybe. But we haven't actually seen him fight Middleweights yet have we? He's been fighting Super welterweight in the land after Light middleweight and before middleweight

Always good to remember that I hate Cotto when reading my views on him though.

In fairness Murray is a top 3 p4per.......

He must be because Haz thinks the 4th best one is crap now Mayweather is fighting him !!

I know Raf, it does come across ha ha. Re: Martinez, remember Cotto seriously shook him with the first left hook he landed in that fight. The 'bum knee' was only an issue when Martinez was buzzed and realised he needed to get on his bike but his legs couldn't take him.

Like you say Murray has the size and is the fundamentals but I see him as a tidy but unspectacular boxer. Did himself no harm with his guts last night but he was in survival mode, don't see how that translates into him going on the attack and beating Cotto.

Don't know what to make of Alvarez with weight, seems to make it up as he goes along but he'd find a way to beat Murray for me. Murray's come up short whenever he's gone for the title.

Dipper Brown wrote:I know Raf, it does come across ha ha. Re: Martinez, remember Cotto seriously shook him with the first left hook he landed in that fight. The 'bum knee' was only an issue when Martinez was buzzed and realised he needed to get on his bike but his legs couldn't take him.

Like you say Murray has the size and is the fundamentals but I see him as a tidy but unspectacular boxer. Did himself no harm with his guts last night but he was in survival mode, don't see how that translates into him going on the attack and beating Cotto.

Don't know what to make of Alvarez with weight, seems to make it up as he goes along but he'd find a way to beat Murray for me. Murray's come up short whenever he's gone for the title.

Corners have got to know when it's not their Man's night...........

Wonderfully brave kid.............But wouldn't be surprised If he's a shell next time !!.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:In fairness Murray is a top 3 p4per.......

He must be because Haz thinks the 4th best one is crap now Mayweather is fighting him !!

I've never said Pacquiao was "crap".

I fancy Murray (well the Murray before last night) would have been too big and just skilled enough to see off Cotto and Canelo.

As i said earlier, I'm 50:50 on the corner pulling him out... i could certainly see a case for it, once the head shots started getting through more regularly late on. The ref timed the stoppage well, but murray looked in ok shape straight after. Hopefully he hasn't had it taken out of him. but you're right that similar working over's have finished others.

hazharrison wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:In fairness Murray is a top 3 p4per.......

He must be because Haz thinks the 4th best one is crap now Mayweather is fighting him !!

I've never said Pacquiao was "crap".

I fancy Murray (well the Murray before last night) would have been too big and just skilled enough to see off Cotto and Canelo.

He's a big middle, but does he use that size to his advantage? Not really in the fights I've seen. We really need to see Cotto at middle again, to see how good he was compared to how bad martinez was, as it looked a bit of both to me. Its possible murray's too big for him to get close to, but p4p cotto is in a different league as a fighter. On balance, I'd pick cotto and alvarez to beat him pretty comfortably to be honest.

Thing to remember about the Martínez Cotto beat is that he had knee surgery post Chavez. He then had knee surgery post Murray. He then had knee surgery post Cotto. He isn't even cleared to return to training till next month. Properly damaged.

It was a very proficient performance and display of GGG's power and all round ring craft. There is nobody at 160lb to beat him. However, even Murray showed, when he stood his ground GGG was nowhere near as effective. Which asks why he didn't. But then, its easy to say stand up to the big punches and get some of your own in, much harder to do it.

For me, Murray is the 2nd best MW but that is largely because of the paucity of talent at that weight. He is big, durable, defensively sound but does lack a punch. One has to ask, why he stays at MW when he could easily step up to SMW? My guess is, he knows he wouldn't have a size advantage and his lack of pop would seem him struggle even at Euro level.

168lb has a good deal of big, tough lads who will punch back that would challenge GGG. But, if GGG wants to clear up at 160lb I wouldn't begrudge him.

There's no point talking about GGG and Froch as it is obvious Froch is looking for one last, "easy" payday before retirement and as much as I think he'd win, fighting a live fighter like GGG would be too much work.

Ward is a possiblity but, on last night's performance, I'd go for Abraham.

Happytravelling wrote:It was a very proficient performance and display of GGG's power and all round ring craft. There is nobody at 160lb to beat him. However, even Murray showed, when he stood his ground GGG was nowhere near as effective. Which asks why he didn't. But then, its easy to say stand up to the big punches and get some of your own in, much harder to do it.

For me, Murray is the 2nd best MW but that is largely because of the paucity of talent at that weight. He is big, durable, defensively sound but does lack a punch. One has to ask, why he stays at MW when he could easily step up to SMW? My guess is, he knows he wouldn't have a size advantage and his lack of pop would seem him struggle even at Euro level.

168lb has a good deal of big, tough lads who will punch back that would challenge GGG. But, if GGG wants to clear up at 160lb I wouldn't begrudge him.

There's no point talking about GGG and Froch as it is obvious Froch is looking for one last, "easy" payday before retirement and as much as I think he'd win, fighting a live fighter like GGG would be too much work.

Ward is a possiblity but, on last night's performance, I'd go for Abraham.

Agree with this.........

A few fan boys getting carried away on here me thinks..

Talking to yourself again.

Strongback wrote:Talking to yourself again.

More fun than debating you...You're so boring !!....Dear oh dear......

GGG is a solid technical middle but he ain't no great.

People on hardly rate multi weight champions like Floyd or Manny as atg's but think this guy is the second coming.

Joe Calzaghe would of boxed this guy silly as would an active Ward.

AdamT wrote:GGG is a solid technical middle but he ain't no great.

People on hardly rate multi weight champions like Floyd or Manny as atg's but think this guy is the second coming.

Joe Calzaghe would of boxed this guy silly as would an active Ward.

Sensible opinion at last..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

Strongback wrote:Talking to yourself again.

More fun than debating you...You're so boring !!....Dear oh dear......

Have you been on the claret since lunch time?          

Strongback wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:

Strongback wrote:Talking to yourself again.

More fun than debating you...You're so boring !!....Dear oh dear......

Have you been on the claret since lunch time?          

Wait for Hammer or Super to come on...

Truss I like GGG but his best opponents hardly rate anywhere near Floyds or Mannys.

Not entirely his fault because to be quite honest the middle weight scene is garbage. Murray, lee and Macklin types are good fighters but far from elite.

love when people state Floyd needs to fight GGG at 154 at f.....g 38 years of age. Floyd and Manny have jumped loads of divisions and became the best.

I doubt GGG could even clean up Super Middle never mind Lhw.

Is GGG exciting? Yes

Do I enjoy watching him? Yes

Is he a talented fighter? Again yes.

However beating Geale and Murray is not anything to be getting too excited about.

AdamT wrote:Truss I like GGG but his best opponents hardly rate anywhere near Floyds or Mannys.

Not entirely his fault because to be quite honest the middle weight scene is garbage. Murray, lee and Macklin types are good fighters but far from elite.

love when people state Floyd needs to fight GGG at 154 at f.....g 38 years of age. Floyd and Manny have jumped loads of divisions and became the best.

I doubt GGG could even clean up Super Middle never mind Lhw.

Is GGG exciting? Yes

Do I enjoy watching him? Yes

Is he a talented fighter? Again yes.

However beating Geale and Murray is not anything to be getting too excited about.

What is not to like........

Hey Truss, how many times have you seen Golovkin fight?

Not too many times by the sound of it.

Waffler.......

He's the best in his division at the moment Adam, it is something to get excited about to be fair.

If GGG drops down to 154 then Floyd should fight him (especially if he gets into a mandatory position) as May holds title at that weight. It is stupid at the moment to be going on about it though as he's just signed to fight the (apparent ) biggest fight of the decade.

Some people can't give any credit and are already looking at either excuses as to why Pac lost or for a reason why he should have fought someone else like Khan??????????????????????

P.s think someones desperate for a hug from you Truss.

Tell you what!

If Floyd was half a dozen years younger and bit bigger naturally then I think he would coast to victory over GGG.

I agree derby he is the best in his division,so Is Wlad but don't see many on here claiming he is great. Before everybody has there knickers in a twist, I know GGG is more exciting than Wlad but honestly? Is his competition any better?

Derbymanc wrote:He's the best in his division at the moment Adam, it is something to get excited about to be fair.

If GGG drops down to 154 then Floyd should fight him (especially if he gets into a mandatory position) as May holds title at that weight. It is stupid at the moment to be going on about it though as he's just signed to fight the (apparent ) biggest fight of the decade.

Some people can't give any credit and are already looking at either excuses as to why Pac lost or for a reason why he should have fought someone else like Khan??????????????????????

P.s think someones desperate for a hug from you Truss.

AdamT wrote:Tell you what!

If Floyd was half a dozen years younger and bit bigger naturally then I think he would coast to victory over GGG.

I agree derby he is the best in his division,so Is Wlad but don't see many on here claiming he is great. Before everybody has there knickers in a twist, I know GGG is more exciting than Wlad but honestly? Is his competition any better?

He wouldn't fight Golovkin!

If he was a naturally light middle and a few years younger he would fight GGG and would win easily.

Guys seriously, GGG is a good fighter but he is way overhyped. Ward beats this guy all day long.

I suppose I can see your point Adam, whilst I like the idea of him cleaning out the division, if the other belt holders won't face him then he needs to stand there and say that and then move up.

Think with Mayweather it's all about whether he can take the power (and how much boiling down ill take out of GGG) it would be an interesting match up but too late for Floyd I think.


Edit:He holds belts at the weight Adam, therefore he should be fighting those in the mandatory position, regardless of who they are etc.

Floyd couldn't beat him now.

He is too old.

Plus Floyd started at super feather. He has no business being the best at LM never mind middle weight. Just goes to show boxing hasn't the depth it once had

AdamT wrote:If he was a naturally light middle and a few years younger he would fight GGG and would win easily.

Guys seriously, GGG is a good fighter but he is way overhyped. Ward beats this guy all day long.

Give over Adam! No basis to that claim. He wouldn't fight Pacquiao. He wouldn't fight Golovkin either.

AdamT wrote:Plus Floyd started at super feather. He has no business being the best at LM never mind middle weight. Just goes to show boxing hasn't the depth it once had

Can't argue with that really, not 100 percent certain Floyd would lose as it would depend on if he can take the power and/or keep GGG off him. Would be intriguing thats for sure.

Naw Floyd couldn't beat him now.

Perhaps in being a bit harsh on GGG as so many are overhyping him. Tell you what! I hope he is as good as some are claiming to be because boxing needs a new superstar.

Only problem is GGG is not exactly a spring chicken.

I think one thing everyone can agree on. GGG is quite possibly the most exciting and marketable fighter around now, that I can concede.
perhaps he should stay at middleweight and destroy all in his path because to be honest he isn't the largest guy and I'm sure somebody will be able to put up a decent challenge eventually.

milkyboy wrote:

hazharrison wrote:

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:In fairness Murray is a top 3 p4per.......

He must be because Haz thinks the 4th best one is crap now Mayweather is fighting him !!

I've never said Pacquiao was "crap".

I fancy Murray (well the Murray before last night) would have been too big and just skilled enough to see off Cotto and Canelo.

He's a big middle, but does he use that size to his advantage? Not really in the fights I've seen. We really need to see Cotto at middle again, to see how good he was compared to how bad martinez was, as it looked a  bit of both to me. Its possible murray's too big for him to get close to, but p4p cotto is in a different league as a fighter. On balance, I'd pick cotto and alvarez to beat him pretty comfortably to be honest.

You're unlikely to see Cotto fight a middleweight again. Murray too big, too strong and skilled enough to overcome Cotto.

I'm not talking P4P (yawn) - I mean at middleweight.

Don't see losing to Calzaghe and Ward - arguably the two best ever from the division above who easily have the frames to make light heavy - as a massive stick to beat Golovkin with.

Losing to a fictional enlarged 25 year old Mayweather though? That's unforgivable.

Ideally I'd like to see Cotto punished for his further abuse of weight classes, however surely Lemeiux v GGG is dying to be made before a move up.

I would like to see him fight Lemiuex, it's the only worthwhile fight left at the weight unless Alvarez decides to make that 5lb jump up from his own weight class. Pirog would have been a good fight too but that one wasn't meant to be.

Haz Floyd has fought plenty of genuine contenders over the years. He has had the luxury of picking his fights now through proving himself.

Perhaps GGG can do the same when he beats loads of champs over the next decade and remain unbeaten.

Haz - I don't see why Cotto should fight Murray. Murray's just fought another titlist and lost. He previously fought Martinez and lost and fought out a draw with Sturm. You and many others can argue he was hard done by and I'd agree he was no disgrace in any of those but the facts are he's had 3 title shots and didn't win one. So he's not getting a shot at the lineal champion and I don't think Cotto owes it to him.

Cotto GGG a different story.

GGG Floyd is a non starter. Floyd holds the belt at 154 but is operating at 147 and is fighting the fight everyone wants down there. GGG is a career middleweight who's always fought at 160 in the pros. Floyd is hardly avoiding him.

I'm no Floyd fan but you'd swear some would only be happy if he fought everyone, in every division at the same time!

AdamT wrote:Haz Floyd has fought plenty of genuine contenders over the years. He has had the luxury of picking his fights now through proving himself.

Perhaps GGG can do the same when he beats loads of champs over the next decade and remain unbeaten.

Wasting your time..

Say one thing for Haz though.............I'd love him as a fan If I was fighting..

Derbymanc wrote:

P.s think someones desperate for a hug from you Truss.

Truss is the one throwing out abuse all afternoon, sounds like he's on the sauce.

As for you I've been giving you a fools pardon up to now but not anymore you halfwit.

Oh no, the Super Duper Billionaire property magnate and World Class Boxing, weightlifting genius has taken away my fools pardon.

What am I gonna do?????????

Probably just carry on treating him with the contempt he deserves.

Although he does need a hug, will anyway help the little man out..............................

Golovkin against Mayweather is a mismatch, and not in favour of the money man. A tired old Oscar pushed Mayweather close for the 9 rounds de la Hoya was able to fight. Golovkin would have wiped the floor with him.

Derby I was on ja606 and realized you are the same guy that torments D4 ha!

Hammersmith harrier wrote:I would like to see him fight Lemiuex, it's the only worthwhile fight left at the weight unless Alvarez decides to make that 5lb jump up from his own weight class. Pirog would have been a good fight too but that one wasn't meant to be.

Think we'll see the Lemiuex fight in the next six months - should be fun while it lasts.