6 Nations Team of the Tournament

My gaff, my rules:

1. This is just a bit of fun.
2. Specialists chosen only in their positions please.
3. Aggregate tournament form should be the determining factor - consistency over all matches is the thing.

***********************
01. Eddy Ben Arous (France)
02. Rory Best (Ireland)
03. Mike Ross (Ireland)
04. Paul O'Connell (Ireland)(c)
05. Alun Wyn Jones (Wales)
06. Peter O'Mahony (Ireland)
07. Chris Robshaw (England)
08. Billy Vunipola (England)

09. Conor Murray (Ireland)
10. Jonathon Sexton (Ireland)
11. Jack Nowell (England)
12. Jamie Roberts (Wales)
13. Jonathan Joseph (England)
14. George North (Wales)
15. Stuart Hogg (Scotland)

16. Joe Marler (England)
17. Scott Baldwin (Wales)
18. Dan Cole (England)
19. Luke Charteris (Wales)
20. Sam Warbuton (Wales)
21. Ben Youngs (England)
22. George Ford (England)
23. Leigh Halfpenny (Wales)

Honorable mentions:
Rhys Webb (Wales)
Robbie Henshaw (Ireland)
Bernard Le Roux (France)
Devin Toner (Ireland)
Tommy O'Donnell (Ireland)
Joshua Furno (Italy)
Dan Lydiate (Wales)
Scott Spedding (France)
Courtney Lawes (England)

i tell you one thing. the gap between the top 4 and the bottom 2 is growing. so whilst the top four can look forward the bottom two are seriously going to come under increasing pressure to be kicked out !

scotland and italys performance were embarassing

At present it looks like a top 3 and bottom 3, France are a country mile away from Wales, England and Ireland.
Worst French team in living memory?

Fair team I think, but George North has been fairly quiet in most games.

I'd put Venditti in!

Good shout on Venditti

1 McGrath
2 Baldwin (particularly for how much better our lineout is)
3 Ross
4 POC
5 AWJ
6 POM
7 Warburton
8 Vunipola
9 Youngs (2 x MOTM shade it over Murray for me)
10 Ford
11 Nowell
12 Henshaw
13 Joseph
14 Venditti
15 Hogg

It was a tough one for wings this year. I agree with RDW - North was very quiet until yesterday (and missed a game). Not sure who else should be in. Struggling to even think of the wingers for the 6 teams at the moment!

Edit: sorry, just saw the calls for Venditti later on in this thread. Good shout!

Liam Williams has played well, but not in every game.

Certainly not been a good tournament for wingers!

Risca thats pretty much spot on in my humble and hungover opinion

Higher_Ground wrote:At present it looks like a top 3 and bottom 3, France are a country mile away from Wales, England and Ireland.
Worst French team in living memory?

They were still not as bad as a couple of seasons ago when they finished last!

Mike Ross has been amazing for Ireland and showed why he is one of the best tighthead in the world. Also SOB in the form he showed yesterday would be in my dream team any day of the week.

1 Rizzo
2 Baldwin
3 Ross
4 Charteris
5 POC
6 POM
7 Warburton
8 Parisse
9 Murray
10 Sexton
11 North
12 Henshaw
13 Joseph
14 Huget
15 Hogg

1 Eddy Ben Arous
2 Rory Best
3 Dan Cole
4 Paul O'Connell
5 Alun Wyn Jones
6 Peter O'Mahony
7 Sam Warburton
8 Billy Vunipola
9 Conor Murray
10 George Ford
11 Liam Williams
12 Jamie Roberts
13 Jonathon Joseph
14 Jack Nowell
15 Stuart Hogg

maestegmafia wrote:1 Rizzo

Wow. A man plays one match in the entire 6Ns. A match in which his team are hammered and he gets into your Team of the Tournament.

POM seems to be making most teams? I thought both Haskell and Lydiate were better throughout. Could have put Warburton at 6, he has played there in this year's tournament. That's probably the only change I'd make as it'd be harsh to drop stats man Robshaw. The best 3 locks in the tournament without a doubt were POC, AWJ and Charteris.

LondonTiger wrote:

maestegmafia wrote:1 Rizzo

Wow. A man plays one match in the entire 6Ns. A match in which his team are hammered and he gets into your Team of the Tournament.

And he faced Aaron frekin Jarvis at the scrum lol

The Saint wrote:POM seems to be making most teams? I thought both Haskell and Lydiate were better throughout.

Haskell? Bizarre.... Just about every England fan wants him replaced with Wood. He has had a rubbish tournament bar the game against Wales. He was absolutely anonymous against Ireland and the less said about his performance and yellow card yesterday the better.

Surely you can't have a team of the tournament with players who only showed up for 1-2 games (North, Nowell). Based on the tournament as a whole:

1. Jack McGrath
2. Rory Best
3. Mike Ross
4. Alun Wyn Jones
5. Paul O'Connell
6. Thierry Dusatoir
7. Chris Robshaw
8. Billy Vunipola
9. Rhys Webb
10. George Ford
11. Liam Williams
12. Robbie Henshaw
13. Jonathan Joseph
14. Giovanbattista Venditti
15. Stuart Hogg

Notes: French selection inconsistency makes it difficult to include anyone but Dusatoir.
No standout performers in the front row, went for hometown bias.
Wingers were being dropped like bad habits, and the wings who did play were largely quiet (think Huget, Bowe, Watson etc.). I went for the only two I could think of who made a notable impact over multiple games.

Artful_Dodger wrote:

The Saint wrote:POM seems to be making most teams? I thought both Haskell and Lydiate were better throughout.

Haskell? Bizarre.... Just about every England fan wants him replaced with Wood.  He has had a rubbish tournament bar the game against Wales.  He was absolutely anonymous against Ireland and the less said about his performance and yellow card yesterday the better.

Yeah he was good against Wales, don't remember POM being good in any particular game. Haskell is probably better at 8 than at 6. Lydiate played well throughout, and got better in each game.

The Saint wrote:

Artful_Dodger wrote:

The Saint wrote:POM seems to be making most teams? I thought both Haskell and Lydiate were better throughout.

Haskell? Bizarre.... Just about every England fan wants him replaced with Wood.  He has had a rubbish tournament bar the game against Wales.  He was absolutely anonymous against Ireland and the less said about his performance and yellow card yesterday the better.

Yeah he was good against Wales, don't remember POM being good in any particular game. Haskell is probably better at 8 than at 6. Lydiate played well throughout, and got better in each game.

I really thought that POM was outstanding the entire tournament.

JmD wrote:Surely you can't have a team of the tournament with players who only showed up for 1-2 games (North, Nowell). Based on the tournament as a whole:

1. Jack McGrath
2. Rory Best
3. Mike Ross
4. Alun Wyn Jones
5. Paul O'Connell
6. Thierry Dusatoir
7. Chris Robshaw
8. Billy Vunipola
9. Rhys Webb
10. George Ford
11. Liam Williams
12. Robbie Henshaw
13. Jonathan Joseph
14. Giovanbattista Venditti
15. Stuart Hogg

Notes: French selection inconsistency makes it difficult to include anyone but Dusatoir.
No standout performers in the front row, went for hometown bias.
Wingers were being dropped like bad habits, and the wings who did play were largely quiet (think Huget, Bowe, Watson etc.). I went for the only two I could think of who made a notable impact over multiple games.

Going on your criteria at the top of your post, i dont think Webb should be there. Murray has been the most consistent of the tournament

George Carlin wrote:

The Saint wrote:

Artful_Dodger wrote:

The Saint wrote:POM seems to be making most teams? I thought both Haskell and Lydiate were better throughout.

Haskell? Bizarre.... Just about every England fan wants him replaced with Wood.  He has had a rubbish tournament bar the game against Wales.  He was absolutely anonymous against Ireland and the less said about his performance and yellow card yesterday the better.

Yeah he was good against Wales, don't remember POM being good in any particular game. Haskell is probably better at 8 than at 6. Lydiate played well throughout, and got better in each game.

I really thought that POM was outstanding the entire tournament.

POM had a good tournament except against Wales when he has a very quiet day and was Irelands weakest backrow.

Haskell was dire all tournament IMO. Very poor missed tackle v Wales, was very weak v Ireland and probably cost England the title v France.

The best 6 is a toss up between Dusatoir, POM or Lydiate. All had their moments IMO.

Nowell, only played three games, right enough, but in each of them he had a case to be considered the most effective English back on show. Bearing in mind what a wasteland this tournament was for wingers until the final week, I don't think that he's an unfair selection.

Might cheat a bit and have O'Brien and Warburton as my two flankers, playing left and right. Like the Joseph/Henshaw centre combo and think that Ford came close to selection but doesn't quite displace Sexton, who was so much the master against the apprentice when they went head to head. That's all the more so since I would pick Hogg at 15 in narrow preference to halfpenny and Sexton is a far more reliable place kicker (normally) than Ford, at least at this stage. I'd also still want Murray at 9. For the rest, I sort of row in with the general opinion, although the second wing position is a bit up for grabs. North for his great awakening v Italy? Venditti for his tries against Scotland and Wales? Nakaitici, who looked useful in spells for France? Watson, whose defence needs work but has immense attacking potential? God knows, really.

A great last week but not that many individuals have been consistently head and shoulders above the rest at their position on a week in/week out basis. O'Connell, Best and Wyn Jones, yes (although Lawes was very good in the two matches he played); arguably Hogg and maybe Joseph and Warburton, but after that it does get trickier.

GunsGerms wrote:

George Carlin wrote:

The Saint wrote:

Artful_Dodger wrote:

The Saint wrote:POM seems to be making most teams? I thought both Haskell and Lydiate were better throughout.

Haskell? Bizarre.... Just about every England fan wants him replaced with Wood.  He has had a rubbish tournament bar the game against Wales.  He was absolutely anonymous against Ireland and the less said about his performance and yellow card yesterday the better.

Yeah he was good against Wales, don't remember POM being good in any particular game. Haskell is probably better at 8 than at 6. Lydiate played well throughout, and got better in each game.

I really thought that POM was outstanding the entire tournament.

POM had a good tournament except against Wales when he has a very quiet day and was Irelands weakest backrow.

Haskell was dire all tournament IMO. Very poor missed tackle v Wales, was very weak v Ireland and probably cost England the title v France.

The best 6 is a toss up between Dusatoir, POM or Lydiate. All had their moments IMO.

Was impressed with Dusatoir against England, dispite him being 408 years old he still gets around the park and makes the tackles.

I think i would have Robshaw in stead of Warburton. Warburton was quite untill the last game really. Robshaw made about the most tackles of any player in the tournament.

majesticimperialman wrote:I think i would have Robshaw in stead of Warburton. Warburton was quite untill the last game really. Robshaw made about the most tackles of any player in the tournament.

You can't have paid any attention to Wales games if you believe Warburton was quiet until the last game, or you're just being a prize plum as per. Stats-man may well have made the most tackles, but aren't us Welsh continuously told that in itself isn't good enough and it is why Lydiate is so poor?

majesticimperialman wrote:I think i would have Robshaw in stead of Warburton. Warburton was quite untill the last game really. Robshaw made about the most tackles of any player in the tournament.

He was man of the match v Ireland

According to Rugby.net stats system the best team with runner up in brackets is:

Marler 1269 (McGrath 1130)
Best 830 (Hartley 734)
Cole 1259 (Ross 1134)
POC 1255 (Maestri 1068)
AWJ 1169 (Gray 1129)
POM 1226 (Haskell 1133)
Robshaw 1479 Warburton (1192)
Vunipola 2050 (Faletau 1462)
Murray 1392 (Youngs 1312)
Ford 2300 (Biggar 1361)
Nowell 1319 (Williams 1053)
Henshaw 1311 (JD2 1124, Roberts 878)
Joseph 1648 (Payne 1293)
Watson 1109 (Bowe 1010)
Hogg 1075 (1/2p 901)

http://www.rugby.net/s/voALLlvqKLX#Tx:c=5162199223894016&s=6168176664510464&g=5818817137606656&m=5479506668158976&q=6103101559799808


Not the team I would have chosen en masse, but for vast majority of players can see why they are where they are. Puzzled by Watson's presence. Guess the tries he scored outweigh the bloody awful tackling in the points algorithm used.

That looks about right bar maybe Watson...

Not enough Welsh in that team. See the Wales online selection for the most accurate 6 Nations team .

1. Charlie Bennett
2. Bobby Bennett
3. Graham Bennett
4. Derek Bennett
5. Geoff  Bennett
6. Tommy Bennett
7. Trefor Bennett
8. Mervyn Bennett
9. Gareth Bennett
10. Phil Bennett
11.JJ Bennett
12. Ray Bennett
13. Steve Bennett
14. Gerald Bennett
15. JPR Bennett


Clock starts now Saint...bet you cant fill in the surnames in less than 5 mins.

Matthews.
Windsor.
Price.
Bevan.
Pass.
Pass.
Pass.
Davies.
Edwards.
Bennett.
Williams.
Pass
Pass
Davies.
Williams.

I'm not great with players of that era, apart from the obvious ones.

Showing my age now...

Faulkner
Windsor
Price
Quinnell(instead of Allan Martin)
Wheel
David
Evans
Davies
Edwards
Bennett
Williams
Fenwick
Gravell (cant believe you missed these two
Davies
Williams

76 team except for Quinnell (stuck him in the second row)...

Ah Gravell - always thought he was a hooker for some reason :-s. Centre's from that era (apart from Gravell) aren't as often mentioned as the front row, half-backs and back 3 though. Definitely a long time before my time. My dad would have been playing for Hartridge High School, Newport Saracens and Newport Youth back then, and had hair. Don't know if they even owned a working TV to be able to watch these guys either.

Thats funny cos Steve Fenwick was one of my favourite players in the 70's....saw him on a couple of occassions in Dublin...

Marler
Hartley
Cole
AWJ
Gray
Haskell
Warburton
Vunipola
Laidlaw
Ford
Nowell
Roberts
Joseph
Watson
Hogg

Ireland didn't have individual standout players in any one position, but collectively they had the best defence, and ultimately performed as the winning team.

That would be a good combined team. Might even beat Ireland. A once off would be good . Kind of like a final trial for the lions...

LondonTiger wrote:According to Rugby.net stats system the best team with runner up in brackets is:

Marler 1269 (McGrath 1130)
Best 830 (Hartley 734)
Cole 1259 (Ross 1134)
POC 1255 (Maestri 1068)
AWJ 1169 (Gray 1129)
POM 1226 (Haskell 1133)
Robshaw 1479 Warburton (1192)
Vunipola 2050 (Faletau 1462)
Murray 1392 (Youngs 1312)
Ford 2300 (Biggar 1361)
Nowell 1319 (Williams 1053)
Henshaw 1311 (JD2 1124, Roberts 878)
Joseph 1648 (Payne 1293)
Watson 1109 (Bowe 1010)
Hogg 1075 (1/2p 901)

http://www.rugby.net/s/voALLlvqKLX#Tx:c=5162199223894016&s=6168176664510464&g=5818817137606656&m=5479506668158976&q=6103101559799808


Not the team I would have chosen en masse, but for vast majority of players can see why they are where they are. Puzzled by Watson's presence. Guess the tries he scored outweigh the bloody awful tackling in the points algorithm used.

Maybe this is how they should select the Lions squad and team. Here you go, here's the team, no go and coach them. A much more objective method which completely removes the bias. And much 'nicer' to be able to blame the algorithm for a series loss (if it happens) rather than the coach!

Actually, the computer could also do a mail merge and send the invite letters to the players. That would save a bit on administration too!

LondonTiger wrote:According to Rugby.net stats system the best team with runner up in brackets is:

Marler 1269 (McGrath 1130)
Best 830 (Hartley 734)
Cole 1259 (Ross 1134)
POC 1255 (Maestri 1068)
AWJ 1169 (Gray 1129)
POM 1226 (Haskell 1133)
Robshaw 1479 Warburton (1192)
Vunipola 2050 (Faletau 1462)
Murray 1392 (Youngs 1312)
Ford 2300 (Biggar 1361)
Nowell 1319 (Williams 1053)
Henshaw 1311 (JD2 1124, Roberts 878)
Joseph 1648 (Payne 1293)
Watson 1109 (Bowe 1010)
Hogg 1075 (1/2p 901)

http://www.rugby.net/s/voALLlvqKLX#Tx:c=5162199223894016&s=6168176664510464&g=5818817137606656&m=5479506668158976&q=6103101559799808


Not the team I would have chosen en masse, but for vast majority of players can see why they are where they are. Puzzled by Watson's presence. Guess the tries he scored outweigh the bloody awful tackling in the points algorithm used.

One of the better 'statistics' based teams. Slightly surprised to see Billy V so far ahead of anyone else at 8, as while he has been consistently good, I don't recall too much that was great.

However, the only real clunk in there is Watson - yes the lad has got pace and elusiveness, but he needs to work on his one-on-one tackling and on his decision making. Tried to force a pass or off-load a few times too often resulting in losing the ball in contact. Surely there has been a better right winger

Bad year for hookers I guess with how low Bests score is and he still tops it.

yappysnap wrote:Bad year for hookers I guess with how low Bests score is and he still tops it.

I think Baldwin has stepped up to the mark these last few games and combines well with Charteris.

dummy_half wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:According to Rugby.net stats system the best team with runner up in brackets is:

Marler 1269 (McGrath 1130)
Best 830 (Hartley 734)
Cole 1259 (Ross 1134)
POC 1255 (Maestri 1068)
AWJ 1169 (Gray 1129)
POM 1226 (Haskell 1133)
Robshaw 1479 Warburton (1192)
Vunipola 2050 (Faletau 1462)
Murray 1392 (Youngs 1312)
Ford 2300 (Biggar 1361)
Nowell 1319 (Williams 1053)
Henshaw 1311 (JD2 1124, Roberts 878)
Joseph 1648 (Payne 1293)
Watson 1109 (Bowe 1010)
Hogg 1075 (1/2p 901)

http://www.rugby.net/s/voALLlvqKLX#Tx:c=5162199223894016&s=6168176664510464&g=5818817137606656&m=5479506668158976&q=6103101559799808


Not the team I would have chosen en masse, but for vast majority of players can see why they are where they are. Puzzled by Watson's presence. Guess the tries he scored outweigh the bloody awful tackling in the points algorithm used.

One of the better 'statistics' based teams. Slightly surprised to see Billy V so far ahead of anyone else at 8, as while he has been consistently good, I don't recall too much that was great.

However, the only real clunk in there is Watson - yes the lad has got pace and elusiveness, but he needs to work on his one-on-one tackling and on his decision making. Tried to force a pass or off-load a few times too often resulting in losing the ball in contact. Surely there has been a better right winger

I was fascinated by this. Can someone with experience of this website surmise what the criteria for scoring 'points' are?

Clearly, I was too generous with Dr Roberts and not complementary enough to Henshaw.

Nice to see Jonny Gray as the third highest rated lock.

dummy_half wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:According to Rugby.net stats system the best team with runner up in brackets is:

Marler 1269 (McGrath 1130)
Best 830 (Hartley 734)
Cole 1259 (Ross 1134)
POC 1255 (Maestri 1068)
AWJ 1169 (Gray 1129)
POM 1226 (Haskell 1133)
Robshaw 1479 Warburton (1192)
Vunipola 2050 (Faletau 1462)
Murray 1392 (Youngs 1312)
Ford 2300 (Biggar 1361)
Nowell 1319 (Williams 1053)
Henshaw 1311 (JD2 1124, Roberts 878)
Joseph 1648 (Payne 1293)
Watson 1109 (Bowe 1010)
Hogg 1075 (1/2p 901)

http://www.rugby.net/s/voALLlvqKLX#Tx:c=5162199223894016&s=6168176664510464&g=5818817137606656&m=5479506668158976&q=6103101559799808


Not the team I would have chosen en masse, but for vast majority of players can see why they are where they are. Puzzled by Watson's presence. Guess the tries he scored outweigh the bloody awful tackling in the points algorithm used.

One of the better 'statistics' based teams. Slightly surprised to see Billy V so far ahead of anyone else at 8, as while he has been consistently good, I don't recall too much that was great.

However, the only real clunk in there is Watson - yes the lad has got pace and elusiveness, but he needs to work on his one-on-one tackling and on his decision making. Tried to force a pass or off-load a few times too often resulting in losing the ball in contact. Surely there has been a better right winger

Billy's work rate is surprisingly high - he played the full 80 mins every game (I think). I think he made the most carries in the tournament, 2 tries, did his fair share in terms of tackles too. Plus holding people up and smashing people.


http://www.rugbyworld.com/countries/england-countries/six-nations-player-analysis-billy-vunipola-england-44095

This is nice analysis.

I would go with

Marler
Best
Cole
POC
AWJ
POM
Warbs
Vunipola
Murray
Ford (just because he played all games)
Williams
Henshaw
Joseph
Nowell
Hogg

Marler (McGrath)
Baldwin (Best)
Cole (Ross)
POC (J Gray)
AWJ (Charteris)
Robshaw (POM)
Warburton (Dusatoir)
Vunipola (Faletau)
Murray (Youngs)
Sexton (Ford)
Joseph (Venditti)
Roberts (Biggar)
Henshaw (JD2)
Huget (North)
Hogg (Halfpenny)

1st (2nd) team of the tournament for me, didnt include subs as that would change it again...

The Saint wrote:

majesticimperialman wrote:I think i would have Robshaw in stead of Warburton. Warburton was quite untill the last game really. Robshaw made about the most tackles of any player in the tournament.

You can't have paid any attention to Wales games if you believe Warburton was quiet until the last game, or you're just being a prize plum as per. Stats-man may well have made the most tackles, but aren't us Welsh continuously told that in itself isn't good enough and it is why Lydiate is so poor?  

He didn't say quiet, he said quite and probably missed out the brilliant after it.

A better way of doing it would be to average the points over the games played as long as it was more than one. If they played 60 minutes, it counts as .75 of a game.

Very good players are excluded due to being injured therefore only playing say three games.

Lawes has to be there, even if it is only for that one tackle, that was worth 1000 points on it's own.

1. Marler
2. Ghiraldini
3. Cole
4. POC
5. AWJ
6. Robshaw
7. Warburton
8. Vunipola

9. Murray
10. Sexton
11. Venditti
12. Roberts
13. JD 2
14. Joseph
15. Hogg

Perhaps not everyone in their starting positions, but I have tried to pick players who for club or country could fill into these positions.

ruggerradge Sexton really? He had an absolute shocker vs Wales. Plus didn't play in every game.

Ford had a poor game vs Ireland but he did start every match and was good in the rest of the matches.

beshocked wrote:ruggerradge Sexton really? He had an absolute shocker vs Wales. Plus didn't play in every game.

Ford had a poor game vs Ireland but he did start every match and was good in the rest of the matches.

I was at Murrayfield on Saturday and Sexton bossed his forwards with cool authority and picked out backline apart. Not a major feat I appreciate but he was very good apart from his shocker against Wales.

On aggregate IMO he was the best fly half. Followed closely by Biggar who was very good too.

Ford IMO comes in 3rd. He didn't play badly. In fact I think he was very good and very consistent. I just feel that Sexton and Bigger played much better over the course of the entire tournament. Certainly in defence Sexton and Biggar both made telling contributions.

For what it's worth I think Robshaw should win player of the tournament.

Ruggerradge completely disagree.

I have criticised Ford a lot for his performance against Ireland (though he wasn't helped by his poorly performing pack or fellow half back and ineffectual centres) but bar that match he did boss proceedings.

He outplayed Biggar in Wales. Ran proceedings well vs the Scots,Italy and France.

Top points scorer was Ford. Two tries too.

Biggar unfortunately loses credit because he's not the first choice kicker for Wales.


Player of the tournament is a tough one - bit biased but I would say Billy Vunipola - one of the only Englishman to hold his head up high vs Ireland, powerful performances vs Scotland,Italy and France, bit quiet vs Wales but still racked up a pretty good tackle count.

In a break with tradition I actually agree completely with the OP's proposition for team of the tournament. Closest call for me would be whether to put Cole or Ross at tighthead.

I'd probably give player of the tournament to POC. I'm sentimental like that.