West Indies/England - Player Ratings

In ode to CF..... here is my player ratings from the recent series.

West Indies

Kraigg Brathwaite - 8 - wonderful hundred in the 2nd test that really should've seen his side get a draw, and a few other starts. Got a few beauties from Jimmy which happens as an opener - but one with real potential here.

Devon Smith - 2 - absolutely hopeless

Shai Hope - 5 - Tough to make your debut in the final game, looked a little out of place but from what I read he isn't an opener so put into a tough situation.

Darren Bravo - 8 - a couple of fifties in the series, obviously the last one was a magnificent innings in a high pressure situation. When he applies himself he is a really classy player.

Marlon Samuels - 7 - great hundred in the 2nd test, other than that a few starts when you'd hoped he would make them big uns. Gets a slight bump for the salute!

Shiv Chanderpaul - 3 - looks like one series to far for one of the all time greats - maybe the last we've seen of him in the test area unforunately.

Jermaine Blackwood - 9 - Excellent series, a brilliant 1st and 3rd test for the youngster who looks to have good match awareness (will hit out if needed, or dig in both shown in the 3rd test). Needs to cut out the rush of blood moments, but he's young so naturally will do. Exceptional fielder also.

Denesh Ramdin - 5 - a real battling innings to help save the 1st test but that was it with the bat, and his captaincy leaves a lot to be desired. 

Jason Holder - 8 - the hundred in the 1st test was the innings of the series, truly magnificent. Struggled with penetration with the ball until the 3rd test when he bowled beautifully - another one with a mature head on young shoulders with some real potential.

Jerome Taylor - 9 - the best bowler of the series for me, set the tone with the new ball everytime with some memorable spells of swing bowling. If he'd have been fit for the 2nd test I think the WIndies would've won the series. 

Shannon Gabriel - 7 - bowled with good pace and discipline on the whole, although he isn't the most threatening bowler ever. Good series for him however.

Kemar Roach - 3 - looks a shadow of the bowler who gave Bairstow fits last time they were over here, maybe one injury too far?

Sulieman Benn - 1 - awful, just awful

Devendra Bishoo - 5 - bowled ok in his one test, but doesn't look like a viable long term option to me

V Permaul - 5 - like Bishoo bowled ok in his one test, but again struggle to see him sticking for a long time.



England


Alastair Cook - 8 - a good series for Captain Cook, glad to see him recapture some sort of form with the bat, and I thought he actually captained the side well. Promising series heading into a crucial summer for his career.

Jonathan Trott - 3 - I'd have loved to have seen him bring back the old days, but unfortunately this seems like the end of the road for a really good England player. A real shame.

Gary Ballance - 9 - hundred in the 1st test and a pair of fifties in the 2nd test - Ballance looks a real gem of a player, one that could hold that number 3 position for a long time to come. Love me some Gary Ballance I do

Ian Bell - 5 - hundred in the 1st innings of the tour, then just 12 runs in the final four innings. Not good enough for an experienced player, needs to do better.

Joe Root - 9 - couple of fifties in the 1st test and a wonderful hundred in the 2nd test - again like Ballance looks a gem of a player and one to be in the side for a decade to come. Bowled really well as well 

Ben Stokes - 6 - a good fifty in the 1st innings of the tour, then failed to make the most of some 20's/30's in the other innings. Bowled well without the reward I thought, which is obviously a little bit of a worry. Not a bad tour, but not a good one either.

Jos Buttler - 6 - fifty in the 1st test, then left stranded with the tail when batting at 8, tough to judge his batting when not given much responsibility really. On the whole kept well, barring the missed stumping in the 3rd test. Like Stokes not a bad tour, but not a good one either.

Chris Jordan - 5 - I do like Chris Jordan, but 6 wickets in 6 innings isn't really good enough for a 3rd seamer who doesn't really contribute with the bat (the odd 10/15 runs isn't contributing). Yes he is an excellent fielder, but you don't pick bowlers in the international scene because they can catch. Place under severe threat imo.

Stuart Broad - 6 - about as Stuart Broad a series as possible to have with the ball. At times he looked a world beater, others a mere county bowler. He gets marked down a point to a 6 because his batting is an absolute abomination.

James Anderson - 9 - wonderful series for Jimmy, match winning spell in the 2nd test and a 6 for in the 3rd test. It gives me cold sweats to think how impotent we'd be in he got injured. 

James Tredwell - 6 - bowled well 1st innings of the 1st test, but was a let down 2nd time around (when needed to bowl WIndies out). Not the answer going forward in tests going forward imo, should stick to the ODI's.

Moeen Ali - 6 - bowled ok in the 2nd test, and got a fifty in the 3rd (before being run out) - but unfortunately for Moeen the poor bowling in the 3rd test will be what this series is remembered for for himself. I wonder how smart it was to chuck him into the 2nd test with very little cricket after an injury - England need to manage there players better than this (and didn't learn from what they did with Ballance going into the world cup)


A word for Phil Simmons the new WIndies coach also - looks to have installed some real resolve into this young side already, a promising start to his reign as the West Indies coach.

Olly - think you're pretty much on the money there (which makes it fundamentally different from any ratings CF conjured up!). I might quibble by 1 point here and there but that's inevitable.

A few random comments below.

Thought you were a bit tough on Bishoo. Put in a massive amount of work on his return to Test cricket and got a reasonable return. 6 for me.

Whilst Ramdin's use and over use of certain bowlers seemed crazy at times, the West Indies are for the first time in a long while playing as a team rather than a mish mash of disjointed individuals. Simmons certainly deserves credit for that as you say but perhaps so also does the captain. Also, Ramdin pouched some decent chances - an excellent and incredibly important one to get Cook at the very of day one in the last Test. Again a 6 for me.

Thought you were kind but also fair and accurate with Hope. Very few runs on debut but he didn't easily surrender his wicket second dig (when I was watching him). Hung in there to see out the opening spells of Anderson & Broad which increased English doubts. Agree with you on 5. CF would have given him 1.

I thought that in Australia Stokes flattered to deceive and produced his best performances when it didn't really matter. Did little to change matches or my opinion. A 5.

Root and Ballance a bit high considering they both failed in both innings in the 3rd test, Ali is also far too high, a 3 would be more fitting.

Cook 6
Trott 2
Ballance 7
Bell 5
Root 7.5
Stokes 5
Buttler 6
Ali 4
Jordan 4
Broad 6
Anderson 8
Treadwell 5

West Indies
Kraigg Brathwaite 6. After Chanderpaul, he's their best with the bat, and judging by those standards, Brathwaite didn't quite deliver. That hundred was brilliant, but then he didn't add too many more, and even had thrown away a start with a bit of a reckless shots. He's a player I hold in very high regard, and the expectations are also high, not quite there though he did OK.
Devon Smith 2. A decent innings and then the usual Smith garbage, the selectors have to be marked a couple down for picking him in the first place.
Shai Hope 3. Yes it was his debut, yes he was batting out of position, yes he's not much experienced in FC cricket, yes he is young and upcoming. But He really didn't score any runs, the points are for trying to stick around in the 2nd innings....... Perhaps he should bat up the order for his domestic side from now on. Or perhaps Gayle would return for the Australia series, and sooner rather than later, an opening will come up in the middle order when Chanderpaul goes.
Darren Bravo 7. Too many unconverted starts, but the last innings of the series was so very important, came on a lively track, under serious pressure situation.
Marlon Samuels 5. There was that hundred but then nothing else other than some atrocious moments of brain freeze that shouldn't come from a senior player. Bowled a lot of overs, but contrary to the belief of skipper Ramdin, he's notthe the Caribbean Murali!.
Shivnarine Chanderpaul 4 A few starts, but Chanderpaul was not even a shadow of the player he has been till last year. I don't know whether this is the end for him, but it can't be too far away.
Jermaine Blackwood 8. He was fantastic in the first and final tests, there are a few technical issues but he's got a fine temperament and is a very positive player. He does need to learn from those rush of blood moments that makes him look stupid at times, the 2nd innings in the first test was a particularly bad one for which I mark him 1 down.
Denesh Ramdin 5. Played a crucial innings in the context of the seris and showed a bit of stickability. His keeping was decent as well. But as an onfield captain, he was absolutely dreadful, his bowling changes were downright stupid at times!. But as Guildford hinted above, he should also be given a bit of credit in ensuring the squad stays together as a unit.
Jason Holder 7. There was that hundred in the first test, and then his bowling eventually ame to the party in the 3rd. But his bowling wasn't sharp enough for a 3rd seamer. He does have the attributes to be a decent all-rounder, but there is a fair few way to cover.......
Kemar Roach 4. Roach was just about alright in the first test, bowling a couple of testing spells, but he was nowhere near his best throughout the 2 tests. He needs to get a lot more overs under his belt to reach top form, and then make sure he does stay on the park after that. His batting was crucial in the larger context of the series as he helped save the first test.
Jerome Taylor 8. Taylor was always brilliant with the new ball, always made it talk, always got wickets with it. Couldn't work the same magic with the old one consistently, though the pitch for the first test gave him absolutely nothing to work with. Has to stay fit.......
Shanon Gabriel 6 Gabriel has got some pace in him, and he tested some of the English batsmen with the same, Jonathan Trott in particular, not quite coming through there. But there is not much else to him as a bowler, and though he had an OK series here, think if Roach is fit, then he should start the Australia series.
Suleiman Benn 1. Benn was awful in the first test, and offered nothing with the bat or on the field.
Devendra Bishoo 6. He was the best West Indies bowler in the test he played, though he nothing extraordinary. Showed good attitude with the bat as well, it was a shame he got injured after that, think he would have made a greater impact than Permaul on that 3rd test track.
Veerasamy Permaul 5. Did a very handy job in the 2nd innings of the only test he played.

England
Alastair Cook 7. Made some runs at last, the hundred in the 3rd test was a pretty good effort. His on field captaincy has also improved. Said that, he's been party to some of the questionable selections, Ali and Trott in particular, and England will have to have positive results for Cook to be able to stay on.......
Jonathan Trott 2. It was a doubtful selection to start with, and Trott never really looked comfortable in the middle. He has taken out any decision from the selectors/management and has retired from international cricket. A good player who offered a lot to English cricket, but never looked that player in this series and he has decided that is the moment.
Gary Ballance 8. Made runs in the first 2 games. Need to convert those into big hundreds and his failure in the 3rd test on a demanding track would not do much to views that he has to prove against quality attacks in challenging conditions. But for the here and now, he's done really well.
Ian Bell 4. A good start and then absolutely nothing. Poor series for a senior player.
Joe Root 9. Looks England's best batsman by a long way. Even in the 3rd test, he was batting so well in the first innings and in a different tempo as well, so it came a bit of a shock when he got out. Bowled pretty well, much better than Moeen Ali.......
Ben Stokes 6. A good innings, a couple of start with the bat. A wicket here a wicket there with the ball. But Stokes did bowl better than his number of wickets for the series suggests, but he has to strive for more consistency.
Jose Buttler 6. Wasn't really given enough responsibility with the bat as even Ali was batted ahead of him. Did playe a good hand with the bat at times and his keeping was alright up to that moment when he missed Blackwood.
Moeen Ali 4. Ali is in the side as England's frontline spinner. But he was far too inconsistent, bowled some real garbage and offered no real control or threat. His 50 in the 3rd test was stylish and good and he played the short ball well, but that is not his primary responsibility.
Chris Jordan 4. Hasn't taken enough wickets and offered not much with the bat. His catching is good, but with not enough wickets or no real control with the ball, think England will have to start looking at other options and let Jordan work a bit more on his bowling.......
Stuart Broad 5. A couple of decent spells mixed with a few absolutely terrible ones. His batting, ones so promising, now can give Chris Martin a pretty decent run for the money.
James Anderson 9. England's best bowler by a country mile. Decisive in the 2nd test win, bowled pretty well in the 3rd test as well. Showed good attitude with the bat for a number 11.

I am not really keen on "marks out of ten " for cricketers (plenty of different stats already in this sport !) ; but over a series makes more sense than per match...and it makes for discussions.
Actually lean towards msp's ratings - reckon you're a bit generous , Olly - not that that is a sin...
Would quibble on a couple of points though : Moeen a four might be OK ; but to say that making a good fifty is not his primary responsibility ? If he's batting at six , it surely is...
And I think you might be treating Stokes a bit better than he deserves : don't get me wrong , I like him - but I think even he would be a little disappointed with his returns.
I'd also consider making Taylor a 9 ...his bowling on unhelpful pitches was good - though perhaps his overall figures profited from missing the Grenada pudding...

alfie wrote:I am not really keen on "marks out of ten " for cricketers (plenty of different stats already in this sport !) ; but over a series makes more sense than per match...and it makes for discussions.
Actually lean towards msp's ratings - reckon you're a bit generous , Olly  - not that that is a sin...
Would quibble on a couple of points though : Moeen a four might be OK ; but to say that making a good fifty is not his primary responsibility ? If he's batting at six , it surely is...
And I think you might be treating Stokes a bit better than he deserves : don't get me wrong , I like him - but I think even he would be a little disappointed with his returns.
I'd also consider making Taylor a 9 ...his bowling on unhelpful pitches was good - though perhaps his overall figures profited from missing the Grenada pudding...

Alfie - if you think Olly was ''a bit generous'' here, you should see how ultra kind he was with the Surrey bowlers (his newly adopted county team) in his comments after their first CC outing! His lack of cynicism remains a concern for some of ''the Surrey boys''.

my ratings

ENGLAND

Cook - 7 (returned to form good to see)
Trott - 3 (finished at international level)
Ballance - 10 (350 runs for the series, class act in tests)
Bell - 5 (frustrates again)
Root - 10 ( 358 runs at 59, also bowled well)
Moeen - 4 (poor series with bat and ball)
Buttler - 6 (average with bat and gloves)
Jordan - 7 (unlucky with bat, bowled tightly but needs more wickets)
Tredwell - 7 (bowled well, unlucky to be dropped)
Anderson - 10 (17 wickets in 3 games, and was class)
Broad - 7 (bowled pretty well, but no more than a number 11 with bat)

WINDIES

Brathwaite - 5
Hope - 4 (not convincing, doubt he will last long)
Bravo - 7 (got starts but didn't get a big one)
Samuels - 6 (frustrates with the bat, and offers nothing with the ball)
Shiv - 3 (think his time is coming to an end)
Blackwood - 10 (311 runs at 51, and a real bright spark for the windies)
Ramdin - 6
Holder - 8 (good prospect for the windies future test captain)
D.Smith - 3 (surely his time has gone)
Taylor - 9
Gabriel - 7
Permaul - 6 (inconsistent)
Roach - 5 (looks shattered, needs a rest)
Bishoo - 6
Benn - 4

A warm welcome, Wisden.

Glad to see some realistic support for Jordan. Think you're on the money as well with your 'average' assessment of Buttler - we probably just have to be patient there for now but not too long for such an important role.

Not sure how Jordan can be deemed unlucky with the bat and Buttler average. Buttler would have scored a lot more runs had the tail been able to hang around with him.

LondonTiger wrote:Not sure how Jordan can be deemed unlucky with the bat and Buttler average. Buttler would have scored a lot more runs had the tail been able to hang around with him.

More a general theme for me of Jordan reviving glimpses of the potential he hinted at when at the Oval and which seemed lost forever whilst Buttler hasn't properly stepped up to the next level with either gloves or bat which is so necessary for England success.

Btw, to be well balanced you don't need a chip on each shoulder.

Wisden's high ratings remind me of a certain cricketfan90's?

LondonTiger wrote:Not sure how Jordan can be deemed unlucky with the bat and Buttler average. Buttler would have scored a lot more runs had the tail been able to hang around with him.

Therein lies the problem, Buttler should be controlling the strike better than he is, it's something Prior was brilliant at, he would regularly at his best add 30-40 runs with the tail.

Wilsden doesn't even rate Stokes

Hammersmith harrier wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:Not sure how Jordan can be deemed unlucky with the bat and Buttler average. Buttler would have scored a lot more runs had the tail been able to hang around with him.

Therein lies the problem, Buttler should be controlling the strike better than he is, it's something Prior was brilliant at, he would regularly at his best add 30-40 runs with the tail.

To be fair to Buttler, Prior had a much better tail. Right now England have Broad who looks like he has forgotten how to hold a bat.

Stella wrote:Wisden's high ratings remind me of a certain cricketfan90's?

who's that?? Is it a bad thing..??

wisden wrote:

Stella wrote:Wisden's high ratings remind me of a certain cricketfan90's?

who's that?? Is it a bad thing..??

Not at all.

PaulHv2 wrote:

Hammersmith harrier wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:Not sure how Jordan can be deemed unlucky with the bat and Buttler average. Buttler would have scored a lot more runs had the tail been able to hang around with him.

Therein lies the problem, Buttler should be controlling the strike better than he is, it's something Prior was brilliant at, he would regularly at his best add 30-40 runs with the tail.

To be fair to Buttler, Prior had a much better tail. Right now England have Broad who looks like he has forgotten how to hold a bat.

I wouldn't agree with that really; Prior had Swann, Broad and Anderson whereas Buttler has Broad and Anderson, the backing line up is apparently meant to be stronger down the order than it was before.

Prior had Swann who could bat, Bresnan at times, who again could bat, and Broad who too could bat.
Buttler has Jordan who it is said can bat but hasn't done at the top, Broad who has forgotten how to hold a bat, and Anderson, the only semi decent hang around guy in the lot........ And for some strange reasons, they have Buttler batting at 8 that is obnoxious.......

msp83 wrote:West Indies
Kraigg Brathwaite 6. After Chanderpaul, he's their best with the bat, and judging by those standards, Brathwaite didn't quite deliver. That hundred was brilliant, but then he didn't add too many more, and even had thrown away a start with a bit of a reckless shots. He's a player I hold in very high regard, and the expectations are also high, not quite there though he did OK.
Devon Smith 2. A decent innings and then the usual Smith garbage, the selectors have to be marked a couple down for picking him in the first place.
Shai Hope 3. Yes it was his debut, yes he was batting out of position, yes he's not much experienced in FC cricket, yes he is young and upcoming. But He really didn't score any runs, the points are for trying to stick around in the 2nd innings....... Perhaps he should bat up the order for his domestic side from now on. Or perhaps Gayle would return for the Australia series, and sooner rather than later, an opening will come up in the middle order when Chanderpaul goes.
Darren Bravo 7. Too many unconverted starts, but the last innings of the series was so very important, came on a lively track, under serious pressure situation.
Marlon Samuels 5. There was that hundred but then nothing else other than some atrocious moments of brain freeze that shouldn't come from a senior player. Bowled a lot of overs, but contrary to the belief of skipper Ramdin, he's notthe the Caribbean Murali!.
Shivnarine Chanderpaul 4 A few starts, but Chanderpaul was not even a shadow of the player he has been till last year. I don't know whether this is the end for him, but it can't be too far away.
Jermaine Blackwood 8. He was fantastic in the first and final tests, there are a few technical issues but he's got a fine temperament and is a very positive player. He does need to learn from those rush of blood moments that makes him look stupid at times, the 2nd innings in the first test was a particularly bad one for which I mark him 1 down.
Denesh Ramdin 5. Played a crucial innings in the context of the seris and showed a bit of stickability. His keeping was decent as well. But as an onfield captain, he was absolutely dreadful, his bowling changes were downright stupid at times!. But as Guildford hinted above, he should also be given a bit of credit in ensuring the squad stays together as a unit.
Jason Holder 7. There was that hundred in the first test, and then his bowling eventually ame to the party in the 3rd. But his bowling wasn't sharp enough for a 3rd seamer. He does have the attributes to be a decent all-rounder, but there is a fair few way to cover.......
Kemar Roach 4. Roach was just about alright in the first test, bowling a couple of testing spells, but he was nowhere near his best throughout the 2 tests. He needs to get a lot more overs under his belt to reach top form, and then make sure he does stay on the park after that. His batting was crucial in the larger context of the series as he helped save the first test.
Jerome Taylor 8. Taylor was always brilliant with the new ball, always made it talk, always got wickets with it. Couldn't work the same magic with the old one consistently, though the pitch for the first test gave him absolutely nothing to work with. Has to stay fit.......
Shanon Gabriel 6 Gabriel has got some pace in him, and he tested some of the English batsmen with the same, Jonathan Trott in particular, not quite coming through there. But there is not much else to him as a bowler, and though he had an OK series here, think if Roach is fit, then he should start the Australia series.
Suleiman Benn 1. Benn was awful in the first test, and offered nothing with the bat or on the field.
Devendra Bishoo 6. He was the best West Indies bowler in the test he played, though he nothing extraordinary. Showed good attitude with the bat as well, it was a shame he got injured after that, think he would have made a greater impact than Permaul on that 3rd test track.
Veerasamy Permaul 5. Did a very handy job in the 2nd innings of the only test he played.

Why would you have Chris Gayle anywhere near a Test side? This is not the IPL.

To be fair, Gayle is a cracking Test player when he wants to be. At the very least he's better than Smith.

He wasa pretty decent player up and until 2012. But his fitness levels now are frankly appalling, he can't bat or field for more than 2 hours and his batting these days is just block or slog and his attitude towards Test cricket is rather distasteful.

Gayle won't play another test again, im 100% sure of that...time for windies to move on... Brathwaite looks a solid player, but the other opening position is a problem... where's Kieron Powell these days?

Is that you, CF90? Your ratings and the comments accompanying it are exactly the same to what you've posted on another site.

who is CF90? Im confused...

If Devon Smith is the alternative, I'd anyday have Gayle instead!. And Gayle still averages above 40 in test cricket. He didn't do anything useful in recent tests, but along with Brathwaite, he's still miles better as an opener than other options that the West Indies have got. And after the WC, he did make it clear that he's available for all formats for the West Indies.
Kieran Powell is more in the Devon Smith mold, Not really international class.
Hope Gayle will be back for the Australia series.

msp83 wrote:If Devon Smith is the alternative, I'd anyday have Gayle instead!. And Gayle still averages above 40 in test cricket. He didn't do anything useful in recent tests, but along with Brathwaite, he's still miles better as an opener than other options that the West Indies have got. And after the WC, he did make it clear that he's available for all formats for the West Indies.
Kieran Powell is more in the Devon Smith mold, Not really international class.
Hope Gayle will be back for the Australia series.

Yep, precisely why he played the England series... oh wait he didn't. Must have been injured, I guess...... Oh Wait!!

Kieran Powell was quite decent in 2012 and comfortably outperformed the IPHell mercenary in the 2013 ODI series in Australia. He has had some personal issues because of which he has gone off the boil a bit but the lad has talent. Hope he sorts his issues out and comes back.

Now that we have been talking about Kieran Powell, I just had a look at his cricinfo profile. Interestingly, he was playing cricket in Sri Lanka when the West Indies domestic season was on. Has he made himself unavailable for West Indies selection altogether?

Just like Chris Gayle playing in a corrupt T20 league when he could be playing Tests for WI?

Well, this seems to be different Shanky, he wasn't playing in an IPL like T-20 league, he was playing FC cricket for Tamil Union. This was when the restructured FC tournament was going on in the Caribbean. He had a go at the cricket director and selectors before that.