Cotto v Canelo 155 its on

This fight will take place some time on November. Canelo coming down again to 155 which is pushing it.

See Cotto winning this one on points.

I think Canelo wins a close decision.

Should be a great mix of styles.................

Hoping Canelo can break him down.......Cotto has had a few wars and isn't getting younger..

Alvarez by ko 11............

Canelo breaks him into little pieces

Think Cotto will be competitive. I would guess Canelo 7-5 or maybe 8-4. Both guys looked good in their last fights.

If there is a stoppage it will definitely be for Canelo.

Utter embarassing mess.

You think Canelo wins easily Tophat??

Perhaps I'm giving the Miguel too much credit. He has been matched rather well.

TopHat24/7 wrote:Utter embarassing mess.

I'll take a good fight whatever the catchweight..

ONETWOFOREVER wrote:This fight will take place some time on November. Canelo coming down again to 155 which is pushing it.

See Cotto winning this one on points.

Canelo coming down??!

He hasn't ever fought above 154 and is only 24 yrs old so should hardly be struggling to 'boil down' to LMW - especially since he was a WW only a few years ago.

Cotto's the smarter, quicker, better fighter. He can earn a decision here.

I did think this Haz but side with Canelo, because of his youth and size.

Good fight but should be at 160 or come down to 154.

Think we'd all pick a younger Cotto..

Has he got 12 good rounds in the tank is the question....

I don't think he has..

Think I actually give Cotto a go here. I still don't like him, but Canelo has a fight on his hands.

This has got to be the biggest fight in boxing at the moment hasn't it, except from heavyweights of course. Two big names in good form and split as close to 50/50 as you can get in boxing

Cotto is more experienced, is the more fluid boxer, has the better footwork, head movement and better left hook

Canelo is younger, physically stronger, better chin, throws the better combinations and has equal big power in both hands

Don't think any one of them have a power, handspeed advantage and neither are exactly known for their high stamina/punch output, they seem pretty equal for me it's how Canelo can get him to trade and wear down Cotto who although looks very strong has been in a lot of wars and even in his prime had a tendency to tire late. Feel this could be a battle of body punches and who tires first as both are lethal when they dig to the body

Feel Canelo will either stop cotto in the 11th or will be the stronger down the stretch and win a close competitive points win, but you can imagine Cotto being ahead by the halfway stage with his boxing skills

and also the weight suits both, Canelo has invented a 155 weight class since Floyd and while Cotto has had catchweights of 157 and 158 he is the naturally smaller man so the higher the weight it actually benefits Canelo more

Cotto is a top class talent, the last time Canelo fought one of those he was made to look clueless.

Canelo being the naturally bigger guy and younger will be offset by Cotto's greater skill.

If Cotto gets his head right I think he can win the fight.

AdamT wrote:I did think this Haz but side with Canelo, because of his youth and size.

Good fight but should be at 160 or come down to 154.

Cotto has looked impressive under Roach: hands high again, stalking steadily and boxing cleverly. Alvarez can be outboxed (he doesn't look the brightest) and Cotto has the ability to mix it up with him when he closes the gap. Hopefully Golovkin can land the winner.

35 years old and had a few pastings...

He's going to have to fight for 12..

That's what I'm looking at..

I still side with Canelo but Cotto has looked similar to his days as a light welter/welter.

It is really a 50/50 fight. Some will side with Cotto, some way Canelo.

None of them beats GGG but have a feeling Cotto would get blasted out quicker than Alveraz.

I definately favour Alvarez to win this. I think he will knock Cotto out.

Cotto has looked sharp enough in his last couple of fights. Maybe enjoying something of a rebirth under Roach. But he has been in with a blatantly shot and a blatantly weight drained fighter in those fights. Alvarez will be big at the weight and too hot to handle for Cotto.

Cotto may be a top-class talent but, naturally enough at his age, he can blow hot and cold these days. This is not an easy fight to predict with any certainty.

I'm aware that it's a dangerous thing to compare results and performances against common opponents, particularly those with a different style altogether, but I'm going to do it anyway. Cotto looked remarkably average against Trout, a good technician but hardly Sugar Ray Leonard, and was deservedly beaten. Alvarez also didn't uproot many trees against the same Trout but found what was necessary for a win which may have been close but was equally merited, in my view. Alvarez basically knows how to dig out wins and his experience against Mayweather shouldn't be a stick with which to beat him. He lost to the outstanding fighter of this millennium but I don't believe that Cotto sets him a challenge that he can't overcome. If pushed, I would expect Canelo to be too young and strong for Cotto and to win a reasonably comfortable points verdict (perhaps 116-112).

Easy win for the young Mexican Saul Alvarez. Miguel Cotto is vastly overrated and has lost every big fight in his career(disreguard the Sergio Martinez fight as the veteran Argentine was a crippled). Alvarez will beat down Cotto and force a stoppage around rounds 9-10.

With Cotto there is always the psychological question, he first wilted in the original Margarito fight and it has happened since in the face of relentless pressure such as in the Pacquiao match.

Then there is the other Cotto that we don't see very often like in the Clottey fight where he fought the majority of the contest with a very bad cut over his eye. Then we saw the good footwork and savvy.

It depends what Cotto turns up and can he avoid falling into his usual trap of going head long at his opponent. As a talent Cotto has it all but he never became the fighter that talent deserved. If Roach can keep him to a game plan I think he is too good for Alverez. If it's a war its a no brainer Canelo wins.

captain carrantuohil wrote:Cotto may be a top-class talent but, naturally enough at his age, he can blow hot and cold these days. This is not an easy fight to predict with any certainty.

I'm aware that it's a dangerous thing to compare results and performances against common opponents, particularly those with a different style altogether, but I'm going to do it anyway. Cotto looked remarkably average against Trout, a good technician but hardly Sugar Ray Leonard, and was deservedly beaten. Alvarez also didn't uproot many trees against the same Trout but found what was necessary for a win which may have been close but was equally merited, in my view. Alvarez basically knows how to dig out wins and his experience against Mayweather shouldn't be a stick with which to beat him. He lost to the outstanding fighter of this millennium but I don't believe that Cotto sets him a challenge that he can't overcome. If pushed, I would expect Canelo to be too young and strong for Cotto and to win a reasonably comfortable points verdict (perhaps 116-112).

If we're comparing opponents, how about each man's performance against Floyd? Cotto fought a canny, tenacious fight; Alvarez looked completely lost. Cotto can outsmart Alvarez and looks physically equipped to last the course. Good fight this.

Good fight and close one to call. Whether misleading or not Cotto seems rejuvenated, never been overly impressed with Canelo (thought he lost to Trout and Lara) and was clueless against Mayweather. I'm edging towards Cotto just but wouldn't be surprised by any outcome.

Cheers, Rodders

hazharrison wrote:

captain carrantuohil wrote:Cotto may be a top-class talent but, naturally enough at his age, he can blow hot and cold these days. This is not an easy fight to predict with any certainty.

I'm aware that it's a dangerous thing to compare results and performances against common opponents, particularly those with a different style altogether, but I'm going to do it anyway. Cotto looked remarkably average against Trout, a good technician but hardly Sugar Ray Leonard, and was deservedly beaten. Alvarez also didn't uproot many trees against the same Trout but found what was necessary for a win which may have been close but was equally merited, in my view. Alvarez basically knows how to dig out wins and his experience against Mayweather shouldn't be a stick with which to beat him. He lost to the outstanding fighter of this millennium but I don't believe that Cotto sets him a challenge that he can't overcome. If pushed, I would expect Canelo to be too young and strong for Cotto and to win a reasonably comfortable points verdict (perhaps 116-112).

If we're comparing opponents, how about each man's performance against Floyd? Cotto fought a canny, tenacious fight; Alvarez looked completely lost. Cotto can outsmart Alvarez and looks physically equipped to last the course. Good fight this.

Going out on a limb there mate..

1. You're being a little patronising making out that Alvarez has learned nothing from Floyd....

2. You can't compare opponents..because styles make fights......Let's compare Curry-Honey.....Curry-Starling...Starling-Honey....

3. Cotto has faded when he was much younger.....In the 2 1/2 years since Trout........He's fought a dead Martinez, a crappy Geale and a stiff...You can't validate the "looks physically equipped line" from that !!.

We know he's an old 35 because of the trouncings he's had..........

We know a 25 year old engine is better than a 35 year old one..

We know Alvarez will pressure him more than anyone in the last two and a half years.........

We know Alvarez has compiled a quality record since Floyd..........

I'd pick a young Graham to beat Brewer everytime............

Always picked Canelo to beat Cotto but this catchweight gives Miguel a better chance. Don't quite see why Alvarez should be made to boil down when it's for the middleweight title and Miguel holds a middleweight belt. Ridiculous really.

Cotto looking much improved under Freddie Roach though, a partnership that seems to bring the best out of Miguel.

The psychological question and whether Cotto will wilt is easy to throw at him but Margaritio had bricks in his fists for that fight, if anything it's a wonder Cotto hung in there as long as he did; some of the residue left over in the Pacquaio fight for me, actually I don't think Miguel wilted in that fight if anything he was a bit unlucky to be stopped against Manny imo.

The catchwweight ruined Alvarez' fight with Floyd for me, it's taken a lot of the shine off this one too but styles make fights and I've always thought Alvarez can win this one, but bit less confident now.

Herman Jaeger wrote:Always picked Canelo to beat Cotto  but this catchweight gives Miguel a better chance. Don't quite see why Alvarez should be made to boil down when it's for the middleweight title and Miguel holds a middleweight belt. Ridiculous really.

I just look at it as name vs. name to be honest. They're both around the same weight naturally so I'm not buying this as a 'who's the best middleweight.' just 'who's the best man on the night'. It's also no disadvantage to Canelo to 'boil down', he's always fought lower than 160.

Herman Jaeger wrote:The psychological question and whether Cotto will wilt is easy to throw at him but Margaritio had bricks in his fists for that fight, if anything it's a wonder Cotto hung in there as long as he did; some of the residue left over in the Pacquaio fight for me, actually I don't think Miguel wilted in that fight if anything he was a bit unlucky to be stopped against Manny imo.

Kind of agree, Cotto certainly deserved to hear the final bell against Manny. Manny was a buzz saw that night and totally cut through Cotto from the 3rd round. Did well to hang in and should have been given the benefit of the doubt to go 12, for me.

Hope Canelo spanks him silly.

Used to like Cotto, can't stand the guy now.

C'mon the ginger!

Can't see much evidence that Canelo will pressure Cotto. Alverez has always picked his punches. Remember he tried to out box Floyd.

What has picking your punches got to do with pressure ??

Canelo does usually prefer to be the one on the back foot and looking for holes, he's a very accurate puncher with quickish hands

But I agree that he will have to replicate the Angulo performance where he held the centre and walked forward, going blow for blow with Angulo who was battered from pillar to post like he had never been before.

I thought he drew with Lara and just nicke dit against Trout, but Cotto is neither of those guys. Both trout and lara are taller then canelo, like to fight on the back foot, like to jab and are awkward southpaws. Cotto is smaller then Canelo, is most effective on the front foot and is orthodox (albeit naturally left handed)

I'm just interested to see how much of the resurgence of Cotto is real, this is probably the best he's looked since pre margarito but as truss and everyone has alluded to since Trout his opposition as been questionable at best.

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:What has picking your punches got to do with pressure ??

He doesn't let his hands go like pressure fighters do. He also doesn't have the tank to fight flat out that's why he doesn't exert a lot of energy and is careful about not throwing too many punches. Alverez is no pressure fighter.

Have you ever seen Azumah Nelson fight....

One of the greatest pressure fighters of alltime..

TRUSSMAN66 wrote:Have you ever seen Azumah Nelson fight....

One of the greatest pressure fighters of alltime..

You comparing Alverez to Zoomy is ridiculous, Nelson had great footwork and ring generalship. He needed a great engine to fight like that. Alverez has feet of stone, is naive and has no tank. Zoomy continually threw punches and they were well chosen which makes him a very special talent.

Ridiculous statement again. Give it up you're a fraud.

I'm not comparing him to Zoomy...

You inferred you have to let your hands go to be a pressure fighter......and Alvarez picks his punches..

I'm saying Nelson was a great pressure fighter that picked his punches..

Nelson wasn't any one thing in particular. One of the many attributes that made him such an outstanding fighter was his ability to adapt, to present a different game plan and to be precisely what his opponent was least comfortable with. Against Fenech, one of his signature performances, he was the consummate counter-puncher, perfectly happy on the ropes, taking very little and crafting those wonderful short left hooks inside onto the Australian's chin almost at will.

Against other fighters, Zoomy did indeed choose to apply pressure but it was intelligent pressure. He certainly didn't throw punches continually, but did so with immense thought, scarcely wasting one and showing his opponent that whatever was thrown at him would be met with an even more withering response. There are more ways than one to apply pressure - the result of Nelson's method was the physical equivalent of what they call zugzwang in chess - any move that you attempt only makes your own position worse. That takes great intelligence and Nelson was one of the great boxing brains that I have ever seen.

Now I would agree that Canelo doesn't remotely approach Nelson in any of these departments. I'm not, however, convinced that he doesn't have a tank - his shots look hurtful enough in the latter stages of 12 rounders to me. I would imagine that making Cotto fight for three minutes of each round must be the Alvarez aim. If he can do that, it will be very difficult for the older man to keep his superior technique functioning for long enough to keep him ahead on the cards.

Excellent summation by Captain..

If you watch Gutierrez, Cabrera and Cowdell....even Whittaker to a lesser extent.......You can see how he forces his opponent to continuously work while he stays in his comfort zone......although Whittaker's boxing on the retreat was a joy to watch....

Mike Mccallum was another one who pressured without seeming to pressure...

Golovkin is a better example of a fighter who exerts strangulating pressure without necessarily flinging himself at an opponent like Ricky Hatton.

Alvarez is more of a sharp-shooter. He's heavy handed and technically good offensively but he's also slow footed and he can be outboxed.

I think Cotto can old man him here. He'll pick his shots and make Alvarez miss.

GGG is a good call...........You feel he's on you all time even when he isn't working..

Chavez made you work more than you wanted ....

Tyson in his early days was a pressure fighter, who picked his punches.

He didn't waste many punches. He stalked forward with his high guard and would use good head movement, then feint often.

Tyson either made his opponent work harder, or go into their shell.

Mike always get the name of a slugger because of his exciting come forward style but there was a lot of thinking done in his early days.

Tyson intimidated his opponents into not working.......Adam..

Different kind of pressure fighter mate..

I don't recall watching Alverez where he has not tried to conserve energy.  He just isn't a high output fighter and he doesn't have the footwork to cut off the ring effectively and keep his opponent under pressure through good movement.  Remember he tried to outbox Floyd even though it had been shown that Mayweather looks decidedly less comfortable when an opponent is throwing a lot of leather at him.

Very accurate fighter, Canelo, however, certainly by comparison with the late vintage Cotto up until his destruction of Martinez and Geale. Getting out of the way is likely to prove a problem for Cotto, who is no longer a greatly elusive target in the ring. Not sure how good Alvarez's footwork is going to need to be.

Mayweather is a better fighter than Alvarez, there's no sense in pretending otherwise. However, he was also considerably more experienced than Canelo, a gap in savvy that was far wider and far more apparent than that between Mayweather and the street-wise Cotto when they fought. If the Kirkland fight is anything to go by, Canelo is improving at what he does best, albeit that he is not suddenly going to become a technical wizard. Cotto, by contrast, despite the recent uptick in hs fortunes, does not strike me as the fighter he was at 140 and in the early days at 147. It would be surprising if it were otherwise, bearing in mind his age. 155 in 2015 seems far more like Alvarez territory to me and I don't quite see how Cotto wins other than by messing the younger man to defeat, a la Hopkins. Old manning him, as someone so accurately put it earlier on this thread. Just think that Alvarez now knows enough not to be hoodwinked so easily.

I would see Cotto's route to victory being good movement, the jab and opportunistic use of the left hook. It would be a mistake for Cotto to stand in front of Alverez and trade shots, this could potentially happen but Roach won't want it to.

AdamT wrote:You think Canelo wins easily Tophat??

Perhaps I'm giving the Miguel too much credit. He has been matched rather well.

I don't even care. It's pathetic. A joke.

A supposed 160 champ who refuses to fight at the weight having a fight with the 154 champ at a 155 catchweight because any lower and it would be a LMW bout. Effing ridiculous.

Have totally gone off Cotto now after all this debacle since he beat the Argie cripple.

Norris fought Taylor at 150 and we didn't care because it was an intriguing match up. .

Not sure some people have forgiven Can for failing against money. .

If this was a straightforward 154 fight, with no strap on the line, I'd be excited by it. As it is, I can't get passed the farce of it all.

Ok.....

To be honest I couldn't care what weight they fight at, it's a fight to look forward to. In fact I'd say it's a must see for a boxing fan.