Ireland v Scotland, 15 August

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IRELAND v SCOTLAND
15 August 2015
KO: 17:00 local
Aviva Stadium, Dublin

Live on Sky Sports at Notch's house

Referee: Pascal Gaüzère (France)
Assistant Referees: [TBC]
TMO: [TBC]

A. Head to Head

130 Played 130
59 Won 66
5 Drawn 5
66 Lost 59
1,416 Points 1,420

B. Recent Form

21 March 2015
BT Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
10 – 40 to Ireland

2 February 2014
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
28 – 6 to Ireland

24 February 2013
Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
12 – 8 to Scotland

10 March 2012
Aviva Stadium, Dublin
32 – 14 to Ireland

6 August 2011
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
10 – 6 to Scotland

27 February 2011
Murrayfield Stadium, Edinburgh
18 – 21 to Ireland

20 March 2010
Croke Park, Dublin
20 – 23 to Scotland

C. Teams

IRELAND

15. Simon Zebo (Cork Constitution/Munster)
14. Tommy Bowe (Belfast Harlequins/Ulster)
13. Jared Payne (Ulster)
12. Gordon D'Arcy (Lansdowne/Leinster)
11. Luke Fitzgerald (Blackrock/Leinster)
10. Ian Madigan (Blackrock/Leinster)
09. Isaac Boss (Terenure/Leinster)

08. Sean O'Brien (UCD/Leinster) capt
07. Chris Henry (Malone/Ulster)
06. Jack Conan (Old Belvedere/Leinster)*
05. Dan Tuohy (Ballymena/Ulster)
04. Devin Toner (Lansdowne/Leinster)
03. Mike Ross (Clontarf/Leinster)
02. Sean Cronin (St Mary's College/Leinster)
01. Dave Kilcoyne (UL Bohemians/Munster)

16. Richardt Strauss (Old Wesley/Leinster)
17. Michael Bent (Dublin University/Leinster)
18. Nathan White (Connacht)*
19. Paul O'Connell (Young Munster/Munster)
20. Jordi Murphy (Lansdowne/Leinster)
21. Eoin Reddan (Old Crescent/Leinster)
22. Paddy Jackson (Dungannon/Ulster)
23. Dave Kearney (Lansdowne/Leinster)

SCOTLAND

15 Ruaridh Jackson  (Wasps)
14 Sean Lamont  (Glasgow  Warriors)  
13 Richie Vernon  (Glasgow  Warriors)  
12 Peter Horne  (Glasgow  Warriors)  
11 Tim Visser  (Harlequins)
10 Greig Tonks  (Edinburgh  Rugby)
09 Henry Pyrgos  CAPTAIN  (Glasgow  Warriors)

01 Ryan Grant  (Glasgow  Warriors)  
02 Fraser Brown  (Glasgow  Warriors)  
03 Jon Welsh  (Newcastle  Falcons)
04 Jim Hamilton  (Saracens)  
05 Grant Gilchrist  (Edinburgh  Rugby)
06 Blair Cowan  (London  Irish)
07 Hugh Blake  (Glasgow  Warriors)
08 David Denton  (Edinburgh  Rugby)  

16 Ross Ford  (Edinburgh  Rugby)
17 Gordon Reid  (Glasgow  Warriors)
18 Mike Cusack  (Glasgow  Warriors)
19 Rob Harley  (Glasgow  Warriors)
20 John Barclay  (Scarlets)  
21 Sam Hidalgo-­Clyne  (Edinburgh  Rugby)
22 Duncan Weir  (Glasgow  Warriors)  
23 Matt  Scott  (Edinburgh  Rugby)

TJ wrote:Irish fans - If we get our guys to let you win will you promise not to break any of our players?  We really can't afford to have any more broken

I'll take that with the rider that if Sexton somehow plays, that the Scots don't go all Basteraud on him. Ditto, Luke "the twig" Fitzgerald - don't even blow on him.

Pot Hale wrote:

TJ wrote:Irish fans - If we get our guys to let you win will you promise not to break any of our players?  We really can't afford to have any more broken

I'll take that with the rider that if Sexton somehow plays, that the Scots don't go all Basteraud on him.   Ditto, Luke "the twig" Fitzgerald - don't even blow on him.

If he plays on the right wing he'll be up against Tim Visser. He should be fine.

George Carlin wrote:I think the fact that Harley is listed as a lock rather suggests that Vern sees Strauss as a blindside too, leaving Denton, Ashe and probably Wilson to scrap for the number 8 shirt.

I think that Beattie has had his chips and quite rightly. He was given all 6N to improve and he didn't.

When Du Preez becomes SQ, it's party time.

I don't think Wilson will make it either. Too lightweight to be the primary ball carrier at 8. He's talented, and I actually quite liked him at 7 for Glasgow. He's good apparently against teams who play above the ground.....

funnyExiledScot wrote:

Pot Hale wrote:

TJ wrote:Irish fans - If we get our guys to let you win will you promise not to break any of our players?  We really can't afford to have any more broken

I'll take that with the rider that if Sexton somehow plays, that the Scots don't go all Basteraud on him.   Ditto, Luke "the twig" Fitzgerald - don't even blow on him.

If he plays on the right wing he'll be up against Tim Visser. He should be fine.

Well if Luke "the twig" Fitzgerald is concerned about a wafe of wind, then he should be worried - very worried - as that is about as hard as McMissers tackles get.....

Riskysports wrote:

funnyExiledScot wrote:

Pot Hale wrote:

TJ wrote:Irish fans - If we get our guys to let you win will you promise not to break any of our players?  We really can't afford to have any more broken

I'll take that with the rider that if Sexton somehow plays, that the Scots don't go all Basteraud on him.   Ditto, Luke "the twig" Fitzgerald - don't even blow on him.

If he plays on the right wing he'll be up against Tim Visser. He should be fine.

Well if Luke "the twig" Fitzgerald is concerned about a wafe of wind, then he should be worried - very worried - as that is about as hard as McMissers tackles get.....

Well to make it safe, probably better to put Andrew Glassfoot Trimble in his place.

Oh no wait, the Welsh already did for him.....

funnyExiledScot wrote:I guess it depends of what constitutes a "bolter". Hardie would be the most obvious "bolter", given that he really has come out of the blue (or black I should say), but would you consider someone like Watson or Jackson to be a "bolter"?

I think if someone like Hughes or Hoyland were to make it, or Dell, then that would be a shock!

I think someone like hardie, Blake, Hoyland would be a real surprise inclusion and if they have performed well in warm up games and trained well, given all the right reasons to be included then I say why not! I think it's important scotland have a lot of confidence going into the WC and play smart positive rugby.

Jackson, Watson would also be bolters to me too despite having some experience already.

RE: Strauss discussion

He is probably my favourite rugby player so I would love to see him in a Scotland Jersey. He is a strong leader too which can only be beneficial for the squad. RDW makes a good point in that he should be carrying water, warming up/down on game days before WC, I hope he is. If he were to not be included that is fine, but we know he can perform.

jimbopip wrote:

asoreleftshoulder wrote:

George Carlin wrote:Irish posters - you'd be perfectly entitled to wonder WTF is going on here.

Unfortunately, if you're a Scotland fan, it all makes perfect sense.

I've lurked on enough Scottish threads to understand what's going on but that reminder of which nickname refers to which player is both hilarious and surprisingly informative and easy to understand.

Mr Shoulder you have , coincidentally, provided a perfect description of Ian Bru (before the Horlicks and Glenmorangie kicks in)

You bloody know it.

Actually that reminds me of my favourite news bulletin from Not The Nine O'Clock News:

Puerto Rican police investigating the main turbine failure which brought the island to a standstill say it was the work of saboteurs.

Apparently they found traces of Horlicks in the donkey.

Henners Piecrust to captain Scotland.

For our cousins across the North Channel, that's Mr Henry Pyrgos, Laird of Kingspan.

25 man squad for the game vs Ireland.

Fowards;
Barclay
Blake
F Brown
Cowan
Cusack
Denton
Dell
Gilchrist
Ryan Grant
Hamilton
Harley
McInally
Reid
Welsh

Backs;
Fife
SHC
Horne
Jackson
Lamont
Pyrgos
Seymour
Tonks
Vernon
Visser
Weir

Re Strauss- at least we have a fair chance of having one fully fit /unbroken player ready for the competition!

So, final XXIII could be

Reid, Brown, Cusack
Hamilton, Gilchrist
Cowan, Denton, Barclay
Pyrgos, Jackson,
Horne, Vernon,
Seymour, Tonks, Visser

Subs – Welsh, McInally, Dell, Harley, Blake, SHC, Weir, S Lamont.

Not horrible, but not great either. Harley still seems to be down as a lock, unfortunately.

cp10 wrote:25 man squad for the game vs Ireland.

Fowards;
Barclay
Blake
F Brown
Cowan
Cusack
Denton
Dell
Gilchrist
Ryan Grant
Hamilton
Harley
McInally
Reid
Welsh

Backs;
Fife
SHC
Horne
Jackson
Lamont
Pyrgos
Seymour
Tonks
Vernon
Visser
Weir

hes clearly going to name v close to if not actually an entire B team.

http://thescotlandteam.com/2015/08/11/scotland-name-squad-to-face-ireland/

Things to note -

Harley is the 3rd second row
Barclay is covering number 8 if anything happens to Denton
Both Horne and Tonks are getting a chance but neither at fly-half
Vernon will be capped at 13. What a guy

Best starting line up possible

Reid, Brown, Cusack, Gilchrist, Hamilton, Harley, Barclay, Denton,
Sam H-C (but it will be Henners), Jackson, Visser, Horne, Vernon, Seymour, Tonks

Backs: Dougie Fife, Sam Hidalgo-Clyne, Peter Horne, Ruaridh Jackson, Sean Lamont, Henry Pyrgos CAPTAIN, Tommy Seymour, Greig Tonks, Richie Vernon, Tim Visser, Duncan Weir.

Forwards: John Barclay, Hugh Blake, Fraser Brown, Blair Cowan, Mike Cusack, David Denton, Allan Dell, Grant Gilchrist, Ryan Grant, Jim Hamilton, Rob Harley, Stuart McInally, Gordon Reid, Jon Welsh.

Pyrgos as captain is an error.

SHC is the form 9 and should be getting game time with Russel but since he isn't selected Jackson will have to do. For the record I'm happier with Pyrgos rather than Laidlaw but SHC should be getting game time.

my team from that lot:

1. Reid
2. McInally
3. Cusack
4. Gilchrist
5. Hamilton
6. Harley
7. Barclay
8. Denton

9. SHC
10. Jackson
11. Visser
12. Horne
13. Vernon
14. Seymore
15. Tonks

However based on VC's selection of Pyrgos it doesn't bode well for me, spider Sense tells me we could get a bit of fisting on Saturday.

Looks like Blake might well get a cap off the bench this weekend, not bad for somebody without a club. Strange situation for him, surely he must know whether he's going to Edinburgh or Glasgow (or elsewhere) next season by now?

Finn is sitting it out

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Pyrgos as captain is an error.

SHC is the form 9

Pyrgos was absolutely superb in the closing stages of the season, especially the final. He played a huge part in that win, orchestrating the forwards, putting Glasgow in the right parts of the pitch and releasing the backs in an effective way. It was a pretty complete scrum-half performance. And he scored a try.

SHC is a very good player, but Pyrgos deserves this.

Like you say not too bad, but we do look skinny in the forwards, but with Strauss and Trigger unavailable and with 4 games to cover that was always going to be a risk. Harley, Barcs and Cowan also offer us a degree of flexibility:

Reid / Grant / Dell
Brown / McInally
Cusack / Welsh
Hamilton
Gilchrist
Cowan / Blake
Harley
Denton / Barclay
Pygros / SHC
Jackson / Weir
Fife / Seymour
Horne
Vernon
Visser / Lamont
Tonks

Captain_Sensible wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Pyrgos as captain is an error.

SHC is the form 9

Pyrgos was absolutely superb in the closing stages of the season, especially the final. He played a huge part in that win, orchestrating the forwards, putting Glasgow in the right parts of the pitch and releasing the backs in an effective way. It was a pretty complete scrum-half performance. And he scored a try.

SHC is a very good player, but Pyrgos deserves this.

I don't necessarily disagree. However SHC has offered something we haven't seen from a Scottish Scrumhalf since Blair or Cusiter's younger years. A real pacey sniping threat from the base of a ruck.

Whether Pyrgos deserves it is immaterial. IMO he isn't the form scrum half at the moment.

Decent squad of players, personally I'm pleased we're holding back our big guns for now.

Ireland fans - you will probably hammer this Scotland team, but we'll score a couple against you with the breakaway and pilfering talent in the pack.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Pyrgos as captain is an error.

SHC is the form 9 and should be getting game time with Russel but since he isn't selected Jackson will have to do. For the record I'm happier with Pyrgos rather than Laidlaw but SHC should be getting game time.

my team from that lot:

1. Reid
2. McInally
3. Cusack
4. Gilchrist
5. Hamilton
6. Harley
7. Barclay
8. Denton

9. SHC
10. Jackson
11. Visser
12. Horne
13. Vernon
14. Seymore
15. Tonks

However based on VC's selection of Pyrgos it doesn't bode well for me, spider Sense tells me we could get a bit of fisting on Saturday.

There's a good chance that will be the team. With all the players not there, I'm still reasonably confident that team would beat USA or Japan.

Captain_Sensible wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Pyrgos as captain is an error.

SHC is the form 9

Pyrgos was absolutely superb in the closing stages of the season, especially the final. He played a huge part in that win, orchestrating the forwards, putting Glasgow in the right parts of the pitch and releasing the backs in an effective way. It was a pretty complete scrum-half performance. And he scored a try.

SHC is a very good player, but Pyrgos deserves this.

+1.

I want to see SHC as much as anyone but Pyrgos will give us shape and control for at least the first 40 minutes, which is what this Scotland team needs. If the game is fecked on the scoreboard by half time (which it might well be against Ireland), then by all means let's get Cowan, Barclay and Blake on the field at the same time and turn the breakdown into murderball.

That's when I want Clyne on the field.

Given that Russell is missing out, I'm fine with Pyrgos starting. H-C and Finn need to play together, but they won't play both the Japan and USA games, meaning a second choice half back pairing is required. I had thought Laidlaw/Jackson, but Pyrgos was excellent last season and finished strongly. No problem with his selection.

My team for Ireland based on that squad:

1.Reid 2.McInally 3.Cusack 4.Hamilton 5.Gilchrist 6.Harley 7.Barclay 8.Denton 9.Pyrgos 10.Jackson 11.Visser 12.Horne 13.Vernon 14.Seymour 15.Tonks

16.Welsh 17.Brown 18.Dell 19.Cowan 20.Blake 21.SH-C 22.Weir 23.Lamont

Front five: exactly what I wanted to see. This looks to me the second choice front 5 to face USA or Japan.

Back-row: Strong and balanced back row. I may be tempted to start with Cowan rather than Barclay, as I see Harley/Cowan/Denton as similarly a likely second choice combination for either USA or Japan, behind Strauss/Barclay/Ashe. The other option could be to look at Barclay at 6 with Cowan at 7. That could be a useful experiment.

Half backs and centres: Again, looks to me like Cotter is weighing up his reserve combination, plus looking at the impact sub capabilities of SH-C and Weir. With Dunbar likely out, and potentially Taylor as well, Horne and Vernon are back-up to Scott/Bennett.

Back three: Interesting to see Tonks at 15, but perhaps they are worried about Maitland recovering and wanted to see how he went as cover there.

Conclusion: this is our second string side and the likely one to face either Japan or USA.

Interesting one. I think there could be a half-decent team there. My choice would be:

Reid, McInally, Cusack, Gilchrist, Hamilton, Barlcay, Cowan, Denton; Pyrgos, Jackson, Visser, Horne, Vernon, Lamont, Tonks

I just can't accept Lamont on the wing. If there's on thing we do face against Japan and USA and that's individual one on one pace. The Japan wingers are rapid and the USA still have Ngwenya who was sharp enough at the last World Cup to make a complete fool of Bryan Habana.

To get Lamont up to that sort of speed we'd need some of those "medics" from the Tour De France, and perhaps ask Gatlin to come in as a consultant with a few of those pink tablets.....

The Irish are too busy peeing their pants with Laughter at the thought of Lamont on the win to even comment

Watching Lamont trying to catch Zebo would be slightly amusing. A more interesting question is whether Lamont could catch Toner over 100 metres. One to ponder.

funnyExiledScot wrote:Watching Lamont trying to catch Zebo would be slightly amusing. A more interesting question is whether Lamont could catch Toner over 100 metres. One to ponder.

He certainly wouldn't be able to catch Sean Cronin.

Captain_Sensible wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Pyrgos as captain is an error.

SHC is the form 9

Pyrgos was absolutely superb in the closing stages of the season, especially the final. He played a huge part in that win, orchestrating the forwards, putting Glasgow in the right parts of the pitch and releasing the backs in an effective way. It was a pretty complete scrum-half performance. And he scored a try.

SHC is a very good player, but Pyrgos deserves this.

+1 Absolutely agree with this. Pyrgos seems to get ignored by fans and coaching staff despite his good form. No he's not as zippy as SHC but he offers more tactically and his service is still probably around 5 times faster than Laidlaw's. In my eyes he offers the best of both worlds, reminds me a bit of Cusiter, but like Cusiter when Blair was off form, Pyrgos has been undeservedly overlooked for too long.

NeilyBroon wrote:

Captain_Sensible wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Pyrgos as captain is an error.

SHC is the form 9

Pyrgos was absolutely superb in the closing stages of the season, especially the final. He played a huge part in that win, orchestrating the forwards, putting Glasgow in the right parts of the pitch and releasing the backs in an effective way. It was a pretty complete scrum-half performance. And he scored a try.

SHC is a very good player, but Pyrgos deserves this.

+1 Absolutely agree with this. Pyrgos seems to get ignored by fans and coaching staff despite his good form. No he's not as zippy as SHC but he offers more tactically and his service is still probably around 5 times faster than Laidlaw's. In my eyes he offers the best of both worlds, reminds me a bit of Cusiter, but like Cusiter when Blair was off form, Pyrgos has been undeservedly overlooked for too long.

I would agree - Pyrgos is certainly nothing flashy but he does everything to a decent level and tends to make good decisions. He passes faster than Laidlaw, can kick, keeps up with play, bosses his forwards quite well, and he looks ratty which is always a good trait in a 9! He did go through a Weir-esque phase of every other kick getting charged down, though he is hopefully over that now.

I would probably take him as the 9 for the USA game with SHC on the bench, SHC starts Japan game with Laidlaw on the bench and then performances hopefully decide that SHC and Pyrgos are better options than Laidlaw!

Also, he's scored a try against the Boks so he must know how to beat them...

Update from the Irish side of things. The following from Irelands press conference being reported in the Irish media today;

1) Andrew Trimble ruled out of Scotland game
2) Martin Moore and Luke Fitzgerald are fit and available though
3) Speculation Dave Kilcoyne will start- makes sense as he's been sent out to face the media. Darren Cave also on media duty- a possible second chance for him?
4) Noel Reid and Rob Herring released back to Leinster and Ulster, seemingly ending their hopes. Tommy O'Donnell will not be replaced after being ruled out of the tournament. 45 becomes 42- Schmidt keeping his options open, and the journos were wrong; they expected between five and seven players to be cut.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:The Irish are too busy peeing their pants with Laughter at the thought of Lamont on the win to even comment

Mike Ross is being lined up as his direct opponent on our wing to make it a fair match

Hmm revised complete uninformed guess at Ireland team after today's slightly helpful update:


1 Kilcoyne
2 Cronin
3 Moore
4. O'Connell
5. Ryan
6 O'Mahony
7 Henry
8 Murphy
9 Marmion
10 Madigan
11 Fitzgerald
12 Cave
13 Earls
14 D Kearney
15 Zebo

Strauss, Bent, McGrath, Toner, Henderson, Boss, Jackson, Jones

Wonder if Schmidt will try out the utility players in different positions?

Is this the last chance saloon for Madigan, Notch?

No, not at all. With a probable 17/14 split and only 3 players who can play 10 in the 42-man squad he seems certain to be included in the final cut. I thought he looked good coming on at 12 against Wales, even if they defended terribly, and he can expect some more game time at inside centre over the next few weeks, and at out half too of course.

SHC will get decent gametime I would think. Henners / SHC - both in great form Henners offers a little more control, SHC the higher risk option. Happy with the selection.

Looking at the Scotland squad there are a couple of things that catch my eye.

Only one full back: Tonks

Only two centres: Horne-Richie V

Only one 6: Big Bad Bob

Only two second rows: Hagrid and the broken one.



This would suggest to me that they will play the whole game, not to give them a Death or Glory audition, but to actually give them game time for the tournament.

If NoMaits is not 100% we are an injury to Hogg away from no full back. hence Tonks getting the full 80 minutes.

Similarly, Furra Linee and Richie V may well be the only fit centres when the tournament starts so they must get as many minutes under their belts as possible.

I think Rob Harley is the only player in the squad who is an out and out 6. Ashe and Wilson are 8s who can play six. Bluto plays 6,7 or 8 as the Tombola decrees. Despite playing a blinder in the Pro 12 final Harley was dead on his feet and out of form towards the of the season and needs game time to get himself back into form. However, I would bet Bru's stones and the contents of Fes' wine cellar that he will be in the squad.

Some posters have said we have three sevens on the bench: we have two 7s, Cowan and Blake and two 8s, Denton and Barclay. When Ireland thrashed us at Murrayfield they dominated the breakdown and went wide very quickly. Barclay will jackal like a 7, and both he and Blake will have more pace to defend out wide than Dozer and Cowan. I see Barclay-Blake starting and Dozer-Cowan taking over after 40. (This does open the door to Ashe-Wilson-Hardie starting next week, which looks very dynamic.)

For what it's worth I think Fife and Dell will drop out; one because he seems to have McMisser's attitude towards physical contact and the other because he's not avery good winger.

I'm expecting:

1 - Grant / Reid
2 - Brown / McInally
3 - Welsh / Cusack
4 - Gilchrist
5 - Hamilton
6 - Cowan
7 - Barclay / Blake
8 - Denton

17 - Grant / Reid
18 - Brown / McInally
19 - Welsh / Cusack
20 - Harley
21 - Blake

Had a thought - interesting that pyrgos is captain even though gilchrist is in the squad, and he was cotter's very first captain.

Maybe the thinking is it is so long since he's played a game that cotter would rather get him back playing instead of worrying about captaincy?

I read as much from some journo or other. I think it is a fair call by Cotter as well. Gilchrist is in an interesting position as he has done little wrong but now finds himself gone from captain to not starting in our strongest XV.

I think his route in will be to oust Ritchie as Jnr is too good at the moment. I feel we are picking Ritchie more on reputation than anything else...so unlike us

Weegie Wizard wrote:I read as much from some journo or other. I think it is a fair call by Cotter as well. Gilchrist is in an interesting position as he has done little wrong but now finds himself gone from captain to not starting in our strongest XV.

I think his route in will be to oust Ritchie as Jnr is too good at the moment. I feel we are picking Ritchie more on reputation than anything else...so unlike us

Dunno if you can say that, Richie was superb in the 6N before injury.

If only all our team selections were "tricky" as Richie Gray vs Grant Gilchrist!!

It wasn't long ago we had to put up with the likes of Al Kellock.....

Yeah, I keep getting these explicit letters from Megan Fox and Mila Kunis.

It wasn't so long ago that only Helen of Troy was interested.

IanBru wrote:Yeah, I keep getting these explicit letters from Megan Fox and Mila Kunis.

I am guessing that's because the terms of the restraining orders were set out very clearly in the first place.

I see in today's Herald that Jim Hamilton is amazed and inspired by the raw talent in the squad. Now, you expect a lot of hyperbole from the players just before a tournament but his interview seemed pretty well grounded so I'm thinking that there must be a really positive atmosphere in the camp.

Let's hope it's still positive around eight o'clock on Saturday evening.

IanBru wrote:Yeah, I keep getting these explicit letters from Megan Fox and Mila Kunis.

It wasn't so long ago that only Helen of Troy was interested.

That would make you older than ASBO.....

Team announcement half 12