Leicester Tigers Thread 2015/16 A New Beginning Part 1

by Welly Fri Sep 04, 2015 4:07 pm

First topic message reminder :

2015/16 Senior Squad ATM:
Coaches: Cockerill (DOR), Mauger (HC), Hansen (Defence + Skills Coach), Blaze (Ass. Forwards), Murphy (Ass. Backs)
1/3) Ayerza, Balmain, Brugnara, Cole, Mulipola, Pasquali, Rizzo
2) Youngs, Ghiraldini, Bateman, Thacker
4/5) De Chaves, Fitzgerald, Kitchener, Slater
6/7/8) Crane, Croft, Fonua, McCaffrey, O'Connor, Pearce, Williams
9) Harrison, Kitto, Youngs
10) Burns, Williams
12/13) Bai, Loamanu, Roberts, Smith, Tuilagi
11/14) Benjamin, Betham, Camacho, Goneva, Thompstone,
15) Bell, Morris, Tait

2015/16 Development Squad: Oliver Byrant, Jake Farnworth, George Tresidder, Will Owen

2015/16
Greg Bateman (Exeter)
Mike Williams (Warriors)
Mike Fitzgerald (Chiefs)
Opeti Fonua (Welsh)
Brendon O'Connor (Blues)
Peter Betham (NSW Waratahs)
Lachlan McCaffrey (London Welsh)
Jono Kitto (Bay of Plenty + Cheifs Development Squad)

Transfers Out 2014/15:
Paul Burke (N/A)
Phil Blake (N/A)
Neil McCarthy (Glous)
Tom Price (Scarlets)
Geoff Parling (Exeter)
Neil Briggs (Sale)
Julien Salvi (Exeter)
Pohe (USC)
Brad Thorn (Retirement)
Peterson (Glasgow)
Hamilton (Coventry)
Bristow (Wasps)
R.Williams (?)
Whetton
Hepetema (BoP)
Allen (Retirement)

by Welly Fri Mar 11, 2016 1:53 pm

Worth been playing 13 for Coventry I believe.

Really hoping Genge stays with us long term but not 00% sure ATM.

by king_carlos Fri Mar 11, 2016 5:26 pm

I hadn't realised he'd been at 13 for Conventry. In that case I don't really get the logic behind Charlie staying at 13 rather than moving inside. Ah well, onto the original point I'd much rather he stayed at FB personally. I reckon he could be a really classy player at the back with the way our game plan is moving.

I reckon Genge will be staying long term. I was under the impression that when he signed on loan the club had already been in talks with him about next season but because he wasn't having a great time in Bristol either personally or with the coaches Cockers managed to get him in on-loan.

If the rumours are right then it sounds like he's a kid who's a bit rough round the edges who was hanging about with the wrong crowd for a bit. It seems that most involved feel that he'd be best off getting a break from the area and a new start elsewhere.

by Welly Sun Mar 13, 2016 12:50 pm

Anyone else impressed with the Van Vurren and Genge.

Balmain looked more comfortable with VV @ 2 i thought and Genge is destructive as a runner.

by formerly known as Sam Sun Mar 13, 2016 1:03 pm

I've not seen the game yet but Balmain should look more comfortable as I think VV is about three stone heavier than Thacker. It would be helpful if VV can do a good job and get a contract for next season. With his size he should be a good squad option if he has the requisite aggression and throwing ability.

Thacker could then concentrate on moving to the back row this summer. I look forward to seeing how Gene got on. From what I heard in the radio our defence was lazy and lacking intensity.

by Welly Sun Mar 13, 2016 1:09 pm

Yeh i think too many players returning from injuries like Smith and Tait.

Goneva was struggling.

Forwards were beaten of the park Logo looked tired from the off, Williams, VV, Balmain, and Owen needed to come on sooner.

Thompstone has been brilliant this season though.

by **LondonTiger** Sun Mar 13, 2016 2:24 pm

Logo looked as if he had eaten too much birthday cake and having had a sugar rush pre-game was lacking any real energy come game time.

by king_carlos Mon Mar 14, 2016 8:31 pm

Welly wrote: Anyone else impressed with the Van Vurren and Genge.

Balmain looked more comfortable with VV @ 2 i thought and Genge is destructive as a runner.

I just got the chance to watch it and was impressed with both, yes. Genge especially looks like a real brawler - of course that needs to be controlled but I like seeing that in a young guy, especially a tight forward. His aggression in contact is terrific.

VV was strong in the loose and scrum. His throwing was also better than I expected given the terrible reports of it, although one of his 4 throws was under thrown it was still taken. If we can keep him for next season then he'd be a good project option as 4th choice and could easily overtake Bateman by the end of next season.

by killer938 Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:28 am

Didn't know if this should have it's own thread but posting here anyway.

Very sad to wake up to the news that Seru Rabeni has passed away, he was such a great player to watch and epitomised what is great about the game, played hard with a huge smile on this face. Only had one very brief encounter with him personally but from what I understand he was also a real gentleman off the field. All my thoughts with his family and friends.

Living in France I don't get to many games these days but I happen to be back in England this weekend and so can go to the game on Sunday. Very glad I will be there and will be able to pay tribute to him along with the rest of the Tigers family.

by **LondonTiger** Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:35 am

Wow. Just 37. Sad

by killer938 Tue Mar 15, 2016 9:41 am

I know, way too young

by TightHEAD Tue Mar 15, 2016 10:43 am

Poor guy, way too young.

by formerly known as Sam Tue Mar 15, 2016 11:11 am

Thoughts are with his family. Taken far to young.

by funnyExiledScot Tue Mar 15, 2016 11:15 am

Have only just seen the news. Horrible and far far too young. Magnificent player in his pomp.

by ScarletSpiderman Tue Mar 15, 2016 12:40 pm

A really top draw player, and a real shame to see him pass away so you. Thoughts go out to his friends and family.

by propdavid_london Tue Mar 15, 2016 1:08 pm

I was shocked to read this too - very sad!
http://www.planetrugby.com/news/seru-rabeni-passes-away-at-37/
The Tigers days with Rabeni and Alessana Tuilagi rampaging were awesome times. Not may teams could deal with them.

by mikey_dragon Wed Mar 16, 2016 12:58 pm

Rabeni and Tuilagi on the wings for Tigers was the stuff of nightmares for opposition! I was surprised to read that he wasn't with you for as long though, but it is going back a few years.

by lostinwales Wed Mar 16, 2016 3:14 pm

Tom Youngs out for the season following back surgery

by formerly known as Sam Wed Mar 16, 2016 3:49 pm

That AP final with Tuilagi and Seru running over or through the Glaws back line was a brilliant memory. Great power in our back line then with Varndell offering something completely different as well.

Tom Youngs I'm not surprised about. After missing a few weeks it was always likely that something would need to be done and a minor op isn't a shock. Hope he recovers quickly.

by Jimpy Thu Mar 17, 2016 12:09 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:That AP final with Tuilagi and Seru running over or through the Glaws back line was a brilliant memory. Great power in our back line then with Varndell offering something completely different as well.

Tom Youngs I'm not surprised about. After missing a few weeks it was always likely that something would need to be done and a minor op isn't a shock. Hope he recovers quickly.

He plays for Leicester, a bout of indigestion would rule him out for 6 - 8 weeks.

by king_carlos Wed Mar 23, 2016 5:43 pm

Mike Williams has re-fractured the same arm he injured earlier in the season. More than likely out for the season. Sad

Second Tiger of the season after Fonau to break an arm only to return then do the same thing again. Such bad luck for both of them. Also really bad news for the run in as I'd have backed him to be one of our most prominent players in physical knockout matches.

Fitzgerald will also miss at least the Sale game with a 'torn buttock'. Thankfully Aguero is back in training though so Marcos might finally get a rest.

by **LondonTiger** Wed Mar 23, 2016 7:42 pm

One player "rebreaking" the same arm in same place may be bad luck. Two doing it reflects badly on the medical and physio staff.

by formerly known as Sam Wed Mar 23, 2016 8:43 pm

Either it's a massive coincidence or urine poor work from the medical staff rushing players back. Given Leicester City have one of the best medical set ups in professional sport how are Tigers struggling so much on this front.

Williams was our stand out player for the opening three months of the season. Big loss.

by Welly Wed Mar 23, 2016 9:19 pm

Sam

Football and Rugby are massively different as you know no point comparing the two medical teams.

I highly doubt it is rushing considering we are fine in their positions.

Having reboroken the same bone twice in the space of a few weeks from healing there is a high chance it is coincidence mine certainly was pretty much everything happened the same way on both occasions, esp when you look at both players playing styles.

Fonua charges with the forearm leading a lot of the times and Williams smashes anything that moves both are very physical style and tend to potentially lead to similar injuries.

by yappysnap Wed Mar 23, 2016 10:47 pm

Having spoken to a Quins physio who was unhappy with the club and how much pressure they put on players to return early when not fit and on the medical staff to get them back early I wouldn't be surprised if it happened at Tigers too.

by formerly known as Sam Wed Mar 23, 2016 11:10 pm

Welly wrote: Sam

Football and Rugby are massively different as you know no point comparing the two medical teams.

I highly doubt it is rushing considering we are fine in their positions.

Having reboroken the same bone twice in the space of a few weeks from healing there is a high chance it is coincidence mine certainly was pretty much everything happened the same way on both occasions, esp when you look at both players playing styles.

Fonua charges with the forearm leading a lot of the times and Williams smashes anything that moves both are very physical style and tend to potentially lead to similar injuries.

Well there's a large difference due to the physical nature of the sport. The number of muscular injuries incurred is a concern however and the number of reoccurring injuries even more so. With all the off field developments it's a concern we're not pushing the boundaries on the medical side which would be a major factor in our potential success.

Leicester City have spent large sums developing a sports science and medical department. Two injuries of note all season and one was a carry over from last season (ACL).

You can keep your best players on the pitch week in, week out you win. Another year and a catalogue of injuries looks likely to hamper our ability to make a home playoff semi final.

by Welly Thu Mar 24, 2016 9:41 am

Unless you know the exact amount of money we spend that is pure speculation.

Also of course LCFC have spent tons of money, the owners are worth nearly $3 billion, and as LCFC isn't a big name drawer, you have to pump money into facilities. Side note congrats City on making a pre tax profit (£26million I think).

by king_carlos Thu Mar 24, 2016 10:49 am

In contact sport a repeat of an injury such as that is fairly common is it not? If a scan of the arm shows the bone has healed and the player is experience no pain in training then they will usually be declared fit. Unfortunately there is no way to really confirm that they are ready for the intensity of a match until you put them on the field?

Along with BOC re-injuring his hammy on his return I guess you could argue that guys are being rushed back. As a medical staff Tigers have a good reputation for getting badly injured players back in the pitch though.

Is the that old all-weather pitch still the same joint destroying mess that it used to be? That was always one thing that I thought desperately needed to be sorted to help out guys with knee and ankle issues.

by formerly known as Sam Thu Mar 24, 2016 12:41 pm

It's just an area I feel we could push. The teams able to keep a consistently string team over the course of the season are the ones that perform the best. Luck is only a factor to a certain degree.

Been a year or two since I last played at Oval Park but the sand based knee killer was still there then. Oadby Wyggs were waiting for Tigers to leave so they could access grass roots grant money and rip the damn thing out last I heard.

by Guest Thu Mar 24, 2016 3:28 pm

Miles Benjamin announces his retirement.

A real shame imo, we barely got to see much of him but I was a big fan of his while he was at Worcester. His strike rate for a side not performing particularly well was really impressive. I had hoped he'd be retained next season as, apart from his complete inability to catch a high ball, he had the strength, pace and finishing ability that could've made him an international quality winger.

by Welly Thu Mar 24, 2016 4:10 pm

Huge shame indeed.

Crowson saying he is the 4th winger to be leaving end of season.
Goneva (Falcons)
Camacho (No new contract)
Loamanu (No New contract)

by yappysnap Thu Mar 24, 2016 5:29 pm

Shame to hear about Benjamin, all the best for him in the future

by formerly known as Sam Thu Mar 24, 2016 5:47 pm

Benjamin was a quality winger, just knew how to get to the try line. I liked how he always played with a smile, I hope he takes that enthusiasm into a coaching role.

by king_carlos Thu Mar 24, 2016 6:55 pm

A shame about Benjamin. After so long out injured people had started wondering if that could be the outcome but there weren't the same whispers as with someone like AA. I was still harbouring hopes that he'd hang around and get fit for next season, on song he was a fantastic finisher.

As Sam says he was also just an enjoyable player to watch play, always looked like he loved being on the pitch and ran with his heart on his sleeve.

All the best for the future Miles!

Gives us with Tombstone, Betham, TV, JPP and Brady as wingers for next season. Catchpole and Morris can also cover but Betham, TV and JPP may be used at centre/FB instead at times. Perhaps leaves room for another recruit if someone (Lewington please) becomes available. By no means something to worry about though with youngsters also coming through.

by formerly known as Sam Thu Mar 24, 2016 9:00 pm

Nathan Earle the Sarries academy product is a rumour I've heard. He's fast, elusive and not easy to put down. Could be a good signing for now and develop for the future as a bridge between what we have ad the core of youngsters coming through.

by king_carlos Mon Mar 28, 2016 7:27 pm

Tigers 23 for the final A-league game tonight against Wuss at Sixways.

15 Tom Hardwick
14 Sam Yawayawa
13 Matt Smith
12 Seremaia Bai
11 Gonzalo Camacho
10 Oli Bryant
9 Ben White
1 Ellis Genge
2 Michael van Vuuren
3 Tiziano Pasquali
4 Joe Maksymiw
5 Sebastian de Chaves (c)
6 Ed Milne
7 Will Evans
8 Christian Loamanu

Replacements
16 Jake Farnworth
17 Riccardo Brugnara
18 Aniseko Sio
19 Charlie Beckett
20 Harry Wells
21 Harry Simmons
22 Jack Roberts
23 Charlie Thacker

Matt Smith looked off the pace in his last game so I'm glad to see him getting a run out. I'm surprised to see Bai getting game time with Roberts and Charlie Thacker on the bench though. Loamanu starting at 8 is indicative of injuries and some knackered bodies in the back row more than anything.

With two loose heads on the bench it will be interesting to see if Charlie Beckett gets a chance in his recently adopted position at TH or is used in the back row.

Are Odogwu, Worth, Owen, Catchpole and Tressider injured, away with Championship clubs or just not selected does anyone know?

by king_carlos Mon Mar 28, 2016 7:34 pm

Worcester Cavaliers: 15 Ben Howard, 14 Dean Hammond, 13 Andy Short, 12 Alex Grove, 11 Perry Humphreys, 10 Tiff Eden, 9 Luke Baldwin; 1 Ryan Bower, 2 Jack Singleton, 3 Gareth Milasinovich, 4 Dan Sanderson, 5 Darren O'Shea, 6 Mat Gilbert, 7 Sam Ripper-Smith, 8 Huw Taylor (c)
Replacements: 16 Ben Sowrey, 17 Derrick Appiah, 18 Joe Rees, 19 Charlie Hewitt, 20 Andrew Kitchener, 21 JB Bruzulier, 22 Jamie Shillcock, 23 Josh Adams

That's the Wuss line-up.

Should be a good game looking at that. The two experienced centre partnerships stand-out, two good second row pairings going at each other as well. A good challenge for Maksymiw being paired with Seb.

Ben Howard is a very good young FB who will be a really tough test for Hardwick.

Tiz against former Tiger Ryan Bower in the scrum should be an interesting match-up as well.

by Welly Mon Mar 28, 2016 7:35 pm

First Game in a Tigers shirt for Milne I think since Argentina?

Really rate him hopefully will be viewed as a replacement for Pearce.

Odogwu has a highlights video up don't know if that is good or bad for the future.

by king_carlos Mon Mar 28, 2016 7:42 pm

I believe so for Milne yes, Welly. I rate him really highly as well, especially with the style that Mauger is trying to implement. As a ball playing 8 with Mike Williams (or Fitz, Slates, etc) at blindside I think he could be a useful option.

I'm on a train so can't look it up but is that a highlight reel on a YouTube account with his name Welly? I've noticed a few highlights compilations for young Tigers players on accounts under their own name, I think it must be something that the club are encouraging so that fans who won't get a chance to watch A-league/warm-up games can see the up and coming academy guys in action.

by yappysnap Mon Mar 28, 2016 7:47 pm

'Sam Ripper-Smith'

What a name

by Welly Mon Mar 28, 2016 8:16 pm

king_carlos wrote:I believe so for Milne yes, Welly. I rate him really highly as well, especially with the style that Mauger is trying to implement. As a ball playing 8 with Mike Williams (or Fitz, Slates, etc) at blindside I think he could be a useful option.

I'm on a train so can't look it up but is that a highlight reel on a YouTube account with his name Welly? I've noticed a few highlights compilations for young Tigers players on accounts under their own name, I think it must be something that the club are encouraging so that fans who won't get a chance to watch A-league/warm-up games can see the up and coming academy guys in action.

Here is his account

https://m.youtube.com/user/PowerPproductions

God that try v Argentina gives me goosebumps whenever I see it.

by king_carlos Mon Mar 28, 2016 9:29 pm

It looks like it might be his account given he's subscribed and stuff like that to it. The only videos he's uploaded are highlight things though which I've seen for a few of our youngsters.

Perhaps it's something the club are encouraging to build a bit of hype for fans... Or maybe a few of the academy lads started messing around with editing software and made some highlight compilations to massage their egos! Laugh

I don't think there's much to be read into there for the future though, I can't see Odogwu going anywhere soon. Especially with Niki, Benjamin, Camacho and Loamanu departing. He should have a good chance of pushing for LV cup game time next season.

by king_carlos Mon Mar 28, 2016 9:33 pm

Updates for the A-league are on the Tigers twitter feed for any interested in what's going on.

Worcs were 20 nil up at half time but it's been dragged back to 20-14 with a quick fire brace from Camacho.

Smith, Genge and Seb came off at half-time for Jack Roberts, Brugnara and Harry Wells. Probably a fair indication that the three of them will be involved this weekend.

by Welly Mon Mar 28, 2016 9:39 pm

Camacho with a late charge for a contract Wink

Backs coming up look very good

White
Umaga
Bryant
Odowgu
Davies
Yawayawa
Thacker
Worth

All look promising and that is only off the top of my head.

by king_carlos Mon Mar 28, 2016 9:55 pm

.... A very late charge indeed Laugh

It's such a shame how far he has looked from his best since the injuries. I do wonder where he'll head next season, perhaps the Jaguares will take a punt on him. If not then perhaps a lower Top 14 side or Div 1 in France.

Worcs knock over a penalty but Tiger respond with a try through Harry Wells. 23 - 21, can't be long left now.

Agreed that the backs coming through look excellent Welly. There are a few forwards who could make the grade as well!

Hills, Hogan, Maksymiw, Owen, Evans, Milne, Fred Tuilagi

Hopefully they get the game time needed to progress whether that be in Championship, A-league or first XV.

by king_carlos Mon Mar 28, 2016 10:21 pm

Worcs 23 - Tigers 21

Final score. Sounds like it was a much better and more even game than many A-league matches this season. It's amazing what a difference there is when both sides are looking to use their A-team in a similar fashion eh. I'm not saying more experienced selections are a poor use of a clubs A-team but whilst all the teams in the league are looking to use their side for different means the games are often ending up farcically one sided.

by formerly known as Sam Mon Mar 28, 2016 10:35 pm

Slight concern that we improved in the second half after three of the more first team expectant players went off. I still hope Wells can come back into first team contention. A big mobile lump of a second row.

I liked what I saw of Milne previously, particularly his work rate which was simply massive. Has he bulked out any as he was a bit light for number 8 at AP level.

by Welly Mon Mar 28, 2016 10:42 pm

A longer A league season would help a lot.

Even if it was say 13 teams play each other once rotating home and away fixtures every year, and during internationals it isn't played so say:
2016/17 season
September - October Play 5 games
November - December 0 A league games due to internationals
January - Play 2 games
February - March 0 Games due to 6N's
April - May play 5 games then a SF and Final.

Would also like to see either a
A summer Academy league of some kind. (A conference system of say 6/8 weeks during pre season and Summer holidays for schools) So teams have an idea on academy players levels before the season and can try to arrange proper loans during season to Championship, Nat 1 and Nat 2 teams.

by Welly Mon Mar 28, 2016 10:43 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:Slight concern that we improved in the second half after three of the more first team expectant players went off. I still hope Wells can come back into first team contention. A big mobile lump of a second row.

I liked what I saw of Milne previously, particularly his work rate which was simply massive. Has he bulked out any as he was a bit light for number 8 at AP level.

Roberts sounded like he added alot of pace to the team. (Which he did in the LV cup last season)

Milne has been playing some games at lock for Rosslyn so i suspect he has bulked up a bit, should also improve his ability as a lineout jumper as well.

by king_carlos Mon Mar 28, 2016 11:24 pm

Welly wrote: A longer A league season would help a lot.

Even if it was say 13 teams play each other once rotating home and away fixtures every year, and during internationals it isn't played so say:
2016/17 season
September - October Play 5 games
November - December 0 A league games due to internationals
January - Play 2 games
February - March 0 Games due to 6N's
April - May play 5 games then a SF and Final.

Would also like to see either a
A summer Academy league of some kind. (A conference system of say 6/8 weeks during pre season and Summer holidays for schools) So teams have an idea on academy players levels before the season and can try to arrange proper loans during season to Championship, Nat 1 and Nat 2 teams.

For me it would still leave the issue of clubs using their sides for differing purposes which is very difficult to overcome. Other than a bit of pride and bragging rights there is no real incentive to win the A-league. This is especially true for clubs with smaller squads.

Some clubs with bigger squads and strong development set-ups will love it as a chance to throw some older development players in with fringe players and see who they compare. Others with smaller first team squads will have to play much younger sides due merely to availability. We've seen plenty of Tigers A-team games this season which have been almost pointlessly one sided due to the other team having a much older and more physically developed pack.

Personally I still like the idea of 18/19 year old prospects getting lower league game time with the Lions, then more experienced development players (Will Owen would have been a prime candidate this season) going on season long loans to Championship clubs.

by Jimpy Tue Mar 29, 2016 9:58 am

Having watched the performance v Sale twice now – just to make sure I wasn’t having a nightmare at the time, I can honestly say it was appalling. In fact, words failed me until now.

It was so bad, it was actually funny at times. At half time, I almost expected Richard Cockerill and Aaron Mauger to come out of the tunnel in a clown car to distribute red noses to the Tigers players. So inept was the performance, I at least consoled myself that at least it couldn’t possibly be any worse in the second half and that Tigers would come back to win.

Oh dear Lord, how wrong can you be. My girlfriend doesn’t watch much rugby, so I think the phrase ‘from the mouths of babes’ sprang to mind when she said, “do these guys play together regularly?” as yet another move worthy of a pub team was butchered. Tigers were lazy across the park, lacked commitment at the breakdown and were clueless in attack.

It was EMBARASSING.

Now, I’ve heard some excuses – like Sale have only lost one match at home all season etc…. but it doesn’t wash. Sale weren’t even that good, they were there to be put away and by a margin. Cipriani’s try was indicative of the apparent confusion that seems to reign all too often amongst the ranks.

Anyone who doubts that the DoR must surely be on borrowed time after this shambolic effort will need their heads examining. Top 2 is out of the question, top 4 is but a hope, top 6 looks most likely.

Not good enough.

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