Why Rafa is not liked at RG?

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It is quite strange to see that Parisians do not rejoice much on Rafa's exploits at RG. He has been one of the best player to play there but that has not guaranteed him the affection of the locals.

I think that the reasons behind that could be:

Fed speaks French which means that Parisians favor and like him more than Nadal and wants to see him winning there again and again (which certainly has not been the case)

Nadal's style of celeberating- it is too machoistic. The fist pumps, angry face can get you on your nerves specially if you are not a Nadal fan.

Nadal's ability to defend, defend and defend.

your thoughts.

French sporting crowds generally are known to be fickle - the rugby crowd has been known to turn on their side and boo very loudly during a bad perfromance, but also for the boos to turn to cheers virtually with one good bit of French flair.

I doubt there's much of a political motive for booing Nadal - OK the French and Spanish have had their disputes over the years (mainly courtesy of Napoleon's rather assertive manner of obtaining land for his Mediterranean holiday villa), but does anyone really think that a sports crowd cares about such things (excluding the England football crowd and their obsession with Germany)?

I suspect that it's a combination of a few different things, probably in the following order:
1 - Jealousy of Rafa's success. Wouldn't matter if he had the greatest style in the world ever, seeing the same player dominate your tournament year after year will raise some resentment.
2 - A few incidents over the years, such as the Grosjean one described above and the translation of the winner's speech from Spanish to French
3 - Perhaps also that Rafa, despite having had so much success in France, has not learnt French well enough to speak French in public. This especially contrasts with Federer, who is reasonably fluent in French (and English, German and perhaps Afrikaans?)
4 - Playing style, and the fact that Rafa is principally a grinder capable of producing occasional moments of magic, rather than the type of flamboyant player that is loved in France (Noah, Leconte etc).
4 -

dummy_half, i am confused as to how you make the link to Afrikaanse for a possible language Fed? Afrikaanse is mainly Dutch and i am not sure if Fed speaks Dutch.

Dummy - 4 IS teh main reason. I am Parisian and can easily see why Nadal's game is not liked!

Besides as I pointed out many times, check any close match against Rafa and you will see that the crowd is supporting the challneger. That was the case many times v uncharismatic Davydenko and even at Wimbledon when v Haase and Petzchner.

The thing is to be with Rafa means having to cheers for many UEs for his opponent and NO crowds like that.

Why should Rafa have to speak French... do any of the French players speak Spanish..or indeed does Djokovic speak French.. Wow we could open another can of worms.

Tenez wrote:Dummy - 4 IS teh main reason. I am Parisian and can easily see why Nadal's game is not liked!

Besides as I pointed out many times, check any close match against Rafa and you will see that the crowd is supporting the challneger. That was the case many times v uncharismatic Davydenko and even at Wimbledon when v Haase and Petzchner.

The thing is to be with Rafa means having to cheers for many UEs for his opponent and NO crowds like that.

I got the answer I was looking for. This sums it up.

wow wrote:

Tenez wrote:Dummy - 4 IS teh main reason. I am Parisian and can easily see why Nadal's game is not liked!

Besides as I pointed out many times, check any close match against Rafa and you will see that the crowd is supporting the challneger. That was the case many times v uncharismatic Davydenko and even at Wimbledon when v Haase and Petzchner.

The thing is to be with Rafa means having to cheers for many UEs for his opponent and NO crowds like that.

I got the answer I was looking for. This sums it up.

Yep answers a lot of questions for me too... though I should have guessed

eirebilly

Federer's mother is South African, which is why I wondered whether he speaks (at least a bit of) Afrikaans. It's also why his English is much better than is the case for many (most) people who have been taught it as a second language - he has a much better understanding of the nuances of the language that someone like Nadal (not that Rafa's English is bad - a damned sight better than my Spanish, but it was obviously learnt rather than practices).

The Swiss are taught very good English - spoken and grammatically - in their schools from an early age. As they are in Holland, Denmark, and many other northern European countries. I dont think teaching English was a priority on a Majorcan island.

The key thing though is that Federer speaks good French as all people from Basel do with it being so near the French border. They almost feel he's french.

Oh ok, i did'nt now that dummy_half . Then i would imagine that he does speak a little Afrikaanse. Very talented man when you consider that he can speak the languages so well.

Lydian

Fair point - after all, Switzerland has 4 official languages (German of a sort, French, Italian and Romantsh) plus good English language teaching.

As an aside, my brother has lived in Zurich for voer a decade now, and his child was born there. It's going to be interesting seeing her grow up being at least bi-lingual (and a half - her mother is German, so she'll learn both German and Swiss-German, which for those that don't know is about as similar as Geordie is to English).

I wasn't knocking Nadal at all - I have a lot of sympathy for sportsmen who are almost forced to learn English simply because they are good at their sport. Many of them (Michael Schumacher being a good example) tend to have a few eccentricities in their use of the language, and very few get the nuances correct (other than Federer, Sebastian Vettel is one of very few who seems to get it right most of the time).

Interesting points dummy_half re@ your family. I didnt think you were knocking Nadal either - nor would it be an issue if you were. I have worked in Basel alot and have seen the command of English most of the Baselers have - which often puts our own 'command' to shame. And of course you'll know Zurich and Basel are very different cities - with Zurich being much more 'german' than Basel which has its own language almost, along with the mix of French, German and English.

Federer is a bright guy (but then I think all these top players are in their own ways - sometimes the insights of what Nadal and Nole say are very interesting) and has a very good command of language for sure. I think Nole also speaks English extremely well and speaks with nuance, infact I think Nole is an extremely bright guy, there's alot more to him than meets the eye for sure.

I think you will know also Lydian that the Latins do not so much have a problem with the English Language as a whole but more with the pronunciation of it.. They sometimes understand it better than they speak it. Saying that most of them speak better English than I do Spanish

The Paris crowd are a very intelligent, knowledgeable about tennis, entity on the whole. There have been, however, where their behaviour has been very unsporting, and inappropriate.

That said, there is no small amount of imbibing done at this tournament, so towards the end of the day, one can get comments, noises, etc., that are more about what a person has consumed, than true feelings about a particular person.

I think the fact that Nadal has won so many French Opens, there is a significant number of people, without individual favourites, who would root for the "underdog," regardless of the people actually involved in the match.

I don't think it's necessarily as "personal" an issue as some contributors would like to make out - that's more of putting their own biases forward, under the guise of others' reactions, regardless of validity.

Despite any and all of this general commentary, something that is consistent, and said in great words by Billie Jean King - "Pressure is a priviledge, and Champions adjust!"

Whatever anyone, or any group of people "feel" about Nadal, what he has done, to come out to Roland Garros the past 7 years and done, what he has done, shows he could care less about what they think about him - it's about his tennis. And as long as his tennis takes him to the final, where he then has a chance to fight for the title - the rest is all just banter.

Vamos Rafa! Great job to get to the final, without having played your best stuff - come what may, you've given a good account.

"Let them have their whine, and drink it too!"

I did not like Rafa's post match celebrations either.

I doubt after winning it 5 times and now in the final of the sixth he could give a toss frankly... its two weeks out of his entire year and he is professional enough to not let it get to him. Vamos Rafa

"Why Rafa is not liked at RG?"

Because there is no flair and finesse in his game like what Federer has. Nadal's game is based purely on physically moonballing his opponent into submission.

gboycottnut wrote:"Why Rafa is not liked at RG?"

Because there is no flair and finesse in his game like what Federer has. Nadal's game is based purely on physically playing his opponent into submission.

If that's the case then why only RG?

wow wrote:

gboycottnut wrote:"Why Rafa is not liked at RG?"

Because there is no flair and finesse in his game like what Federer has. Nadal's game is based purely on physically playing his opponent into submission.

If that's the case then why only RG?

Because of the French loving sportsmen/women to have/show flair.

And as mentioned before, it happens all over the world, not only in France.

Why wouldn't Federer be more loved, he is the older and more sentimental choice in every stadium as fans realize they are watching a legend entering the twilight of his career. So of course they are going to want to cheer for the older more accomplished player who they might not see much longer. It happens to all the legends when they get older, as their careers enter the twilight people want to seem them succeed and be successful for just a bit longer. Remember connors' run to the final of the US open where the crowd went into a frenzy for him. Everyone wants to see the old lion have another day in the sun.

socal1976 wrote:Why wouldn't Federer be more loved, he is the older and more sentimental choice in every stadium as fans realize they are watching a legend entering the twilight of his career. So of course they are going to want to cheer for the older more accomplished player who they might not see much longer. It happens to all the legends when they get older, as their careers enter the twilight people want to seem them succeed and be successful for just a bit longer. Remember connors' run to the final of the US open where the crowd went into a frenzy for him. Everyone wants to see the old lion have another day in the sun.

Not really, Fed is only 29 and Connors was much older when he made that final. Fed hit more winners and display variety into his shot making which at times is not visible in Nadal's game. Nadal is more of a defence, chasing balls and turning defence into offence. Nadal shares equal fan following as Fed but it is only RG where bias is that clear. Today will make it clearer as who they support more. So keep yourself hooked to telly.