Aviva Premiership - Round 6

First topic message reminder :

Table

Team	Played	--Won--	-Drawn-	---BP---	Points
Saracens	5	5	0	2	22
Exeter	5	4	0	3	19
Leicester	5	4	0	0	16
Harlequins	5	3	0	3	15
Wasps	5	3	0	2	14
Northampton	5	2	0	4	12
Sale Sharks	5	2	1	2	12
Bath	5	2	0	2	10
Worcester	5	2	0	2	10
Gloucester	5	2	0	1	9
Newcastle	5	0	1	0	2
London Irish	5	0	0	0	0

Fixtures:


Fri 4th Dec

19:45 Gloucester Rugby  v   Sale Sharks BT Sport
Both sides will not have been happy with their performances last week in games that failed to rise above the awful conditions. Gloucester's experiment of Twelvetrees at 10 and hook at 12 failed rather conspicuously as neither managed to add any control. Gloucester will be hoping for dry conditions in which their quick backs are more likely to thrive. Not for the first time this season, Danny Cipriani was unsuccessful with a "win-the-game" kick. After his break during the Challenge Cup matches he looked rusty, and with the court appearance hanging over him he will need to cast away all extraneous emotions and perform if Sale are to sneak anything from this game. Gloucester should win and overtake their visitors in the table, but it is hard to see either team threatening the top half of the table.


Sat 5th Dec

15:00 Harlequins  v   London Irish
Having secured a TBP at Sandy Park, Quins will be bemoaning their ill-discipline (plus attempts to run the clock down at the end of the first half) that allowed Exeter to sneak the win. Still, if you had offered them 2 points before they started their journey west they would probably have bitten your hand off. London Irish are the only team still pointless in the table, but can keep tyheir hopes up by looking at just how hard their opening fixtures have been. all five of their opponents so far finished in the top half of the table last season, and all bar Bath are their again. The trip to the Stoop continues the trend of playing form teams. Certainly Irish have no being playing as poorly as the table would suggest and, despite Quins being clear favourites, they are capable of getting something from this game.

15:00 Worcester Warriors  v   Leicester Tigers
Along with visitors Bath, Leicester did well to rise above the conditions last week and produce a game full of ambition and running - but perhaps not finishing. With Bell and Youngs both kicking far too long with the wind behind, Bath dominated territory and possession in the first half. However tigers showed real grit to hold them at bay, repeated this when down to 14 men in the second half and pulled away at the end. While the influence of Mauger can be seen in how Tigers are trying to play, the physicality with which tigers hit every tackle, ruck and maul was quintessential Cockers. They will need all that grit and fire for the visit to Sixways to face a Worcester side that are more than the sum of their parts. Wuss will be disappointed and even shocked by the score line last week. They did not play as poorly as a casual look at the score would suggest. DOC needs to avoid winding the ref up though. There were a number of 50/50 calls that went the Sarries way after some rather pointless in the refs face behaviour.


15:15 Bath Rugby  v   Northampton Saints BT Sport
The top two in last years regular season have struggled for form and consistency in the league so far, both with just two wins from five games. It is hard to decide who will be more confident going into this match. Bath played some excellent rugby in absolutely dire conditions at the weekend, but allowed Leicester's physicality to seize the day. Saints in conditions almost as bad featured in perhaps the worst match of the season - but dominated their opponent up front. Bath struggled at the lineout last week, but went toe-to-toe  at scrum time with the Leicester 8, almost gaining parity. they will need to raise their game further though for the visit of Saints beast of a scrum. I fell thi smatch could be decided by the conditions. If dry and still Bath should be able to avoid arm wrestle and seize the win. Wet and heavy and Saints abrasiveness and grunbt should dominate. Both sides will not wish to lose and slide down the table, but both sides will have their eyes on potentially tricky European matches.

17:30 Wasps  v   Exeter Chiefs BT Sport
Two teams that love to run the ball. Also two teams that have shown admirable defence this season at times, Wasps most notably in Europe, Chiefs for Leicester's visit. I am fascinated to see how this match will pan out. On paper Wasps look stronger, but Exeter have continued to make a mockery of such assertions. Battle of the back rows could be seismic.


Sun 6th Dec

15:00 Newcastle Falcons  v   Saracens BT Sport
It will be a shock if Saracens fail to win this game. Falcons should not be written off though. With one eye on Europe the defending champions will continue to rotate their players. Falcons came close to beating Sarries last season in Barnet with an all action attacking game - same again could make things interesting - but they have to be precise. Lose possession when in attack and they will see just how precisely Sarries counter attack.

 Tigers (v Worcester Warriors, away, Saturday 3pm)
15 Telusa Veainu 
14 Adam Thompstone 
13 Peter Betham 
12 Seremaia Bai 
11 Vereniki Goneva 
10 Owen Williams 
9 Sam Harrison 
1 Matias Aguero 
2 Greg Bateman 
3 Dan Cole 
4 Ed Slater (c) 
5 Graham Kitchener 
6 Mike Williams 
7 Tom Croft 
8 Jordan Crane 

Replacements
16 Tom Youngs 
17 Marcos Ayerza 
18 Fraser Balmain 
19 Dom Barrow 
20 Lachlan McCaffrey 
21 Jono Kitto 
22 Tommy Bell 
23 Matt Smith

Worcester Warriors: 15 Chris Pennell, 14 Bryce Heem, 13 Wynand Olivier, 12 Ryan Mills, 11 Cooper Vuna, 10 Tom Heathcote, 9 Jonny Arr; 1 Na'ama Leleimalefaga, 2 Niall Annett, 3 Joe Rees, 4 Donncha O'Callaghan, 5 Darren Barry, 6 Matt Cox, 7 Sam Betty, 8 Phil Dowson (c)
Replacements: 16 Jaba Bregvadze, 17 Val Rapava Ruskin, 18 Gareth Milasinovich, 19 Tevita Cavubati, 20 Marco Mama, 21 Charlie Mulchrone, 22 Ryan Lamb, 23 Ben Howard

Team changed around a bit for this game. Slightly concerned that we have no open side at all in the back row. Great to see the Slater and Kitchener pairing back in the second row.

Leicester Tigers (v Worcester Warriors, away, Saturday 3pm)
15 Telusa Veainu
14 Adam Thompstone
13 Peter Betham
12 Seremaia Bai
11 Vereniki Goneva
10 Owen Williams
9 Sam Harrison
1 Matias Aguero
2 Greg Bateman
3 Dan Cole
4 Ed Slater (c)
5 Graham Kitchener
6 Mike Williams
7 Tom Croft
8 Jordan Crane

Replacements
16 Tom Youngs
17 Marcos Ayerza
18 Fraser Balmain
19 Dom Barrow
20 Lachlan McCaffrey
21 Jono Kitto
22 Tommy Bell
23 Matt Smith

Fantastic to see Slater and Kitchener back playing together. Also nice to be able to rotate and rest O'Connor (assuming he is being rested) before the two games against Munster. Not sure about Croft at 7. Bit surprised they didn't put Cole on the bench as well as Ayerza with the games coming up but overall a strong team.

Beat me to it Sam, with pretty much the same comments as well

15 Ben FODEN (capt)
14 Jamie ELLIOTT
13 George PISI
12 Luther BURRELL
11 George NORTH
10 JJ HANRAHAN
9 Kahn FOTUALI’I
1 Ethan WALLER
2 Mikey HAYWOOD
3 Kieran BROOKES
4 Michael PATERSON
5 Christian DAY
6 Jamie GIBSON
7 Teimana HARRISON
8 Sam DICKINSON

16 Reece MARSHALL
17 Alex WALLER
18 Paul HILL
19 Victor MATFIELD
20 James CRAIG
21 Lee DICKSON
22 Stephen MYLER
23 Ken PISI

So Elliott in for Tuala, Harrison for Wood and JJ starting.

Dunno how Khan is starting after the dismal display last week.

Cole was rested against Treviso whilst Marcos and Youngs started with Balmain. Reverse of that tomorrow I guess.

Falcons v Sarries

1 Rob Vickers
2 George McGuigan
3 Jon Welsh
4 Sean Robinson
5 Calum Green
6 Mark Wilson
7 Will Welch (C)
8 Nili Latu

9 Michael Young
10 Tom Catterick
11 Marcus Watson
12 Juan Pablo Socino
13 Adam Powell
14 Belisario Agulla
15 Alex Tait

Replacements 16 Scott Lawson, 17 Alex Rogers, 18 Taione Vea, 19 Mouritz Botha, 20 Ally Hogg, 21 Sonatane Takulua 22 Craig Willis, 23 Chris Harris

Saracens team

15 Alex Goode (190)
14 Mike Ellery (10)
13 Nick Tompkins (23)
12 Duncan Taylor (74)
11 Chris Wyles (185)
10 Charlie Hodgson (74)
9 Ben Spencer (60)
1 Richard Barrington (60)
2 Jamie George © (136)
3 Juan Figallo (18)
4 Maro Itoje (35)
5 George Kruis (109)
6 Jackson Wray (120)
7 Will Fraser (63)
8 Samuela Vunisa (1)

Replacements

16 Jared Saunders (23)
17 Mako Vunipola (83)
18 Petrus Du Plessis (107)
19 Michael Rhodes (5)
20 Billy Vunipola (45)
21 Neil De Kock (239)
22 Tim Streather (25)
23 Ben Ransom (51)

Very much looking forward to watching Bath Saints and Wasps Chiefs, should be cracking games.

Scottrf wrote:15 Ben FODEN (capt)
14 Jamie ELLIOTT
13 George PISI
12 Luther BURRELL
11 George NORTH
10 JJ HANRAHAN
9 Kahn FOTUALI’I
1 Ethan WALLER
2 Mikey HAYWOOD
3 Kieran BROOKES
4 Michael PATERSON
5 Christian DAY
6 Jamie GIBSON
7 Teimana HARRISON
8 Sam DICKINSON

16 Reece MARSHALL
17 Alex WALLER
18 Paul HILL
19 Victor MATFIELD
20 James CRAIG
21 Lee DICKSON
22 Stephen MYLER
23 Ken PISI

So Elliott in for Tuala, Harrison for Wood and JJ starting.

Dunno how Khan is starting after the dismal display last week.

A few key players missing for this one. Agree about Khan, but they were horrible conditions.

Where is Corbisiero, is he injured again? Wood being rested?

Hanrahan will not give Saints the game management that Myler can and his place kicking not up to scratch, I hope Ford has an off day to match.

Looks like Saints are resting a lot of players prior to the Champions Cup games coming up.

Oh yeah missed that it's Ethan starting. Corbs is injured (a burn - back soon), Alex has put a few big shifts in so can see why he's rested.

Concerning that we have two of our first 3 hookers out, as well as Clark, Lawes, Fischer. Quite an inexperienced pack, not many of those forwards have played together for the first team.

Is Hartley back yet, I was sort of expecting him to bench at least this week.

Lawes seems to be taking a long time for what was initially reported as a niggle

JJ back!!!!!!!

Interesting that Ellis seems to have leapfrogged Ewels and Spencer in the second row, especially as he is still technically in the academy and the others have moved to the senior squad.

I think Spencer is permanently injured. Just like that other young second row we had who had to retire at like 24 and also Ben Williams, who retired at 26.

Sadly I think you might be right. Thinking about it Ewels might be dual registered this season, so with Hooper and Day out, Ellis might be the last man standing.

killer938 wrote:Leicester Tigers (v Worcester Warriors, away, Saturday 3pm)
15 Telusa Veainu
14 Adam Thompstone
13 Peter Betham
12 Seremaia Bai
11 Vereniki Goneva
10 Owen Williams
9 Sam Harrison
1 Matias Aguero
2 Greg Bateman
3 Dan Cole
4 Ed Slater (c)
5 Graham Kitchener
6 Mike Williams
7 Tom Croft
8 Jordan Crane

Replacements
16 Tom Youngs
17 Marcos Ayerza
18 Fraser Balmain
19 Dom Barrow
20 Lachlan McCaffrey
21 Jono Kitto
22 Tommy Bell
23 Matt Smith

Fantastic to see Slater and Kitchener back playing together. Also nice to be able to rotate and rest O'Connor (assuming he is being rested) before the two games against Munster. Not sure about Croft at 7. Bit surprised they didn't put Cole on the bench as well as Ayerza with the games coming up but overall a strong team.

Cole starting may also be a response to the lack of O'Connor or McCaffrey in the back row. Allows us to retain some more pilfering in the pack.

I think it was fkaS who mentioned the possibility on the Tigers thread, Balmain on the bench may also be a desire to see how he goes with Ayerza and Youngs alongside him. Often as second choice TH he comes on at a similar time to those two being subbed off. Going on at a similar time to them (I expect they may be subbed as a unit) will allow us a good look at where he is compared to Cole.

Is it just me or have line-outs gone the same way as scrum put-ins? i.e. the vast majority nowhere near straight?

Surely a penalty try? Hibbard pulls the maul down as it is marching towards the try line. Hibbard YC, but Sale can't capitalise.

Heaf wrote:Is it just me or have line-outs gone the same way as scrum put-ins?  i.e. the vast majority nowhere near straight?

no not really, all short throws are i suppose.

Should of been a penalty try to Sale there

Haley has been consistently good for Sale this season, I know England are blessed with full backs but I wonder if he might be a Saxons option?

makes me laugh how LD goes on about something that never actually happened.

IS there any need for that? RE: The late hit on Stringer.

Cumbrian wrote:IS there any need for that? RE: The late hit on Stringer.

no and i have no idea why the glous supporters are moaning about the call.

Stringer suckered May into it by hiding, refusing to give up the ball. Fair penalty though.


Other than that I feel Doyle has been exceedingly one eyed, penalising glaws for things 9correctly) but allowing Sale to do the same things.

Not bad at all from Afoa at the linenout!

Try for Gloucester every day of the week.

Heaf wrote:Is it just me or have line-outs gone the same way as scrum put-ins?  i.e. the vast majority nowhere near straight?

Taylor has not thrown one down the middle all game. He either stands level with his players and throws it straight, or when the AR forces him to stand in the middle he throws crooked.

best play with hibbard of the pitch lol

what exactly did he do wrong there?

Boneheaded from Ioane to be penalised, but not a lot in it... Harsh call

36 well in at the side then

Looked forward to me...

have to say, this ref is really favouring glous here

Maybe not, reckon it should be given.

shouldn't of been given, 36 was in at the side of a ruck about 2 phases ago

Do the Gloucester fans know the rules? It was clearly charged down meaning everybody was onside yet they still moan really loudly...

LondonTiger wrote:

Heaf wrote:Is it just me or have line-outs gone the same way as scrum put-ins?  i.e. the vast majority nowhere near straight?

Taylor has not thrown one down the middle all game. He either stands level with his players and throws it straight, or when the AR forces him to stand in the middle he throws crooked.

so not just me then

hardly surprising they've won 15 out of 16 according to the commentator ...

Glous defence well on top here

36 with 4 blokes on the outside and he goes for contact

Haley for England! Bandwagon starts here!

Cumbrian wrote:Do the Gloucester fans know the rules?  It was clearly charged down meaning everybody was onside yet they still moan really loudly...

actually I think you may be wrong ... only the kicker's team are put on side, the charger-down's team are offside if they are in front of him and play the ball ...

I fail to see your argument, Sale kicked the ball and Gloucester charged down and the Glos fans shouted about Sale players being offside. They were wrong.

JP Doyles decisions at the breakdown have been just bizarre today.

ah sorry - I thought you were talking about the reverse situation - you're right - ignore me that's what happens where you're watching with a delay ...

Great try by Sale, can't believe 36 cocked it up that badly.

Heaf wrote:ah sorry - I thought you were talking about the reverse situation - you're right - ignore me  that's what happens where you're watching with a delay ...

No worries.

....just kidding

I thought it was just me that spotted that obvious obstruction by Sale before AH mentioned it ...

Heaf wrote:I thought it was just me that spotted that obvious obstruction by Sale before AH mentioned it ...

i don't get how it was though, he wasn't moving at all. i think the glous players went looking for it - they were trying to play the ref all evening.

nathan wrote:

Heaf wrote:I thought it was just me that spotted that obvious obstruction by Sale before AH mentioned it ...

i don't get how it was though, he wasn't moving at all. i think the glous players went looking for it - they were trying to play the ref all evening.

Interestingly I had the opposite impression. I felt Sale spent much of the game trying to buy penalties.