Aviva Premiership Round 15

First topic message reminder :

I couldn't see a topic this week so I thought I'd make one.

Friday 4th March
Newcastle Falcons v Worcester Warriors  - BT SPORT - KO 19:45

Saturday 5th March
Sale Sharks v Harlequins - KO 2:30 pm
Gloucester V Wasps - KO 3 pm
Bath v London Irish - KO 3:15 pm
Saracens v Northampton Saints - KO 3:15pm BT SPORT

Sunday 6th March
Leicester Tigers v Exeter Chiefs - KO 3pm BT SPORT

Burrell did touch it.

Should have been Sarries scrum.

Could be crucial.

perhaps I am overly harsh on the ref. I just think he's been poor.

Why on earth isn't Barnes looking after this one?

Quins get losing bp away at Sale. On the one hand it was an improved performance (bar Hopper who was dreadful) on the other we were in the lead then ended up losing.

Also Yarde looks like he may have broken his arm/wrist and Botica may have tweaked his hamstring...

15 -17

Quins might struggle now unless COS has some medical jokers up his sleeve, will be tough esp with Super rugby started

beshocked wrote:Burrell did touch it.

Should have been Sarries scrum.

Could be crucial.

perhaps I am overly harsh on the ref. I just think he's been poor.

Why on earth isn't Barnes looking after this one?

A Sarries scrum is the one thing I couldn't be as they knocked on initially

beshocked wrote:Ref = MVP for Saints.

MVP?

Burrell knocked on not Sarries.

Rarely get the rub of the green vs Saints if ever.

Well done Saints, a deserved win against an admitidly weakened Sarries side

Sorry I meant what does MVP mean - not one I'm familiar with?

beshocked wrote:Burrell knocked on not Sarries.

Rarely get the rub of the green vs Saints if ever.

As usual Beshocked your watching a different game. The Sarries player knocked on before Burrell; in my opinion didn't touch it, hence offside when the ball was picked up

Heaf wrote:Sorry I meant what does MVP mean - not one I'm familiar with?

Most valuable player.

Most valued player.

To be fair on reflection Saints deserved to win but don't think it helps when you have an atrocious ref.

The Saints tries weren't great pieces of skill - they came from the ref's whistle.

I hate it when a ref dominates. It was a dire game.

Ball went backwards well past it.

Makes me worry that Joubert might ping England off the field.

WELL-PAST-IT wrote:

beshocked wrote:Burrell knocked on not Sarries.

Rarely get the rub of the green vs Saints if ever.

As usual Beshocked your watching a different game. The Sarries player knocked on before Burrell; in my opinion didn't touch it, hence offside when the ball was picked up

Rubbish from beshocked. Ref should have binned another saracen in the first half for continuous cynical play. Saints were clearly better. Saracens refused to release the tackled players and George's darts were shocking I'm sorry to say.

Pretty poor game but Saints pressured Saracens who kept compounding errors.

Can't go backwards if he is facing forwards with the ball in front of him, bounced backwards yes.

Agree none of the tries were masterpieces, but at least Saints did score tries, apart from a 10 minute spell in the first half, Sarries didn't look like crossing the line.

Disagreed with MotM, thought it should be Wood, he was the one cutting down the dangerous Sarries runners all game as well as carrying

Bathman_in_London wrote:

Heaf wrote:Sorry I meant what does MVP mean - not one I'm familiar with?

Most valuable player.

Ah thanks

Actually I think it did hit the Sarries player's hand an go backwards so it should either have been a scrum to Sarries if Burrell touched it or a penalty to Saints if he didn't (as the Sarries player that picked it up was off-side if Burrell didn't touch it).  I couldn't tell however whether Burrell touched it or not.

Greenandpleasantland surprised he didn't YC another but he pinged Saracens again and again.

Saints weren't clearly better. Only scored your tries because of the penalties and YC.

He pinged Saracens becaus they refused to release the players when they made a tackle. Saracens never really threatened Saints line. The set piece for Sarries was a mixed bag. Okay scrum but awful line out. Defence from Sarries was poor which had seemed a trend in the last month.
If you give penalties and make mistakes because of pressure then you can't claim to be doing well.

Isn't that the name of the game, you keep dropping mauls on your line, you will get pinged repeatedly. Tackle and don't roll away you will get pinged, handle the ball on the ground a couple of metres out your will get pinged, wrong man YC, but Sarries were cynical about giving away penalties close to their line. Had Barnes been reffing, I suspect the YC count would have been a lot higher.

You do realise that all Sarries points came from penalties

Well past it i don't like to blame the ref but I felt like this ref wanted to be the star on this occasion.

George did struggle with the darts but then again he's barely played with Hamilton and Smith recently.

I agree Saracens didn't look like scoring but when you strip a pack of 4 of its best players, have a 3rd choice 10, first choice 15 etc it makes it a little harder.

Why didn't they play Goode at 10? He must be better than Morte who had a poor game and the biggest brain fart I can remember to finish it.

I have every sympathy for Saracens missing so many players. I've never had a high opinion of Mordt. It looked to me like Saracens lacked someone to really lead them whereas Saints had their main leaders on the park.
In the first half Saints helped Saracens by keeping dropping the ball to let pressure off in the 1st quarter but when they held on and cranked into the 22 Saracens buckled and overcommitted at the breakdown.
Tbh a pretty common trait with most AP teams and with England.

Greenandpleasantland Saints did not releasing of their own but didn't get pinged to the same degree.

If Barnes was in charge there would have been more clarity and consistency.

Did you not think the scrum was a mess?

A ref has a responsibility, I thought he was sub par.

I am not saying that every penalty was unwarranted. Just felt Saints got the rub of the green.

It doesn't help when you have an inexperienced ref in charge.

I would say it was a bit of both really - poor discipline from Sarries and a lack of consistency from the ref.

Hamilton for example = muppet.

Agree Mordt is poor. Goode did the playmaking role better.

They got the rub because they adapted to what the ref wanted to see at the breakdown. He was consistent at what he was saying.
Thank scrums were a mess as they always are. The ref has to implement the laws and you have both sides who are trying to cheat. Soft engages different binds and then hitting in and driving on an angle or up. Nearly every scrum has something that could be penalised.
I think the big reason Saints got the rub was the experienced guys working out how far they could go.
And I have to agree Mordt at 10 over Goode??? Just no

G&PL, not an MK person by any chance?

Welly wrote: Quins might struggle now unless COS has some medical jokers up his sleeve, will be tough esp with Super rugby started

Yea fingers crossed he has a cunning plan...

If Botica has to miss even a week then we literally don't have a fly half. I don't know if any Prem teams ever had to play without a 10 before.

yappysnap wrote:

Welly wrote: Quins might struggle now unless COS has some medical jokers up his sleeve, will be tough esp with Super rugby started

Yea fingers crossed he has a cunning plan...

If Botica has to miss even a week then we literally don't have a fly half. I don't know if any Prem teams ever had to play without a 10 before.

A couple of years ago we had to play with Tindall at 10

yappysnap wrote:

Welly wrote: Quins might struggle now unless COS has some medical jokers up his sleeve, will be tough esp with Super rugby started

Yea fingers crossed he has a cunning plan...

If Botica has to miss even a week then we literally don't have a fly half. I don't know if any Prem teams ever had to play without a 10 before.

we've been doing it for a while now ...

HongKongCherry wrote:

yappysnap wrote:

Welly wrote: Quins might struggle now unless COS has some medical jokers up his sleeve, will be tough esp with Super rugby started

Yea fingers crossed he has a cunning plan...

If Botica has to miss even a week then we literally don't have a fly half. I don't know if any Prem teams ever had to play without a 10 before.

A couple of years ago we had to play with Tindall at 10

We had Mele and Harrison switching between 9 and 10 the other season. It didn't go well. Harrison defended at 10 and Mele attacked from 10. Everyone was a little confused.

WELL-PAST-IT wrote:G&PL, not an MK person by any chance?

Yes I do live in the land of the concrete cow.
And very nice it is too

greenandpleasantland wrote:

WELL-PAST-IT wrote:G&PL, not an MK person by any chance?

Yes I do live in the land of the concrete cow.
And very nice it is too

We lived there for about 15 years, our kids (in their 30s now) still do.

I played my last ever game of rugby for MK 2nd XV in 2002, when I decided I was well past it and off the pace. Hence the name.

Wasn't someone talking about Robbie Nairn a few weeks back?? Well it looks like he may be starting for Quins next week as Yarde's out with a dislocated shoulder.

Beshocked ever considered that the team defending for large periods is bound to struggle with the ref. Especially when that team is unable to defend mauls legally.

Come on guys get with the script, sarries never deserve to lose the prl should just do the right thing and crown them champions now before they have to endure any more unfair treatment.

Hopefully that would be one less thing for beshocked to moan about but I'm sure he'd find something wrong with the decision.

Anyway, moving on from the bickering....

peoples prediction for tigers/Exeter?

Unfortunately I'm going for an Exeter win

nathan wrote:Anyway, moving on from the bickering....

peoples prediction for tigers/Exeter?

Unfortunately I'm going for an Exeter win

Manu to show what we have been missing for the last 15(?) months and show fantastic form flattening everything in his path only to get a season ending injury 5 minutes before the end of the match

Sounds about right!

Mat Tait out with a groin injury, Bell to replace him

Exeter should be looking to won this. We are looking disjointed of late. Our front row resources are looking stretched and losing a leader like Tait in the back line will not help. The only positive is that Bell can kick for goal and will offer us a big kicking option at the back.

Given we have five jumpers in the line out and Thacker is normally a good thrower we should have a decent line out and hopefully can get our rolling maul going.

We've started ok, just think we are playing a bit loose at the moment

Didn't look like he used any arms in that tackle

Chiefs are blitzing Thacker. Clearly they are concerned about what he can do ball in hand and want to hit him early and drive him back.

Why oh why did we peel off the front instead of the rolling maul in their 22? We just ended up going backwards and had to milk a penalty. Low was a bit lucky given he used no arms in the tackle though not rolling away was a harsh call on him when he was held in.

Have they always shouted use it at a scrum?

You see refs call use it at scrums occasionally these days when it's clearly going nowhere but the attacking side insist on keeping it at the base.

Kitto is soooooo slow

king_carlos wrote:You see refs call use it at scrums occasionally these days when it's clearly going nowhere but the attacking side insist on keeping it at the base.

I like it, stops the attacking team just playing for a penalty

But he went behind the ball so he was offside

Not the best pass by manu

nathan wrote:

king_carlos wrote:You see refs call use it at scrums occasionally these days when it's clearly going nowhere but the attacking side insist on keeping it at the base.

I like it, stops the attacking team just playing for a penalty

Agree nathan. The best attacking ball you can get at phase 1 is if your set-piece is moving forward. Once the scrums moving forward I want to see the attacking team forced to use it more often.

If a defending side are under pressure and collapse, stand up, bore in, etc to prevent the opposition moving the scrum forward then absolutely penalise them. However it really annoys me when a struggling scrum are clearly trying to stay square and legal but get a penalty against them purely because the attacking side have kept the ball in at the base when it could have been used.

Great play there!!

That's the sort of basic finishing of a chance and slick hands that were so missing last season.

I like how he's calling use it quite early. Scrums are now much more attacking platforms as opposed to attempts to earn a penalty.

Two nice tries by us. Parling will be kicking himself. He did so well to come through the missing and then the temptation to slip his bind and attack the ball carrier was just too great.