We Go Again! The Premier League thread

[Crimey]

First topic message reminder :

This would be a huge day for Leicester if it stays like it is.

[Hammersmith harrier]

Manchester United won plenty with Wes Brown in the squad playing plenty of games but he barely played for England despite being more competent in his starting position than Milner, his inclusion would be pointless.

[Ent]

Brown would've played a lot for England if he could have stayed fit.

A utility man (whoever it is) allows an extra attacker or a luxury player to be brought.

[Hammersmith harrier]

There are far better utility players out there than Milner anyway, I cannot envisage any scenario when him coming off the bench is a viable or preferred option.

[Crimey]

There are far better utility players out there than Milner anyway, I cannot envisage any scenario when him coming off the bench is a viable or preferred option.

Who? People have suggested Eric Dier, who plays very different positions and can be brought up regardless. Phil Jones is atrocious.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

You can make an argument for utility players over the course of a 50 games season

For a 4/5 game tournament (at best for England) when you can literally pick two players for every position, there is no need

[Marky]

That's fine if you know your formation, but if you want to switch from 4-2-3-1 to 3-5-2 for example, you need versatile players to adjust accordingly.

[Hero]

That's fine if you know your formation, but if you want to switch from 4-2-3-1 to 3-5-2 for example, you need versatile players to adjust accordingly.

Don't tell Azzy that...

[Azzy]

That's fine if you know your formation, but if you want to switch from 4-2-3-1 to 3-5-2 for example, you need versatile players to adjust accordingly.

According to some, if a player normally plays one formation, he's completely unable to play in a different formation. So if England play anything other than 4-2-3-1 this summer, they will get beaten by every team they play - the players won't be able to adapt to something unfamiliar.

[Crimey]

That's fine if you know your formation, but if you want to switch from 4-2-3-1 to 3-5-2 for example, you need versatile players to adjust accordingly.

Exactly. Players who can only play one position are being left behind by modern football and the idea of taking a squad of specialities is ludicrous. It's a strength to have players who can allow you to adjust tactically, particularly if you can do that without having to make a substitution.

According to some, if a player normally plays one formation, he's completely unable to play in a different formation. So if England play anything other than 4-2-3-1 this summer, they will get beaten by every team they play - the players won't be able to adapt to something unfamiliar.

There is a degree of sense to this. Particularly if you switch from a back four to a back three. Unless the players are familiar with that system, it can be a real adjustment. Small changes aren't going to be particularly noticeable, but big changes do take a lot more training and drilling to make sure people are comfortable. Then it also depends on the footballing intelligence of the players, I think Milner has a better brain than he does technical ability, so he's somebody who can understand how to play in a new position, there are certain other players who are a bit dim footballing wise and so struggle when moved from their comfort zone.

[Azzy]

I'll be honest, the fact that Liverpool have used him so much this season should shame the Liverpool board. They'll never get back to the pinnacle of English football with the likes of Milner starting 30+ games each season.

This is an absolutely ridiculous statement. Manchester City had no problem winning two league titles with Milner in their squad and playing plenty of games, let us not forget City tried to keep him and he chose to leave. I actually think City would be in a better position if Milner was them right now.

Milner's last three seasons:

15-16: 1,990 minutes played, 5 goals, 7 assists (all season to date)
14-15: 1,741 minutes played, 5 goals, 8 assists
13-14: 1,359 minutes played, 1 goals, 7 assists

He's already played 50% more than he did two seasons ago, with 8 games left of the season - realistically, he could get to play double the amount he was for City. If he plays 90mins in each game left, he gets to 2,710 minutes - a 56% increase on last season and a 99% increase on two years ago.

A full 38 game season is 3,420 minutes - so last season Milner played 51% of the time, and two seasons ago he played 40% of the time. It's no wonder City won the league when he was only on the pitch for 40% of the time, and when he played more, they didn't.

[Soldier_Of_Fortune]

I'll be honest, the fact that Liverpool have used him so much this season should shame the Liverpool board. They'll never get back to the pinnacle of English football with the likes of Milner starting 30+ games each season.

This is an absolutely ridiculous statement. Manchester City had no problem winning two league titles with Milner in their squad and playing plenty of games, let us not forget City tried to keep him and he chose to leave. I actually think City would be in a better position if Milner was them right now.

Milner's last three seasons:

15-16: 1,990 minutes played, 5 goals, 7 assists (all season to date)
14-15: 1,741 minutes played, 5 goals, 8 assists
13-14: 1,359 minutes played, 1 goals, 7 assists

He's already played 50% more than he did two seasons ago, with 8 games left of the season - realistically, he could get to play double the amount he was for City. If he plays 90mins in each game left, he gets to 2,710 minutes - a 56% increase on last season and a 99% increase on two years ago.

A full 38 game season is 3,420 minutes - so last season Milner played 51% of the time, and two seasons ago he played 40% of the time. It's no wonder City won the league when he was only on the pitch for 40% of the time, and when he played more, they didn't.

He would walk into WBA's team

[Azzy]

I'll be honest, the fact that Liverpool have used him so much this season should shame the Liverpool board. They'll never get back to the pinnacle of English football with the likes of Milner starting 30+ games each season.

This is an absolutely ridiculous statement. Manchester City had no problem winning two league titles with Milner in their squad and playing plenty of games, let us not forget City tried to keep him and he chose to leave. I actually think City would be in a better position if Milner was them right now.

Milner's last three seasons:

15-16: 1,990 minutes played, 5 goals, 7 assists (all season to date)
14-15: 1,741 minutes played, 5 goals, 8 assists
13-14: 1,359 minutes played, 1 goals, 7 assists

He's already played 50% more than he did two seasons ago, with 8 games left of the season - realistically, he could get to play double the amount he was for City. If he plays 90mins in each game left, he gets to 2,710 minutes - a 56% increase on last season and a 99% increase on two years ago.

A full 38 game season is 3,420 minutes - so last season Milner played 51% of the time, and two seasons ago he played 40% of the time. It's no wonder City won the league when he was only on the pitch for 40% of the time, and when he played more, they didn't.

He would walk into WBA's team

And I, all my fellow Albion fans, my cat, my dead grandma, the postman, Goran Ivanisevic, the Pope and the Albion board would all be disgusted with themselves.

Face it - if James Milner is good enough to play more than 50% of your team's games, you're not a big club. He's the very epitome of averageness, the kind of 'it'll do' Britishness that the likes of Liverpool, United and Chelsea in the past have abhorred. If Liverpool feel Milner is worth playing, that speaks volumes to their ambitions as a club.

[Crimey]

Milner would immediately be West Brom's best player, nobody would be disgusted, it'd be a coup!

That's ludicrous considering as Milner played an important role in City's squad, you can talk all you want about percentage of games played, but it was clear to everybody that Milner was important to Manchester City (hence why they wanted to keep him) and they did fine as a "big club".

What Milner does well is that he is consistently good, he doesn't often produce amazing performances, they do happen, but not regularly, but he's generally reliably good. The best squads have always had players like Milner and they will continue to do in the future.

[Ent]

You can make an argument for utility players over the course of a 50 games season

For a 4/5 game tournament (at best for England) when you can literally pick two players for every position, there is no need

Pl squads are bigger and can be changed in January.

The utility player allows an extra attacker, young player or someone with a slight injury to be taken (for example).

[Azzy]

Milner would immediately be West Brom's best player, nobody would be disgusted, it'd be a coup!

That's ludicrous considering as Milner played an important role in City's squad, you can talk all you want about percentage of games played, but it was clear to everybody that Milner was important to Manchester City (hence why they wanted to keep him) and they did fine as a "big club".

What Milner does well is that he is consistently good, he doesn't often produce amazing performances, they do happen, but not regularly, but he's generally reliably good. The best squads have always had players like Milner and they will continue to do in the future.

Saido Berahino would have something to say about that opening statement. As would his agent and his twitter feed...

Darren Fletcher is also a better player, in my opinion. I'd rather have one Fletcher than three Milners. You can make outlandish statements all you want, but the statistics don't lie. City played better without him in the team.

If Milner was so consistently good, then why was he playing in half (or less) of City's games? It's not like Fernando, Navas, Fernandinho or Nasri have been ripping up trees. They signed a better player (Delph) to replace him too. If he was so good, City would have used him more, and kept him. The fact they didn't, and let him move to a 'rival' (as if, really), shows his true worth. As does the fact he signed with Liverpool rather than United, Arsenal, Chelsea or Spurs. He signed for the best club willing to pay him ludicrous amounts for his contributions.

Liverpool were conned, plain and simple.

[Crimey]

Darren Fletcher is nowhere near as good as James Milner, if you genuinely think that I may as well stop debating the point as I can't take anything else you say seriously.

Because Manchester City rotated their squad a fair bit and he's not as good as Fernandinho, Yaya Toure or David Silva and about as good as Nasri and Navas. I wouldn't stop Milner for Delph, particularly as Delph has shown time and time again across his career that he can't stay fit.

They didn't "let him go", they wanted to keep him, Milner wanted to leave. They offered him a lot of money to stay but he turned it down. That shows his "true worth".

He wasn't likely to sign for Manchester United, for obvious reasons, nor Spurs who haven't signed a player in that age bracket for a while. Chelsea and Arsenal both have a lot of players who play in his positions. Not to mention the fact that Arsenal were actually heavily linked with him.

[Azzy]

He wasn't likely to sign for Manchester United, for obvious reasons, nor Spurs who haven't signed a player in that age bracket for a while. Chelsea and Arsenal both have a lot of players who play in his positions. Not to mention the fact that Arsenal were actually heavily linked with him.

Obvious reasons that stopped Carlos Tevez from moving to City? Owen Hargreaves? Andy Cole? Andrei Kanchelskis? Denis Law? With United's midfield as shallow as it is, and with them having such injury problems the last few years, surely someone like Mr Utility himself would be the best signing United could make?

Spurs haven't signed a player aged 29 for a while...so they didn't sign Michel Vorm (31) last season? Federico Fazio (28)?

All teams have players in the LB, RB, DM, CM, AM, RM, LM positions. Apparently only James Milner can do it all. Why sign 7 players, one for each position, when Milner would suffice and he's so consistently good?

Arsenal have been heavily linked with about 100 players, every day, since the Emirates was paid off. They must sign less than 1% of the players linked to them.

If Milner is so consistently good, and his versatility is so valuable, why was the biggest team to go in for him Liverpool, who haven't won the league for 26 years and counting? The figures show that the more he plays, the less you win, so it cannot have been to vie for the title. Maybe Liverpool were aiming for Wenger's 4th place spot.

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Id rather Fletcher this season, thats for sure. In fact, id rather him at his peak than Milner at his peak

[Crimey]

Id rather Fletcher this season, thats for sure. In fact, id rather him at his peak than Milner at his peak

Which is ridiculous, Fletcher is slow, worse range of passing, less ability to press, can't cross and has been a below average player ever since he came back from his stomach injury.

Milner is starting at full back tonight, I guess it'll put my theory to the test.

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Id rather Fletcher this season, thats for sure. In fact, id rather him at his peak than Milner at his peak

Which is ridiculous, Fletcher is slow, worse range of passing, less ability to press, can't cross and has been a below average player ever since he came back from his stomach injury.

Milner is starting at full back tonight, I guess it'll put my theory to the test.

Yeah, thats nonsense Crimey. Fletcher has been excellent for West Brom this season, an absolute general and up there with their best performers, and was an excellent player for Manchester United.

[Crimey]

Id rather Fletcher this season, thats for sure. In fact, id rather him at his peak than Milner at his peak

Which is ridiculous, Fletcher is slow, worse range of passing, less ability to press, can't cross and has been a below average player ever since he came back from his stomach injury.

Milner is starting at full back tonight, I guess it'll put my theory to the test.

Yeah, thats nonsense Crimey. Fletcher has been excellent for West Brom this season, an absolute general and up there with their best performers, and was an excellent player for Manchester United.

It doesn't surprise me that you rate Fletcher, considering your allegiances.

[westisbest]

With the good news of Fox and co leaving, let's hope there is some good news on the pitch.

Ah and look we are on sky this evening.

Now that will please everyone

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Id rather Fletcher this season, thats for sure. In fact, id rather him at his peak than Milner at his peak

Which is ridiculous, Fletcher is slow, worse range of passing, less ability to press, can't cross and has been a below average player ever since he came back from his stomach injury.

Milner is starting at full back tonight, I guess it'll put my theory to the test.

Yeah, thats nonsense Crimey. Fletcher has been excellent for West Brom this season, an absolute general and up there with their best performers, and was an excellent player for Manchester United.

It doesn't surprise me that you rate Fletcher, considering your allegiances.

To who?

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Wrong time to play Arsenal. Out of the cup, CL and title race; this is when Arsenal start to play

[Duty281]

Glorious goal from Arsenal.

[1GrumpyGolfer]

Should it have been a penalty on Sanchez or will this just encourage players to make the most of any contact in the box

[Duty281]

Two-zip. 8 points to make up in 8 games.

[guildfordbat]

Two-zip. 8 points to make up in 8 games.

Duty - not impossible but that's a lot to make up in relatively few games. Arsenal would certainly benefit if Palace could do them a favour now by beating Leicester.

[Hero]

Alex Iwobi, can Wenger ruin him like so many prodigal talents before him?

[Soldier_Of_Fortune]

I'll be honest, the fact that Liverpool have used him so much this season should shame the Liverpool board. They'll never get back to the pinnacle of English football with the likes of Milner starting 30+ games each season.

This is an absolutely ridiculous statement. Manchester City had no problem winning two league titles with Milner in their squad and playing plenty of games, let us not forget City tried to keep him and he chose to leave. I actually think City would be in a better position if Milner was them right now.

Milner's last three seasons:

15-16: 1,990 minutes played, 5 goals, 7 assists (all season to date)
14-15: 1,741 minutes played, 5 goals, 8 assists
13-14: 1,359 minutes played, 1 goals, 7 assists

He's already played 50% more than he did two seasons ago, with 8 games left of the season - realistically, he could get to play double the amount he was for City. If he plays 90mins in each game left, he gets to 2,710 minutes - a 56% increase on last season and a 99% increase on two years ago.

A full 38 game season is 3,420 minutes - so last season Milner played 51% of the time, and two seasons ago he played 40% of the time. It's no wonder City won the league when he was only on the pitch for 40% of the time, and when he played more, they didn't.

He would walk into WBA's team

And I, all my fellow Albion fans, my cat, my dead grandma, the postman, Goran Ivanisevic, the Pope and the Albion board would all be disgusted with themselves.

Face it - if James Milner is good enough to play more than 50% of your team's games, you're not a big club. He's the very epitome of averageness, the kind of 'it'll do' Britishness that the likes of Liverpool, United and Chelsea in the past have abhorred. If Liverpool feel Milner is worth playing, that speaks volumes to their ambitions as a club.

.........whatever

[Guest]

Chelsea 0-1 WHU - Lanzini
Watford 0-1 Stoke - John Boy Walters

[Guest]

Crystal Palace 0-1 Leicester - Mahrez

[Guest]

Chelsea 1-1 WHU - Francesc Fabregas

[Guest]

Chelsea 1-2 WHU - Carroll
WBA 0-1 Norwich - Brady (Just an awful, awful, awful result, if it stays that way)

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Been robbed here.

[Guest]

Lose to Sunderland tomorrow & we are absolutely gone. Pulis & the WBA players should be shot

[Dolphin Ziggler]

I love this team. Been the better side and been robbed. Not even sure it's a pen, think the foul is outside, but they've had a freekick and a pen to keep us from winning and we've had chances.

If we hadn't had that huge injury spell I think we'd be comfortably top four

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

First away game I've seen us win in over two years

Brilliant defensive performance - Timm Klose is a hero

[Mackem]

If tomorrow's game wasn't big enough that Norwich result has made it huge. A must win for both teams now.

[westisbest]

Not the worst first half I have seen us play.
Just nobody to put the ball in the net.

We need to score first in second half.

[Ent]

Unreal from Leicester.

7 games to go, minimum of 5 points clear.

Think 5 wins and 2 draws clinches it regardless of what the others do (math...)

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Outrageous refereeing that by Madley

[Hammersmith harrier]

There are far better utility players out there than Milner anyway, I cannot envisage any scenario when him coming off the bench is a viable or preferred option.

Who? People have suggested Eric Dier, who plays very different positions and can be brought up regardless. Phil Jones is atrocious.

Can only assume you haven't watched Tottenham play much then, the only time you bring Milner on is to shore up the midfield in the second half but Dier as well Carrick are more accomplished in that role. Your mentioning of the Jones highlights is purely a club bias thing.

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Lot more reports of Jose having signed a pre-contract deal with Man United.

Don't talk to me about refereeing today...getting sick of playing against 12 men if we go to the "big" sides

[Ent]

Just in your head, refs are bad for all teams.

Phil Jones is atrocious.

[Hammersmith harrier]

Id rather Fletcher this season, thats for sure. In fact, id rather him at his peak than Milner at his peak

Which is ridiculous, Fletcher is slow, worse range of passing, less ability to press, can't cross and has been a below average player ever since he came back from his stomach injury.

Milner is starting at full back tonight, I guess it'll put my theory to the test.

Yeah, thats nonsense Crimey. Fletcher has been excellent for West Brom this season, an absolute general and up there with their best performers, and was an excellent player for Manchester United.

Fletcher is and always has been a better player than Milner.

[Dolphin Ziggler]

Just in your head, refs are bad for all teams.

Phil Jones is atrocious.

But it's evidently cost us the last two games. That's why I'm annoyed

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Lose to Sunderland tomorrow & we are absolutely gone. Pulis & the WBA players should be shot

Hmm I think you'll cause us trouble in a few weeks, and we rarely win back to back games. Keep the faith John

[Hammersmith harrier]

Just in your head, refs are bad for all teams.

Phil Jones is atrocious.

Point being Ent that every man and his dog knows Jones is awful but a Liverpool fan brings it up as some form of defence for the equally awful James Milner.

[Crimey]

James Milner is a lot, lot, lot better than Phil Jones.

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