Who will cross the Whitewash for England on 19th May?

by **LondonTiger** Tue 05 Apr 2016, 2:50 pm

England's summer opens with the first test against Sri Lanka at Headingley on 19th May

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Tue 05 Apr 2016, 3:09 pm

My team (injury permitting)

Cook, Hales, Ballance, Root, Taylor, Stokes, Bairstow, Ali, Broad, Wood, Anderson

I'd like to see them stick with Hales personally, think he's got the potential but will take time to figure it out. Ballance comes back in ahead of Compton for me, but then I'm probably the biggest Gary Ballance fan on earth.

Wood if fit comes into the side, if not then it's Finn.

Otherwise I think it picks itself - we had a good winter in tests, so wouldn't alter too much.

Name to watch for this summer....

Sam Hain of Warwickshire

by VTR Tue 05 Apr 2016, 3:14 pm

Its very odd to be thinking about Test cricket, until I read the OP I'd forgotten about that meek surrender in the final Test in SA, I suppose as it didn't matter to the series result then it won't live long in the memory.

I like the look of Olly's team to be honest so although not adding very much to the debate I'll have to say I would go with that.

I could always delete this post and put a team up captained by KP with Chris Jordan opening the bowling if anyone wants a bit of debate

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Tue 05 Apr 2016, 3:17 pm

Yeah I couldn't care less about a defeat in a meaningless test when the series was already won tbf

by Jetty Wed 06 Apr 2016, 1:28 am

Finn definitely ahead of Wood. One has a strike rate of 47.4 and the other 61.0. Anderson had played no cricket for 2 months before SA. Came back from the UAE 13 wickets at 15.51, best figures for any fast bowler playing 3 Tests there.

by guildfordbat Wed 06 Apr 2016, 9:44 am

As I mentioned on the Surrey thread the other week, a difficulty with this sort of thing is distinguishing between who you / I would pick and who you think the selectors will pick.

I would actually go for Buttler as wicket keeper. I noticed Buttler behind the stumps in the World T20 by largely not noticing him (if no one else does, MfC should understand that Wink

) and was fairly impressed with his glove work. He'll never be a Knott or a Russell but he's definitely moved a notch or two up the ladder. That together with his X-factor batting gets him into my team. If Bairstow is to come into contention for a place, it would be just as a batsman. That might seem a tad harsh on the Yorkie but there's little room for sentiment in my choices.

That all said, I don't think the selectors will go the same way. I reckon they currently see a split between the wicket keeping duties with Bairstow retaining his Test place and starting this summer.

Where I suspect the selectors will adopt the same line of thinking as me is in once more going for Ali to start. His record and reliability to date warrants that in my book. A poor start though could see Rashid pushing for his spot in the real team although I would need a lot more convincing that the leg spinner belongs in the Test side.

Another particular difficulty in choosing a team at this early stage (although it's still good fun Smile

) is knowing who will be fit at the time. Imo, it's a brave or foolish man who is betting now on either Wood or Finn to start a Test more than six weeks away!

by VTR Wed 06 Apr 2016, 10:52 am

Ok, I can't resist, here's my team for the first Test. I've tried to incorporate players that will get called for on social media if England have a bad session rather than going too over the top!

Cook (c) - but on last chance with the more dynamic Morgan snapping at his heels
Roy - has arrived on the international stage with that knock vs NZ and allows us to attack from the off
KP - need to stop cutting off our noses and get our best batsman in the team
Root
Taylor - for now, until we find a taller player
Stokes
Bairstow
Willey - our leading wicket taker at WT20 can't be left out, I also like the idea of including a left arm bowler just for the sake of it
Broad
Rashid - can definitely be the English Shane Warne in Tests after doing well in the Big Bash
Anderson

by Stella Wed 06 Apr 2016, 10:57 am

I stopped reading at KP :-)

He is still arguably our best player.......no he's not, Root is, but England are doing ok without him.

I'd go with:

Cook
Hales
Compton
Taylor
Root
Bairstow
Stokes
Ali
Broad
Finn
Anderson

by VTR Wed 06 Apr 2016, 12:02 pm

Stella wrote:I stopped reading at KP :-)

The man himself would very much welcome that Smile

by VTR Wed 06 Apr 2016, 12:05 pm

Back in the real world I wouldn't be too unhappy with that team, Bell and Ballance will be pushing for that number 3 slot, hard to see any other batsmen coming into the frame. One point I have to pick up though, are you batting Bairstow above Stokes because poor Ben took a bit of a knock recently?

Finn will play if fit, but if he and Wood are out I do wonder who comes in then. Woakes might get the nod being back in England, I am not sure who the options are after that. Plunkett? Footitt?

by Gooseberry Wed 06 Apr 2016, 12:14 pm

I think Bells goign to have to do something pretty strong early season to get a place personally.

Hales is a massive concern for me, it was a big mistake to stick him in over the winter (albeit one they felt forced into) which may have affected him come Wolrd Cup. Now hes "the man in" dropping him becomes harder.

Compton maybe hasnt done enough to garuntee himself a spot but it would be typical of Englands treatement of him to ditch him again ...despite doing no worse than all the others given a go in the top 3 over the last few years.

Which brings up Ballance. One minute golden boy, the next out on his ear, then the armchair pundits favoutrite (largely because he hasnt had the opportunity to get out horribly for England recnetly).

2 of 4 players, all of which have their question marks. Of them Bell is the easiest to exclude.

Willey I still dont get why hes exluded from tests when they were picking Footit simply to get a left armer in. If they want him to specialise in the short formats OK we accept that. Finn if hes fit I guess.

The rest of the team pretty much picks itself as things stand.

by guildfordbat Wed 06 Apr 2016, 12:15 pm

VTR wrote:Back in the real world I wouldn't be too unhappy with that team, Bell and Ballance will be pushing for that number 3 slot, hard to see any other batsmen coming into the frame. One point I have to pick up though, are you batting Bairstow above Stokes because poor Ben took a bit of a knock recently?

Finn will play if fit, but if he and Wood are out I do wonder who comes in then. Woakes might get the nod being back in England, I am not sure who the options are after that. Plunkett? Footitt?

Just wondering if someone else could pleasantly surprise you again! Whistle

by Stella Wed 06 Apr 2016, 12:17 pm

Not Jordan?

He represents absolutely no threat as a third seamer.

by Jetty Wed 06 Apr 2016, 12:24 pm

There's is a 10mph difference between Footitt and Willey. 14 at 36.50 or 76 at 23.63 last season.

I'd like to see Ballance back in the team.

by VTR Wed 06 Apr 2016, 12:27 pm

guildfordbat wrote:
VTR wrote:Back in the real world I wouldn't be too unhappy with that team, Bell and Ballance will be pushing for that number 3 slot, hard to see any other batsmen coming into the frame. One point I have to pick up though, are you batting Bairstow above Stokes because poor Ben took a bit of a knock recently?

Finn will play if fit, but if he and Wood are out I do wonder who comes in then. Woakes might get the nod being back in England, I am not sure who the options are after that. Plunkett? Footitt?

Just wondering if someone else could pleasantly surprise you again!

Ha, you have it in writing that Chris Jordan is now in my view "one of the first names on the T20 teamsheet". Absolutely no way in Tests though!

by **LondonTiger** Wed 06 Apr 2016, 2:14 pm

guildfordbat wrote:I would actually go for Buttler as wicket keeper. That might seem a tad harsh on the Yorkie but there's little room for sentiment in my choices.

by guildfordbat Wed 06 Apr 2016, 2:41 pm

As it's my team and the ECB's money, they can cough up to get Buttler out of his IPL contract.

by **LondonTiger** Wed 06 Apr 2016, 3:07 pm

by Jetty Wed 06 Apr 2016, 3:22 pm

What's he going to learn at the IPL? He's far better than ~~most~~ all of the players there already. Smile

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Wed 06 Apr 2016, 3:38 pm

I hadn't considered Guildfords thoughts on playing Bairstow as a specialist bat - definitely something I would consider, but considering they've essentially told Buttler to go play IPL clearly they don't think so

by VTR Wed 06 Apr 2016, 3:47 pm

Jetty wrote:What's he going to learn at the IPL? He's far better than ~~most~~ all of the players there already.

He will learn how to smash 50m DLF maximums off young Indian medium-pacers at the same time as working on his running between the wickets with players you are surprised to hear haven't retired, all whilst being told Lendl Simmons is the better player

by guildfordbat Wed 06 Apr 2016, 3:47 pm

My own take is that like many things, it's a case of finding a sensible balance.

Rashid playing competitive white ball cricket a little while ago rather than being a drinks waiter for the Test side was a good move on all sides.

However, I can't go along with someone playing in the IPL if that shuts the door on a likely Test place. That to my mind is giving undue priority to the limited overs side of the game. I'm sure most would feel the same if come 19th May your Saint Joe was in the IPL to improve his one day game rather than lining up in the England Test team against Sri Lanka. To be fair, if it wasn't for Buttler being in my Test side, I wouldn't have an issue. I guess the England selectors are agreed on Bairstow over Buttler in Tests. I just feel that's probably wrong and certainly premature.

As a bit of an aside, Jason Roy's 2015 Surrey contract prevented him playing in the IPL as the Club wanted him to develop his game in all formats. That didn't seem to do him any harm in this year's T20 World Cup.

As a further aside, I'm no fan of Strauss in his current role. Far too oily for my liking.

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Wed 06 Apr 2016, 3:56 pm

Too oily? You'll have to explain that to me Guildford Smile

by guildfordbat Wed 06 Apr 2016, 4:01 pm

Only one letter but all the difference in the world between ''oily'' and you, Olly! Very Happy

The former is too slick and too smooth.

by Mad for Chelsea Wed 06 Apr 2016, 4:08 pm

Re Buttler's keeping in the T20, I tend to agree with guildford's assessment that you noticed him by not noticing him. I can't recall any dropped catches, byes (I think NZ managed one in the last over) or wides that went for extras. He was neat, tidy and quietly efficient. One small blot with a missed half-chance to stump Williamson off a leg side wide from Rashid in the semi, where he didn't quite collect the ball cleanly - not in the sense that he fumbled, but that he took a split-second longer to get the ball under control than he would have with a clean take, and that allowed Williamson to get back. I would have backed say Dhoni to make that 9 times out of 10, but no other (international male) keeper more than 5 out of 10 or so, hence half chance. Then you could talk about not quite getting his fingers under the Samuels edge in the final, but a bottom-edged cut shot like that is one of the harder takes, the spin on the ball means it's dying on you all the way and it's really difficult to get to it. No blame for Buttler from me there. So not quite un-noticed, but I do keep an eye out for these things Very Happy

Having said that, I would still start Bairstow in the first Test. I saw enough improvement in SA to suggest he'll make a decent enough keeper long-term, he was setting his feet much better by the end of the tour certainly, and of course he scored shed-loads of runs.

On the IPL debate, I'm very happy for England's players to play there to develop their LO skills, in fact I think it's an excellent idea. I supported the idea of sending Rashid to play in the Big Bash rather than carry drinks on the SA tour. However, it's also clear to me that it should NOT take priority over Tests (or indeed any other form of international cricket). If for instance Bairstow was to suffer an injury which would see him miss the SL tests - which I obviously sincerely hope not - then I would very much expect the ECB to do what would be necessary to get Buttler back for them. That would probably, I imagine, just mean buying out the end of his contract or something.

by **LondonTiger** Wed 06 Apr 2016, 5:00 pm

by Gooseberry Wed 06 Apr 2016, 7:09 pm

[quote="Jetty"]What's he going to learn at the IPL? He's far better than ~~most~~ all of the players there already. Smile

[/quote

maybe he can come back with some tips for Stokes

by Jetty Thu 07 Apr 2016, 2:25 am

VTR wrote:
Jetty wrote:What's he going to learn at the IPL? He's far better than ~~most~~ all of the players there already.

He will learn how to smash 50m DLF maximums off young Indian medium-pacers at the same time as working on his running between the wickets with players you are surprised to hear haven't retired, all whilst being told Lendl Simmons is the better player

20/20s in India
Buttler 59.78
Kohli 47.81

Smile

by VTR Thu 07 Apr 2016, 8:00 am

Gooseberry wrote:
Jetty wrote:What's he going to learn at the IPL? He's far better than ~~most~~ all of the players there already. [/quote

maybe he can come back with some tips for Stokes

Ouch! I hope his mum doesn't read that comment....

by alfie Thu 07 Apr 2016, 1:20 pm

Would be rather unlike England to make extensive changes at the start of the summer - especially after a successful trip to SA. I agree several players (three of six batsmen!) need to score solid runs to maintain their spots but I'd be surprised if the top seven change for the first match - possibly one change if someone puts up a good case early and either Compton or Taylor don't start well ?
I see guildford championing Buttler ; and I agree he was pretty sound behind the stumps in the t20 - what I saw anyway - though I guess not that many balls actually come through to the keeper in that format ! But anyway I have no real problem with Buttler the keeper : never likely to be a Knott or an Evans but he might become a Stewart. Trouble is his batting at Test level looks a bit iffy...so I can't see him replacing Bairstow ; even though the latter could easily slot in at five as a batsman on his recent form. I certainly wouldn't rule a Buttler return out for the future ; but changing keepers again after such a short period makes no sense at all - one of the things the selectors have done well lately is give players a decent run in a position instead of chopping and changing as they always seemed to do in the 90s - and it seems to work better.

As for the bowlers I'd expect Ali Broad Anderson and either Wood or Finn - fitness permitting.

How boring : I'm suggesting a virtually unchanged team Smile

by Jetty Sat 09 Apr 2016, 2:26 am

5 players Cook thinks that could force their way into the England side this summer - Browne, Vince, Foakes, Ballance and C Overton. Doesn't sound like we will be having an unchanged team.

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Tue 12 Apr 2016, 11:05 am

So due to horrible circumstances we have a slot at number 5 available now

Who are the contenders to take it?

by Hammersmith harrier Tue 12 Apr 2016, 11:17 am

Really really disappointed for Taylor, had the potential to be a world class player in all forms of the game.

by VTR Tue 12 Apr 2016, 11:20 am

Olly wrote:So due to horrible circumstances we have a slot at number 5 available now

Who are the contenders to take it?

Could it mean Ballance comes into the position with Compton retained at 3?

Other options could be James Hildreth who always seems to be talked about without getting a chance. Jason Roy as an outside bet as the selectors clearly like him and might take the punt of investing in his potential?

by Gooseberry Tue 12 Apr 2016, 12:20 pm

Vince and Ballance are options, or bringing in a proper keeper and making Bairstow a specialist batsman.

by Gooseberry Tue 12 Apr 2016, 12:22 pm

Jetty wrote:5 players Cook thinks that could force their way into the England side this summer - Browne, Vince, Foakes, Ballance and C Overton. Doesn't sound like we will be having an unchanged team.

"All of my essex team mates, except Bopara"

by GSC Tue 12 Apr 2016, 12:47 pm

He had the sense to exclude Bopara at least

by king_carlos Tue 12 Apr 2016, 4:04 pm

Gooseberry wrote:
Jetty wrote:5 players Cook thinks that could force their way into the England side this summer - Browne, Vince, Foakes, Ballance and C Overton. Doesn't sound like we will be having an unchanged team.

"All of my essex team mates, except Bopara"

Only one of them is an Essex teammate...

by guildfordbat Tue 12 Apr 2016, 4:34 pm

Carlos - if you've read any of Gooseberry's posts about Jason Roy, you'll realise he won't let facts get in the way of a soundbite.

by king_carlos Tue 12 Apr 2016, 5:37 pm

My vote goes to bringing in Michael Bates as keeper and moving Bairstow up to 5, Ali up to 7... Wink

1.Cook (c)
2.Browne/Burns/Lees
3.Compton
4.Root
5.Bairstow
6.Stokes
7.Ali
8.Bates (wk)*
9.Broad
10.Wood/Finn
11.Anderson

Wicket keeper could also be abbreviated as (WK who can keep).

A reliable opener with good technique and temperament who can face pace bowling and a keeper who will take every chance... Shocked

by **Good Golly I'm Olly** Tue 12 Apr 2016, 5:56 pm

Ian Bell scores a century in the low scoring match between Hampshire and Warwickshire...

by KP_fan Tue 12 Apr 2016, 9:42 pm

so sorry to hear about Taylor....he was after the best test and ODI potential in Eng after Root
Fate...too harsh on him

by VTR Wed 13 Apr 2016, 7:57 am

Olly wrote:Ian Bell scores a century in the low scoring match between Hampshire and Warwickshire...

I suppose Taylor's retirement could open the way for Ian Bell to come back - they might want some more experience in there and he could slot in at 5 as he batted at 6 for many years - batting at 5 or 6 would not be a huge difference for such an experienced player

by CaledonianCraig Wed 13 Apr 2016, 8:52 am

Ian Bell would be a step backwards and a temporary measure given his age. Blood a younger player and bed him into the side - the best way forward.

by VTR Wed 13 Apr 2016, 9:22 am

CaledonianCraig wrote:Ian Bell would be a step backwards and a temporary measure given his age. Blood a younger player and bed him into the side - the best way forward.

Don't disagree - but I am trying to guess what the selectors will do rather than come up with what I would do. Otherwise I might suggest a team with a specialist keeper who is not anywhere near the England setup batting at number 8 Smile

by GSC Wed 13 Apr 2016, 9:31 am

If it were an Ashes series or tour of SA/India id consider Bell. I dont really see much benefit in bringing him back otherwise though. Hes had a pretty good England career, but its time to look to move on I think.

by Strings Philander Wed 13 Apr 2016, 9:50 am

I agree with Craig and GSC that Bell would be a step backward not in keeping with the progress the England team is looking to make across all disciplines, and would only be the right option if it was an Ashes summer. He will need to do a lot more than a ton against an Hampshire attack diluted by Topley's untimely injury, on what sounds like a pretty benign pitch despite the low score, to change my opinion on that.

I'd like to see England move on and Bell score hundreds galore in a great season for Warks

I'm not going to speculate on a replacement for Taylor yet though - it feels a little crass to start passing the poor guy's shirt on on the day he's had to make such a heartbreaking announcement. I'll give the County season a few more games yet and let the horrible news settle.

by alfie Thu 14 Apr 2016, 1:40 pm

I feel a bit like Strings on the tastefulness of filling Taylor's place before he has stepped out the door ; but obviously this thread is here to speculate on England's initial selection this summer so any vacancy affects the discussion.

So firstly I will take the opportunity to record my sympathy for the young man at his rotten luck in having a potentially fine career nipped in the bud . Obviously it is good that the condition was detected before he suffered a much worse fate than being prevented from playing cricket ; but that will be scant comfort in the short term for the loss of his status as an International cricketer. Hopefully he will use his undoubted intelligence to remain in the game in other ways , if that is what he wishes...and in any case I wish him well in whatever he does.
As fans we should be grateful we saw some of what he was capable , even as we regret what will now never be.

I do think the door is open now for a Bell recall , if he wants it enough and is able to convince the selectors he still has the required skills. (Considering the still rather unsettled top order I suspect the appeal of an experienced player at five will be a factor in their thinking)
Not saying it will happen - and frankly not sure what I personally want either. Other - younger - players have a chance to put their hands up ; and runs on the board. Reckon form and figures will be the decider.
One thing I don't think will happen will be the "easy" option of putting Bairstow back to five and installing another keeper. I know many doubt his prospects of ever nailing down the keeper's job for the long term (I'm not sure myself) ; but it would be a bit silly to switch now for convenience ; and risk finding that the "better keeper" , whoever that be , can't cut it with the bat at seven - and have to reverse again... And it would certainly be unfair to Bairstow. I think the keeper debate is for another day.

by ShankyCricket Thu 14 Apr 2016, 3:39 pm

Horrid news about Taylor, utterly awful Sad

by ShankyCricket Thu 14 Apr 2016, 3:40 pm

GSC wrote:If it were an Ashes series or tour of SA/India id consider Bell. I dont really see much benefit in bringing him back otherwise though. Hes had a pretty good England career, but its time to look to move on I think.

He averages 28 in India and 33 in Asia overall. He couldn't bat against spin in Asia at his peak, thats the last tour I'd consider him for!!

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