The next England manager

First topic message reminder :

As of this moment Gareth Southgate, heavy favourite since Woy wesigned, has declared himself not interested in succeeding Hodgson on a permanent nor interim basis.

So, who is the next England manager? Can we really get by with an interim job and hope Wenger will take it in a year? That would actually be better than pretty much anything I can think of, but is dreamland levels of unlikely.

Sir Alex Ferguson says Sam Allardyce is the obvious choice. If England want to go with an English manager.

With all due respect to SAF, he's not exactly got a great history predicting that stuff

Tbh he's probably right, which sums up how bad English managers are.

He loves Sam. Fergie loves the mates game. Sam would be great if we needed a draw in qualification

Roberto Mancini is in the running.

Just give it to Neil Warnock, the Press Conferences will be excellent

Give it Bielsa. Would be fun

I see Arrys cashed in all his chips with his mates in the media to get him involved with England.

That might just end my England interest.

What do you think would be so bad about Harry?

Aside from the fact he's 68, his record is mediocre in the extreme and his last job in English football was taking QPR down with a 3 man defense featuring Rio Ferdinand and Richard Dunne, not much really.

I wouldn't be upset if Klinnsman got it. Think it's too early for Howe. Allardyce probably the most qualified English manager, but don't think he'd be a positive move by the end of it.

It's going to be a crap appointment. We're having to embarrassingly consult the brains of Gary Lineker, Rio Ferdinand & Harry Redknapp about the appointment, because Martin Glenn admitted, 'I'm not a football man & have no idea what I'm doing'.

Going to end in tears

There's no doubt Harry should have got it when Roy was appointed. His time has now gone.

Don't think Harry should've ever got it to be honest

who then? Trouble is a lot of people don't like old Arry, which clouds judgement.

Roy didn't really deserve it. Yes he managed Switzerland in 1994 and then Inter, but after that he had one big job and failed. Harry on the other hand, got Tottenham into the CL, done ok, and got them playing good exciting Football. He 100% deserved it above any other English manager, at that time.

It's all about time, and that was his. Not now!

Roy's Fulham work trumps Harry's Spurs work every day of the week, for me.

That UEFA Cup run is severely underrated.

Redknapp was okay at Spurs but with the players he had probably shoulda done better.

If England need to go foreign then so be it.

Arry's achieved bugger-all in the game, for all his bluster.

Latest odds:

Jurgen 2/1
Big Sam - 9/2
Eddie Howe - 8/1
Glenn - 12/1
Hiddink - 14/1
'Arry - 16/1
Arsene - 20/1

Woy was a more realistic option to build a younger side and phase out some of the over the hill players. Imagine under Harry that Lampard, Gerrard, Cole etc would still be regulars and England would be an old boys club

I don't really buy the 'Klinsmann transformed the German national side' stuff. Would be a pretty average appointment, for me. Has struggled with USA over the last two years too, so not surprised he wants out. The only positive I can see, is that he has the balls to make a bold statement in selection, when he left Landon Donovan out of the WC squad. Maybe, he can tell Wayne to retire. The other options are pretty dire too, can't believe Frank De Boer has not been approached.

Michael O Neil.
Great job with NI.



What about a joint appointment?
An english manager with a foreign one. Who is another question.

GSC wrote:Woy was a more realistic option to build a younger side and phase out some of the over the hill players. Imagine under Harry that Lampard, Gerrard, Cole etc would still be regulars and England would be an old boys club

I think a lot of fans don't see that this was the main reason for going for a fairly low profile appointment and why Roy was kept on after the WC - this was always going to be a period of transition, and Roy has introduced a number of young players who will be the backbone of the next good England side.

We do though need to appoint a manager now who will get the team playing as a team - there's potential to be decent (and as Portugal prove, decent and a bit of luck can take you a long way), but as the Iceland game shows, while on paper our team is quite strong, you still need to maximise that tactically, in selection and in motivation.

What has Frank de Boer done? Everton fans were excited for him and I didn't get it and I can't see how he's an England manager.

Won four eredivisie titles, a modern coach & clued into modern tactics & approaches. Excellent at working with & developing youngsters at Ajax, which is essential now with Rashford, Barkley, Alli, Stones.......

Yet you favour Jurgen, who's achieved very little.

Think in terms of expectation, pressure & mindset, England and Ajax are worlds apart. Klinnsman is the best of a bad bunch for me having done a similar job at international level before, and having experience of the English game.

GSC wrote:having experience of the English game.

When we're in the second round of the WC in Russia, having Jurgen call on his experience of the English game in the mid 90's, albeit just a years stay at Tottenham, might just be the difference maker for us in 2018 & making the QF.

He's coached in Holland. And he bottled it on the last game of the season this year didn't he?

Klinsmann has that Germany time on his cv. I'd put that above some work in Holland. And not sure how de Boer is modern and Klinsmann isn't.

I also don't see why de Boer would want it. No link to the English game, young and has a lot more to do in club management. Klinsmann at least knows international management.

No point stating De Boer's failure last season or comparing them, Klinsmann isn't exactly void of failure himself in management.

It will probably be Jurgen, he's essentially going to get the job, not out of proven success, but just because he's got International management experience, whereas Big Sam & Howe don't have. Not exactly the reasons you want a manager to be appointed really, but that's how it is. Don't really see him taking us past that next hurdle, in my opinion.

No of course, but he has them the same as Jurgen so it's not like he's some genius we are blindly missing out on.

I think Klinsmann may be what we need. Arrogant, strong, a bit of experience but within his own framework and a man who does seem to care about top to bottom infrastructure.

And he's not Big Sam.

Allardyce is being interviewed this week.

I don't understand why Klinsmann is a popular choice, struggled with USA, completely failed at Bayern Munich, even his time at Germany is hard to judge. Some people give him almost all the credit, some people give him less. It's probably somewhere in between. I'm not sure why he's considered so qualified for the job though.

Without knowing the USAs setup for football all that closely, if it's tied to universities developing players like other sports there then Jurgen was fighting a losing battle to implement any kind of structure.

He's been under pressure in that US job for some time. He was slowly turning the US national side, into a eligible, German dominated squad & the homegrown players were being phased out.

One problem that may turn up is that the FA wants to keep the structure they already have; they think it's working based on the results in qualifying and are happy with it. Jurgen Klinsmann is known for bringing his own staff and ideas, so may not be happy working within this structure. Can see drama there.

We clearly read the same article last night. It was stating that as why Allardyce may be a favourite.

Allardyce as a step on from Hodgson is so sad it's funny. As Klinsmann gets his every step examined and reasons not to give him the job are thrown forward, somehow Sam is being guided as a positive thing. I don't get it. It honestly makes no sense to me that people would be happy with this happening

As much as I don't want JK, Big Sam would be depressing too. But maybe that is the direction of manager & style we have to go down now. Make us solid defensively & use our ingrained counter attacking strengths to our advantage, as Portugal did. It won't be pretty to watch, but nothing else is working.

I think it comes from wanting results, Allardyce does get results. I don't trust the FA to be competent enough to create a long-term vision with a manager who will stick around long enough to see that work. 

Like Liam says, I think it'd also be interesting to see England with a pragmatic manager in charge and one that won't be bullied like Hodgson was. Whilst it can often be frustrating to see a manager stick to their guns, it's better than the baffling approach Hodgson took, he had no plan, no style and no clue. I'd love to see if England could actually have more success going for pragmatic results rather than trying to be "noble." 

England definitely have a better squad than Portugal, Wales and Iceland and yet those sides got further, they also got further by admitting they couldn't compete with the better sides and so going for a more pragmatic style.

I don't think England are good enough to face France, Italy, Germany or Spain head on and beat them at their own game. They're in the bracket below. They should maybe accept that. It'd also probably help the defence, which is at the weakest it's been for as long as I can remember, by setting the team up to be more compact.

All Sam has ever done is stop teams from being relegated and promote teams. He like Roy had one big job and fluffed his lines, yet he's a winner. He isn't and his brand will take us back. For all that Roy done wrong, he did at least get us, at times, play some attacking Football.

Which never worked.

I'd actually like to see how England do if they put winning ahead of anything else.

I'm grateful for small mercies and was relatively happy with some decent Football.

Oh dear, never until now realised just how starved of coaching talent English football is. Much like Welsh rugby, the best candidates are always abroad. There's no such thing as an English Mourinho, Guardiola, Del Bosque or Low.

Hodgson, Redknapp, Southgate and Allardyce. My, that's a depressing list. FA need their heads looked at.

Not sure our squad is better than Portugal's...

Regardless, you are not looking at a man who puts winning above all else. Not losing is first, he didn't earn the catchphrase "respect the point" at our place for no reason. If international football were a league and we needed to get back up to a top 20 id hire Sam. There are parts of his management I like too. But he has lost jobs due to his lack of aspirations.

And is there where his case falls down for me. And a arguably why he isn't suited to the players he'll have. One - fans watch England for more than battling wins and solid points. Two - I think you need a man who coaches an ethos that people can pick up when they enter. Three - he will generally be coaching players from teams who are used to being asked to play attacking, aspirational football. His style will be quite the adjustment for them.

I'd definitely say England has a better squad than Portugal's, Ronaldo obviously trumps anything England has, but beyond that it's quite low on quality. First eleven wise I'd say Portugal have a few player who'd make England's side, but beyond that Portugal's depth is really poor.

Their defense is vastly superior. In fact most teams had a better defense than us.

Crimey wrote:I'd definitely say England has a better squad than Portugal's, Ronaldo obviously trumps anything England has, but beyond that it's quite low on quality. First eleven wise I'd say Portugal have a few player who'd make England's side, but beyond that Portugal's depth is really poor.

Raphael Guerriero walks past Rose, even Shaw, given how good his technical ability is. Pepe walks into our side, him & Bonucci are probably the two best CB's in Europe. Rui Patricio could be argued he's on a similar level to Hart. William Carvalho showed how classy he is during this tournament, definitely a step up on Eric Dier, as a defensive enforcer. Nani is a better player & has more goal threat than Sterling & Lallana. Then you have Renato Sanches.....he'd be walking into our side. Looking at a good four, maybe five players walking into our side.

A healthy Shaw is a step above Guerreiro to be honest. But he isn't at present.

LiamB wrote:

Crimey wrote:I'd definitely say England has a better squad than Portugal's, Ronaldo obviously trumps anything England has, but beyond that it's quite low on quality. First eleven wise I'd say Portugal have a few player who'd make England's side, but beyond that Portugal's depth is really poor.

Raphael Guerriero walks past Rose, even Shaw, given how good his technical ability is. Pepe walks into our side, him & Bonucci are probably the two best CB's in Europe. Rui Patricio could be argued he's on a similar level to Hart. William Carvalho showed how classy he is during this tournament, definitely a step up on Eric Dier, as a defensive enforcer. Nani is a better player & has more goal threat than Sterling & Lallana. Then you have Renato Sanches.....he'd be walking into our side. Looking at a good four, maybe five players walking into our side.

Nani is definitely not better than Sterling or Lallana. He played alright in this tournament, but he's not as good as either of them.

So 4 or 5 players getting into the first eleven, but just like I said, England have much better strength in depth. England's squad is much better than Portugal's.

GSC wrote:A healthy Shaw is a step above Guerreiro to be honest. But he isn't at present.

Guerriero is on another level to Shaw, typical 'only seen PL' response, the kind of thing which over hypes all English talent. Guerriero is technically superior, his passing & set-piece taking, are all on a level above Luke Shaw. Luke Shaw has zero end product. Borussia Dortmund have signed one of the best LB's around.

Since we're pointlessly throwing around stereotypes, this is the same kind of thinking that hypes players like Navas and Soldado to the moon because they're foreign, and foreigners are obviously classier players than English. Whereas Navas is around the same level as Aaron Lennon and Soldado was a complete flop in equal surroundings.

I'm throwing around the truth & what we've seen from Guerriero, that has showcased he's a better all-round package, than Shaw. You've just thrown in something random, to support your narrative.

Shaw has showcased great potential, in a short spell before injury. Good prospect, but from what I've seen & supported by Dortmund signing him, is that Guerriero is a vastly better technician & offensive option, than what Luke Shaw is.

England are crap and are always crap, why is there even a debate about a team that hasn't won a knock out game in 10 years and 1/7 in tournament football vs a team that have just won the European championships?