England in Bangladesh and India - The Winter Tours thread

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

First topic message reminder :

A bit early, but with squads due to be announced next week thought I'd start a thread to collate all winter tours news...

Firstly it appears the Bangladesh tour will go ahead despite security concerns. I for one am glad of this, gives England a chance to acclimatise to Asian conditions against an improving Bangladesh outfit (especially as England have no planned tour matches in India)

Secondly - it appears Haseeb Hameed will be getting the nod for Bangladesh according to Nick Hoult - http://www.telegraph.co.uk/cricket/2016/08/29/england-plan-to-call-up-teenage-opener-haseeb-hameed-for-banglad/

Peoples initial thoughts on that?

[msp83]

Should say a bit surprised with Bangladesh selections. While Mosaddek Hossain does have unarguable domestic numbers in his favor, can't quite figure out why Nassir Hossain is not playing. In their great run last year, Nassir's all-round contributions, particularly with the ball wherein he has evolved considerably, were important. Musharraf Hossain has had a few good domestic seasons, but think they should have gone in with Nassir, who's batting abilities would have been handier.......

[Gooseberry]

Duckett as a limited overs opener was a Lions thing, he blasted a ridiculous century in the role.
He also opens in the CC and was described as being on the tour as an "opener" because of the focus on the test team role. Of course with Hales out he could have been seen as a legit option for these game too, but all in its hardly an unreasonable position to not parachute him straight in to an unfamiliar role in his first international cap regardless of how well he did in the B team.

[Mad for Chelsea]

England looking sharp in the field so far, Bangladesh were pretty average.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

England looking sharp in the field so far, Bangladesh were pretty average.

Pretty average is a very kind way to put it MFC!!

[Mad for Chelsea]

Thought their ground fielding was pretty good, they made a few good stops, etc. Their catching was village though, I think it was at least four dropped catches?

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Bairstow off the field with a hip flexor injury

Not been a good day for Jonny

Meanwhile Rashid has recovered nicely from a shaky first two overs - massive fan of Billings dabbing after the catch too

[Mad for Chelsea]

Think Nass made a good point a few minutes ago: don't get why Moeen doesn't come around the wicket more to the right-handers, hasn't bowled a single dot ball to either of them in this spell so far I don't think..

[Mad for Chelsea]

Rashid with another, he has recovered well from that dicey start, though that was a very ordinary shot from Mushfiqur.

[Mad for Chelsea]

crikey that's some dew. Roy just planted his left foot shaping to throw the ball and you could see the water spring up

[Mad for Chelsea]

Kayes looks like he's really struggling with cramp, those last few attempts at running not looking too pretty... Big moment in the match this.

[Mad for Chelsea]

should the batsmen really be allowed drinks at the end of every over? or should the umpires be stepping in?

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

should the batsmen really be allowed drinks at the end of every over? or should the umpires be stepping in?

English batsmen weren't allowed it

[Mad for Chelsea]

Bit of a disappointing spell from Moeen that, completely unthreatening and too easy to milk. These two have played well to be fair, and look to have done enough for Bangladesh to see it home from here.

[Mad for Chelsea]

Now we're having another break for new socks!!! I feel like I'm channelling my inner Bumble at the moment, but for me Bangladesh have been allowed to take far too many breaks in this innings, dealing with the heat and humidity should be a part of the game. Over-rate is below 13 overs per hour at the moment which is a bit ridiculous.

Shakib has played quite beautifully, but not sure why England have insisted on banging the ball halfway down the pitch to him, surely that's feeding his strengths.

[Mad for Chelsea]

ANOTHER break...

[msp83]

Spectacular innings from Shakib and fine work from Imrul. But Shakib is cramping up now, will he continue, will he be able to see it through? Or is there a twist at the end?

[Mad for Chelsea]

Shakib promptly falls first ball after the latest break. It's another short ball and he pulls to midwicket. I'm still not convinced short is the answer to Shakib though. A third wicket for Ball, who's bowled pretty well.

[Mad for Chelsea]

and Ball strikes with his next ball too, Hossain with a golden blob, and Ball will be on a hat-trick. Time for a late twist?

[msp83]

Ball is turning it on for England! With 6 down, Bangladesh might just struggle to see it through, a chase they should have seen through. Can't blame Shakib for playing the big shot, he has been playing the short balls very well, and more importantly, it would have been difficult to run the singles and finish the chase though that should have been the ideal approach. Can England pull it back?

[Mad for Chelsea]

Rashid with a lovely set-up to get rid of Mortaza: first the googly spinning back in which the captain sees out, but it's followed by a ripping leg-spinner that turns and bounces and Mortaza can only feather it behind. Bangladesh still need 36 to win, now 7 down.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Bit of a disappointing spell from Moeen that, completely unthreatening and too easy to milk. These two have played well to be fair, and look to have done enough for Bangladesh to see it home from here.

Not sure why he's bowled out which means Rashid will likely have overs left unbowled

[Mad for Chelsea]

Rashid gets rid of Kayes! Kayes comes down the pitch, but Rashid (probably) sees him coming, fires it flat and wide of off stump, and Buttler completes a smart stumping. Called a wide, but a massive wicket for England, Bangladesh now 8 down!

[Mad for Chelsea]

Ah the leg-spinner bowling to the somewhat clueless looking tailender, a glorious sight for club cricket players all over the world. Maybe Buttler got it spot on in keeping Rashid back?

[Mad for Chelsea]

And now a run out! Rashid with the direct hit, England have been pretty good at those today, and this one brings a run out as confusion reigns in the batting side. Bangladesh needed 39 from 52 balls when Shakib got out, this has been a rather spectacular implosion.

[Mad for Chelsea]

And England complete the turnaround, Ball inducing an edge off a massive mow, and Buttler does well to dive forward and take the catch. 5 wickets for Ball on debut, best figures ever by an England debutant in ODIs tempting to give him MOM for that, though suspect it will go to Stokes.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

271-4 to 288 all out

That is quite the collapse!

Credit to England for continuing to believe and play hard in those conditions. Ball looked like he was gonna explode from overheating during that final over!!

[Mad for Chelsea]

Might as well post this here, since I'm not sure it's worth creating a new thread for the women's tour to the WI. England's women have just won the first of five ODIs. It was an extremely tense and exciting match, as low-scoring games can be. England scored just 149, and WI looked well set at 53/0 before England started chipping away, picking up wickets regularly to reduce them to 100/7. From there it ebbed and flowed, with England getting a wicket whenever WI looked like edging ahead, and Brunt eventually dismissed the last batswoman to see England win by five runs.

Also a wonderful trip down memory lane for me, as the lack of TV coverage (disappointing) meant the only way to follow the game was by listening on TMS. This is of course what I used to do in France before the days of the internet, though the audio quality has rather improved since then . Also, no interruption for the shipping forecast!

[msp83]

Bangladesh batting and have Imrul who scored a ton in the last game. They are 25-1 in th 7th over.
Good to see them bring Nassir Hossain back in. He's been pretty badly handled over the last couple of years. After Shakib, Mushfiqur and Tamim, he was the best talent to have emerged from the country. His batting has had the patches of consistency, but he is a player to be backed. And his bowling had come on significantly last year. His temperament might just have come in pretty handy for Bangladesh in the last game I feel.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

I know Jimbo is a huge fan, but at this moment in time James Vince just isn't good enough for international cricket. He needs some time out of the spotlight to go away and work on his game

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Well this isn't going well

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

26-4, Buttler comes in and shuffles down the wicket and knocks it for four

Love you Jos

[JDizzle]

I'm just going to say it, knowing full well this will be a massive jinx, but Jos looks in unreal touch. That punch through the covers on the up...

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

I'm just going to say it, knowing full well this will be a massive jinx, but Jos looks in unreal touch. That punch through the covers on the up...

He's just hit an 86mph bouncer wide outside off stump through mid on whilst walking down the wicket.

Utterly ridiculous shot

[msp83]

Bangladesh have leveled the series! They win by 34 runs, skipper Mortaza leading from the front, slogged a very significant 44 of 29, and then finished with 4-29 with the ball to sink England.
Very happy to see Nassir Hossain performing right away. I was disappointed they left him out in that first game. A run-a-ball 27 with the bat to give the finishing touch to the innings, then 1-29 of his entire quota of 10 overs. And took that skyer to finish the game! Is not the greatest ever individual performance, but then he's that kind of a player, handy with bat, ball and in the field, has a fine temperament, and should be really supported by the management.......

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

England should be really disappointed by that loss - let Bangladesh off the hook with the ball, then the top order batted horribly.

A big game Wednesday - interested to see how they respond.

[msp83]

BTW, between Ali and Rashid, the latter bowling a bit better so far in the series......

[KO-KING]

Does stokes have to embarrass everyone where ever he goes, he acts like a 13 year old, I understand things at times getting out of control in the middle... It's hot humid and competitive... But after the game...

[JDizzle]

BTW, between Ali and Rashid, the latter bowling a bit better so far in the series......

Although neither inspiring much faith for the upcoming Tests in Bang, never mind India!

[Gooseberry]

Does stokes have to embarrass everyone where ever he goes, he acts like a 13 year old, I understand things at times getting out of control in the middle... It's hot humid and competitive... But after the game...

Hes specifically been given the role of "grumpy dwarf" or "enforcer", the behavior is encouraged. Giving the opposition a hard time is something other teams have learnt from Australia.

But yes it does come across a bit ridiculous at times, especially when it seems forced. And as a general thing you'd hope people could act in a more controlled manner rather than seeking to gain advantage by ratcheting up the pressure.

Certainly doenst seem to have worked for England here, and Buttlers had to straight up admit that he lost it.

[Gooseberry]

BTW, between Ali and Rashid, the latter bowling a bit better so far in the series......

Although neither inspiring much faith for the upcoming Tests in Bang, never mind India!

Rashids taken 6 for 102 over the two games and hit an unbeaten 33.... he must be doing something right!

I don't think anyone could though really be expecting Englands spin attack to be the worlds greatest and its already been suggested that Ali may be bumped up the order for tests and treated as an occasional bowler rather than a frontline spinner to concentrate on his batting again.

I'm more concerned that the "pace" attack looks pretty toothless, especially with injuries mounting.



In other news apparently taking two of the worlds finest ODI batsmen out of your top 5 and replacing them with Duckett and Vince doesnt improve the sides batting performances.

[KO-KING]

Does stokes have to embarrass everyone where ever he goes, he acts like a 13 year old, I understand things at times getting out of control in the middle... It's hot humid and competitive... But after the game...

Hes specifically been given the role of "grumpy dwarf" or "enforcer", the behavior is encouraged. Giving the opposition a hard time is something other teams have learnt from Australia.

But yes it does come across a bit ridiculous at times, especially when it seems forced. And as a general thing you'd hope people could act in a more controlled manner rather than seeking to gain advantage by ratcheting up the pressure.

Certainly doenst seem to have worked for England here, and Buttlers had to straight up admit that he lost it.

I've got no problem of in the Match aggression... I like it

But he went up to tamim and grabbed his shirt after the match, that's just not on... He didn't even get warned...

[KO-KING]

In other news apparently taking two of the worlds finest ODI batsmen out of your top 5 and replacing them with Duckett and Vince doesnt improve the sides batting performances.

Hales wouldn't have done well in my opinion and Duckett is better than Morgan in my opinion... Root obviously is something else, but I read his back was sore vs Pakistan series so not sure if root absence is a choice

Why is Plunkett not playing, I'd drop Willey

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

In other news apparently taking two of the worlds finest ODI batsmen out of your top 5 and replacing them with Duckett and Vince doesnt improve the sides batting performances.

Hales wouldn't have done well in my opinion and Duckett is better than Morgan in my opinion... Root obviously is something else, but I read his back was sore vs Pakistan series so not sure if root absence is a choice

Why is Plunkett not playing, I'd drop Willey

Duckett is a great prospect but right now he's not even close to Eoin Morgan

Plunkett got injured in the warm up game

Also saw Mark wood needs a third ankle operation in 12 months. Guy can't catch a break

[KO-KING]

Hales wouldn't have done well in my opinion and Duckett is better than Morgan in my opinion... Root obviously is something else, but I read his back was sore vs Pakistan series so not sure if root absence is a choice

Why is Plunkett not playing, I'd drop Willey

Duckett is a great prospect but right now he's not even close to Eoin Morgan

Plunkett got injured in the warm up game

Also saw Mark wood needs a third ankle operation in 12 months. Guy can't catch a break

Ah that explains why Plunkett not in

Was a fan of wood

And in terms of Morgan, guys been struggling for a while now, I don't think we would have crossed 50 this series, and I saw Duckett in the first match he just looks so good, ignoring his second wicket cause Shakib would have been impossible to deal with at start by anyone, and that bowl was just a wicket ball

Ducketts got good timing, good defense, can rotate strike, can find boundaries

Last young player I thought was as good even was root (I thought root was better.. But still)

[Gooseberry]

In other news apparently taking two of the worlds finest ODI batsmen out of your top 5 and replacing them with Duckett and Vince doesnt improve the sides batting performances.

Hales wouldn't have done well in my opinion and Duckett is better than Morgan in my opinion... Root obviously is something else, but I read his back was sore vs Pakistan series so not sure if root absence is a choice

Why is Plunkett not playing, I'd drop Willey

Its Bairstow who's taken Morgans place.

Roots resting yes a "probably needed it" but the point is that the side is significantly weaker without 3 senior batsmen to select from whatever the reasons for that. No team wouldn't be.

As for Morgan vs Duckett...potentially in the long run Duckett could be a better player but to suggest that you'd expect Morgan who averages nearly 50 in Bangladesh to do better than a debutant. Especially off the back of a strong 2016.

Hales ...to be fair his record in the sub continent hasnt been as good as other places but its still better than Vinces.


So although the batting hasnt been great Im not overly concerned, its not the strongest side England could have put out.

[Gooseberry]

Morgan averaged 44 in ODIs this summer, thats not struggling.

[Good Golly I'm Olly]

Should also be noted that Bangladesh are bloomin good ODI side at home - you don't win 17 of your last 20 home ODIs if you're rubbish

[Mad for Chelsea]

Re the Stokes thing, apparently Tanim didn't shake hands with some English players and Stokes took exception to it? I didn't watch any of the game yesterday so won't comment much, but it's not that surprising that England's batting has been weakened a bit, as would any team missing three of their top 4.

Re Vince, there's plenty to like about him, but the biggest issue is that he just doesn't seem to learn from his mistakes.

As Olly points out, Bangladesh are a good ODI side, and very hard to beat at home, but it's still disappointing to not chase down 240... Still, sets things up very nicely for the final match. Will be interesting to see if England make changes.

[KO-KING]

Re the Stokes thing, apparently Tanim didn't shake hands with some English players and Stokes took exception to it? I didn't watch any of the game yesterday so won't comment much, but it's not that surprising that England's batting has been weakened a bit, as would any team missing three of their top 4.

Re Vince, there's plenty to like about him, but the biggest issue is that he just doesn't seem to learn from his mistakes.

As Olly points out, Bangladesh are a good ODI side, and very hard to beat at home, but it's still disappointing to not chase down 240... Still, sets things up very nicely for the final match. Will be interesting to see if England make changes.

No I saw it, bairstow tried to do neville vs Viera death stare and not letting go of tamim hand, he took offense and turned to face each other then stokes comes in then grabs/pushed tamim on his chest

Then goes on Twitter Trying to make out he was protecting his teammate.

He can dish it out fine, but expects people just to take it and not retaliate.

Either way great series

Would have been better if both teams had their players fit and in form

Would have loved to see root vs mustafizur

England bangladesh so many classics in recent times now in Bristol, 2011 world cup, 15 wc, both these matches

[msp83]

I like Ben Stokes a lot, but seems he needs a little bit of growing up. But then, Thre is a section in English cricket management that encourages Anderson like behavior on a cricket field because that helps you play to potential. Ridiculous!

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