Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

[navyblueshorts]

First topic message reminder :

Actually Davie, they didn't fit yours (apologies; 'idiocy' is a bit strong). Your earlier comments were all about how he'd actually done something terrible/illegal i.e. told them how to get around 3rd party ownership (he didn't) with the possible implication that he'd been knowingly involved in it (no evidence of this), took £400k for dodgy seminars (he didn't and he said he'd have to clear it with the FA) etc. You wanted him to be a crook from the off.
You also claimed Ben and I said he was 'innocent' - we said no such thing.

You never took S_R's approach re. his position being untenable because he was England manager, the one thing he probably falls foul of. His comments re. Hodgson/Nevile were unfortunate, but this was a private conversation and, actually, big deal. Seriously, the next poor schmuck who takes this on should treat the media as they deserve.

There may well be more to this - we'll see. Until then, the only thing he's 'guilty' of is putting himself in a stupid position cf. the FA's comments re. FIFA etc and forcing the FA to ask him to fall on his sword. S_R's right with this; the FA had little choice really.

[beninho]

Golf as a sport does lend itself to snobbery, myself included.

Its not a cheap game, to but a set of irons most people would spend from £200, when you are starting at that, you will think that the advertised brands, and big names will always be the best, which just gets reinforced as you are able to spend more.

Even on balls, as mentioned above, they probably produce balls which are absolutely fine for the vast majority of players, yet people will still spend more, to get some named balls.

But its the same with most things in life!

[super_realist]

Indeed. I'd say that most players who buy the likes of ProV1 etc aren't good enough to get the benefit of the ball.

[navyblueshorts]

Of course he gets paid to wear it, you wouldn't sign a contract with them to get paid nothing.
Sure he's got an old school friend in Japan who he feels compelled to wear Dunlop gear.

Dunlop Golf is part of Srixon.

You have evidence of this I have no doubt? Or is it simply an assumption?

[navyblueshorts]

I'm sure Dunlop fit a certain type of golfer and that they are perfectly fine. In fact, they are probably good enough for most golfers given the average handicap of a golfer.
I'll never use them though, in the same way I wouldn't want a Vauxhall. Perhaps I'm a snob.

Ummm, maybe. Don't you think it's a bit laughable that you're equating the wearing of clothes, that do F-all for one's golfing success, with a handicap range?

[MontysMerkin]

I think the s is superfluous.

[super_realist]

No, I'm suggesting the use of Dunlop gear (i.e. clubs and balls) is a better indication of handicap level.
What you wear is clearly not an indicator of how good you are, although I don't know anyone, low or high who wears Dunlop. The ONLY time I have ever seen people wear it is for Pub Golf or Footgolf, i.e not taken seriously. Never actually seen it on the course, any course.

My point is more that Dunlop is a company with a big image problem and suffers from its association with Sports Direct and from being perceived as cheap and nasty, a far leap from where it once was, which in turn makes me surprised that any touring pro would choose to be connected to them.

Having said that, I've just realised I have a set of Dunlop's on my car. Different company though.

[navyblueshorts]

No, I'm suggesting the use of Dunlop gear (i.e. clubs and balls) is a better indication of handicap level.
What you wear is clearly not an indicator of how good you are, although I don't know anyone, low or high who wears Dunlop. The ONLY time I have ever seen people wear it is for Pub Golf or Footgolf, i.e not taken seriously. Never actually seen it on the course, any course.

My point is more that Dunlop is a company with a big image problem and suffers from its association with Sports Direct and from being perceived as cheap and nasty, a far leap from where it once was, which in turn makes me surprised that any touring pro would choose to be connected to them.

Having said that, I've just realised I have a set of Dunlop's on my car. Different company though.

I agree with image issue etc. Wilson are fighting it now it seems, but it's a long haul back and most golfers aren't actually interested in quality - just brand image.
As for wearing Dunlop gear, I'm currently off 3 and have a couple of decent polo shirts and polo necks that I regularly use .

[super_realist]

I think in most cases quality goes in line with brand image/cost. There's obviously a few that don't fit that, and many that could be considered over-priced but in general most of the brands considered to be good produce goods of high quality.

Wilson have been fighting it for decades. I don't think they'll ever come back.

[beninho]

I have a couple of dunlop tops, brought for me one christmas. I have worn them, I though am sh*t.

I think we are starting to see a disconnect between the clubs/balls and the actual clothes. Nike/Adidas/Puma/Under Armour will pay the money to clothe them, and you will not really notice what clubs they play.

[navyblueshorts]

Interesting (maybe) that Brendan Steele won the recent Safeway Open with mainly the Wilson FG Tour 100s. Pity for Wilson that Harrington is an also ran these days.

[navyblueshorts]

I have a couple of dunlop tops, brought for me one christmas. I have worn them, I though am sh*t.

I think we are starting to see a disconnect between the clubs/balls and the actual clothes. Nike/Adidas/Puma/Under Armour will pay the money to clothe them, and you will not really notice what clubs they play.

I will, because I don't give a stuff what they're wearing. I'm a golfer, not a mannequin. Maybe I'm unusual...

[super_realist]

Wilson could win every Major for the next 10 years but I still don't think people would buy them.
I also think Nike are going the same way too. They've spread their reach too far in my opinion and are a jack of all trades and a master of none.

[navyblueshorts]

Wilson could win every Major for the next 10 years but I still don't think people would buy them.
I also think Nike are going the same way too. They've spread their reach too far in my opinion and are a jack of all trades and a master of none.

Serious golfers would certainly look at them very seriously I would think; especially if their clubs looked decent and were well made. The johnny-come-lately-only-in-it-coz-of-Tiger-Woods crew, maybe not.

[super_realist]

I'm not so sure, they've already won more majors than any other competitor, but still account for a very low number of sales.
They're "outmarketed" by many other brands, despite technically being just as good.

I think for example some of their clubs are very nice indeed, but regardless of the success they have given their staff players, they don't capture the imagination of the players who buy clubs.

My local pro tries rabidly to promote them, presumably because he gets a better margin on them, but they don't sell too well regardless of how good they might be.

Personally, I've had a couple of sets of Wilson over the years, which proves I don't really follow all that is trendy, although I'm currently using Mizuno.

[super_realist]

Surprised Mac isn't all over this:

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/bbc-accused-of-racism-over-poll-asking-whether-all-black-people-like-fried-chicken-a3383666.html

[McLaren]

Anyone know if you can get the new costco balls in the UK? Apparently they are ok.

[super_realist]

Back on balls, and proper balls. I've read that Snell are making excellent balls which outperform other Premium balls. I've not seen them in shops in UK though.

[MustPuttBetter]

Ok i'm biased, I use them, but I don't get the 'problem' with Wilson Staff clubs. The FG Tour 100, the FG v2, the FG62 iron ranges are all as nice as any out there - in my opinion

[super_realist]

I'm not saying they are bad clubs, they, like Dunlop simply have an image problem regardless of how good they are or how good they look.

The blades are lovely looking clubs.

[navyblueshorts]

Anyone know if you can get the new costco balls in the UK?  Apparently they are ok.

What new balls? I'm using the Callaway Hex Pro from CostCo at the moment. Very, very good. Rumoured to be the older Callaway iS ball core with a different badge and maybe the newer cover. Worth trying them if that's what you're asking after.

Edit: About £19/doz incl. VAT.

[navyblueshorts]

Back on balls, and proper balls. I've read that Snell are making excellent balls which outperform other Premium balls. I've not seen them in shops in UK though.

Yeah, me too. See a lot of chat from U.S. sites, but can't get them here as far as I know. Same with all the recent Maxfli balls, some of which are meant to be excellent. Couldn't get the TopFlite (I know!) Gamer Tour either - stupid name, but meant to be very, very good and pretty cheap.

[Davie]

Anyone know if you can get the new costco balls in the UK?  Apparently they are ok.

What new balls? I'm using the Callaway Hex Pro from CostCo at the moment. Very, very good. Rumoured to be the older Callaway iS ball core with a different badge and maybe the newer cover. Worth trying them if that's what you're asking after.

Edit: About £19/doz incl. VAT.

I think he's just taking the piss after my comment about Dunlop balls rivalling the lesser Titleist

[McLaren]

Davie/Navy

In the US costco have started selling a 4 piece urethane ball that is supposedly very good.

http://www.costco.com/Kirkland-Signature-Four-Piece-Urethane-Cover-Golf-Ball,-2-dozen.product.100310467.html

Just wondering if anyone knows if it will be coming to UK costco's.

[super_realist]

Is anyone that much of a miser that they care so much about the cost of balls?

[McLaren]

Is anyone that much of a miser that they care so much about the cost of balls?

Not sure about being a miser but new premium balls are out of my budget. So if costco can produce a pro v1 matching ball for a fraction of the price I would rather give them a shot.

[super_realist]

You can get pretty good deals Mac if you look around.

Have you tried those Taylor Made Project A balls for instance?

[Davie]

Is anyone that much of a miser that they care so much about the cost of balls?

What a ridiculous comment

Play a course, with a lot of water and OOB .. and if you're not a single figure golfer, then the chances of losing 2 or 3 balls per round at 3 quid a ball soon adds up!

[super_realist]

I think you are being ridiculous Davie.

No one is saying you have to buy £3 balls though and no one is saying you should use course management which leads to a ball holocaust in the water, especially if you aren't in control of it, what good is a £3 ball to you anyway?

You can get very good Grade A/B balls or Lake Balls on Ebay for dirt cheap if you still want to play a quality ball.

You can't possibly think you have to spend £3 everytime you lose a ball?

[McLaren]

Super

I think you know we were talking about new balls. Hence why I compared the new costco ball to new prov1's.

[McLaren]

On an unrelated note and as a man utd fan can I just say that I love De Bruyne. Just always seems to do the right thing with the ball.

[super_realist]

If you are losing 3 proV1's a round, then it's obviously a ball which you aren't good enough to use.
If you are losing that many balls, then you should use something that doesn't matter if you are losing them.

I've just found a dozen Taylor Made Project A for 22.95. That's less than £2 a ball and a better ball than an NXT Tour or AD333 Tour.

[McLaren]

Where did you find that deal Super?

[super_realist]

Golfonline. There's a lot of places which will sell balls at reasonable prices. Just google it.

[westisbest]

https://www.facebook.com/teamgolfgods/videos/519641728226548/

[navyblueshorts]

Davie/Navy

In the US costco have started selling a 4 piece urethane ball that is supposedly very good.

http://www.costco.com/Kirkland-Signature-Four-Piece-Urethane-Cover-Golf-Ball,-2-dozen.product.100310467.html

Just wondering if anyone knows if it will be coming to UK costco's.

Ah. Interesting. Certainly not seen it over here yet. Will keep an eye out for them to at least try.

[navyblueshorts]

https://www.facebook.com/teamgolfgods/videos/519641728226548/

Hmm. Idiot alert! I can see a candidate for a Darwin Award...

[raycastleunited]

Balls!

Who spends £3 a ball, especially when you are losing 3 a round?

I never buy golf balls, I find more than I lose, and this is supplemented by balls won for 2's, sweeps, competitions etc.

[dynamark]

Ray- most of the balls I used to find were Molitor or Pinnacle sadly.
Good quality balls tend to have a individuals marking on them.
Nice to open a pack of new ammo though tends to make you concentrate

[super_realist]

It's amazing some of the balls people use. The crap I've found or seen people using on the Old Course is amazing. People will spend £200 on a round, £60 on a caddy but will use a 15 year old Ultra or Top Flite. Incredible.

[raycastleunited]

Ray- most of the balls I used to find were Molitor or Pinnacle sadly.
Good quality balls tend to have a individuals marking on them.
Nice to open a pack of new ammo though tends to make you concentrate

I guess it depends on the courses you play. I mainly tend to find premium balls like Pro V1's etc, then mid range balls like AD333 or NXT Tours go in a bag for winter golf, and finally older or lower range balls go in a bag for the practice ground.

As Super said, I find it really odd when I find a Commando or similar on the course.

[super_realist]

Last week or so, it's really been evident the difference in yardage the ball is going due to the colder air.
Might be time to switch to something like an NXT for winter.

[navyblueshorts]

Last week or so, it's really been evident the difference in yardage the ball is going due to the colder air.
Might be time to switch to something like an NXT for winter.

Yep, noticed that too. Maybe a club difference with the irons for me; guess I'll just have to club up one.

[super_realist]

It's a horrible time of year, coincidently seems to go hand in hand with a reduced MPG in the car.
Makes sense I suppose.

[pedro]

How far down in hcp would you say you'd have to be in order to tell the difference?

Since I'm spraying it all over the place and have limited length control, both from tee and fw, I've always had self critique enough to not blame the ball. So I hardly know which type I'm playing. (I'm playing off 18 btw.). Laughing off Mickelson for blaming the ball for his RC misery is easy enough but should mid-handicappers care?

[raycastleunited]

Since I'm spraying it all over the place and have limited length control

Yeah, but what's your golf like?

[super_realist]

How far down in hcp would you say you'd have to be in order to tell the difference?

Since I'm spraying it all over the place and have limited length control, both from tee and fw, I've always had self critique enough to not blame the ball. So I hardly know which type I'm playing. (I'm playing off 18 btw.). Laughing off Mickelson for blaming the ball for his RC misery is easy enough but should mid-handicappers care?

Good question. I usually notice a difference around about Oct-Nov and it starts improving around Mid Mar-Apr. Hard to tell what HCP you would start notice it. I suppose if there's a club you hit consistently well, regardless of handicap, you're going to notice a 5-10 yard difference.

[super_realist]

Here's an interesting test of those Costco balls Mac was talking about up against a Pro V
http://www.mygolfspy.com/kirkland-vs-titleist-pro-v1/

[McLaren]

Super, interesting article although it doesn't make clear whether or not the differences are statistically significant. Whatever the case it would seem that the costco ball is pretty much as good as a proV1, so if they come to the UK there is no reason not to give them a shot.

Would you be ok using a ball without one of the top brands names on it?

[super_realist]

I'd give it a go Mac, the clincher to me though would be how felt for putting and chipping.
Performance wise it certainly seems to be competitive, however it doesn't mention as far as I could see what the durability was either, but I'd certainly buy a dozen. I actually bought a dozen Penfold Hearts which had been re-released as a premium 4 piece to celebrate 50 years of Goldfinger, and they performed ok, but the durability was shocking.

Another thing which goes against the ball, and it's a minor point, but nonetheless important is that the name of the ball, the type face it is in etc make it look incredibly rubbish.

Why would a company, which has appeared to make a great ball at a knock down price ruin it with a crummy name and a font that makes it look like it belongs alongside a Pinnacle? Surely that's the crucial association you want to get away from. Snell is the same, come on, a bit of effort and a ball like this (or Snell) could get into the game in a big way. It would be a bit like Jaguar breaking into the BMW, Audi, Merc sector, just takes a bit of effort and understanding the market, and not cutting corners on getting the right look.

It's as if they spent all the money on development (or paid for the patent of some other ball more likely) and ruin it by scrimping on Marketing and Artwork? Crazy.

[raycastleunited]

The impact of a logo is amazing. The font colour and style of the word signature just look so cheap.

[Sponsored content]