Silly Season Transfer Rumours 16/17

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Nit before the Lions tour. Don't think any of the All Black internationals will end their career pre tour.

Morgan might well improve if he leaves Gloucester.

Look at the development of Billy Vunipola, he’s gone from a player who could only last 50 minutes to consistently playing 80.
I think without the right focus, Morgan could be an England contender again.
He’s got great attributes, just needs to work on his flaws.
Personally I think the difference between the best performing clubs and the mediocre/poorly performing ones are the development of players in general and of course player retention.

And budget......

propdavid_london wrote:If Morgan moves to Chiefs then it might do him well!  That Exeter pack is very hard working and will hopefully encourage morgan to graft too.  At the very least it will give him a platform to carry well.

George Ford is an interesting one - I am sure that there are several prem clubs that would pay well for him.  
Has anyone considered that George might want to be off to join his Dad at Toulon - it would be a tragedy for his England career if he did.

Waldrom doesn't graft at Chiefs. Chiefs just select two flankers to compensate for him. Hence why they are currently struggling as they have injuries and deploying Horstman on the flank means the work rate has dropped off as he's not got the engine of Armand or Ewers. Tigers can't afford the luxury of an 8 that isn't going to work hard for the team.

Mike Ford was in the press saying it's nice how he can now communicate with George without it being about work. Apparently at Bath they really only talked about work and he only found out about George's private life through his wife. I also doubt George would throw away his international career when his dad is likely to be at Toulon for all of about five minutes (they like to hire 'em and fire 'em down by the med).

I do think Saints would be a good choice for Ford but only if Mallinder leaves and Saints bring in a new decent DOR.

Saints seem to be a bit stale at the moment, out of ideas. Still got the players to be a top team, just not the gameplan/management IMO.

Ford would definitely be an upgrade on Myler obviously.

Still fixing Saints isn't just about signing one player, probably need another powerful player in the engine room to partner Lawes, a top class 9. Also need to get more from the players they have as the potential is there.

beshocked wrote:...Rugby fan I would say that Lancaster was more to blame for the decline of Ashton than Saracens...

I don't think Saracens can be blamed much at all. Ashton's case is just a reminder that moving to Saracens won't necessarily give your career a boost. The worst that can be said about the club is that they didn't really develop him as a player. They still got great performances from him, so perhaps didn't want to fix what wasn't broken. Also, I don't think development is just down to the club: the player has to want to do it too.

Rugby Fan wrote:

beshocked wrote:...Rugby fan I would say that Lancaster was more to blame for the decline of Ashton than Saracens...

I don't think Saracens can be blamed much at all. Ashton's case is just a reminder that moving to Saracens won't necessarily give your career a boost. The worst that can be said about the club is that they didn't really develop him as a player. They still got great performances from him, so perhaps didn't want to fix what wasn't broken. Also, I don't think development is just down to the club: the player has to want to do it too.

I agree it depends what you mean career boost. With Saracens, Ashton has scored the most tries in a HC season, he's won 2 AP titles and the European Champions Cup.

Not bad going. It has clearly helped make him a target for Toulon. Helps him earn more money and for a rugby player it's important to do so in a limited time.

http://www.espn.co.uk/rugby/story/_/id/17896319/wallabies-coach-michael-cheika-seek-kurtley-beale-Europe

Did Wasps plan for the possibility of this by signing Le Roux?

Just seen Gary Gold has resigned as Sharks head coach .. wonder if he'll be heading for a job up north?

Trying to think of any big jobs likely to come up .. possibly Saints?

Bambam Saints need to find someone better than Mallinder, I personally don't think Gary Gold would fit that criteria.

Easier said than done though.

Jake White is floating around isn't he? He could be the next Saints coach maybe. Now of course he would be controversial due to his handling of Montpellier but he did win silverware there.

Can't see many attack minded player going to Saints if White came.

Unless they are saffas

Welly wrote: Can't see many attack minded player going to Saints if White came.

Unless they are saffas

I wouldn't exactly call Saints that attack minded at the moment.

You also never know - Jake White might learn from his mistakes at Montpellier. Also he might settle better in England rather than France and also if he has aspirations to be England coach there aren't better ways than succeeding with an English club.

I am not claiming that Jake White is the best fit or that he’s one of the top coaches at the moment but he’s experienced and could potentially turn around Saint’s pack.
Saints have in the last two seasons been smashed by French clubs, White might be able to reverse the trend.

I'm not too happy with John Kingston!

beshocked wrote:Morgan might well improve if he leaves Gloucester.

Look at the development of Billy Vunipola, he’s gone from a player who could only last 50 minutes to consistently playing 80.
I think without the right focus, Morgan could be an England contender again.
He’s got great attributes, just needs to work on his flaws.
Personally I think the difference between the best performing clubs and the mediocre/poorly performing ones are the development of players in general and of course player retention.

He might be made to look better as being part of a better pack/team, but he has an awful lot to work on to be a better player. As EJ highlighted, his overall work rate at the breakdown is poor, he offers no lineout option and given his bulk his scrummaging is poor. A good 8 should be able to make the hard yards when required from static ball to create momentum; he can't do that. Nevertheless, his maul defence is excellent. I don't know his tackle completion stats but I'd suggest they are very high. When he hits the ball at pace he can pick excellent lines and has real gas for a big 8. His ball skills are also very good, although he doesn't off-load as often he could/should.

He would be an excellent signing for some teams, but Tigers need a ball carrier and he won't offer that. For Chiefs they would need Ewers or Armand to help with the hard yards.

I know we've definitely offered Kvesic and Hook new contracts, but I've not heard we've offered Morgan and perhaps that is telling.

beshocked wrote:...I agree it depends what you mean career boost. With Saracens, Ashton has scored the most tries in a HC season, he's won 2 AP titles and the European Champions Cup...

I think Ashton wanted more caps and hoped his move to Saracens would help with that quest. Personally, I wish he'd got more.

Rugby Fan wrote:

beshocked wrote:...I agree it depends what you mean career boost. With Saracens, Ashton has scored the most tries in a HC season, he's won 2 AP titles and the European Champions Cup...

I think Ashton wanted more caps and hoped his move to Saracens would help with that quest. Personally, I wish he'd got more.

Ashton's club form when he hasn't been banned in general has been good, it's Lancaster who in my opinion wasted Ashton, not utilising his strengths.

If you pick a player you have to do that.

Different player but Jones has managed to get the best out of Haskell by utilising his strengths.

HKC I think Morgan is capable of improving but he needs a system and team which helps him. I don't think scrummaging and being a lineout option are that important for a no 8. Workrate though and making hard yards are important.

As for which other club he would be best suited. I don't know.

Midi are reporting that Boudjellal has made it 'his personal goal' to sign George Ford. He has spouted nonsense so many times before without it coming true that the rumour itself doesn't surprise me.

I find these announcements more interesting given that he clearly has more of an input into who comes to the club than his revolving door of coaches do. Perhaps a reason why his coaches won't stay and his players are under-performing.

If the rumours are true about George wanting to leave Bath due to the treatment of Mike then I have a lot of sympathy for him. He was still a young lad who was given the opportunity of working with his dad in a promising (and incredibly well funded) team that would be built around his qualities, I can't blame him at all for taking it.

However, if he again thinks it's a good idea to follow his dad, in particular to a team that are well known for having next to no patience for its coaches then I'd have to conclude that he's simply stupid.

It would be very foolish for Ford Jr to say goodbye to his England career.

I still think Saints with a change in coaching set up would be his best bet.

Ford would easily supplant Myler.

As a Saracens fan I would make a trade - Bath can have Farrell, Sarries can have Ford Jr. I would be happy with that.

Or Saints can have Farrell, Sarries can have Mallinder Jr.

Quite a lot of Tigers fans seem to think he'll be coming back home. Williams heading back to Wales, Taity heading to France for a pension fund, with Freddie Burns switching to 15 and kicking goals seems the favourite rumour.

9.Youngs
10.Ford
11.JP Pietersen
12.Toomua/Thompstone
13.Tuilagi
14.Veainu/Betham
15.Burns

Looks fantastic on paper but if Toomua and Manu stay unavailable then Ford loses his safety net and wrecking ball. I'd still take George in a heartbeat though.

How he'd fit into the cap and Tigers budget is yet to be seen. It's quite possible that all of Owen Williams, Tait and Croft will be off at the end of the season though.

Burns at full back? Really?

Sadly for Manu, I don't think he'll ever stay fully fit. Shame really as he can be a destructive player when fully fit and in form.

Looks good though if it can click.

beshocked wrote:Burns at full back? Really?

Sadly for Manu, I don't think he'll ever stay fully fit. Shame really as he can be a destructive player when fully fit and in form.

Looks good though if it can click.

Burns played 15 for the early part of his Glaws career and covered there for Tigers once. He played well there but I presume he doesn't fancy it which is why he's not played there since. He's got the ability to be another Geordan for us so I'd love to see it given a go.

Clemont Poitrenaud has signed to play for the Sharks in Super Rugby from next season.

I said to colleagues that Ford would be linked to Toulon as soon as his dad was wedged into the top job over there.
Personally I think he is too young to be walking away from his international career - I bet Cips is hoping he gets on that plane.

We have a very good 10 in Farrell, slightly less creative but a lot more solid than George - with other options available to EJ. He isn't in the position of strength that Wilko was in and EJ has already said it would end his international career.

As a Quins fan I would love him there but we seem to have filled our 10 berths with NEv, Swiel, R.Jacksoon and Catrakalis for next season.

Best fit would be back to Tigers.
How long is Gopperth got with wasps? If he was moving on then Ford would fit in well there.

Other question would be - who would Bath be after as a replacement - Ford must have been on a reasonable packet so should have a bit of wedge and/or space under the cap.

Propdavif what is the issue with Sloan went from starting every game to not featuring in any basically. Wouldn't mind Tigers going for him.

Bath apparently after Cruden.

Gopperth signed a new deal this season and is prob their player of the season and with Cips there on a big deal can't see it happening.
Saints might struggle getting him due to the treatment of his brother there.
Tigers depends on the 10 situation.
Sarries have Faz
Exeter 10 isn't there biggest problem currently Back 3 and Back row needs reinvestment in.
Quins as said have about 5 10's
Sale need a 10 BUT can't see it happening.

Sloan is out for whole season I think with long term injury - not entirely sure what he has done.
If as people say that Owen W is off back to the principality then it is the most likely replacement option.
Sale have AJ McGinty - but don't seem to be getting their moneys worth at the moment
I had a feeling he had re-signed for Wasps - and as you say is in the form of his life at the moment
Chiefs have Steenson and Devoto/Slade to fill in
Saints don't play well with an open 10 (see Lamb and Geraghty experiments)
Falcons move would be interesting - Delany isn't that popular there is he?
Worcester, Bristol would be negative moves for his development (apologies to those clubs)

Fissler is reporting Andy Robinson gone from Bris and Heynek Meyer to replace him

Oh and yes Sloan out for the season, we're missing Hopper and Lowe too Roberts obv away playing Int rugby so may want some injury cover at 12

We have signed some Namibian 8 though

yappysnap wrote:Fissler is reporting Andy Robinson gone from Bris and Heynek Meyer to replace him

That would be a big statement of intent from Bristol, but in order to stay up they're basically going to have to become an SA franchise. Might Meyer be bringing some former Bulls players?

yappysnap wrote:Fissler is reporting Andy Robinson gone from Bris and Heynek Meyer to replace him

Edinburgh might have him back!

Change needs to happen at Bristol....their format doesn't seem to be working for them at the moment.
Where did you hear that Yappy?

On twitter, Fissler seemed to think it was a done deal, he's a plonket but usually spot on with these things.

Seems too little too late IMO. Bristol are way behind and it's not just the coach, most of their squad seem unable to play 80 mins of top end rugby.

They do have a Poopie load of cash though so could try to buy their way out.

Usually if Fissler posts it on Twitter it means he is very confident in it happening and it happening before Sunday.

Fissler now back tracking.

Martin Haag has just resigned as England u20 coach. Maybe Robinson out was correct but the coach coming in was wrong.

Pushed out.

Whether chopped by Dean Ryan or not, he's still a well respected coach with recent success at the JWC who has worked at Bristol as first-team coach before.

Tigers have signed an Australian flanker or lock called Josh Fenner. He was apparently a star for Brisbane State School this year and was expected to sign for Queensland Reds but has instead opted to come to Tigers. Probably to come into the development squad.

Reportedly he's a rangy flanker who's an excellent line-out option and has pace to burn.

Already been mentioned abit ago.

Here is his highlights reel

Ah either couldn't remember or hadn't heard. He looks a handy player. It's always interesting when a guy opts to go abroad straight out of school when he has the offer of a contract locally. Hopefully it works out for him.

yappysnap wrote:Oh and yes Sloan out for the season, we're missing Hopper and Lowe too Roberts obv away playing Int rugby so may want some injury cover at 12

We have signed some Namibian 8 though

Stanely also away playing for Samoa, so we really need someone to play at 12. Don't really fancy Marchant as a 12, nor Alofa, so Jackson looks the best bet for now… Or put J Chisholm there alla Clifford!



On Ford - we'd take him, and Nev may nor may not be playing next year. Saints would be the perfect fit. Or he should stay at Bath under Blackadder. Toulon would be an awful move, not only do they have little patience with coaches but also with players from the sounds of it, the owner is half mad and a bit of a ****, they are a fading force, haven't managed 10s well since Wilko and it would end his England career with Farrell then straight in at 10 and Cips/Burns straight back in the mix and Slade a potential 10 too.


No way he goes to Toulon.

king_carlos wrote:Ah either couldn't remember or hadn't heard. He looks a handy player. It's always interesting when a guy opts to go abroad straight out of school when he has the offer of a contract locally. Hopefully it works out for him.

He was born and raised in England and Tigers was his home club

Welly wrote:Saints might struggle getting him due to the treatment of his brother there.

Welly, genuine question but what is supposed to have happened with Joe Ford at Saints? I've read that comment on here a few times but never seen anything else. I always assumed he went to Saints, didn't make the grade/ first team and went back to Leeds where he went well again. Then moved to Sale where he saw a bit of action but not much before returning to Leeds once again. Gives the impression that he's a decent kicking 10 in the Championship but maybe good enough for the Prem? Not sure why Saints should have that held against them unless something did happened or they treated him badly?

On a related note would love Saints to sign George Ford but can't see it. Disappointingly everything points towards him playing with those pesky cats again that you support if he does in fact move at the end of the season.

Not seen anything on the Beeb about Martin Hagg!

Bath sign Ben Tapuei.

Good signin. But I hope it doesn't hamper Clarks development.

Darren Allinson to Bath on a short term loan

Welly wrote: Bath sign Ben Tapuei.

Good signin. But I hope it doesn't hamper Clarks development.

Given the huge injury list for Bath centres it's last man standing at the moment. They had to sign somebody to help out. Clark has had some steady game time so far I can't see them forgetting about him.

Tapuei is a pretty good signing I think, a left footed play making 12 is exactly what was needed. Clarke would have been playing the last few weeks but for injuries, he does look more comfortable at 13 though and Joesph has got that spot sewn up.

Petrus Du Plessis and Jim Hamilton both linked with a move to London Irish.

Both old but would be solid options for a year if we were to get back up, which is looking more and more likely.

Apparently Etzebeth will be signing with an English club after the AIs

Matawalu has moved to Exeter til the end of the season