Ulster 2016/2017

First topic message reminder :

And it's been confirmed

Ulster Rugby has today announced that Jono Gibbes will join the Province as Head Coach ahead of the 2017/18 season, having signed a two-year contract.

  The former New Zealand player is currently Forwards Coach at French giants ASM Clermont Auvergne and he previously held a similar position at Leinster Rugby.

Gibbes joined Leinster in 2008, helping the squad to win three Heineken Cup titles during a six-year spell in Dublin. The first of those successes came under the stewardship of Michael Cheika in 2009, before he assisted Joe Schmidt in the 2011 and 2012 triumphs.

He moved to France in 2014 and was part of a coaching set-up that guided Clermont to the Top 14 and Champions Cup finals in his debut season.

In addition to his expertise in forward play, the 40-year-old has also gained valuable experience in coaching other aspects of the game, such as attack, during his stints at Leinster and Clermont.

Gibbes said that there were many contributing factors in his move back to Ireland:

"The respect that I have for Les (Kiss), as a coach and as a person, was one of my main reasons for making this decision. He really sold his vision of where he wants to take Ulster over the next few years.

"Ulster is a team that I know well, having come up against them on a number of occasions. The Clermont-Ulster games this season gave me an insight into the strengths of the squad and it's exciting to think that I'll be part of that environment from next season.

"With 6 years at Leinster and 3 years at Clermont in the Top 14, I've been afforded many different experiences, working with some very talented coaches and players. I hope to apply what I've learned to the role at Ulster and my family and I are looking forward to integrating into a strong community in Belfast."

Welcoming the news, Director of Rugby Les Kiss, added:

"Jono's CV speaks for itself and I know that he's looking forward to joining Ulster and working with the team. Jono has vast experience on both the playing and coaching fronts, having worked in many different environments such as Super Rugby, PRO12, the French Top 14 and European competitions.

"Since his retirement from playing, Jono has had an integral role in the coaching teams of two of European rugby's most successful sides. He was a key part of the Leinster set-up that won three Heineken Cups in four years and he has continued to be hugely successful during his time in France.

"Jono's expertise as a Forwards Coach is obvious, however his wealth of knowledge in other areas of the game will be really important for us."

"A review of the coaching structure is ongoing ahead of next season and the appointment of Jono as Head Coach is the first part of that process. A further announcement will be made in the coming weeks, which will focus on getting the right balance in our coaching team."

The sooner this season is over the better.
Fresh start next season.
We suddenly upped the tempo in the last fifteen,after spending a great deal of the game faffing about - shows the mentality is the problem.
Need Gibbes and a defence coach

Id rather we got our act together now and were further down the road come the start of next season

I've been feeling like that for a while now. I thought the squad would have a bit more grit but the motivation seems to have gone. We are not going to be in the playoffs so we will have to settle with at least being in Europe next year. The new coaching team will bring something new, whether it cures Ulster will be seen next season.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Olding - Marshall just isn't working. Let's stop moving players out of position. Cave or Payne at 13 from now on please. Perhaps Stockdale.

Said months ago it has to be Payne or Cave at 13 everytime otherwise the defence is weak.
Both fit neither selected at 13

Don't blame Marshall and Olding blame Kiss

They are both 12's - see above re 13.

The drift defence is a joke

Also exposed because we pick an player well past it in the backrow, his words not mine.
Timoney ran further in his cameo than Wilson did all match.
Henderson was pretty poor - only Reidy put in a true performance in the backrow.

Stockdale. Trimble and Timoney all played better than the player they replaced

Our props simple don't do enough around the park.

Someone above mentioned injuries to Props - whilst true of Herbst when were Kane and McCall last injured ?
Cant be described as players with a history of injuries

Sadly coming to the conclusion Kiss is not up to it

Regarding Payne - 2 years ago Ireland needed him at 13 and Ulster needed him at 15

In 2017 that has completed reversed we need him at 13 and Ireland should be playing him at 15


Botha got injured last weekend.
We are going into the new system with 3 NIQ and the two backrowers both are building up a history of being injury prone
The local lads need to show attitude and skill they have not shown this year otherwise we will be in big trouble

Botha has a history of injuries. With our luck both Arno and Marcel with both have very limited gametime, fingers crossed not.
Also about last night, Coetzee's absence was definately clear to see. Leadership wise we're lacking, look at Best rallying the troops versus Coetzee.

geoff999rugby wrote:
Someone above mentioned injuries to Props - whilst true of Herbst when were Kane and McCall last injured ?
Cant be described as players with a history of injuries

It was me who mentioned it, McCall is out injured at the minute with a hamstring injury and was out earlier in the season with what Im sure was the same injury.
Kane is out at the minute with a finger injury sustained, I think this is his fifth injury this season though one was a 'facial laceration', he has also injured his knee and ankle.
At one point we had Ah You, Herbst, Lutton and Simpson all out injured and thats how Kane got his break.

There are quite a few muscle and joint injuries and forwards, particularly props, will be under a lot of stress physically so they will happen but I was floating the thought based on an article by Chris Weidman the MMA fighter talking about as a young wrestler getting bad medical advice from doctors and coaches who missed a knee problem that was hampering him.

geoff999rugby wrote:
The drift defence is a joke

Also exposed because we pick an player well past it in the backrow, his words not mine.
Timoney ran further in his cameo than Wilson did all match.
Henderson was pretty poor - only Reidy put in a true performance in the backrow.

Stockdale. Trimble and Timoney all played better than the player they replaced

Our props simple don't do enough around the park.

Wilsons effort can't be faulted but simply not up to the job, we missed Henry last night as we needed someone getting into rucks being a nuisance and disrupting things. Reidy though should have been doing that and wasn't. When we did try it though we were penalised

The game plan as a whole was a problem, we allowed them space to play and should have been in their faces. We were too happy to play from deep rather than getting the ball up the field and playing where it mattered.

I thought Timoney came on and played well, actually. Quite a tough game to come into, made his tackles (which the experienced members around him struggled with) and made a few good carries. Did he get a turnover as well or am I making that up?

Anyway, I've no doubt that will be the last time we see him.

Jean Deysel who we were linked with signing a couple of times is having a blinder for Munster at blindside.

It was Timoney that was turned over near the end.  He wasn't completely isolated, maybe ran a bit further from his support than he should have but the rest of his support should have got there.  Black was trying for the clear out so there was no reason he couldn't have busted a gut to get there given he was just on the field.  On the TV it cut to Kiss shaking his head at the decision.  So that's probably the end for Timoney.  Someone has to carry the can for the "loss", and it sure won't be the pros and seasoned internationals on display.

Roger is done.  He looked fine for the first 10 - 15 mins.  Made quite a few tackles but after that disappeared.  There was no reason why Timoney couldn't have started ahead of him.

We need to start talking about Henderson.  He's gone seriously off the boil.  For a lad who should be pushing for a Lions squad place, he just looks lost.  He's also developed this ridiculous habit of trying to take mild contact, effectively being reduced to a stationary target and then trying to push through.  It's what Diack does.  Rather than Ferris-like trying to bust through the initial contact.  He invariably then gets doubled up on and pushed backwards.  Our main ball carrier reduced to a stone pillar.  I can't understand it.  Is he coached to do that?  Or is he concerned with getting injured?   To a novice like myself it almost looks like he's more worried about how he's going to make contact with the ground.  Did he pick up any arm or shoulder injuries while landing from a tackle?

For all the talk of us stepping up in the last 10-15 it's as much Cardiff looking spent.  Considering the game they had the week before and the number of early injuries they picked up and it's no surprise.  To say we pushed it up a gear is flattering.  In reality we probably stood still and they fell off the pace.

Loss of Payne is disappointing.  I think he's got a shot at the Lions as a utility back.  The same goes for Warburton.  Emerging from the hype I'm slowly seeing the player that the Welsh said was there 7 years.  It would be desperately sad if he wasn't available for selection because of injury.  

You have to give Cardiff credit.  They beat us in the midfield.  Realised they were beating us in the midfield ........ and continued to beat us in the midfield.  And our passive defence did nothing to counter that.  I wouldn't even mind if we did the drift well, but we don't.  A good drift might get caught out every once in a while to a talented step or a show and go but teams are both going through AND around us.  That's unforgivable.  

I can honestly say I don't want Ulster in the play offs this year.  I don't want to see us get embarrassed.

It won't happen because of the "political" backlash but they should send a kids team to Munster and Ospreys, try and salvage some useful experience from this season.  We should then field a main team for Leinster.  Final send off for Ruan and hope that Leinster have top 2 wrapped up by then and send a kids team (that will probably still beat us but) that we might have a chance against.

Couple of other thoughts

Treadwell - Again looked good.  He's now a starting lock for us.  Was Henderson a starter for us at 21?  How many of the top locks were 1st team starters at 21? Genuine question.
Gilroy - The poor lad looks at his worst when he's trying to force it.  When he's trying to make things happen.  He's at his best when things just flow ...... and they're not flowing at the minute.
Absence of Henry - We didn't have a breakdown threat.  Best was the only other player who could try and jackle and he was pinged early on.  After that the only way Ulster were getting the ball back was if Cardiff knocked it on

Sadly you're absolutely right Redman. We're not going to be in the playoffs, we'd be torn to shreds on current form. The Henderson point annoys me so much. He gets the ball, tries some kind of sidestep that then renders him stationary and then is flattened. Is he carrying an injury?
We are so badly off the pace and lacking an inspirational leader to rally the troops. Is it Kiss that's to blame or is it the two coaches who don't even speak that's disrupting things? Probably a mixture but next season better bring better fortune or the gate receipts won't look as good.

Marshall did well at 13 with McCloskey inside him, and more importantly when Barakat was around. The defence now looks directionless.
It was obvious last season that Wilson was done and the only reason they continue to play him must be to justify Bryn giving him too long a contract. The jury's out on Cunningham especially if he can only sign injury prone players.
Ulster can bemoan the absence of Henry, but Chris wouldn't make the Blues team, not indeed any of the other top 8 teams.

The Great Aukster wrote:Marshall did well at 13 with McCloskey inside him, and more importantly when Barakat was around.

Marshall was ok but he spent the time covering McCloskey who was poor defensively.

Losing Barakat is a loss but nowithstanding that no one is going to convince me Marshall is a better 13 than a 12 and he is nowhere near Payne or Cave as an organiser of the backline defensively

marty2086 wrote:

geoff999rugby wrote:
The drift defence is a joke

Also exposed because we pick an player well past it in the backrow, his words not mine.
Timoney ran further in his cameo than Wilson did all match.
Henderson was pretty poor - only Reidy put in a true performance in the backrow.

Stockdale. Trimble and Timoney all played better than the player they replaced

Our props simple don't do enough around the park.

Wilsons effort can't be faulted but simply not up to the job, we missed Henry last night as we needed someone getting into rucks being a nuisance and disrupting things. Reidy though should have been doing that and wasn't. When we did try it though we were penalised

You have just answered your own question Marty - why do something you are going to get penalised for.
Lets face it Davies is a total tube - but not the reason we didn't win.

Reidy was too busy plugging holes because his backrow partners were useless.
One because he is past it, the other because he has his head up his arse instead of putting in an honest 100% performance.

Highlighted, in part, by the significant improvement when Timoney came on

Apparently relations between Beavis and Butthead are so bad that training sessions have been abandoned early on occasion.

Don't know if anyone here watches Super 15 rugby but I have more bad new
Our new LH looks like a bit of a donkey - reminds me of Ruaidhrí Murphy

The way Ulster's season has gone, I'm not sure I can bring myself to watch any more Pro 12 rugby, never mind Super Rugby.

The super15 has some dross but for the most part it's fantastic rugby. They even seem to allow their players to play some heads up rugby down there which is actually exciting to watch
I'm afraid Ulster rugby would be shredded down there. Mind you, we'd be shredded if we got into the playoffs of the Pro12 at the moment. The game at Ravespan against Clermont seems a very long time ago now.

Saw this on Pundit Arena last week comparing Pro12 sides to Super Rugby counterparts, don't think they've watched us this season though

Ulster – Waratahs

Big budgets, big players, mediocre success they flatter to deceive more often than not. A destructive and clinical performance one week followed by a clumsy and calamitous one the next. Being a supporter must be both exciting but also infuriating. Nevertheless, any team that contains Israel Folau or Charles Piatau just cannot be written off

Pete I watched Melbourne recently and they are about Edinburgh standard.

We would be nowhere near the play offs but there are some very poor teams - at least one in South African conference as well

geoff999rugby wrote:Pete I watched Melbourne recently and they are about Edinburgh standard.

We would be nowhere near the play offs but there are some very poor teams - at least one in South African conference as well

Melbourne are beyond dreadful this season and on the SA side of things neither the Bulls or the Kings look decent in any way. Mind you, that's not exactly the level that's impressing but it's most likely our level at the moment.

There will 2 teams will be dropped from Super Rugby, one Aus and one SA, for next year.
Does this mean decent NIQ's becoming available maybe not for the provinces, but hopefully the other teams can pick up some to improve tem foe next year.

Also interesting that the conference system they used was said to be to confusing for fans, and they are changing it, when its a system we are looking to put in place. I like a league and don't like the imbalance a conference brings, but if it brings up the finances to match France/England I am up for it.

Theres actually 3 teams being dropped, SA are set to lose two teams

The competition reduces to a 15-team format – five from New Zealand, four each from Australia and South Africa (a reduction of one and two respectively), and one each from Argentina and Japan. Australia and South Africa have yet to announce which of their teams will play in the 2018 season. The Sunwolves will move into the Australian Conference.

It might actually become harder to get top quality NIQ players in as the unions will be cutting costs and trying to pool quality players into fewer teams

A point I would make is for all the quality you see in Super 15 there set pieces (scrums and lineouts) are on the whole not as good as the NH.

They are seen as simple ways to get things moving and they don't put the same emphasis on practising them.
In this context seeing our new LH showing up as being below average is very disappointing

As I mentioned earlier we are a couple of sick notes away from being a team without foreign start/stars next year - Charlie apart

geoff999rugby wrote:A point I would make is for all the quality you see in Super 15 there set pieces (scrums and lineouts) are on the whole not as good as the NH.

They are seen as simple ways to get things moving and they don't put the same emphasis on practising them.
...

Scrums maybe - there's a lot less emphasis on the "dark arts" (i.e. trying to win penalties) - the focus is on providing a good platform off own ball down under. Lineouts OTOH get a lot of attention. Again though focus is on winning the ball (off own or opposition throw) rather than spoiling

I take your word for it - just the games I have watched this year - the lineouts have been a shambles

geoff999rugby wrote:I take your word for it - just the games I have watched this year - the lineouts have been a shambles

Granted "shambles" is a fairly accurate general description of all 5 Aussie teams, the Kings, Cheetahs, Bulls & Sunwolves

Fair enough - it would depend on the teams you watch.

The more relevant point is Ulster are signing a player who looks weak in the position where the Super 15 as a whole pays less attention to technique than the NH.
That doesn't look good.

If we were signing someone with only average SH handling skills I would be ok with that due to the mark superiority , in the SH, in that area but a poor SH scrummager is no use to us

geoff999rugby wrote:Fair enough - it would depend on the teams you watch.

The more relevant point is Ulster are signing a player who looks weak in the position where the Super 15 as a whole pays less attention to technique than the NH.
That doesn't look good.

If we were signing someone with only average SH handling skills I would be ok with that due to the mark superiority , in the SH, in that area but a poor SH scrummager is no use to us

geoff999rugby wrote:Our new LH looks like a bit of a donkey - reminds me of Ruaidhrí Murphy

Geoff whats the issue with the new vDM?

Chat on the other forum is he's not hugely active around the park, nor particularly good in the scrum.

Still no Notch about? Anyone heard from him?

Redman wrote:Chat on the other forum is he's not hugely active around the park, nor particularly good in the scrum.

The word before hand was we were getting a solid scrummager, I flicked through the first half of the game with the Force and I know the Force aren't the best scrum in Super Rugby but he did seem strong in the scrum without getting a push on. He had the whole Force front row turning into him at one point and held up to it.

I'd agree about him around the park, he just seems very nonchalant going between breakdowns and a team getting quick ball would have a field day attacking his channel

Redman wrote:Still no Notch about?  Anyone heard from him?

I heard some very bad news about him, he's not a Munster fan

marty2086 wrote:

Redman wrote:Still no Notch about?  Anyone heard from him?

I heard some very bad news about him, he's not a Munster fan

He still comments on bakebook so he's still online. He's just moved on and is seeing other forums. It's not us, it's him.

TBH this place has died a lot over the last number of seasons, only the same posts get lots of comments.
What are the alternatives that good posters like Notch have moved to?

UAFC is still probably the best place for info, but it's hard to find it among all the sh1te they talk. And post there at your peril. Savage and obnoxious most of them.

clivemcl wrote:UAFC is still probably the best place for info, but it's hard to find it among all the sh1te they talk. And post there at your peril. Savage and obnoxious most of them.

Nail and Head comes to mind Clive. They are right now posting about 98% utter sh17e. Leading up to a match day and it'll drop to around 60% only to return to 98% soon after.

As Clive said it's not a great place to post as they are ignorant, only because they are hiding behind the anonymity of the keyboard etc. There's one poster on there in particular who just turns on everyone in the most obnoxious way yet he's elevated himself to cult status on the forum.

I don't really know of any other forums. This one may be quiet for periods etc but at least it's monitored and that kind of obnoxious, keyboard warrior attitude isn't tolerated. My only real gripe here is the inability to say the really bad F word.

It's not Farrell or Ford before some smartarse says it.

I know exactly who you mean and couldn't agree more.

I post on Planet Rugby from time to time and it is hugely tribal but even that is a much friendly place than the UAFC boards where in theory you all have an interest in Ulster Rugby in common.

One of the reasons I much prefer 606 is because there's actual mods moderating proceedings, ensuring things don't get out of hand. Indeed it's a compliment to Notch that that atmosphere has remained even after he has stepped back from things.

It could be worse, at least they aren't the eejits on Bakebook

marty2086 wrote:It could be worse, at least they aren't the eejits on Bakebook

Those people are special Marty, special, deluded and in need of engagement with reality. Whatever way you put it they are special
I had to unlike the Ulster supporters thingy, imagine????

Pete330v2 wrote:

marty2086 wrote:It could be worse, at least they aren't the eejits on Bakebook

Those people are special Marty, special, deluded and in need of engagement with reality. Whatever way you put it they are special
I had to unlike the Ulster supporters thingy, imagine????

That bunch aren't so bad, well there is one who is a certain kind of special, makes the pessimism on here seem like optimism

The official Ulster page has the best kind of supporters who bitch and moan at everything

It's a shame that Notch doesn't post here any longer. Haven't a clue why he stopped. Seems odd that he just disappeared, but his reasons are his own business, I guess.

I don't mind any of the other forums. Although I don't post there, UAFC are good for picking up a bit of Ulster info, even if they do seem a bit mad. A lot of people don't get their humour, which is very definitely Northern Ireland's own brand of dark humour, and so I can understand why they might shy away from it, or take offense if they venture into it. Still a decent bunch of guys though.

GWlad is a bit mad, but most of the posters there are good rugby people. A few nutjobs, but then most forums have them.

PR certainly is tribal, as with most, but not for the faint-hearted. Interesting topics on politics though  

606V2 is my online home though. Reasonable discussions, mostly, and hot debates which can be fun. Trolls are either dealt with by the mods, or give up when their conspiracy theories are exposed as false. Some posters can be a bit contentious, but I enjoy that. Overall, a really good site, methinks.

Getting back to the rugby the Barbarians are putting together a strong squad for the games against England and Ulster, Genia, Ashley-Cooper, Aki, Corey Flynn, Isa and Census Johnson the first players announced

Was there not chat that Ruan and Roger were going to be playing for the Baa Baas?