Lions reinforcements (or why we should learn to love Roberts)

by Gwlad Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:45 pm

Since we're all being so nice to each other and we haven't had one for a while, i thought we needed to relieve some tension with a new Lions thread.

We know that by the 1st test there will be at least 15-20% casualties so we'll lose up to 8 players. Its likely we'll lose a couple before the squad even leaves and unlike the boyos at Rorke's Drift Gatland can call on reinforcements to swell the ranks to hold off the All Black hordes. With the club games and well documented All Black perceptions of what is and what isn't foul/dangerous play, it could get messy.

I expect the following to get the nod in this order. I've picked players who should have been in the squad, are leaders, or who are former Lions and can make an impact.

Props: Healy, Jenkins, Evans,
Props: Nel, Lee, Francis
Hookers: Hartley, Brown, Hibbard
Locks: Launchbury, Ryan, R Gray, Charteris,
Flank: Watson, Lydiate, Wobshaw
8: Heaslip, ?
9: Care, Davies
10: Ford, Russell.
Centre: Roberts, Ringrose
back 3: Kearney. Never Mike Brown

Fire at will.

by **Ozzy3213** Wed Apr 26, 2017 5:57 pm

Roberts

by Cyril Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:06 pm

Shane, Lydiate, Mikey P and Cuthbert were unlucky to miss out on Gats' initial squad. Time for them to get their boots.

by Gwlad Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:15 pm

An i see there you go and even from a MOD, not that I'm surprised but just the usual anti Welsh rubbish. And it's me that's borderline nationalistic.

Cyril, thanks for reminding me about Lydiate, he is definitely on the radar when fit, i've added him Very Happy

by **Ozzy3213** Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:18 pm

That's not anti Welsh Gwald, it's anti Roberts, he's pump mate, and the AB's will be laughing their tits off if he sets onto the field to face them. #OneTrickPony #CrashBall #NoThanks

by Gwlad Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:23 pm

Ozzy3213 wrote:That's not anti Welsh Gwald, it's anti Roberts, he's pump mate, and the AB's will be laughing their tits off if he sets onto the field to face them. #OneTrickPony #CrashBall #NoThanks

Thanks for the clarification, in the current climate the merest hint of a Welsh name draws such derision that its nice to be clear this isn't anti Welsh like Cyril. #why would you pick a double Lion who has won a tour down under as a replacement.

I suppose i was confused by you not referring to any other options or the rest of the suggested replacements that i drew that conclusion, that and the 475 hilarity emojis. thumbsup

by Luckless Pedestrian Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:26 pm

Gwlad wrote:
Ozzy3213 wrote:That's not anti Welsh Gwald, it's anti Roberts, he's pump mate, and the AB's will be laughing their tits off if he sets onto the field to face them. #OneTrickPony #CrashBall #NoThanks

Thanks for the clarification, in the current climate the merest hint of a Welsh name draws such derision that its nice to be clear this isn't anti Welsh like Cyril. #why would you pick a double Lion who has won a tour down under as a replacement.

Because he's past it. He can't get into the Wales side. He's slow.

by Taylorman Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:30 pm

Ozzy3213 wrote:That's not anti Welsh Gwald, it's anti Roberts, he's pump mate, and the AB's will be laughing their tits off if he sets onto the field to face them. #OneTrickPony #CrashBall #NoThanks

Yes well that's true, the number of times we've played the JD2, Roberts pairing, wouldn't surprise if Gats tried do get them out there again, they've been good for him otherwise.

The Lions midfield is one of the big questions for this side, and it's like to be an English pairing with Farrell, Joseph Te'o. I would go with Sexton at ten but I can't see Gats doing that. This side just seems to have Farrell at 10 all over it.

by Gwlad Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:32 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:
Gwlad wrote:
Ozzy3213 wrote:That's not anti Welsh Gwald, it's anti Roberts, he's pump mate, and the AB's will be laughing their tits off if he sets onto the field to face them. #OneTrickPony #CrashBall #NoThanks

Thanks for the clarification, in the current climate the merest hint of a Welsh name draws such derision that its nice to be clear this isn't anti Welsh like Cyril. #why would you pick a double Lion who has won a tour down under as a replacement.

Because he's past it. He can't get into the Wales side. He's slow.

He is by no means past it, but he has slowed i agree, but then again he is a Gatland favorite and as a replacement i would think would be superb to call on. I agree he would be there to do a job but its a job he is very good at and when he least came on he finished. Look NZ will be direct and physical and that is something he can live with and in fact dominate.

by **Ozzy3213** Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:41 pm

He is beyond past it Gwlad. What he's done and won in the past counts for nothing, if it did we'd be rolling out Johnno, Gibbs, Jenkins and the rest.

He is done at the very top level. Being a battering ram is no longer enough. International defences eat that shoite up all day. If he had some guile, pace or decent hands then I'd have him in like a shot, but he hasn't any of that and should be nowhere near this Lions squad, regardless of who drops out.

by **LondonTiger** Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:44 pm

With Scotland in Australia and Wales playing tonga in NZ, players from those countries could be favoured logistically. However ignoring this, and looking at like-for-like replacements I reckon (and I am always wrong) something like:

McGrath/Marler - Healy, Evans
Mako - Gethin (with Genge being considered.)
Hookers: Hartley, Brown, Hibbard
Cole/Furlong - Francis, Nel, Lee
Sinckler - Fagerson considered.
AWJ/Kruis/Lawes - Grayx2, Charteris
Itoje/Henderson - Launchbury, Ryan
Stander/POM/Moriarty - Robshaw, Haskell, Barclay
Warburton/Tipuric - Watson
Billy/Faletau - Heaslip, Hughes, Wilson

Scrum-Halves - Care, Laidlaw
Fly Halves - Ford, Russell, Jackson, Davies
Joseph - Ringrose
Te'o - Roberts
Henshaw/JD2 - Williams, Dunbar
Wings - Maitland, Visser, Earls
FB - Brown, Kearney

by Taylorman Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:45 pm

Honestly can't remember the last time Roberts dominated a NZ midfield. As a pair they went well but old school isn't going to cut it here, something new, particularly in the midfield will be required.

by Gwlad Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:49 pm

That's your opinion but I disagree and i am pretty sure Gatland would disagree he is done at the top level otherwise he wouldn't be benching for Wales. I also think its borne of ignorance; thats is, Roberts='Gatlandball'.
Roberts is a victim of that confusion because he is a big lump and a direct 12 and 'Gatlandball' simply defined is running straight and committing defenders.
Roberts has much more to his game than that including one of the best timed receivers of the ball at the top level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErgtyeyF7Mc

by Cyril Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:50 pm

Taylorman wrote:Honestly can't remember the last time Roberts dominated a NZ midfield. As a pair they went well but old school isn't going to cut it here, something new, particularly in the ~~midfield~~ head coach and backs coach department will be required.

Fixed for you. Sadly it's not fixed in real life Sad

by Cyril Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:53 pm

Gwlad wrote:That's your opinion but I disagree and i am pretty sure Gatland would disagree he is done at the top level otherwise he wouldn't be benching for Wales. I also think its borne of ignorance; thats is, Roberts='Gatlandball'.
Roberts is a victim of that confusion because he is a big lump and a direct 12 and 'Gatlandball' simply defined is running straight and committing defenders.
Roberts has much more to his game than that including one of the best timed receivers of the ball at the top level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErgtyeyF7Mc

Grenoble? 2nd bottom in the Top14 and finished plum bottom of their Challenge Cup group.

NZ will be sweating on that performance. All he did was hit a nice line Laugh

by Gwlad Wed Apr 26, 2017 6:57 pm

Cyril wrote:
Gwlad wrote:That's your opinion but I disagree and i am pretty sure Gatland would disagree he is done at the top level otherwise he wouldn't be benching for Wales. I also think its borne of ignorance; thats is, Roberts='Gatlandball'.
Roberts is a victim of that confusion because he is a big lump and a direct 12 and 'Gatlandball' simply defined is running straight and committing defenders.
Roberts has much more to his game than that including one of the best timed receivers of the ball at the top level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErgtyeyF7Mc
Grenoble? 2nd bottom in the Top14 and finished plum bottom of their Challenge Cup group.

NZ will be sweating on that performance. All he did was hit a nice line

Pretty sure it's a gap you'd never find Cyril. Laugh

by Cyril Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:01 pm

Gwlad wrote:
Cyril wrote:
Gwlad wrote:That's your opinion but I disagree and i am pretty sure Gatland would disagree he is done at the top level otherwise he wouldn't be benching for Wales. I also think its borne of ignorance; thats is, Roberts='Gatlandball'.
Roberts is a victim of that confusion because he is a big lump and a direct 12 and 'Gatlandball' simply defined is running straight and committing defenders.
Roberts has much more to his game than that including one of the best timed receivers of the ball at the top level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErgtyeyF7Mc
Grenoble? 2nd bottom in the Top14 and finished plum bottom of their Challenge Cup group.

NZ will be sweating on that performance. All he did was hit a nice line

Pretty sure it's a gap you'd never find Cyril.

So, Lions replacements are going to be selected from players who can score past a terrible French side?

This is going to be the worst tour yet, isn't it?

It's not too late for Gats to throw in the towel and call it off. Go on, Warren!

by Gwlad Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:01 pm

Cyril instead of your constant naysaying, especially about Wales, why don't you actually contribute something and suggest some replacements or alternatively find another thread thumbsup

by Cyril Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:05 pm

Gwlad wrote:Cyril instead of your constant naysaying, especially about Wales, why don't you actually contribute something and suggest some replacements or alternatively find another thread

I've made suggestions.

I didn't think this was a serious thread though when I read some of your replacements. It's difficult to tell sometimes.

by Gwlad Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:08 pm

Cyril wrote:Shane, Lydiate, Mikey P and Cuthbert were unlucky to miss out on Gats' initial squad. Time for them to get their boots.

These were your 'suggestions?' It's pretty clear that you are so obsessed with Wales and everything Welsh that you feel the need to try and undermine a thread and then attempt to infer that the thread isn't serious when it is you that tries to ridicule it? i provided a list of credible replacements - credible enough for respected pundits to be debating all of them - and you just launch into your juvenile tripe about some Wales players.

Like i said, what are your suggestions for replacements?

by WELL-PAST-IT Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:11 pm

Props: Healy, Jenkins, Evans,
Props: Nel, Lee, Francis
Hookers: Hartley, Brown, Hibbard
Locks: Launchbury, Ryan, R Gray, Charteris,
Flank: Robshaw, Watson, Lydiate
8: Heaslip, ?
9: Care, Laidlaw.
10: Ford, Russell.
Centre: Ringrose, Roberts.
back 3: Kearney, Maitland.

JENKINS???????????????????????????????????????????????????????

I would sooner bring back big Phil

Roberts is like me Well Past It, far better options out there now, possibly Celts as well.

The rest, apart from possibly Gray J and not Gray R and Grey R for Charteris can't think of many others

No wings though, not that we will need them unless they get hurt defending, Gatball doesn't allow the ball out that far

by Gwlad Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:15 pm

LondonTiger wrote:With Scotland in Australia and Wales playing tonga in NZ, players from those countries could be favoured logistically. However ignoring this, and looking at like-for-like replacements I reckon (and I am always wrong) something like:

McGrath/Marler - Healy, Evans
Mako - Gethin (with Genge being considered.)
Hookers: Hartley, Brown, Hibbard
Cole/Furlong - Francis, Nel, Lee
Sinckler - Fagerson considered.
AWJ/Kruis/Lawes - Grayx2, Charteris
Itoje/Henderson - Launchbury, Ryan
Stander/POM/Moriarty - Robshaw, Haskell, Barclay
Warburton/Tipuric - Watson
Billy/Faletau - Heaslip, Hughes, Wilson

Scrum-Halves - Care, Laidlaw
Fly Halves - Ford, Russell, Jackson, Davies
Joseph - Ringrose
Te'o - Roberts
Henshaw/JD2 - Williams, Dunbar
Wings - Maitland, Visser, Earls
FB - Brown, Kearney

Looks good, a solid replacement in each position with even some lions experience, though Ford first up is worrying.

Curious why you think Roberts? Seems he is dead and buried on here.

I think 10 is a real issue. Sexton can get injured easily and i expect him to be targeted which is why i think Farrell will start at 10; he is definitely more robust. We need to hope neither of these two gets injured.

by Cyril Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:28 pm

Gwlad wrote:
Cyril wrote:Shane, Lydiate, Mikey P and Cuthbert were unlucky to miss out on Gats' initial squad. Time for them to get their boots.

These were your 'suggestions?' It's pretty clear that you are so obsessed with Wales and everything Welsh that you feel the need to try and undermine a thread and then attempt to infer that the thread isn't serious when it is you that tries to ridicule it? i provided a list of credible replacements - credible enough for respected pundits to be debating all of them - and you just launch into your juvenile tripe about some Wales players.

Like i said, what are your suggestions for replacements?

There's no need for the personal insults. Must you always do that? I never insult you.

by Gwlad Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:30 pm

Cyril wrote:
Gwlad wrote:
Cyril wrote:Shane, Lydiate, Mikey P and Cuthbert were unlucky to miss out on Gats' initial squad. Time for them to get their boots.

These were your 'suggestions?' It's pretty clear that you are so obsessed with Wales and everything Welsh that you feel the need to try and undermine a thread and then attempt to infer that the thread isn't serious when it is you that tries to ridicule it? i provided a list of credible replacements - credible enough for respected pundits to be debating all of them - and you just launch into your juvenile tripe about some Wales players.

Like i said, what are your suggestions for replacements?
There's no need for the personal insults. Must you always do that? I never insult you.

You haven't been insulted whatsoever, stop desperately trying to be.

What are your suggestions otherwise please don't bother replying.

by Gwlad Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:32 pm

WELL-PAST-IT wrote:Props: Healy, Jenkins, Evans,
Props: Nel, Lee, Francis
Hookers: Hartley, Brown, Hibbard
Locks: Launchbury, Ryan, R Gray, Charteris,
Flank: Robshaw, Watson, Lydiate
8: Heaslip, ?
9: Care, Laidlaw.
10: Ford, Russell.
Centre: Ringrose, Roberts.
back 3: Kearney, Maitland.

JENKINS???????????????????????????????????????????????????????

I would sooner bring back big Phil

Roberts is like me Well Past It, far better options out there now, possibly Celts as well.

The rest, apart from possibly Gray J and not Gray R and Grey R for Charteris can't think of many others

No wings though, not that we will need them unless they get hurt defending, Gatball doesn't allow the ball out that far

Again he's a Gatland favorite and though long in the tooth as a midweek leader he'd be invaluable as a replacement.

As far as Gatlandball and Roberts is considered, every try we scored v NZ in 2016 was by no means a Gatlandball try and in fact Roberts created one from nowhere.

by Cyril Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:43 pm

Gwlad wrote:
Cyril wrote:
Gwlad wrote:
Cyril wrote:Shane, Lydiate, Mikey P and Cuthbert were unlucky to miss out on Gats' initial squad. Time for them to get their boots.

These were your 'suggestions?' It's pretty clear that you are so obsessed with Wales and everything Welsh that you feel the need to try and undermine a thread and then attempt to infer that the thread isn't serious when it is you that tries to ridicule it? i provided a list of credible replacements - credible enough for respected pundits to be debating all of them - and you just launch into your juvenile tripe about some Wales players.

Like i said, what are your suggestions for replacements?
There's no need for the personal insults. Must you always do that? I never insult you.

You haven't been insulted whatsoever, stop desperately trying to be.

What are your suggestions otherwise please don't bother replying.

'juvenile tripe' isn't an insult then?

by Taylorman Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:45 pm

Cyril wrote:
Gwlad wrote:That's your opinion but I disagree and i am pretty sure Gatland would disagree he is done at the top level otherwise he wouldn't be benching for Wales. I also think its borne of ignorance; thats is, Roberts='Gatlandball'.
Roberts is a victim of that confusion because he is a big lump and a direct 12 and 'Gatlandball' simply defined is running straight and committing defenders.
Roberts has much more to his game than that including one of the best timed receivers of the ball at the top level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErgtyeyF7Mc
Grenoble? 2nd bottom in the Top14 and finished plum bottom of their Challenge Cup group.

NZ will be sweating on that performance. All he did was hit a nice line

Never even heard of Grenoble. But Roberts has gone 0 from 9 tests versus ABs for one try way, way back in 2010 where he was the last in the chain and flopped over in the 77th minute when Wales were 22-3 down...

I'm guessing we're hoping on no injuries to ensure he doesn't come out then Whistle

we wouldn't want to be subjected to that again!

by Scottrf Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:57 pm

Better hope that the All Blacks don't underestimate Roberts like you do because he can run into you when you most expect it.

by Cyril Wed Apr 26, 2017 7:58 pm

Scottrf wrote:Better hope that the All Blacks don't underestimate Roberts like you do because he can run into you when you most expect it.

by Gwlad Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:01 pm

Taylorman wrote:
Cyril wrote:
Gwlad wrote:That's your opinion but I disagree and i am pretty sure Gatland would disagree he is done at the top level otherwise he wouldn't be benching for Wales. I also think its borne of ignorance; thats is, Roberts='Gatlandball'.
Roberts is a victim of that confusion because he is a big lump and a direct 12 and 'Gatlandball' simply defined is running straight and committing defenders.
Roberts has much more to his game than that including one of the best timed receivers of the ball at the top level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErgtyeyF7Mc
Grenoble? 2nd bottom in the Top14 and finished plum bottom of their Challenge Cup group.

NZ will be sweating on that performance. All he did was hit a nice line

Never even heard of Grenoble. But Roberts has gone 0 from 9 tests versus ABs for one try way, way back in 2010 where he was the last in the chain and flopped over in the 77th minute when Wales were 22-3 down...

I'm guessing we're hoping on no injuries to ensure he doesn't come out then we wouldn't want to be subjected to that again!

i guess not since only last summer he stood up your defense, took an easy intercept and ran 60 metres (slowly) before holding up your tackler and feeding a support player to score.

by Taylorman Thu Apr 27, 2017 12:32 am

Gwlad wrote:
Taylorman wrote:
Cyril wrote:
Gwlad wrote:That's your opinion but I disagree and i am pretty sure Gatland would disagree he is done at the top level otherwise he wouldn't be benching for Wales. I also think its borne of ignorance; thats is, Roberts='Gatlandball'.
Roberts is a victim of that confusion because he is a big lump and a direct 12 and 'Gatlandball' simply defined is running straight and committing defenders.
Roberts has much more to his game than that including one of the best timed receivers of the ball at the top level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErgtyeyF7Mc
Grenoble? 2nd bottom in the Top14 and finished plum bottom of their Challenge Cup group.

NZ will be sweating on that performance. All he did was hit a nice line

Never even heard of Grenoble. But Roberts has gone 0 from 9 tests versus ABs for one try way, way back in 2010 where he was the last in the chain and flopped over in the 77th minute when Wales were 22-3 down...

I'm guessing we're hoping on no injuries to ensure he doesn't come out then we wouldn't want to be subjected to that again!

i guess not since only last summer he stood up your defense, took an easy intercept and ran 60 metres (slowly) before holding up your tackler and feeding a support player to score.

My my, a 60 meter run in a test, bring him over then, we dont have any of those in our sides so I'd love to see one. thumbsup

by Gwlad Thu Apr 27, 2017 12:35 am

Taylorman wrote:
Gwlad wrote:
Taylorman wrote:
Cyril wrote:
Gwlad wrote:That's your opinion but I disagree and i am pretty sure Gatland would disagree he is done at the top level otherwise he wouldn't be benching for Wales. I also think its borne of ignorance; thats is, Roberts='Gatlandball'.
Roberts is a victim of that confusion because he is a big lump and a direct 12 and 'Gatlandball' simply defined is running straight and committing defenders.
Roberts has much more to his game than that including one of the best timed receivers of the ball at the top level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErgtyeyF7Mc
Grenoble? 2nd bottom in the Top14 and finished plum bottom of their Challenge Cup group.

NZ will be sweating on that performance. All he did was hit a nice line

Never even heard of Grenoble. But Roberts has gone 0 from 9 tests versus ABs for one try way, way back in 2010 where he was the last in the chain and flopped over in the 77th minute when Wales were 22-3 down...

I'm guessing we're hoping on no injuries to ensure he doesn't come out then we wouldn't want to be subjected to that again!

i guess not since only last summer he stood up your defense, took an easy intercept and ran 60 metres (slowly) before holding up your tackler and feeding a support player to score.

My my, a 60 meter run in a test, bring him over then, we dont have any of those in our sides so I'd love to see one.

by LordDowlais Thu Apr 27, 2017 10:01 am

Why do you think the Welsh team are touring the Pacific Islands and playing games against them in New Zealand at the same time the Lions are touring down there ?

We all know where the reinforcements will come from. Very Happy

by Cyril Thu Apr 27, 2017 10:18 am

Agreed, Dowlais. I just wish Gats would replace the English players now and make them available for the Argentina tour. Shane thinks there will be at least 7 Welsh in the Test XV so you don't need us anyway!

by Scottrf Thu Apr 27, 2017 10:19 am

So a repeat of losing 40-7 to a club side?

by TightHEAD Thu Apr 27, 2017 10:21 am

Shane Williams will get a call up.

by Cyril Thu Apr 27, 2017 10:26 am

It may sound pessimistic but I can see the Lions only winning 2-3 games all tour.

by Scottrf Thu Apr 27, 2017 10:30 am

Cyril wrote:It may sound pessimistic but I can see the Lions only winning 2-3 games all tour.

As long as they are the tests, that's fine.

by TightHEAD Thu Apr 27, 2017 10:34 am

Cyril wrote:It may sound pessimistic but I can see the Lions only winning 2-3 games all tour.

That many!

Kit Manufacturer Canterbury (Made by Kids in a hot country) are going to be lumbered with a lot of Lions stock after the first few games.

by Guest Thu Apr 27, 2017 11:52 am

Gwlad wrote:That's your opinion but I disagree and i am pretty sure Gatland would disagree he is done at the top level otherwise he wouldn't be benching for Wales. I also think its borne of ignorance; thats is, Roberts='Gatlandball'.
Roberts is a victim of that confusion because he is a big lump and a direct 12 and 'Gatlandball' simply defined is running straight and committing defenders.
Roberts has much more to his game than that including one of the best timed receivers of the ball at the top level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErgtyeyF7Mc

"Wow. What a receiver. One of the greatest of all time. I know all about receivers, I have many people tell me, he's the greatest. The best. We're going to have lots of receivers, the best receivers."

Catching the ball- something you'd think a prerequisite for any professional Rugby player- puts you in with a shout for the Lions.

Incredible.

by Cyril Thu Apr 27, 2017 12:06 pm

Scottrf wrote:
Cyril wrote:It may sound pessimistic but I can see the Lions only winning 2-3 games all tour.

As long as they are the tests, that's fine.

Hmmm, I've discounted the tests. Getting within 15 points or so would be a result for those games.

by robbo277 Thu Apr 27, 2017 12:22 pm

I think it depends when injury strikes.

If we're talking before take-off or in the first week, you go with your next best choice, the guy who's more likely to get a test spot. So you'd go with Cian Healy or Rob Evans at loosehead and Bennett, Dunbar, Scott Williams or Ringrose in at centre.

If you're flying someone out to plug the gaps for the last midweek game and provide opposition in training, then players like Jenkins and Roberts with all their experience would be better for those roles.

The Lions drew the final midweek game (between T1 and T2) with the Emerging Springboks in 2009 and lost to the Brumbies in the last midweek game before the test series in 2013. I think shipping stand-ins really hurts us in these late games (although is completely necessary) and if we are just looking for someone to play these games then we're best off picking players who firstly not going to be bitter about missing out on the original party and a test chance may be better, and who secondly definitely won't get another Lions call in 2021, so will give it their all.

If we were looking someone just to come in for the midweek games, then I'd suggest players the other side of 30 like Jenkins, Hartley, Ford, Nel, Ryan, Robshaw, Haskell, Heaslip, Laidlaw, Roberts, Bowe, Brown and Kearney. Obviously we won't be calling on all of them, but there's plenty of experience there and plenty of players who'd give a good 80 for the cause, even if there were no prospect of test selection.

by Pete C (Kiwireddevil) Thu Apr 27, 2017 1:11 pm

Players I think ought to be on the cover list (with the cheeky set of players that for various reasons as a NZ fan I'd love to see called up in brackets Wink

)
Props: Healy, Evans,
Props: Nel, Fagerson, (Vickery - plenty left in those legs)
Hookers: Hartley, Brown, Hibbard (R Ford)
Locks: Launchbury, Ryan, R Gray, J Gray, (Ball - 7/10)
Flank: Robshaw, Watson,Haskell (Lydiate)
8: Heaslip, (T Wood)
9: Care, Laidlaw. (Phillips)
10: Russell, Ford (Gopperth)
Centre: Ringrose, Dunbar. (Woodward)
back 3: Brown, Maitland. (Cuthbert)

by mikey_dragon Thu Apr 27, 2017 4:31 pm

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:Players I think ought to be on the cover list (with the cheeky set of players that for various reasons as a NZ fan I'd love to see called up in brackets )
Props: Healy, Evans,
Props: Nel, Fagerson, (Vickery - plenty left in those legs)
Hookers: Hartley, Brown, Hibbard (R Ford)
Locks: Launchbury, Ryan, R Gray, J Gray, (Ball - 7/10)
Flank: Robshaw, Watson,Haskell (Lydiate)
8: Heaslip, (T Wood)
9: Care, Laidlaw. (Phillips)
10: Russell, Ford (Gopperth)
Centre: Ringrose, Dunbar. (Woodward)
back 3: Brown, Maitland. (Cuthbert)

Jake Ball is good at running around and wrecking opposition; I take it that's what you're referring to?

by Gwlad Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:10 pm

Cyril wrote:Agreed, Dowlais. I just wish Gats would replace the English players now and make them available for the Argentina tour. Shane thinks there will be at least 7 Welsh in the Test XV so you don't need us anyway!

still no replacement suggestions from you. are you not capable of doing that?

by RuggerRadge2611 Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:20 pm

My 1st call ups:

1. Healy/Francis
2. Brown/Cronin
3. Lee/Fagerson
4. J. Gray/Charteris
5. Laucnhberry /R. Gray
6. Robshaw / Barclay
7. Watson / Haskell
8. Heaslip / Hughes
9. Laidlaw / Care
10. Russell / Ford
11. Visser / Wade
12. Dunbar / Williams
13. Ringrose / ??
14. Maitland / Earls
15. Brown / Goode

I was struggling to think of another outside centre to bring along to be honest.

by Pete C (Kiwireddevil) Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:23 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:
Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:Players I think ought to be on the cover list (with the cheeky set of players that for various reasons as a NZ fan I'd love to see called up in brackets )
Props: Healy, Evans,
Props: Nel, Fagerson, (Vickery - plenty left in those legs)
Hookers: Hartley, Brown, Hibbard (R Ford)
Locks: Launchbury, Ryan, R Gray, J Gray, (Ball - 7/10)
Flank: Robshaw, Watson,Haskell (Lydiate)
8: Heaslip, (T Wood)
9: Care, Laidlaw. (Phillips)
10: Russell, Ford (Gopperth)
Centre: Ringrose, Dunbar. (Woodward)
back 3: Brown, Maitland. (Cuthbert)

Jake Ball is good at running around and wrecking opposition; I take it that's what you're referring to?

A couple of years back that useless hack Andy Howell at WOL did a Wales vs NZ preview and incompetently rated both team's players out of ten. Jake Ball and reigning world player of the year Brodie Retallick were both rated as 7/10. So hence "Seven out of Ten" has become Ball's nickname on a couple of rugby FB groups I'm in. I did say the bracketed players were ones I'd enjoy seeing, not why I'd enjoy seeing them.

by Gwlad Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:28 pm

miaow wrote:
Gwlad wrote:That's your opinion but I disagree and i am pretty sure Gatland would disagree he is done at the top level otherwise he wouldn't be benching for Wales. I also think its borne of ignorance; thats is, Roberts='Gatlandball'.
Roberts is a victim of that confusion because he is a big lump and a direct 12 and 'Gatlandball' simply defined is running straight and committing defenders.
Roberts has much more to his game than that including one of the best timed receivers of the ball at the top level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ErgtyeyF7Mc

"Wow. What a receiver. One of the greatest of all time. I know all about receivers, I have many people tell me, he's the greatest. The best. We're going to have lots of receivers, the best receivers."

Catching the ball- something you'd think a prerequisite for any professional Rugby player- puts you in with a shout for the Lions.

Incredible.

Point is as a replacement he'd be outstanding. Only last summer he created a try from nowhere after an intercept and 60M jog against NZ. His timing to take the pass and score the winning try in Oz on his last winning Lions tour years ago equally outstanding. As a solid replacement with lions pedigree he has no equal.

by robbo277 Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:32 pm

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:My 1st call ups:

1. Healy/Francis
2. Brown/Cronin
3. Lee/Fagerson
4. J. Gray/Charteris
5. Laucnhberry /R. Gray
6. Robshaw / Barclay
7. Watson / Haskell
8. Heaslip / Hughes
9. Laidlaw / Care
10. Russell / Ford
11. Visser / Wade
12. Dunbar / Williams
13. Ringrose / ??
14. Maitland / Earls
15. Brown / Goode

I was struggling to think of another outside centre to bring along to be honest.

Not sure if another 13 would be necessary. You have Davies, Joseph and Payne out there as your 13s, Ringrose on standby, Daly and Nowell out there able to cover 13 from wing, or Te'o and Henshaw able to fill in at 13 as well as 12.

by Poorfour Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:39 pm

Genuinely astonished that anyone is touting Fagerson as a serious prospect for a callup. He looks like a prospect and was very much thrown in at the deep end - but he was also clearly out of his depth in the matches I saw.

Other than that, most of the suggestions are sensible. I have to say, though, that even as a Quins fan, Dr Roberts looks well off his best and I can't see him getting the call.

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