Gat for NZ?

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/sport/id-love-to-beat-the-all-blacks-then-coach-them-mjlvjb90b

Allty wrote:https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/sport/id-love-to-beat-the-all-blacks-then-coach-them-mjlvjb90b

Hell no!

Gats got turned down for the Chiefs' job twice, he's a ways down the pecking order.

There's a difference between ambition and realism.

He is way past his sell by date.

Its good to see ambition though....

He'd destroy the ABs

He'd drop Milner-Skudder and select Ben Te'o on the wing instead!

No thanks. Maybe he could do a stint in Georgia to add some flair to his game.

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

Allty wrote:https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/sport/id-love-to-beat-the-all-blacks-then-coach-them-mjlvjb90b

Hell no!

Gats got turned down for the Chiefs' job twice, he's a ways down the pecking order.

Who do you see ahead of him? I'm guessing it's a couple of S15 coaches? Don't say Cotter and Schmidt

Simple fact is that if Vern, Schmidt and Gats had the same demographic player profile that the super 15 have you'd see very different results in NH rugby.

mikey_dragon wrote:

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

Allty wrote:https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/sport/id-love-to-beat-the-all-blacks-then-coach-them-mjlvjb90b

Hell no!

Gats got turned down for the Chiefs' job twice, he's a ways down the pecking order.

Who do you see ahead of him? I'm guessing it's a couple of S15 coaches? Don't say Cotter and Schmidt

Schmidt would be ahead of Gatland who's simply been away from NZ rugby too long but it's more likely they'll go with Ian Foster if they're consistent, the same way Hansen got in...from within the core group.

Fringe coaches to join the group after Hansen...Rennie, Joseph, Schmidt, Cotter and I think by 2019 Scott Robertson the Crusaders coach, who's yet to have a loss with them in his first season, will push his name forward. Very popular with players and is younger than the others.

I didn't know about Foster but I expected it to be someone like Rennie definitely, along with Crusaders current coach should their form continue. Which is the coach who turned the Highlanders from zero's to hero's?

Haven't Schmidt and Cotter been away from NZ as long/longer than Gatland? Cotter is overrated by some in the NH and further down the pecking order than Great Gats. Schmidt is a good coach, but like Gatland would probably need a S15 stint before getting to coach the All Blacks.

mikey_dragon wrote:Which is the coach who turned the Highlanders from zero's to hero's?

Jamie Joseph

He didn't start out too well but I gather he changed his training regime and that gained dividends. As a player he was brutal. When he took over he implemented what he thought was what made players better. Train them into the ground. It didn't work. When he figured that out or was told that his approach wasn't working the team improved and are where they are now, which is SR champions in 2015 and a better team than the Blues presently

He could be in the mix, not head coach though

I'm liking what Robertson is doing and has done, he's got a bright coaching future

ebop wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:Which is the coach who turned the Highlanders from zero's to hero's?

Jamie Joseph

He didn't start out too well but I gather he changed his training regime and that gained dividends. As a player he was brutal. When he took over he implemented what he thought was what made players better. Train them into the ground. It didn't work. When he figured that out or was told that his approach wasn't working the team improved and are where they are now, which is SR champions in 2015 and a better team than the Blues presently

He could be in the mix, not head coach though

I'm liking what Robertson is doing and has done, he's got a bright coaching future

True, and a break dancing coach as well!.

Can you imagine him breaking out in 2019 at the World cup presentation in front of Emporer Hirohito or whoever it is now!

Gwlad wrote:Simple fact is that if Vern, Schmidt and Gats had the same demographic player profile that the super 15 have you'd see very different results in NH rugby.

Youd still be defending him selecting Cuthbert though

mikey_dragon wrote:I didn't know about Foster but I expected it to be someone like Rennie definitely, along with Crusaders current coach should their form continue. Which is the coach who turned the Highlanders from zero's to hero's?

Haven't Schmidt and Cotter been away from NZ as long/longer than Gatland? Cotter is overrated by some in the NH and further down the pecking order than Great Gats. Schmidt is a good coach, but like Gatland would probably need a S15 stint before getting to coach the All Blacks.

I keep hearing how Scotland's players aren't all that good and that as a team they are better than the sum of their parts. In addition I hear that the Welsh players are superstars who are just poorly coached.

Doesn't that obliterate your argument?

Gooseberry wrote:

Gwlad wrote:Simple fact is that if Vern, Schmidt and Gats had the same demographic player profile that the super 15 have you'd see very different results in NH rugby.

Youd still be defending him selecting Cuthbert though

If it annoyed you, i sure would.

Good to know you wouldn't just say your opinion if it it meant annoying someone. Never get why people do it.

Gwlad wrote:Simple fact is that if Vern, Schmidt and Gats had the same demographic player profile that the super 15 have you'd see very different results in NH rugby.

Well with the way they're spending the SuperXV will end up supplying them all anyway.

Remove the SH players from northern club and test rugby and you'd be left with a shell of many very overpaid, underperforming sides. The supposed best side, Saracens, looks half full of South Africans for a start.

No 7&1/2 wrote:Good to know you wouldn't just say your opinion if it it meant annoying someone. Never get why people do it.

says the guy with 81 negative votes, hell you just annoy people anyway

I don't care. I'll say what I think not to get a review I don't even see anyway.

No 7&1/2 wrote:I don't care.  I'll say what I think not to get a review I don't even see anyway.

Rated : Plus one

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:I didn't know about Foster but I expected it to be someone like Rennie definitely, along with Crusaders current coach should their form continue. Which is the coach who turned the Highlanders from zero's to hero's?

Haven't Schmidt and Cotter been away from NZ as long/longer than Gatland? Cotter is overrated by some in the NH and further down the pecking order than Great Gats. Schmidt is a good coach, but like Gatland would probably need a S15 stint before getting to coach the All Blacks.

I keep hearing how Scotland's players aren't all that good and that as a team they are better than the sum of their parts. In addition I hear that the Welsh players are superstars who are just poorly coached.

Doesn't that obliterate your argument?

I'm sorry but you've confused me. What do you think my argument is and what on earth is your reply all about?

When I said "overrated by some in the NH" I meant those in northern Britain i.e. Scotland. Gatland has far greater coaching achievements than Cotter. This isn't opinion, it's another blatant fact that's there slapping you across the face mun.

Have Schmidt or Cotter won ANYTHING? Cotter won the sack didn't he?

Gwlad wrote:Have Schmidt or Cotter won ANYTHING? Cotter won the sack didn't he?

They have *won* more test matches than Wales this season

This defence of Gatland is cringeworthy. Just about every Welsh fan I have met (they are much nicer in public than on here trust me on that) has stated that he has taken Wales about as far as he can go and that a change is needed.

On here too, Gatland has come in for really sharp criticism. He has had some good results, but having good results doesn't always mean you are a good coach.

Wales were good 4-5 years ago, however Schmidt and Cotter have got better results out of their teams as opposed to Gatland or Howley in more recent and relevant games. The fact that Wales constantly come unstuck against Southern Hemisphere teams is the most telling.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

Gwlad wrote:Have Schmidt or Cotter won ANYTHING? Cotter won the sack didn't he?

They have *won* more test matches than Wales this season

This defence of Gatland is cringeworthy. Just about every Welsh fan I have met (they are much nicer in public than on here trust me on that) has stated that he has taken Wales about as far as he can go and that a change is needed.

On here too, Gatland has come in for really sharp criticism. He has had some good results, but having good results doesn't always mean you are a good coach.

Wales were good 4-5 years ago, however Schmidt and Cotter have got better results out of their teams as opposed to Gatland or Howley in more recent and relevant games. The fact that Wales constantly come unstuck against Southern Hemisphere teams is the most telling.

what have Schmidt or Cotter got to do with Wales?

Gwlad wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

Gwlad wrote:Have Schmidt or Cotter won ANYTHING? Cotter won the sack didn't he?

They have *won* more test matches than Wales this season

This defence of Gatland is cringeworthy. Just about every Welsh fan I have met (they are much nicer in public than on here trust me on that) has stated that he has taken Wales about as far as he can go and that a change is needed.

On here too, Gatland has come in for really sharp criticism. He has had some good results, but having good results doesn't always mean you are a good coach.

Wales were good 4-5 years ago, however Schmidt and Cotter have got better results out of their teams as opposed to Gatland or Howley in more recent and relevant games. The fact that Wales constantly come unstuck against Southern Hemisphere teams is the most telling.

what have Schmidt or Cotter got to do with Wales?

You tell me! You brought them into it!

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

Gwlad wrote:

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:

Gwlad wrote:Have Schmidt or Cotter won ANYTHING? Cotter won the sack didn't he?

They have *won* more test matches than Wales this season

This defence of Gatland is cringeworthy. Just about every Welsh fan I have met (they are much nicer in public than on here trust me on that) has stated that he has taken Wales about as far as he can go and that a change is needed.

On here too, Gatland has come in for really sharp criticism. He has had some good results, but having good results doesn't always mean you are a good coach.

Wales were good 4-5 years ago, however Schmidt and Cotter have got better results out of their teams as opposed to Gatland or Howley in more recent and relevant games. The fact that Wales constantly come unstuck against Southern Hemisphere teams is the most telling.

what have Schmidt or Cotter got to do with Wales?

You tell me! You brought them into it!

no, you brought Wales into it

This whole article is about Gatland and Wales and what he might do after the Lions test?

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:This whole article is about Gatland and Wales and what he might do after the Lions test?

I imagine he'll return to his job in Wales before going S15 in 2019 and then All Blacks.

He'll retire to the bach in Waihi and do a spot of painting. He's proven he can't coach in NZ little alone be trusted with the ABs.

Gatland returned to NZ for 1 season and won silverware. He'll do the same again and no doubt leave you lot blubbering into your Speights at your nursing home.

Gwlad wrote:Gatland returned to NZ for 1 season and won silverware. He'll do the same again and no doubt leave you lot blubbering into your Speights at your nursing home.

Think you need to check your facts there sport

No, pretty sure you live in a nursing home and think that Gatland failed in NZ when in fact he lead Waikato to win in 2006

Gwlad wrote:Gatland returned to NZ for 1 season and won silverware. He'll do the same again and no doubt leave you lot blubbering into your Speights at your nursing home.

Yes, he won the Air NZ champs in 2006, with a NZ team. And not a Super rugby side. We've many coaches who have done that.

Hansen's comments re Gatland is that if anything he'll be predictable.

'Steve Hansen said this about Warren Gatland, and the conservative game plan he always adheres to.

“I’ve never seen him do anything else other than that. I guess we need to be prepared for what we normally get and prepare for something different as well … he’s done most of his coaching up north and has a particular style he likes which works for him up there using big ball carriers up front, big mid-fielders to carry.”

Which suggests Farrell at 10, Halfpenny at 15, and explains why Launchberry isn't there. Surprising though he's gone for Tipuric who with Warburton there probably won't see a test.

When Hansen's that upfront he's usually already done all the homework he needs to.

Gwlad wrote:No, pretty sure you live in a nursing home and think that Gatland failed in NZ when in fact he lead Waikato to win in 2006

And flopped in 2005 and 2007. His Welsh team got humiliated by the Chiefs. And he's been woefully outclassed by the ABs on every occasion. Please do us a favour and offer him the world to stay in Wales.

Unfortunately in Wales he is unable to nurture the motherlode of rugby talent in Polynesia like NZ can

Gwlad wrote:Unfortunately in Wales he is unable to nurture the mothered of rugby talent in Polynesia like NZ can

Is that a Freudian slip?

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:You do know that Polynesia includes New Zealand, don't you?

Of course, its very handy for New Zealand that Polynesia also includes Tonga, Fiji and Samoa.

Gwlad wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:You do know that Polynesia includes New Zealand, don't you?

Of course, its very handy for New Zealand that Polynesia also includes Tonga, Fiji and Samoa.

It's certainly handy having access to all those good rugby genes.

Thankfully for the standard of our rugby we didn't have many Welsh settlers either

When the Originals toured in 1905-6 they lost one game of 35, to Wales. We don't need (want) to be living there to leave our indelible mark on NZ rugby history.

Pete C (Kiwireddevil) wrote:

Gwlad wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:You do know that Polynesia includes New Zealand, don't you?

Of course, its very handy for New Zealand that Polynesia also includes Tonga, Fiji and Samoa.

It's certainly handy having access to all those good rugby genes.

Thankfully for the standard of our rugby we didn't have many Welsh settlers either

True, and otherwise G Edwards might never have been capped.

Gwlad wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:You do know that Polynesia includes New Zealand, don't you?

Of course, its very handy for New Zealand that Polynesia also includes Tonga, Fiji and Samoa.

Guess opening our borders to families from the islands a long time ago has had unforeseen benefits. Not only is NZ a more interesting place because of it, many NZ born kids of islander parents have turned out to be pretty handy on the rugby pitch. Maybe Britain can open its borders to Pacific Islanders as well? Provide support and financial assistance so they can establish a community. Do you reckon that could happen? If you don't think that's a good idea then you should probably shut your ignorant cake hole on these matters and just stick to poaching.

And I suggest you stop swallowing your own rhetoric before your ignorant cake hole chokes on BS.

NZ invented poaching players like Olo Brown, Jerome Kaino, Mils Muliaina, Joe Rokocoko and Waisake Naholo who were all born outside of New Zealand. Thats just a few of them. How many get 'invited' to apply at one of many schools because they happen to be rather good rugby players.

Other countries started recruiting players, but none to the extent and with the organized structure NZ put into it. And they are recruited as professional sportsmen into a global game. not picked up as kids and packed off to a school abroad so that they can eventually fulfill eligibility rules.

Then when the rugby world cottoned on NZ started coming out with the sort of patriarchal drivel you have obviously bought right into, that it's nurturing and 'opening borders'.

Its cultural exploitation of their sporting heritage while putting NOTHING back into it.

You cherry pick a handful of players and ignore the thousands and thousands that are NZ born and play rugby for schools, club teams, SR teams and NZ. Not to mention the NZ born players with Pacific Island parents that play for their parents' countries because they're not good enough to make the ABs. So why don't you accept your ignorance and shove it up your bunghole. Time to run along like a good little boy.

No I don't think I will because the facts are well documented and incontrovertible, but you can't argue with facts so you resort to pathetic taunts when you know you're beaten. You're the poster who mocked autism remember. Just like I have come to expect from a kiwi like you, poor sportsmanship and hate the truth hence we all get subjected to excuses about bad food and bad refereeing when it happens.

It was the All blacks after all that stated their 2 aims upto 2016 were to win RWC and 'protecting players of PI origin'....one can only wonder what that means. Do you think they need protecting physically, one doubts that. I think protecting them as a commodity is much more likely. But as you say, we're all doing it now except that in NZ it is now 'nurturing' where the rest of us are just poaching.

Didn't mock autism

You do get quite overheated and frothy don't you?

ebop wrote:Didn't mock autism

You do get quite overheated and frothy don't you?

Yeah wouldnt worry about him hes just a clown. Fact is the NH club scene is ruining rugby the world over.

Up there its holding the Internationals to ransom by not releasing players adequately and NZ, OZ and SA are supplying off the shelf professionals in the hundreds to the NH so they can have their little soirees. Obviously theyre mainly watchers with fat wallets or they wouldnt need to pour hundreds of millions into the Sothern Hemisphere to help them coach and play the game despite having greater numbers, resources and obviously money- just very little actual talent.

Oz and SA rugby are suffering partially because of that and what do the greedy little NH clubs do? Throw more money at them.

When the dollar goes to the pack who's going to pick up the mess? We will. Thats why every time I see a club fall over in the NH, I laugh.

Some of that angst is likely to come out in the Lions series without them admitting it, the ABs wont want to let the NH have their cake and eat it too. Not the Lions fault but thats the reality. Not only do we have to face off against the NH players, we have to battle the SH help that we gave them, as well as hearing the periodic...'the gap is closing rubbish'.

And Gwlad wants to cherry pick a few players born in Samoa.

He's typical of the problem...no idea, and just wants to throw stones at those doing the real work so he can be sooooooooooo proud of his kiwi coach.

...Meant for Gwlad only of course. Keeps playing the same old tired line. Although the players exodus to the north is becoming unmanageable. Something's going to break sooner or later.

ebop wrote:You cherry pick a handful of players and ignore the thousands and thousands that are NZ born and play rugby for schools, club teams, SR teams and NZ. Not to mention the NZ born players with Pacific Island parents that play for their parents' countries because they're not good enough to make the ABs. So why don't you accept your ignorance and shove it up your bunghole. Time to run along like a good little boy.

oh the irony

of course now you totally ignore the issue and try to deflect with personal remarks, usual form for the kiwi on the defensive, just like your coaches, press, 'fans'

Lol

You're so predictable

(and ignorant)