Mayweather vs Ortiz

by **Fists of Fury** Tue 07 Jun 2011, 5:48 pm

First topic message reminder :

It's on. Sept 17th for Ortiz's WBC title. Thoughts?

by coxy0001 Wed 08 Jun 2011, 2:59 pm

I know you'll find this hard to follow, i shall try to keep it short and avoid using big words:

Marg: One fight in 2 years, beaten up badly in previous fight. No ranking at weight.

Cotto: Quits against a cheat. Barely gets past c-rated Clottey.

Both FMJ and Manny are choosing guys when they're ripe for the taking, which is something you can't accuse FMJ of this time as the guy's gonna be flying come fight night.

Why didn't Manny wait for the Ortiz vs Berto winner by the way? I mean surely you'll consider a 145lb fight against either more competitive than a fight against JMM at the same weight?

I hope that hasn't confused you too much.

by Young_Towzer Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:01 pm

The thing you have to remember is at the time he fought Baldy and Judah the DLH fight was on the horizon and his welterweight fights at the time were very much to legitimise the chances of him squaring off against Oscar in fans mind and to give him the opportunity to feel his way into the weight without the risk of blowing the Oscar pot of gold out of the water.

As a fan I would much rather him have fought Cotto but you're being very naive about the business side of the game to think any fighter would risk such a mega fight getting bashed up against tough fighters. Is not ideal but it is realistic and we are kidding ourselves if we think anyone else would have done any differently in the cirumstances.
........................
No, he fought Judah in 2006 well over a year before de la Hoya, at the same time he was offered much, much more money to fight a better fighter in Margarito. Also, he was offered the Cotto fight but chose to fight a fighter who couldn't carry Miguel's gym bag, Baldomir. Ducker imo, i have said myself many, many times Manny's opponents havent been good lately for the sport, but he imo wants the Mayweather fight much, much more than Mayweather does and would knock Mayweather out, also he is rated number 1 in the sport. End of.

by Rowley Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:06 pm

Even back in 2006 the DLH fight was being mooted, however given the size differential it was seen as fanciful in many quarters hence the need for Floyd to take a couple of fights at welter to legitimise it in peoples eyes and thus boost the chances of it doing decent numbers on PPV, would it have done greater numbers on the back of beating Cotto or the cheat, almost certainly, however the risk of injury or getting bashed up would have increased so the business side of the game inevitably takes precedent.

Oh and by the way putting end of on the end of a comment that is on the whole pure specualation and impossible to prove to any satisfactory degree just makes you look like a clown, or about 12.

by Young_Towzer Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:09 pm

Even back in 2006 the DLH fight was being mooted, however given the size differential it was seen as fanciful in many quarters hence the need for Floyd to take a couple of fights at welter to legitimise it in peoples eyes and thus boost the chances of it doing decent numbers on PPV, would it have done greater numbers on the back of beating Cotto or the cheat, almost certainly, however the risk of injury or getting bashed up would have increased so the business side of the game inevitably takes precedent.

Oh and by the way putting end of on the end of a comment that is on the whole pure specualation and impossible to prove to any satisfactory degree just makes you look like a clown, or about 12.
...............................
Nah, the de la Hoya fight would of sold anyway, both huge names, Oscar came back and fought a very dangerous Mayorga after 2 year out and destroyed him, at the same time this guy was fighting the gutless quitter Judah on the back of a beatdown of a Journeyman in Baldomir, End of.

by Rowley Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:11 pm

Manny and David Haye are both huge names but fights sell better when people consider they have a chance of being competitive spectacles. His fights with Judah and Baldy acheieved this, because I know when it was first mooted there were plenty dismissed it on the grounds Oscar would be simply too big for him.

by **Seanusarrilius** Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:14 pm

I cant wait for this fight, it will be exiting as Ortiz will come to fight and i fully expect Mayweather to win. But its a live fight and thanks the lord because Pac and Mayweather both have not taken a fight this angerous in a while

by coxy0001 Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:15 pm

rowley wrote:Manny and David Haye are both huge names but fights sell better when people consider they have a chance of being competitive spectacles. His fights with Judah and Baldy acheieved this, because I know when it was first mooted there were plenty dismissed it on the grounds Oscar would be simply too big for him.

Young_Towzer was only about 10 then and probably wasn't following the sport. Otherwise he'd be able to agree that consensus was DLH was just too big for him.

by **HumanWindmill** Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:22 pm

Fellas, I'd appreciate it if you'd all take a breath and pull back on the nasty stuff.

Thank you.

by Rowley Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:26 pm

Why I have been the very model of even handed probity. I have Coxy to lose his temper on my behalf.

by Young_Towzer Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:27 pm

I know you'll find this hard to follow, i shall try to keep it short and avoid using big words:

Marg: One fight in 2 years, beaten up badly in previous fight. No ranking at weight.

Cotto: Quits against a cheat. Barely gets past c-rated Clottey.

Both FMJ and Manny are choosing guys when they're ripe for the taking, which is something you can't accuse FMJ of this time as the guy's gonna be flying come fight night.

Why didn't Manny wait for the Ortiz vs Berto winner by the way? I mean surely you'll consider a 145lb fight against either more competitive than a fight against JMM at the same weight?

I hope that hasn't confused you too much.

......................................
and i'm the kid haha 8)

by Sugar Boy Sweetie Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:30 pm

Yes the Oscar fight was mooted when mayweather moved up to 147. He was supposed to fight one of the U.S's best welters of the time, Judah, in a big title clash, but baldimor took the shine off that. Mayweather was clearly well managed at 147 with the intention of building up to a mega fight with Oscar. Nothing necessarily wrong with that - many fighters are carefully managed at various stages of their careers for financial purposes - just look at mannys last 2 years of in house fights against damaged goods opponents.

But let's have one thing right - Miguel Cotto has never called mayweather out to fight to my knowledge. Can anyone provide a link to show he has?

by **Union Cane** Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:32 pm

Coxy, could you teach YT about the 'Quote' button?

by Rowley Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:32 pm

Spot on SBS, should be said Floyd's record once you get to welter does leave something to be desired and there are holes. The massive inactivity and pointless retirement give people a very valid stick to beat him with but some of the criticism, if not unfair is very, very naive to how boxing as a business works in the real world.

by coxy0001 Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:34 pm

Union Cane wrote:Coxy, could you teach YT about the 'Quote' button?

Now now Union, lets let him figure it out all by himself otherwise he'll never learn. Much akin to potty training etc

by azania Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:42 pm

Young_Towzer wrote:Oh I know Floyd hasn't fought them. Clottey? Dont make me laugh kiddo. Cotto and Marg had weight stips so I put an asterix on them.
............................
Baldomir and Judah over Cotto/Marg when he said he'd fight them

You a MOD, d4thincarnation will be next!

So Baldomir and Judah are the only opponents Floyd fought. Who deat Oscar, Hatton, SSM and schooled JMM? Seriously kid, are you old enough to vote?

by Michael Easton Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:45 pm

Young_Towzer wrote:with the one-time exception of the IBF belt he picked up from Zab Judah
/////////////////
What they gave Judah an IBF title even though Baldomir the journeyman had just battered him, don't laugh!

Baldomir didn't pay the sanctioning fees to the WBA and IBF so didn't win the belts, even though he won the fight.

Sanctioning body madness innit?

by Young_Towzer Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:48 pm

So Baldomir and Judah are the only opponents Floyd fought. Who deat Oscar, Hatton, SSM and schooled JMM? Seriously kid, are you old enough to vote?
........................................................
Isnt Marquez a fat lightweight, yeah grandad i'm 21. How come they have someone like you as a MOD though when all you 'try' and do is fan the flames and try to wind people up, you won't get a reaction out of me i'm just baffled they need someone like you, come across as a tad over aggressive wum to me in all honesty, on the right under young_towzer it should say age: 21 Very Happy

by Rowley Wed 08 Jun 2011, 3:51 pm

on the right under young_towzer it should say age: 21
________________________________________________________

Azania's says 98, given his views on old time fighters I have my doubts about this

by coxy0001 Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:01 pm

To be fair Towzer the bird i'm gonna be nailing once she's back from travelling is 21 (ex tried to go "away for a weekend" during cricket season)

Bearing in mind i'm 29 but look 25 i find it thoroughly acceptable

Least i know what she means about liking the mature man though as opposed to guys her age Wink

by Davie Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:02 pm

Did you guys just choose to ignore Windy's little suggestion that you play nicely? Or did you miss it? Either way, read it again please

by Rowley Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:02 pm

If she really likes a mature man coxy I am 38 and can promise you I look every day of it.

by whotobeA Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:18 pm

coxy, she's 21 & been travelling? if i were you i'd put 2 on the end if your jumping on, she's likley gonna have a higher jiz count than most of us on here!

For what its worth I think Manny being more active maybe puts him maybe a nose ahead but based upon them both winning their upcoming fights i think Floyd takes over. The circular argument about their records keeps going but these fights start to change things towards Floyd imo.

by Small Time Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:27 pm

[quote="whotobeA"]coxy, she's 21 & been travelling? if i were you i'd put 2 on the end if your jumping on, she's likley gonna have a higher jiz count than most of us on here!quote]

Jiz count?? Now that my friend is comedy gold Very Happy

by coxy0001 Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:27 pm

whotobeA wrote:coxy, she's 21 & been travelling? if i were you i'd put 2 on the end if your jumping on, she's likley gonna have a higher jiz count than most of us on here!

For what its worth I think Manny being more active maybe puts him maybe a nose ahead but based upon them both winning their upcoming fights i think Floyd takes over. The circular argument about their records keeps going but these fights start to change things towards Floyd imo.

Trust me, she takes some effort to get there. Bit posh n proper to get ruined by half of Australia etc

And i still have Floyd a 4/5 favourite ahead of Manny at say 10/11 (so basically nothing in it). Just think he's style-wise all wrong for Manny, nothing would give me greater pleasure seeing him beat as well based on how his fans have ruined most of boxings cyberspace

by **HumanWindmill** Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:35 pm

PM for you, Union.

by Rowley Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:36 pm

I foresee a spell on the naughty step for someone

by **HumanWindmill** Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:37 pm

Not at all, jeff.

In fact, I'm such a nice chap I'll send one to you straight away.

by Scottrf Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:37 pm

rowley wrote:I foresee a spell on the naughty step for someone

by whotobeA Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:38 pm

Have to agree there coxy, i appreciate how good Manny is & the names he;s managed to get one way or another on his record but out of the 2 Floyd has shown more (by a country mile) of what the game is about & i also think Floyd takes a UD after a few scares throughout.

by Rowley Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:39 pm

As you can probably guess Scott things are a little slow at work today

by **Union Cane** Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:44 pm

"BACK IN YOUR CAGE, ROLEYDOG!"

by **HumanWindmill** Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:46 pm

Union Cane wrote:"BACK IN YOUR CAGE, ROLEYDOG!"

There it is !

I'll second that. WHO LET YOU IN THIS THREAD GEOFREY ROLEY ?

by Rowley Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:49 pm

It's great isn't it. I have been on these forums for about four years now. Have made a genuine attempt to improve my knowledge and contribute decent articles and comments and all I am remembered for is being insulted by an idiot and starting a debate about when the decade ended. Why do I bother

by **Union Cane** Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:53 pm

rowley wrote:It's great isn't it. I have been on these forums for about four years now. Have made a genuine attempt to improve my knowledge and contribute decent articles and comments and all I am remembered for is being insulted by an idiot and starting a debate about when the decade ended. Why do I bother

At least you will be remembered.

Crying or Very sad

by **HumanWindmill** Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:53 pm

rowley wrote:It's great isn't it. I have been on these forums for about four years now. Have made a genuine attempt to improve my knowledge and contribute decent articles and comments and all I am remembered for is being insulted by an idiot and starting a debate about when the decade ended. Why do I bother

'Tis a worthy cause to keep Adad fresh in our memories, mate.

by Imperial Ghosty Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:55 pm

I ask myself the same question Jeff, why do you bother, after all your idol would get taken apart by Jamie Moore most probably

by Imperial Ghosty Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:56 pm

I also feel left out having not received a PM, favouritism I tell ya

by Rowley Wed 08 Jun 2011, 4:56 pm

Union Cane wrote:
rowley wrote:It's great isn't it. I have been on these forums for about four years now. Have made a genuine attempt to improve my knowledge and contribute decent articles and comments and all I am remembered for is being insulted by an idiot and starting a debate about when the decade ended. Why do I bother

At least you will be remembered.

Union if you don't think your reverse linear threads will have you remembered you're delusional. It was only last night I woke up in a cold sweat thinking about them

by **HumanWindmill** Wed 08 Jun 2011, 5:02 pm

rowley wrote:
Union Cane wrote:
rowley wrote:It's great isn't it. I have been on these forums for about four years now. Have made a genuine attempt to improve my knowledge and contribute decent articles and comments and all I am remembered for is being insulted by an idiot and starting a debate about when the decade ended. Why do I bother

At least you will be remembered.

Union if you don't think your reverse linear threads will have you remembered you're delusional. It was only last night I woke up in a cold sweat thinking about them

Likewise.

I tried to apply it to my family tree and found out that I am my own grandfather, which hitherto I had believed only happened in Cornwall and the Shetlands.

by BALTIMORA Wed 08 Jun 2011, 5:16 pm

whotobeA wrote:coxy, she's 21 & been travelling? if i were you i'd put 2 on the end if your jumping on, she's likley gonna have a higher jiz count than most of us on here!

For what its worth I think Manny being more active maybe puts him maybe a nose ahead but based upon them both winning their upcoming fights i think Floyd takes over. The circular argument about their records keeps going but these fights start to change things towards Floyd imo.

He's right coxy; she's gonna be a spunk bomb by the time she gets back. Posh or not, a bit of travelling and a few funny (ie foreign) accents and she'll have been dripping like a busted fridge.

by Rowley Wed 08 Jun 2011, 5:20 pm

BALTIMORA wrote:
whotobeA wrote:coxy, she's 21 & been travelling? if i were you i'd put 2 on the end if your jumping on, she's likley gonna have a higher jiz count than most of us on here!

For what its worth I think Manny being more active maybe puts him maybe a nose ahead but based upon them both winning their upcoming fights i think Floyd takes over. The circular argument about their records keeps going but these fights start to change things towards Floyd imo.

He's right coxy; she's gonna be a spunk bomb by the time she gets back. Posh or not, a bit of travelling and a few funny (ie foreign) accents and she'll have been dripping like a busted fridge.

Some charming turns of phrase there, one in the eye for those that would have you believe chivalry is dead.

by **Union Cane** Wed 08 Jun 2011, 5:23 pm

I think the phrase "A box of assorted creams" would also apply in this instance.

by BALTIMORA Wed 08 Jun 2011, 5:31 pm

She'll have been thoroughly scuttled.

by Michaels, Sean Wed 08 Jun 2011, 6:07 pm

BALTIMORA wrote:She'll have been thoroughly scuttled.

It'll be like waving a baseball bat in a cave when she gets back. king

by alfredperami Wed 08 Jun 2011, 6:22 pm

Michaels, Sean wrote:
BALTIMORA wrote:She'll have been thoroughly scuttled.

It'll be like waving a baseball bat in a cave when she gets back.

for me its a wide UD for Money whoever the southpaw is.

oh and as a young chap who spent some time on traveling with some posh totty it will be like
opening a window and Flip the night by the time she gets home

by Scottrf Wed 08 Jun 2011, 6:23 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBb-J0hcBQA

by Michaels, Sean Wed 08 Jun 2011, 6:26 pm

Scottrf wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBb-J0hcBQA

nice

by whotobeA Wed 08 Jun 2011, 6:38 pm

Wizards sleeve!!!

Oh & Floyd to win.

by **oxring** Wed 08 Jun 2011, 6:43 pm

I always wondered what supermassive black hole was about. Now I know. A posh tart's vagina.

by coxy0001 Wed 08 Jun 2011, 7:17 pm

Now guys, she doesn't know i'll be caving her in when she gets back. As far as she's concerned we'll be friends, how little does she know. As a consequence she's been moaning about the lack of class on her travels for her to shag.

And if all else fails i'll go up the poo shooter until normal service is resumed in the pink panther.

And regarding the fight, still no odds which is annoying. Have got a feeling this could be like Hatton/Corrales.... Just got this feeling that he'll simply hit Ortiz with too many shots he won't see coming.

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