Another Drive4show 'Anything goes' thread

[beninho]

First topic message reminder :

I think bailly does look a good prospect, but he is pretty raw. The spurs pairing is probably the best in tge league as a partnership. I think mendy looks an immense left back, alonso also good, I think rose is better then bertrand though, when fit. I remember a time when full backs had to defend!

[Diggers]

We don't know the ins and outs of his move, just that he (and the club) didn't agree a deal. Shock, horror that the club says it's done everything to keep him.
He was starting every game before he was crocked, he certainly was in no way in poor form, completely the opposite.

[beninho]

Whats he done wrong regarding how he's left?

I have no idea how good he is, 24, so not really a youngster with potential, 150 games but loads of sub appearances in there. I fear he is crocked and will just drift away in a few years.

I hope he comes good.

[super_realist]

He was in a great big huff for months. Petulant and hasn't handled not playing for Everton very professionally.

[beninho]

Have you seen that scar, its ridiculous. Im no expert but is a hamstring snap usually like that?

[Diggers]

150 appearances with 30 as sub is standard rotation, and in the past two seasons he has had about 6 appearances as a sub. About 33 starts both years, that's as good as you'll find from pretty much anyone. He's only been out 7 months and hamstring tears aren't aren't that problematic these days, just take time.

[Diggers]

He was in a great big huff for months. Petulant and hasn't handled not playing for Everton very professionally.

Who is your source, the Sun or the Star?

[Davie]

Just the next in a long line of "the next Wayne Rooney" - remember Jack Rodwell?

[beninho]

I'm guessing diggers very much remembers rodwell. 60k pw at the bottom of the championship

[super_realist]

He was in a great big huff for months. Petulant and hasn't handled not playing for Everton very professionally.

Who is your source, the Sun or the Star?

Big Fat Sam Allardyce actually, said his head wasn't in it and there's no point in discussing his future at the club because he doesn't want to be there.

[Diggers]

Don't see that Rodwell and Barkley have very little in common apart from playing for Everton. Different positions, Rodwell had a lot of injuries as a teenager which definitely diminished him. This is one injury for a Barkley who has been around Everton's first team for 5 years, scoring goals and making assists.
I'm not saying he has fulfilled his potential yet, but you'd think he was out of form and dropped before his injury when the truth is he was playing very well.
I'd say a good comparison was the Ox, both 24, but in also 150 appearances the Ox has half of Barkley goals and less assists. I rate Chamberlain and am glad to see him playing well, but Barkleys stats are better than his and as good as Willians, while playing in worse sides.

[Diggers]

He was in a great big huff for months. Petulant and hasn't handled not playing for Everton very professionally.

Who is your source, the Sun or the Star?

Big Fat Sam Allardyce actually, said his head wasn't in it and there's no point in discussing his future at the club because he doesn't want to be there.

Oh...Everton's manager. Wow, that's amazing, I'd never imagine he'd say that. I wonder if Barkley would say something different, hmm?

[Davie]

Don't see that Rodwell and Barkley have very little in common apart from playing for Everton.

Both were touted as the "next Rooney"

[Diggers]

Well that hardly their fault. Plenty of people would say that they could have Rooneys career and still be crap, such is the level players are judged by.
I'd rather compare Barkley to similar players and look at what he's done and in particular how he was consistently playing before his injury.

[kwinigolfer]

Barkley & Everton just seemed to fall out of love with each other didn't they?
Don't know whether Koeman was less tolerant of his workrate than Martinez, but he seemed to sulk thru last season. Not sure his performances ever matched the media hype except in cameos, but mutual falling out of love? It happens all the time!

Hope he rewards Chelsea for taking the risk.

[Diggers]

I doubt they see much of a risk, they had agreed a 30m deal in August, which he pulled out of. I know you've never been a fan of his Kwini, fair enough if you like players who seem to put in more of a shift, I've already given my view on tha, but his end product stats show his contributions justify more than a few cameo performances.
I'd say part of Everton's struggles aren't just about missing Lukaku but also Barkleys assists and goals . Coleman a big miss at the back as well.

[Diggers]

Lingard on fire, a 25 year old who a year ago hadn't done anything compared to Barkley, really starting to shine.

[kwinigolfer]

Digs,
Don't dislike him at all, just think he's fallen short of expectations and undeserving of all the hype. Hope he goes ahead and proves himself and is a shining success.
And they REALLY miss Coleman, the root of their problems, fabulous player and the guy who gives them balance and 110% effort.

Agree 100% about Lingard - keep on shooting!

[super_realist]

He was in a great big huff for months. Petulant and hasn't handled not playing for Everton very professionally.

Who is your source, the Sun or the Star?

Big Fat Sam Allardyce actually, said his head wasn't in it and there's no point in discussing his future at the club because he doesn't want to be there.

Oh...Everton's manager. Wow, that's amazing, I'd never imagine he'd say that. I wonder if Barkley would say something different, hmm?

Why would he slag him off, for all of Sam's failures as a manager, he's proven to be a pretty honest guy. Why would Barkley say any different? He left, so obviously he wanted to and if he hadn't been unhappy he wouldn't have wanted to go in the first place.

[Diggers]

It's pretty much the first rule of management. If a player wants to leave (which is perfectly reasonable) then you announce he is sulky and doesn't care. This deflects any grief from the fans that the club should have tried to keep said player (even if the club at that stage didn't want to keep him). They might for example make him train with the juniors to actually have him off.
It's the most basic PR in the world, I've heard it a 100 times from clubs. Fat Sam is no more honest than any of them, he will say whatever puts him and the club in a better light.

[Diggers]

Abject from England again today, the only shock being Smith not converting a 50 into a ton.

[super_realist]

It's pretty much the first rule of management. If a player wants to leave (which is perfectly reasonable) then you announce he is sulky and doesn't care. This deflects any grief from the fans that the club should have tried to keep said player (even if the club at that stage didn't want to keep him). They might for example make him train with the juniors to actually have him off.
It's the most basic PR in the world, I've heard it a 100 times from clubs. Fat Sam is no more honest than any of them, he will say whatever puts him and the club in a better light.

It's very rare indeed that you hear a manager publically criticise a player for their attitude. In fact, if you make a statement like that then all you are doing is inviting lower bids because it shows you've conceded that you are happy to see him going.
It isn't good or prudent management to declare the player as being a wantaway brat. It makes no sense if you want to capitalise. Fat Sam had clearly lost patience with him, and that's the whole point of this isn't it? Barkley's lack of a professional attitude to fight for a place.

In the current climate of English players carrying a 50% levy on their true value, then haven't Chelsea got themselves rather a cheap player, even if he's just as over-hyped as Rodwell?

[Diggers]

Super, this deal was probably as good as done before Sam arrived. You seemed to imply Barkley was sulking for not playing...he couldn't play, he's been injured. The fact is for whatever reason Wverton have let a big asset devalue, the best way to deflect blame for that is to blame the player. Like I say, it happens all the time, I'm literally amazed that anyone buys that kind of spin, guess you are proof as to why they say it.
Allardyce has been at the club a few months, he constantly changes clubs, for him to talk about loyalty is laughable. Barkley had been at Everton since he was 11 and has always been well thought of by the staff.
But if you proof of his attitude problems are the spin of a manager like Fat Sam then good luck to you.

[Diggers]

See if you can actually answer this question Super. You say he's over hyped (I doubt you even know who Rodwell is). List for me other players in the Premier League who have achieved what Barkley has that are available for anything like that price.
Show me all the players who aren't overhyped that score more goals and make more assists. Who are they? All of these midfielders who make a goal contribution every third start. Actually try and give some examples of what a comparable player is and what their value might be.

[Davie]

for all of Sam's failures as a manager, he's proven to be a pretty honest guy.

Ah yes that's why he's no longer England manager

[beninho]

I can't be bothered to check, but if we go back on this forum to when bfs got sacked from england (I still dont agree with the decision) will it be full of super r stating how honest a manager he is?

Everyon lost 20m when Barkley bailed on the deal on deadline day, it was agreed for 35m, they may be a bit pissed off with him. I dont get the sulking because he isnt playing, he couldn't play, still not fully fit now.

Rodwell overrated?

[beninho]

Things you dont think about till it happens. Getting Zuma from paw patrol stuck in your golf bag! I honestly though I was going to have to cut the bag open. Kids!

[beninho]

https://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2018/jan/05/roy-hodgson-crystal-palace

Interesting article on Hodgson, confirming what a lot of people said when he was appointed, he is a good fit at a certain type of club, and hysterical over tge top reactions post england were just tgat.

[navyblueshorts]

Super, this deal was probably as good as done before Sam arrived. You seemed to imply Barkley was sulking for not playing...he couldn't play, he's been injured. The fact is for whatever reason Wverton have let a big asset devalue, the best way to deflect blame for that is to blame the player. Like I say, it happens all the time, I'm literally amazed that anyone buys that kind of spin, guess you are proof as to why they say it.
Allardyce has been at the club a few months, he constantly changes clubs, for him to talk about loyalty is laughable. Barkley had been at Everton since he was 11 and has always been well thought of by the staff.
But if you proof of his attitude problems are the spin of a manager like Fat Sam then good luck to you.

As to loyalty, Allardyce gets sacked, like the rest of them. Difficult to show 'loyalty' with owners as they currently are.

As to Barkley, how's this for a conspiracy theory. Barkley rejects £30m move in August 2017 with Chelskey telling to go back to Everton and get fit whne they'll come in for him in Jan 2018. Everton invest the time, energy and money in his surgery/rehabilitation and then Barkley naffs off for a reduce £15m fee and a fat signing on bonus?

[Diggers]

Super, this deal was probably as good as done before Sam arrived. You seemed to imply Barkley was sulking for not playing...he couldn't play, he's been injured. The fact is for whatever reason Wverton have let a big asset devalue, the best way to deflect blame for that is to blame the player. Like I say, it happens all the time, I'm literally amazed that anyone buys that kind of spin, guess you are proof as to why they say it.
Allardyce has been at the club a few months, he constantly changes clubs, for him to talk about loyalty is laughable. Barkley had been at Everton since he was 11 and has always been well thought of by the staff.
But if you proof of his attitude problems are the spin of a manager like Fat Sam then good luck to you.

As to loyalty, Allardyce gets sacked, like the rest of them. Difficult to show 'loyalty' with owners as they currently are.

As to Barkley, how's this for a conspiracy theory. Barkley rejects £30m move in August 2017 with Chelskey telling to go back to Everton and get fit whne they'll come in for him in Jan 2018. Everton invest the time, energy and money in his surgery/rehabilitation and then Barkley naffs off for a reduce £15m fee and a fat signing on bonus?

Don't remember Palace or Sunderland sacking him.
Your theory is just that, a theory. The point is we dont know what's happened or why, so how come we instantly point the finger at Barkley?

[beninho]

If that was the case, then so what? Everton sell players they don't want anymore, whats wrong with leaving on your own terms.

[McLaren]

Super

How much you know about small details in football such as the transfer of a single player and the degree to which you claim to follow the sport is becoming increasingly distant.

Either you don't really follow or watch the game, as you claim, and therefore how could you know anything about Barkley's situation or you spend a great deal of time finding out about transfer dealings, invalidating your claim to not follow the game?

What is the reality of how closely you follow football?

[beninho]

Its clear that super r is mentally stable and, like, really smart. In fact a very stable genius

[pedro]

Aspergers

[navyblueshorts]

Super, this deal was probably as good as done before Sam arrived. You seemed to imply Barkley was sulking for not playing...he couldn't play, he's been injured. The fact is for whatever reason Wverton have let a big asset devalue, the best way to deflect blame for that is to blame the player. Like I say, it happens all the time, I'm literally amazed that anyone buys that kind of spin, guess you are proof as to why they say it.
Allardyce has been at the club a few months, he constantly changes clubs, for him to talk about loyalty is laughable. Barkley had been at Everton since he was 11 and has always been well thought of by the staff.
But if you proof of his attitude problems are the spin of a manager like Fat Sam then good luck to you.

As to loyalty, Allardyce gets sacked, like the rest of them. Difficult to show 'loyalty' with owners as they currently are.

As to Barkley, how's this for a conspiracy theory. Barkley rejects £30m move in August 2017 with Chelskey telling to go back to Everton and get fit whne they'll come in for him in Jan 2018. Everton invest the time, energy and money in his surgery/rehabilitation and then Barkley naffs off for a reduce £15m fee and a fat signing on bonus?

Don't remember Palace or Sunderland sacking him.
Your theory is just that, a theory. The point is we dont know what's happened or why, so how come we instantly point the finger at Barkley?

Well, we all only have 'theories', don't we?

[beninho]

Liverpool being a selling club again....small team.

But seriously, ehat a fricking good deal by liverpool.

[Diggers]

Super, this deal was probably as good as done before Sam arrived. You seemed to imply Barkley was sulking for not playing...he couldn't play, he's been injured. The fact is for whatever reason Wverton have let a big asset devalue, the best way to deflect blame for that is to blame the player. Like I say, it happens all the time, I'm literally amazed that anyone buys that kind of spin, guess you are proof as to why they say it.
Allardyce has been at the club a few months, he constantly changes clubs, for him to talk about loyalty is laughable. Barkley had been at Everton since he was 11 and has always been well thought of by the staff.
But if you proof of his attitude problems are the spin of a manager like Fat Sam then good luck to you.

As to loyalty, Allardyce gets sacked, like the rest of them. Difficult to show 'loyalty' with owners as they currently are.

As to Barkley, how's this for a conspiracy theory. Barkley rejects £30m move in August 2017 with Chelskey telling to go back to Everton and get fit whne they'll come in for him in Jan 2018. Everton invest the time, energy and money in his surgery/rehabilitation and then Barkley naffs off for a reduce £15m fee and a fat signing on bonus?

Don't remember Palace or Sunderland sacking him.
Your theory is just that, a theory. The point is we dont know what's happened or why, so how come we instantly point the finger at Barkley?

Well, we all only have 'theories', don't we?

Indeed, that was my original point to Super, we don't know what's gone on.
We do know Couthino has gone to Barca for 142millon, 105 up front. A lot of money but he's very good, have to say him and Barca look like a very good fit.

[navyblueshorts]

Super, this deal was probably as good as done before Sam arrived. You seemed to imply Barkley was sulking for not playing...he couldn't play, he's been injured. The fact is for whatever reason Wverton have let a big asset devalue, the best way to deflect blame for that is to blame the player. Like I say, it happens all the time, I'm literally amazed that anyone buys that kind of spin, guess you are proof as to why they say it.
Allardyce has been at the club a few months, he constantly changes clubs, for him to talk about loyalty is laughable. Barkley had been at Everton since he was 11 and has always been well thought of by the staff.
But if you proof of his attitude problems are the spin of a manager like Fat Sam then good luck to you.

As to loyalty, Allardyce gets sacked, like the rest of them. Difficult to show 'loyalty' with owners as they currently are.

As to Barkley, how's this for a conspiracy theory. Barkley rejects £30m move in August 2017 with Chelskey telling to go back to Everton and get fit whne they'll come in for him in Jan 2018. Everton invest the time, energy and money in his surgery/rehabilitation and then Barkley naffs off for a reduce £15m fee and a fat signing on bonus?

Don't remember Palace or Sunderland sacking him.
Your theory is just that, a theory. The point is we dont know what's happened or why, so how come we instantly point the finger at Barkley?

Well, we all only have 'theories', don't we?

Indeed, that was my original point to Super, we don't know what's gone on.
We do know Couthino has gone to Barca for 142millon, 105 up front. A lot of money but he's very good, have to say him and Barca look like a very good fit.

Yeah, I think Coutinho was always likely to go to Barca. Pity for Liverpool as he was such a huge cog for them and with Van Dyke having arrived and Keita's arrival imminent, just as they were about to take a step forward, they lose Coutinho. Still, money talks. Be interesting to see him and Messi in tandem for the next few years.

[kwinigolfer]

Mark Hughes on his bike . . . . . . can't see that he became a bad manager overnight, but that home defeat to Newcastle was x-certificate stuff for any manager.
Whoever will they hire? Allardyce . . . . . . ??

[Diggers]

Stats can show anything...but... 13 league games with Couthino win percentage is 46%. 8 games without him...66%.

[super_realist]

Mark Hughes on his bike . . . . . . can't see that he became a bad manager overnight, but that home defeat to Newcastle was x-certificate stuff for any manager.
Whoever will they hire? Allardyce . . . . . . ??

Hard to see he was anything other than a mediocre manager Kwini. Teams like Stoke need to get a sense of perspective really. How good can they realistically expect to be?

Who's next for them? O'Neil x 2, Monk, Strachan etc.

[pedro]

Teams like Stoke need to get a sense of perspective really. How good can they realistically expect to be?

As good as Leicester was last year...

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