Dragons Season Thread 2017/18 - New Beginnings

by munkian Thu 30 Nov 2017, 1:58 pm

First topic message reminder :

RiscaGame wrote:Their backs. Wow.

Jackman really can't settle on a hooker mind.

Just saw Simon Thomas tweet Leon Brown has suffered a second concussion. If that's so, I wonder if that means the first wasn't really dealt with properly?

Are you sure ? I've read it that he suffered a concussion so he hasn't been picked INCASE he suffers another.

by VinceWLB Thu 08 Mar 2018, 10:07 am

Stone Motif wrote:
VinceWLB wrote:
The Oracle wrote:Let's flip this on its head: would another of the top Pro14 coaches do any better with the current Dragons squad? The likes of Pivac, Rennie, Schmidt of old? Would we be mid-table or better with them? If so then obviously it's the poor coaching we've had over the last few years in Jackman, Jones and Jones. If not then can we really ask for more from Jackman? The answer is probably somewhere in the middle. Jackman will do better with an improved squad but probably won't be able to take them as far as one of those other top coaches could.

You just have to look at Zebre.. They had basically no preseason, a thin squad and yet with Bradley they have been playing as a team and even been playing some exciting rugby at times.

Maybe Dragons would be mid table team like Connacht/Benetton with a better coach. I don't think the squad is worse than previous seasons, yet results are.
Where is the squad better than in previous seasons?

No, it's not better but i don't think it's worse either than say 2014/2015, your last not so bad season..

I'm sure there are coaches who would have fared better than Jackman with the current squad, Dragons have a fairly ok platform to work with now, i remember a few seasons ago every scrum was pretty much a guaranteed penalty to the opposition.. And yet this doesn't show in the results. I have always seen the Dragons as a team that is better than the sums of its parts. Where has the flair gone in the backs?

by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 08 Mar 2018, 10:18 am

Stone Motif wrote:http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/16071244.CHRIS_KIRWAN__Jackman_must_be_given_chance_to_change_the_record_at_the_Dragons/

Boom

Spot on as usual from Chris Kirwan.

'It should have been a season where the gradient of improvement was small ready for a big rise but instead the Dragons have gone downhill.

'Perhaps a bit more contrition from Jackman, taking one for the team by shouldering some of the blame, would have been advisable to get through to the summer.

'Because since the turn of the year it seems like we have been killing time and the supporters deserve better than that.'

Has Jackman admitted to a single mistake? Serious question.

by **RiscaGame** Thu 08 Mar 2018, 12:25 pm

I don’t recall him doing so.

He didn’t really put his hands up to the Kirchner farce, did he?

by munkian Thu 08 Mar 2018, 1:09 pm

Nope. He's a bit Schmidt.

by Cardiff Dave Fri 09 Mar 2018, 6:19 am

mikey_dragon wrote:Well we are getting a new attack coach for sure.

A tad extravagent isn't it?
Seems the Bloos are going au naturale in the coaching department.

by munkian Fri 09 Mar 2018, 8:01 am

Cardiff Dave wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:Well we are getting a new attack coach for sure.

A tad extravagent isn't it?
Seems the Bloos are going au naturale in the coaching department.

Same with their ground.

by Luckless Pedestrian Fri 09 Mar 2018, 9:32 am

We're in for Owen Williams, apparently:

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/dragons/16074584.Dragons_eyeing_Wales_playmaker_Owen_Williams/

by munkian Fri 09 Mar 2018, 9:34 am

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:We're in for Owen Williams, apparently:

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/dragons/16074584.Dragons_eyeing_Wales_playmaker_Owen_Williams/

I've been hoping this would happen for a while now.

by Luckless Pedestrian Fri 09 Mar 2018, 9:36 am

Lord knows we need someone who can control a game. Ideally not a former Springbok full back.

by **RiscaGame** Fri 09 Mar 2018, 2:43 pm

Would be a handy signing for us.

by Guest Fri 09 Mar 2018, 2:52 pm

He would be a great addition. Must be a hard sell though. From Scarlets to Leicester to.... Dragons, at the height of his career. Surely he'd be eyeing up a return to Scarlets if anything? I guess they're pretty stocked at 10 and 12 though. But as I say, it can't be easy convincing good players to leave a big side for a less big one (being diplomatic here!).

by munkian Fri 09 Mar 2018, 3:11 pm

Hes not getting much game time at Gloucester.

by formerly known as Sam Fri 09 Mar 2018, 8:15 pm

munkian wrote:Hes not getting much game time at Gloucester.

Mainly because he's injured.

The Lewis lad you've got the signed up from Bath for next season is having a storming game in awful conditions tonight though.

by mikey_dragon Fri 09 Mar 2018, 11:57 pm

If we get both and keep Henson then we have some good depth in that position. I can’t see Owen joining us but it would be a great coup. For the record I can’t see him going to Scarlets either as that would be a pointless career move if the Wales 10 jersey is what he desires. Ospreys would be a good move for him, and it would be even better for Ospreys.

by mikey_dragon Fri 09 Mar 2018, 11:58 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:
munkian wrote:Hes not getting much game time at Gloucester.

Mainly because he's injured.

The Lewis lad you've got the signed up from Bath for next season is having a storming game in awful conditions tonight though.

That sounds promising.

by formerly known as Sam Sat 10 Mar 2018, 12:28 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:
formerly known as Sam wrote:
munkian wrote:Hes not getting much game time at Gloucester.

Mainly because he's injured.

The Lewis lad you've got the signed up from Bath for next season is having a storming game in awful conditions tonight though.

That sounds promising.

Got man of the match despite a yellow card. His kicking from hand was really the difference between the two sides. He's not really had a chance at Bath, might finally get a run now and show more to his game on a pitch that doesn't resemble a paddling pool. Or if he's unlucky Burns will be fit for next week and he'll be back on the bench.

by Welly Sat 10 Mar 2018, 2:09 pm

Owen hasn’t been injured Sam.

by **RiscaGame** Sat 10 Mar 2018, 6:38 pm

Great result for the Newport mafia today. 300k wage bill doesn’t cover a lot, I guess.

by Guest Sat 10 Mar 2018, 7:03 pm

RiscaGame wrote:Great result for the Newport mafia today. 300k wage bill doesn’t cover a lot, I guess.

Unbeaten I believe. How come they’ve only played 4 games though? In fact, how does the league work. I’ve completely forgotten.

In other news Caerleon 15-10 Lord Dowlais Very Happy

by formerly known as Sam Sat 10 Mar 2018, 10:31 pm

Welly wrote: Owen hasn’t been injured Sam.

Really? That's stupid given their lack of points off the tee cost them three points last time put.

by **RiscaGame** Sun 11 Mar 2018, 8:07 am

The Oracle wrote:
RiscaGame wrote:Great result for the Newport mafia today. 300k wage bill doesn’t cover a lot, I guess.

Unbeaten I believe. How come they’ve only played 4 games though? In fact, how does the league work. I’ve completely forgotten.

In other news Caerleon 15-10 Lord Dowlais

I didn’t know until yesterday about the unbeaten thing. It is hard to keep up with the Premiership, with all the changes. I’m not really that interested, bar checking results.

by Guest Sun 11 Mar 2018, 8:17 am

RiscaGame wrote:
The Oracle wrote:
RiscaGame wrote:Great result for the Newport mafia today. 300k wage bill doesn’t cover a lot, I guess.

Unbeaten I believe. How come they’ve only played 4 games though? In fact, how does the league work. I’ve completely forgotten.

In other news Caerleon 15-10 Lord Dowlais

I didn’t know until yesterday about the unbeaten thing. It is hard to keep up with the Premiership, with all the changes. I’m not really that interested, bar checking results.

Yeah, I heard unbeaten and thought it meant all season. But just checked and they’re unbeaten in the 2nd phase which seems to be after the east and west conferences have run (where Newport were 5 wins and 2 losses). Again, not sure how it works as they just seem to be lumped in all together now on the same league table in this phase. Headscratch

by Welly Sun 11 Mar 2018, 6:23 pm

formerly known as Sam wrote:
Welly wrote: Owen hasn’t been injured Sam.

Really? That's stupid given their lack of points off the tee cost them three points last time put.

Yep he has just been dropped.

by Stone Motif Fri 16 Mar 2018, 6:16 pm

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/16092954.Brown_s_Wales_tour_hopes_dashed_as_Dragons_suffer_double_injury_blow/

Rubbish

by Stone Motif Tue 20 Mar 2018, 10:30 am

Pretorious off to Kings, in an unusually certain change of direction for him.

by munkian Tue 20 Mar 2018, 10:53 am

Stone Motif wrote:Pretorious off to Kings, in an unusually certain change of direction for him.

His Mrs wants to go home, fed up of the Weather.

by Stone Motif Tue 20 Mar 2018, 11:57 am

munkian wrote:
Stone Motif wrote:Pretorious off to Kings, in an unusually certain change of direction for him.

His Mrs wants to go home, fed up of the Weather.

Not sure I buy that, surely someone who wasn't a fan of mercurial things would never have married Sarel fecking Pretorious

by munkian Tue 20 Mar 2018, 1:40 pm

Stone Motif wrote:
munkian wrote:
Stone Motif wrote:Pretorious off to Kings, in an unusually certain change of direction for him.

His Mrs wants to go home, fed up of the Weather.

Not sure I buy that, surely someone who wasn't a fan of mercurial things would never have married Sarel fecking Pretorious

Hmm, the weather is pretty much just consistently bad here mind.

by Stone Motif Tue 20 Mar 2018, 1:43 pm

munkian wrote:
Stone Motif wrote:
munkian wrote:
Stone Motif wrote:Pretorious off to Kings, in an unusually certain change of direction for him.

His Mrs wants to go home, fed up of the Weather.

Not sure I buy that, surely someone who wasn't a fan of mercurial things would never have married Sarel fecking Pretorious

Hmm, the weather is pretty much just consistently bad here mind.

Again, a charge that can levelled at her other half with some justification

by **RiscaGame** Wed 21 Mar 2018, 4:44 pm

Personally I can’t pretend to be too upset he has gone, especially if Charlie Davies and Tavis Knoyle follow him out of the door. His passing isn’t that great for a 9 and I think some supporters on FB do confuse him bouncing around like zebedee as being class or great. Personally I’m happier with Rhodri Williams and developing Babos next season, but whilst he has been here he has been underused.

by mikey_dragon Wed 21 Mar 2018, 8:37 pm

I'm only happy if Davies and Knoyle are off too, as Sarel was clearly much better than both. It's likely all 3 will go though, as we've signed two 9's and Babos has took his chances very well. There's always a chance Jonny Evans could return home one day too Smile

.

by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 22 Mar 2018, 10:27 am

You think of senior players as being cool heads that have a calming influence on the young players. We never really got that with Pretorius, on the pitch at least. He was too frenetic and it seemed to unsettle the other players. IMHO, of course.

by Stone Motif Thu 22 Mar 2018, 10:42 am

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:You think of senior players as being cool heads that have a calming influence on the young players. We never really got that with Pretorius, on the pitch at least. He was too freneitic and it seemed to unsettle the other players. IMHO, of course.

In fairness, it was part that and part he'd make a break and no one had the wherewithal/physical ability to get on his shoulder. Gareth Davies syndrome, good athlete, too unpredictable for his position.

by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 22 Mar 2018, 10:52 am

Which is unforgivable really when you know he's a sniping scrum half. But having said that, he'd often make a break only to throw a hopeful (at best) pass rather than go to ground, and the move would end there. That's the freneticism I'm on about. You need a bit of savvy at scrum half. I think Babos has it, and Rhodri Williams does (or did when I last saw him play).

by Stone Motif Thu 22 Mar 2018, 3:19 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Which is unforgivable really when you know he's a sniping scrum half. But having said that, he'd often make a break only to throw a hopeful (at best) pass rather than go to ground, and the move would end there. That's the freneticism I'm on about. You need a bit of savvy at scrum half. I think Babos has it, and Rhodri Williams does (or did when I last saw him play).

Well, yeah,catch 22..unforgivable that we don't have he quality of player to capitalise on his undoubted capacity for some opportunism but equally unforgivable that an overseas signing in a key controlling position also qualifies for the headless chicken of the century award.

by Stone Motif Thu 22 Mar 2018, 3:20 pm

http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/16108271.TEAM_NEWS__Wales_trio_start_for_Dragons_against_Cheetahs/

Three WTF moments on reading the team sheet this week at least.

by munkian Thu 22 Mar 2018, 3:49 pm

Stone Motif wrote:http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/16108271.TEAM_NEWS__Wales_trio_start_for_Dragons_against_Cheetahs/

Three WTF moments on reading the team sheet this week at least.

by Welshmushroom Thu 22 Mar 2018, 4:09 pm

I reckon our first 23 is looking fairly good for next season:-

1. Brok Harris
2. Elliot Dee
3. Leon Brown
4. Cory Hill (C)
5. Rynard Landman
6. Ross Moriarty
7. Ollie Griffiths
8. Harri Keddie
9. Rhodri Williams
10. Josh Lewis
11. Hallam Amos
12. Jack Dixon
13. Morgan Tyler
14. Ashton Hewitt
15. Jordan Williams

16. Ryan Bevington
17. Lloyd Fairbrother
18. Richard Hibbard
19. Joseph Davies
20. James Benjamin
21. Rhodri Davies
22. Angus O'Brien (assuming he doesn't leave for the Scarlets)
23. Jared Rosser

He still needs to recruit though and a rather large number of players should be cut from the squad. Can't remember how many Jackman said were going but I could see as many as 23 going (if it was down to me).

Anybody know yet who exactly is being released this year?

by Stone Motif Thu 22 Mar 2018, 4:15 pm

Welshmushroom wrote:I reckon our first 23 is looking fairly good for next season:-

1. Brok Harris
2. Elliot Dee
3. Leon Brown
4. Cory Hill (C)
5. Rynard Landman
6. Ross Moriarty
7. Ollie Griffiths
8. Harri Keddie
9. Rhodri Williams
10. Josh Lewis
11. Hallam Amos
12. Jack Dixon
13. Morgan Tyler
14. Ashton Hewitt
15. Jordan Williams

16. Ryan Bevington
17. Lloyd Fairbrother
18. Richard Hibbard
19. Joseph Davies
20. James Benjamin
21. Rhodri Davies
22. Angus O'Brien (assuming he doesn't leave for the Scarlets)
23. Jared Rosser

He still needs to recruit though and a rather large number of players should be cut from the squad. Can't remember how many Jackman said were going but I could see as many as 23 going (if it was down to me).

Anybody know yet who exactly is being released this year?

That tight five will be munched every game and we will be pushed to field the back row with any regularity. Very little ability to commit tacklers in the front five which limits your ability ton score tries. I'm not sure Jackass and Co have the nous to coach a side to the level where their ball skills compensate for power, and even if we did we are spinning our wheels hoping the oppo are daft enough to try and play the kind of game that ends up 32-31 instead of just steam-rolling us.

by mikey_dragon Thu 22 Mar 2018, 5:20 pm

We certainly need another good LH and TH if we want depth, and at least two locks but one will do if he's a beast and happens to stay injury free... I can't see Bevington making much of an impact with us unless in a loose game, which is likely only to be against a French 2nd team. We'll also need another fly-half. If Kirchner is fit he starts at full-back, otherwise it's Amos.

by LordDowlais Fri 23 Mar 2018, 8:29 pm

Arwel Robinson is looking like a prospect. He is having a good game so far tonight. It's a shame he will be playing second fiddle to a Merthyr boy next season. Wink

by LordDowlais Fri 23 Mar 2018, 8:46 pm

This is a very poor Dragons side I am watching here.

FFS.

People pay to go there and watch this every other week ?

They must be off their heads. !!!!

Queue the red bars and reports. But its true.

by ScarletSpiderman Fri 23 Mar 2018, 9:41 pm

Just seen the Dragons are after Michael Collins, welsh qualified utility back/centre.

by Guest Fri 23 Mar 2018, 9:50 pm

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Just seen the Dragons are after Michael Collins, welsh qualified utility back/centre.

Yes, saw that. From memory he was pretty good at the Scarlets wasn’t he? Would you recommend SS? Currently playing for the Blues in Super Rugby so can’t be too bad!

Parkes and McNicol have turned out really well for the Scarlets (good coaching helps of course Wink

) so I’d be happy with a few good players from that neck of the woods.

by Cardiff Dave Sat 24 Mar 2018, 5:07 am

LordDowlais wrote:This is a very poor Dragons side I am watching here.

FFS.

People pay to go there and watch this every other week ?

They must be off their heads. !!!!

Queue the red bars and reports. But its true.

Pay?

by Stone Motif Sat 24 Mar 2018, 7:11 am

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Just seen the Dragons are after Michael Collins, welsh qualified utility back/centre.

Yay, another back

by **RiscaGame** Sat 24 Mar 2018, 7:19 am

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Just seen the Dragons are after Michael Collins, welsh qualified utility back/centre.

It seems like this isn’t happening and seems to have stemmed from a Bristol Post clickbait non story. I’m sure Simon Thomas said on Twitter, he spoke to the player and it’s not happening.

by **RiscaGame** Sat 24 Mar 2018, 7:22 am

Cardiff Dave wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:This is a very poor Dragons side I am watching here.

FFS.

People pay to go there and watch this every other week ?

They must be off their heads. !!!!

Queue the red bars and reports. But its true.

Pay?

No we don’t pay. There wouldn’t be much of a cue down there, if that was the case.

by **RiscaGame** Sat 24 Mar 2018, 7:30 am

Last night showed (for me) why we aren’t keeping Pretorious. No control, running up blind alleys and even the pass for the drop goal was poor.

I’m not sure why Jackman took Wainwright off last night. He was our best performing backrow. Fairbrother had an awful game last night, which was a little strange. Our better players had to take too much on, which hopefully won’t have to happen next season as much.

For all the talk of we are blooding players which will serve us well next season and we will be adding to our squad, it would be nice to know that there is some sort of attacking template for them to come into. I can’t see any, save for send one man up carrying. There’s no clear structure like playing round the corner or playing in pods and pepper potting. Also, when they have such an electric back three (particularly the 15), why kick down his throat?

by Stone Motif Sat 24 Mar 2018, 8:56 am

RiscaGame wrote:Last night showed (for me) why we aren’t keeping Pretorious. No control, running up blind alleys and even the pass for the drop goal was poor.

I’m not sure why Jackman took Wainwright off last night. He was our best performing backrow. Fairbrother had an awful game last night, which was a little strange. Our better players had to take too much on, which hopefully won’t have to happen next season as much.

For all the talk of we are blooding players which will serve us well next season and we will be adding to our squad, it would be nice to know that there is some sort of attacking template for them to come into. I can’t see any, save for send one man up carrying. There’s no clear structure like playing round the corner or playing in pods and pepper potting. Also, when they have such an electric back three (particularly the 15), why kick down his throat?

We haven't strengthened the front five, so we'll be in exactly the same position next year. Felt for Elliot Dee and Cory Hill last night, they were forced into errors because they were the only two tight five forwards who turned up last night. OK we'll have Hibbard next year but we can't implement any attacking structure with such a paucity of carriers 1-5.

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