England vs South Africa - 1st Quilter International

by **LondonTiger** Thu 1 Nov - 9:49

First topic message reminder :

Date: Saturday 3rd November 2018
Time: 15:00
Location: Twickenham Stadium

Referee: Angus Gardiner (Aus)
Assistant 1: Jerome Garces (France)
Assistant 2: Ben Whitehouse (Wales)
TMO: Olly Hodges (Ireland)

Teams

England

15 Elliot Daly (Wasps, 21 caps), 14 Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs, 26 caps), 13 Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs, 13 caps), 12 Ben Te’o (Worcester Warriors, 13 caps), 11 Jonny May (Leicester Tigers, 37 caps), 10 Owen Farrell (Saracens, 61 caps) co-captain, 9 Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers, 77 caps), 1 Alec Hepburn (Exeter Chiefs, 2 caps), 2 Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints, 93 caps) co-captain, 3 Kyle Sinckler (Harlequins, 13 caps), 4 Maro Itoje (Saracens, 22 caps), 5 George Kruis (Saracens, 25 caps), 6 Brad Shields (Wasps, 2 caps), 7 Tom Curry (Sale Sharks, 4 caps), 8 Mark Wilson (Newcastle Falcons, 4 caps).

16 Jamie George (Saracens, 28 caps), 17 Ben Moon (Exeter Chiefs, uncapped), 18 Harry Williams (Exeter Chiefs, 11 caps), 19 Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 6 caps) , 20 Zach Mercer (Bath Rugby, uncapped), 21 Danny Care (Harlequins, 81 caps), 22 George Ford (Leicester Tigers, 47 caps), 23 Manu Tuilagi (Leicester Tigers, 26 caps).

South Africa

15 Damian Willemse, 14 S’bu Nkosi, 13 Jesse Kriel, 12 Damian de Allende, 11 Aphiwe Dyantyi, 10 Handre Pollard, 9 Ivan van Zyl, 8 Warren Whiteley, 7 Duane Vermeulen, 6 Siya Kolisi, 5 Pieter-Steph du Toit, 4 Eben Etzebeth, 3 Frans Malherbe, 2 Malcolm Marx, 1 Steven Kitshoff

Substitutes: 16 Bongi Mbonambi, 17 Thomas du Toit, 18 Wilco Louw, 19 RG Snyman, 20 Lood de Jager, 21 Embrose Papier, 22 Elton Jantjies, 23 André Esterhuizen.

by Heaf Sat 3 Nov - 15:23

SA kicking has been very good and not being handled at all well by England.

by stub Sat 3 Nov - 15:25

England will be delighted if this levels it...

by Collapse2005 Sat 3 Nov - 15:25

Looks like England miss big ball carriers. Not much go forward so far.

by Heaf Sat 3 Nov - 15:26

Definitely missing the V brothers ...

by **Biltong** Sat 3 Nov - 15:26

South Africa having no advantage after controlling most of the first quarter

by stub Sat 3 Nov - 15:27

Poor old May!

by Heaf Sat 3 Nov - 15:29

Biltong wrote:South Africa having no advantage after controlling most of the first quarter

Indeed - England living on the edge at the moment ...

by **Biltong** Sat 3 Nov - 15:29

This match is going nowhere fast

by stub Sat 3 Nov - 15:32

Now behave Itoje!

by **Biltong** Sat 3 Nov - 15:32

How many unforced errors by SA in the England 22 now?

Seems we are back to incompetence

by **Biltong** Sat 3 Nov - 15:34

Pathetic

by Duty281 Sat 3 Nov - 15:34

I've never seen a more one-sided 3-3!

by **Biltong** Sat 3 Nov - 15:35

The more we f up the more belief this english team will have

by Heaf Sat 3 Nov - 15:35

Really bad call by the ref there - SA prop knee and elbow went to ground first then got up again ... on his side too ...

by Sgt_Pooly Sat 3 Nov - 15:36

Wilson the shining light Smile

by **Biltong** Sat 3 Nov - 15:37

Heaf wrote:Really bad call by the ref there - SA prop knee and elbow went to ground first then got up again ... on his side too ...

Yeah, but your prop broke down. So in reality Kitshoff saved that scrum from collapsing

by **Rugby Fan** Sat 3 Nov - 15:37

Main source of England possession is South African errors.

by Heaf Sat 3 Nov - 15:39

Biltong wrote:
Heaf wrote:Really bad call by the ref there - SA prop knee and elbow went to ground first then got up again ... on his side too ...

Yeah, but your prop broke down. So in reality Kitshoff saved that scrum from collapsing

Hmmm not sure - looked like the SA prop dropped it first to me - however we're in trouble for sure ...

by Sgt_Pooly Sat 3 Nov - 15:40

Curry is missing too many tackles.

by Duty281 Sat 3 Nov - 15:41

Clive Woodward said England need to score five tries to win this one. Five tries? England haven't even been in the opposition 22 yet!

South Africa finally over for their first try. The forward battle is such a mismatch.

by Heaf Sat 3 Nov - 15:42

Well it was only a matter of time ...

by **Biltong** Sat 3 Nov - 15:44

Farrel is a class goalkicker

by Geordie Sat 3 Nov - 15:44

Ahhhh my fears are laid bare....

Not much point going to the World Cup...

by Taylorman Sat 3 Nov - 15:45

Biltong wrote:
Heaf wrote:Really bad call by the ref there - SA prop knee and elbow went to ground first then got up again ... on his side too ...

Yeah, but your prop broke down. So in reality Kitshoff saved that scrum from collapsing

Itll come Biltong, SA are all over them everywhere. Scrum, breakdowns and if not for Marxs throwing should be up there as well. But yes they should have had two or three tries by now.

Its taken a lot out of England to defend so far. Im a little surprised the Bok back row havent featured more yet. Pollards keeping the ball in front well enough.

by Sgt_Pooly Sat 3 Nov - 15:45

We don't seem to have a game plan. We're not big and nasty enough to dominate the forwards....yet we're not quick enough skilful to outplay. It's a bit of a nothing performance so far, How aren't we 20 behind??

by **Rugby Fan** Sat 3 Nov - 15:45

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Curry is missing too many tackles.

Seems like that to me, too.

by Geordie Sat 3 Nov - 15:47

Sgt_Pooly wrote:We don't seem to have a game plan. We're not big and nasty enough to dominate the forwards....yet we're not quick enough skilful to outplay. It's a bit of a nothing performance so far, How aren't we 20 behind??

I asked the question the other day...did Eddie Jones have no plan or was it constant injuries to key players that caused the problems.

Im more and more convinced its Eddie Jones is a poor head coach.

Changes need to be made.

by Heaf Sat 3 Nov - 15:48

Sgt_Pooly wrote:We don't seem to have a game plan. We're not big and nasty enough to dominate the forwards....yet we're not quick enough skilful to outplay. It's a bit of a nothing performance so far, How aren't we 20 behind??

SA errors are the only thing that have saved us so far - but I doubt they will be as generous in the 2nd half ...

by Geordie Sat 3 Nov - 15:48

Ahhhh my fears are laid bare....

Not much point going to the World Cup...

by **Biltong** Sat 3 Nov - 15:49

England still in this, South Africa really need to start improving their accuracy.

No use you control the match in such an emphatic manner, yet the other team is still in it

by Duty281 Sat 3 Nov - 15:50

Possibly the worst half of rugby seen under Eddie Jones' England. Inferior in every single aspect. A minor miracle that England are only two down - twenty down would be fair.

by Sgt_Pooly Sat 3 Nov - 15:50

Standby for an epic 2nd half performance from England....

by **Rugby Fan** Sat 3 Nov - 15:51

The game has played out much as pre-match forecasts predicted, with Bok forwards breaking the gainline all the time.

England are in the game because of poor South African handling.

by **LondonTiger** Sat 3 Nov - 15:52

Slightly amusing that the only times Marx has thrown the ball straight that half are the two that went long. All the rest, Including the dinky one were crooked as hell.

We will suffer in the second half I reckon. Can only hang on for so long before the dam bursts.

by **Biltong** Sat 3 Nov - 15:53

Dam can only burst if one of the teams actually hang on to the ball, and that team isn't SA

by Duty281 Sat 3 Nov - 15:54

Sgt_Pooly wrote:Standby for an epic 2nd half performance from England....

Cry God for Eddie, Owen and St Clive...

by **LondonTiger** Sat 3 Nov - 15:57

Sgt_Pooly wrote:We don't seem to have a game plan. We're not big and nasty enough to dominate the forwards....yet we're not quick enough skilful to outplay. It's a bit of a nothing performance so far, How aren't we 20 behind??

Plan seems to be kick and chase. Certainly only times we have made any headway. I know 40 minutes is too early to judge, but Farrell is struggling at 10 I feel.

Wilson has done everything we wanted which is one of the few pluses.

by Collapse2005 Sat 3 Nov - 15:57

Not looking great for either side at the RWC. Lots of players missing though to be fair.

by Sgt_Pooly Sat 3 Nov - 15:58

Let's be honest, it's a bloody awful game.

by **Biltong** Sat 3 Nov - 15:58

Collapse2005 wrote:Not looking great for either side at the RWC. Lots of players missing though to be fair.

Bit early to decide these teams' fate based on 40 minutes, don't you think?

by **Rugby Fan** Sat 3 Nov - 15:59

Not been impressed with Daly's security at the back so far. If he can't offer more in attack, then it doesn't look like a good trade-off with Brown

by Sgt_Pooly Sat 3 Nov - 16:00

I'd be tempted to take Curry off and put Mercer at 8 with Wilson 7. Perhaps the props should be the other way round too, I think the stronger scrummager are on the bench.

by **Rugby Fan** Sat 3 Nov - 16:01

LondonTiger wrote:...Plan seems to be kick and chase...

If that's the plan, then we aren't communicating very well. Boks are only occasionally under pressure when we do kick, when it needs to do that all the time.

by Sgt_Pooly Sat 3 Nov - 16:01

Rugby Fan wrote:Not been impressed with Daly's security at the back so far. If he can't offer more in attack, then it doesn't look like a good trade-off with Brown

We've had no ball to be fair and the tiny bit we've had has been kicked away to release pressure. Needs a major step up in the 2nd.

by Collapse2005 Sat 3 Nov - 16:06

Is Tuilagi on the bench? England need a change I think.

by Heaf Sat 3 Nov - 16:09

England are struggling enough without having no chance to compete at the line-out as they are so crocked ... apart from when they go long.

by Taylorman Sat 3 Nov - 16:11

Currys injury looks as though thats one less option for next week though he didnt enjoy this company at all. Lot of mistakes from both sides in this.

by Heaf Sat 3 Nov - 16:12

ABs would be about 50 up by now I reckon ...

by Taylorman Sat 3 Nov - 16:12

Marx having one of his shockers throwing in, hes done than several times before. Couldnt hit a barn door on one match.

by Collapse2005 Sat 3 Nov - 16:12

Is this the same Marx with a world player of the year nomination?

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