Dragons Season Thread - 2019/20 aka Year 1 of the new 5 Year Plan

by Stone Motif Sun 30 Dec 2018, 11:19 pm

First topic message reminder :

RiscaGame wrote:A good win for Dragons. Wonder if George North might get banned this week for more shethousery. Guy is turning into a dirty get down there.

Wasn’t too convinced by the subs we made, but they turned out to be wise choices. That includes Tovey steadying the ship and kicking the winner and surprisingly Suter being solid in the scrum.

It's an amazing win given the Ospreys dominance. If they'd have made the right calls our luck would have run out I think.

by mikey_dragon Mon 30 Dec 2019, 4:27 pm

No not yet, but if he did then he'd just be going backwards faster than he does forwards, as usual.

by **RiscaGame** Mon 30 Dec 2019, 5:12 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Just bought my ticket for the Ospreys game, which is a pretty big one. Two wins out of three derby games would be an excellent return for us. If we lose, how much progress have we really made?

Whilst Ospreys won’t be as bad as the Scarlets game, there’s a reason we are favourites for this game. The trouble is, is that derbies with us tend to be gritty affairs with not many points in it. Especially the recent Ospreys, Dave Parade visits, where it has just been kick tennis really and both teams waiting/playing for mistakes. George North and AWJ (probably) being available is a huge boost for them too. Just hope North behaves this year, unlike last.

by **RiscaGame** Mon 30 Dec 2019, 5:24 pm

Brok only re-signing until the end of the season, is interesting. Makes me wonder if they’re waiting to see what happens with Bevington and then making a decision. For me I’d re-sign Brok and Jarvis and release Bevington.

by mikey_dragon Mon 30 Dec 2019, 6:40 pm

RiscaGame wrote:Brok only re-signing until the end of the season, is interesting. Makes me wonder if they’re waiting to see what happens with Bevington and then making a decision. For me I’d re-sign Brok and Jarvis and release Bevington.

Definitely. I'd hope we are in the market for another good LH anyway, as I don't think anyone else can really step up yet. Apparently Olivier Azam worked with us on a PT basis, I don't remember reading about that.

by Guest Mon 30 Dec 2019, 7:19 pm

Yeah, read about Azam a few weeks back. The Argus (I think) were reporting it and saying the Dragons were keen to stress that it was not in any way to undermine or replace Ceri Jones but more to support and add new ideas. Jones himself was interviewed and said it was great to have Azam on board and didn’t see it as a criticism of himself.

I’m hoping Azam can bring on Leon Brown and give him a bit extra on his technique in the scrum to hopefully help realise his potential.

by mikey_dragon Mon 30 Dec 2019, 7:37 pm

Bringing on Azam FT is perhaps something else we can look to do. No harm in having two forwards coaches Smile

.

by Stone Motif Mon 30 Dec 2019, 9:03 pm

https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/18129052.ryan-dragons-input-wru-talks-wales-aces/

This is interesting. Sounds like the WRU get to choose where our best players will be playing once they're on the 38 list.

https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/18129052.ryan-dragons-input-wru-talks-wales-aces/

Glad we're not in for Webb. If he goes home I wonder if we could get Harri Morgan to move east.

by mikey_dragon Mon 30 Dec 2019, 9:11 pm

Be awkward if the WRU start putting all the players into Cardiff Blues, that's what they wanted a few years back wasn't it? Right before Cardiff went south.

by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 02 Jan 2020, 12:27 pm

More good stuff from Chris Kirwan:

'Expectations are relative, what Leinster and Munster supporters hope for and demand is wildly different to the wishes of the Dragons and Zebre fans.

'In this neck of the woods the desire was a team that is competitive rather than being cannon fodder and that box has been ticked so far, which provides a foundation to grow from.

'Some have jumped the gun in declaring a resurgence at Rodney Parade but the signs are encouraging.

'In Ryan they have a boss who has real clout and who has given them a real sense of direction. There are shades of Richard Cockerill at Edinburgh; work hard and nail the non-negotiables.

'The Dragons look well organised, both on the field and in training at Ystrad Mynach, and are making progress as a team and individually.'

https://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/18133129.chris-kirwan-slow-steady-dean-ryan-giving-dragons-reason-cautious-optimism/

He also warns against thinking the Ospreys game is in the bag, considering the dreadful home defeats to Connacht and Zebre this season.

by mikey_dragon Thu 02 Jan 2020, 12:55 pm

Hopefully Dean is also targeting 4 good forwards for the pack next year like Mulvihill supposedly is.

by **RiscaGame** Thu 02 Jan 2020, 3:52 pm

Yeah, a good article again. Hard not to like Dean Ryan too.

I know a few of my friends who have jumped now on the half season ticket offer now, due to the steady start. It’s good to see a sense of hope there again.

by Luckless Pedestrian Thu 02 Jan 2020, 4:21 pm

I'm confident that Dean Ryan knows what we need on and off the pitch. The question is whether we can afford what we need, which applies to the other regions too. But I'm also confident that he'll do a good job with what we can afford.

by mikey_dragon Fri 03 Jan 2020, 11:59 am

One of my many impressions whilst browsing online is that Cardiff fans really dislike Wainwright, whilst thinking Turnbull is the second coming. I call that delusion.

by Luckless Pedestrian Fri 03 Jan 2020, 12:19 pm

Dragons: W Talbot-Davies, J Rosser, T Morgan, T Griffiths, A Hewitt, S Davies, R Williams (captain), B Harris, E Dee, L Brown, J Davies, C Hill, A Wainwright, T Basham, R Moriarty. Replacements: R Hibbard, A Jarvis, L Fairbrother, M Screech, H Keddie, T Knoyle, J Botica, A Warren.

Ospreys: Ospreys: C Evans, G North, T Thomas-Wheeler, S Williams, L Morgan, L Price, A Davies, N Smith, S Parry, M Fia, A Beard, B Davies, O Cracknell, J Tipuric (captain), M Morris. Replacements: S Otten, D Marfo, S Gardiner, D Lydiate, S Cross, S Venter, M McKenzie, H Dirksen.

Referee: Andrew Brace (Ireland)

by Luckless Pedestrian Fri 03 Jan 2020, 12:23 pm

Another good back row battle. I like the look of Morgan Morris.

It's a boost for the Ospreys to have Scott Williams back, and a surprise that we've brought Tom Griffiths in.

by mikey_dragon Fri 03 Jan 2020, 12:24 pm

T-D and Rosser did look out of their depth against the Blues back 3, but T-D got better as the game went on. I think we've found some good back 3 cover in both, but going forward it should be an area we look to strengthen.

Is Nansen injured again after his one game back versus Scarlets, really?

by mikey_dragon Fri 03 Jan 2020, 12:27 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Another good back row battle. I like the look of Morgan Morris.

It's a boost for the Ospreys to have Scott Williams back, and a surprise that we've brought Tom Griffiths in.

Yeah he's been good for them. If Tipuric goes to Bristol they might not recruit there after-all, unless it's Moriarty...

I wouldn't call that a boost if he's been gash. Hopefully we target that 9,10,12 axis as it's been their weakness. Dixon looked pedestrian against Cardiff, but a few of our guys did tbh. I wonder if we'll try Griffiths outside of Dixon at some point. Morgan is a good player but somehow gives the impression he's really struggling.

by **RiscaGame** Fri 03 Jan 2020, 1:31 pm

I had a feeling Griffiths might play in this, after Dean’s comments after the Blues game. I think I’d have preferred Griffiths and Warren though. To be honest, my only surprise is probably Davies for Screech.

by mikey_dragon Fri 03 Jan 2020, 2:47 pm

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/rugby-union/50984403

Ian Evans leaves, I think it's with immediate effect? Hopefully a sign that Azam is to join us on a full time basis...

by mikey_dragon Fri 03 Jan 2020, 3:11 pm

mikey_dragon wrote:One of my many impressions whilst browsing online is that Cardiff fans really dislike Wainwright, whilst thinking Turnbull is the second coming. I call that delusion.

Oh and further to this is Leon Brown. They really don't like that he has improved, and keep using statistics from previous seasons to bash him. All this whilst rating Scott Andrews and Dillon Lewis as top scrummaging TH's - just let that sink in.

by Brendan Fri 03 Jan 2020, 6:06 pm

Do you think Dragon can get the win v Ospreys.

If they can they will open a nice cushion in the fight for the European playoff. A win could also see Dragon on a similar pts to Glasgow if they lose.

Dragon seem to be a lot harder to play against this year.

by **RiscaGame** Sat 04 Jan 2020, 1:44 am

Brendan wrote:Do you think Dragon can get the win v Ospreys.

If they can they will open a nice cushion in the fight for the European playoff. A win could also see Dragon on a similar pts to Glasgow if they lose.

Dragon seem to be a lot harder to play against this year.

I’m not sure why you’d ask can we win? We beat them at home last season, when they were better than they are now. They had the talisman playing then too. The only thing that doesn’t help us, is we don’t play well as favourites usually, Ospreys have their backs to the wall and a derby is normally pretty close too.

I think we can win. I wouldn't be surprised if Ospreys won tomorrow either. They have a strong team. We have Sam Davies probably trying to prove he should’ve been first choice there. Will be very interesting. Dragons can win.

by **RiscaGame** Sat 04 Jan 2020, 5:15 pm

Well done Dragons, on a good win. Didn’t enjoy watching it though. Seemed very careless in possession. But to rally like we did, after losing two key players so late is great.

Sam Davies’ goalkicking off again though. Bit of a worry.

by Pot Hale Sun 05 Jan 2020, 1:27 am

Another notch on the season belt - congrats Dragons and their fans. 4 wins on the board already and we're not at the halfway point yet. And the next rounds during the 6N where Bennetton (h), Glasgow (a) will be without key players. Cheetahs (h), Ulster, Scarlets, Ulster might be a tougher chunk before you meet Ospreys again, then a tour in SA for two matches in May.

by Luckless Pedestrian Mon 06 Jan 2020, 10:22 am

RiscaGame wrote:Well done Dragons, on a good win. Didn’t enjoy watching it though. Seemed very careless in possession. But to rally like we did, after losing two key players so late is great.

Sam Davies’ goalkicking off again though. Bit of a worry.

It took me a few minutes to realise Cory Hill wasn't out there. Rio Dyer I'd spotted during the warm up.

We really didn't protect the ball well at all on Saturday. It was a good Ospreys back row so we should have expected a battle at the breakdown, but they must have won half a dozen turnovers at least. That Morgan Morris looks a very good player, maybe not Test level but the kind of player you can rely on every game.

With about 10 minutes to go I really though we'd lose - and to be honest we would have deserved to lose. But that scrum and the try that came from it really changed the momentum of the game, and we've learnt from past experience how hard it can be to see out a game when you're in the habit of losing. I feel for the Ospreys, but in the end they didn't do enough.

You won't like this Mikey, but I was in line with Scott Williams's kick for George North's try and it was superb. Wink

by **RiscaGame** Mon 06 Jan 2020, 11:43 am

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

It took me a few minutes to realise Cory Hill wasn't out there. Rio Dyer I'd spotted during the warm up.

We really didn't protect the ball well at all on Saturday. It was a good Ospreys back row so we should have expected a battle at the breakdown, but they must have won half a dozen turnovers at least. That Morgan Morris looks a very good player, maybe not Test level but the kind of player you can rely on every game.

With about 10 minutes to go I really though we'd lose - and to be honest we would have deserved to lose. But that scrum and the try that came from it really changed the momentum of the game, and we've learnt from past experience how hard it can be to see out a game when you're in the habit of losing. I feel for the Ospreys, but in the end they didn't do enough.

You won't like this Mikey, but I was in line with Scott Williams's kick for George North's try and it was superb.

I thought Tom Griffiths was particularly poor at losing the ball, on Sat. Think Wainwright did a couple of times too. Agree on Morris.

To be honest, I had kind of given up on the game when Price kicked to take them to 21-13 around fifty minutes. Then when he missed, I had a feeling we would finish strong and held out hope still. As Holley said on Premier, they sat on their lead too much.

It was a good kick, but so was Sam's (under more pressure too) and I suspect there won't be quite the fuss from some to get him playing for Wales. Wink

by **RiscaGame** Mon 06 Jan 2020, 11:44 am

Plus, his own centre partner and the unloved Adam Warren actually scored tries, so they deserve more credit in the bank.

by Luckless Pedestrian Mon 06 Jan 2020, 11:56 am

I didn't know who'd scored the winning try until I got home, it was mayhem. Adam Warren's been such a consistent player for us, even when we've played him on the wing. I don't think he'll get a call up, but he would deserve it if it came.

Another thing I didn't see until I got home was how 'flat' Elliot Dee's pass was for Leon Brown's try! Laugh

by **RiscaGame** Mon 06 Jan 2020, 12:02 pm

I don't know if Scrum V showed it, or I assume from the clip they showed to preview the show that they just used Premier's coverage anyway. But at halftime, they showed an aerial shot of the pass etc and it looked pretty flat there. At the end of the day, it was checked by the TMO anyway, so I will go along with his not clear and obvious ruling. He won't get a call up, but he is in just as much form as Williams and certainly more durable.

I actually said on FB, I'd have started Warren on the wing, over Dyer laughing

. Thought North might've been too big a test for him. In the end, North was poor and Dyer broke his tackles more than once.

by Luckless Pedestrian Mon 06 Jan 2020, 12:06 pm

On the pass, I guess once the try's been awarded, it's like 'any reason I can't award the try', so it has to be a clearly wrong decision to overturn it. I haven't seen the aerial shot.

by Luckless Pedestrian Mon 06 Jan 2020, 12:08 pm

Not long 'til the Wales squad is announced now, is it?

by **RiscaGame** Mon 06 Jan 2020, 12:38 pm

I can't imagine it will be. Have been happily distracted by the derbies, to have not thought too much about it yet. I assume they will have two weeks in camp before Italy, so it will have to be this week or early next, I guess.

by mikey_dragon Mon 06 Jan 2020, 2:48 pm

LP, why wouldn’t I like it? I can acknowledge it was a good kick and also a good finish by North. I thought our centres were poor though, and Dyer’s inexperience showed at times but overall he was very good. So not a difficult task for players of their supposed caliber to show flashes of brilliance, but if you were to tell me that Williams and North have been good for a couple seasons when they clearly haven’t be, I would have to disagree.

Our front 5 were good, performed a lot better than their opposition. Screech was very good as was Brown. It showed in the lineout with Hill dropping out though, I can’t quite remember but I assume it was Tipuric who was good at stealing our ball. Happy for Dyer too, I’m mates with his best older brother so I know the family will be very pleased.

I seen Basham about afterwards. He’s bigger and taller than the stats indicate so I assume they’re out of date, just in case someone wants to come back and tell me he’s too small for this and that when I continue to heap deserved praise on him.

by Luckless Pedestrian Mon 06 Jan 2020, 2:51 pm

It was tongue in cheek Mikey, hence the wink.

by mikey_dragon Mon 06 Jan 2020, 2:53 pm

We know an Ospreys fan too, spoke to him recently and he was wishing that Ospreys got themselves Dean Ryan. DR deserves a lot of praise mind, transforming our scrum from a joke to a force, and allowing our young players to come in and flourish. Our lineout drive seemed to develop under Ceri and that improvement seems to be continuing. I think we could go somewhere if we keep Dean and get some good signings.

by mikey_dragon Mon 06 Jan 2020, 2:54 pm

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:It was tongue in cheek Mikey, hence the wink.

Fair, difficult to tell when I first read it Smile

. I had to disagree publically though, as it’s ammo I think a returning member could do without.

by mikey_dragon Tue 07 Jan 2020, 12:27 pm

Do you think Moriarty would still join Ospreys now that he's witnessed the state of them first hand?

by **RiscaGame** Tue 07 Jan 2020, 12:42 pm

After AWJ's interview, I'd imagine there will be a reaction to what's happening there now.

Part of me thinks Moriarty will stay. I also wonder whether Ospreys really would want to spend money on his wages, when they can just keep developing Morris etc.

by Luckless Pedestrian Tue 07 Jan 2020, 12:43 pm

I don't know how keen he was to move anyway - I haven't read anything about it, just heard the rumours. If he really wants to move, then I don't think the match last week will have made a difference.

by mikey_dragon Tue 07 Jan 2020, 12:48 pm

True and true. If Moriarty stays with us then he needs to play every single game like he did on Saturday. Not a bad idea if the WRU are mostly paying his wages with us.

by mikey_dragon Wed 08 Jan 2020, 2:47 pm

Why on earth is Brok Harris having to answer for putting in a good clearout on Aled?

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