Silly Season Transfer Rumours 19/20

First topic message reminder :

New year, new thread, new scuttlebutt, rumour and misdirection.

If Radwan does go to Quins...or leave at all I think there will be some genuinely furious Falcons fans asking for answers.

Nic White being allowed to leave his Exeter contract early for a Super Rugby contract, so he could be up for selection in the Australia RWC squad. 

Seeing as most things on the Rugby chat come back to the wage cap, perhaps Chiefs are trying to also get below their cap 

Fluxy wrote:Nic White being allowed to leave his Exeter contract early for a Super Rugby contract, so he could be up for selection in the Australia RWC squad. 

Seeing as most things on the Rugby chat come back to the wage cap, perhaps Chiefs are trying to also get below their cap 

I thought Baxter said that he was out of contract in 2020 and so would be free to sign a deal with a Super Rugby franchise to join next year and hence be eligible for the RWC.

it's a temp contract. he'll be back for exeter after the rwc.

Rhys Webb take note...

miaow wrote:it's a temp contract. he'll be back for exeter after the rwc.

The idea is that he agrees a contract to start in 2020 after his Exeter contract finishes. As he is then committed to Australian rugby he can be selected at the RWC. Same as Toomua agreeing to join the Rebels in June, he agreed that last year and as such was immediately available for the Wallabies despite having another season with Tigers.

Samu Manoa has joined Seattle Seawolves in MLR.

Harlequins announced have announced that 16 players will leave the club at the end of the season.

They are Alofa Alofa, Lewis Boyce, Henry Cheeseman, Ben Glynn, James Horwill, Josh Ibuanokpe, Dave Lewis, Mat Luamanu, Josh McNulty, George Merrick, Stan South, Phil Swainston, Charlie Walker, Luke Wallace, Dave Ward and Calum Waters.

Read more at https://www.premiershiprugby.com/2019/05/03/harlequins-announce-player-departures/#Ao7vdDrkkSswXMos.99

Quins announce leavers with two games to go. No naming where they are going even the confirmed ones

Boyce has a lot of talent if he can kick on.

I'd happily take Charlie Walker back at Tigers. Bags of pace and a nose for the try line.

Sad to see Charlie Walker and Merrick go.
The rest have had their ups and downs - presumably haven't fitted into Gustards plans.
Wallace has been an excellent clubman - but even when fit he hasn't been selected.

Glynn and Alofa have also been good versatile options over the last few seasons - but I think they are being replaced by potentially better players.

Calum Waters - is just someone we haven't given a chance to. Stellar on the 7's circuit and I am surprised he wasn't given more chances when we had Care and Mulchrone out with injury (instead of relying on Dave Lewis and medical joker Hidalgo Clyne).

Lewis was terrible, im stunned he was given so many chances.

Shame to see Glynn, Ward, Alofa, Walker and Wallace go. Some of them I really enjoyed watching.

Dean Ryan is set to take over Dragons as head coach. What do the English guys think of this, good or crap appointment for us?

mikey_dragon wrote:Dean Ryan is set to take over Dragons as head coach. What do the English guys think of this, good or crap appointment for us?

He's got rugby smarts but has been a nearly-man with his stints at club management. Ryan seems to provoke a hostile reaction in some quarters. When he joined the RFU, he got rid of two highly-regarded coaches in our age group development programme, which didn't go down well. He's regarded as a political operator, and a few people thought he was going to use his RFU position to put himself forward as England coach.

The Dragons move is a surprise, as it makes you wonder why he left Worcester for the RFU in the first place. It's possible that the RFU budget woes mean he can't see any way to achieve what he originally planned.

I'm sure Ryan learned a lot from Gloucester and Worcester, so there's always a chance he'll click at the Dragons.

The commentators on the brumbies game just said that christian lealiifano is out of contract and has had offers from Japan, France and Ireland.

Maine man wrote:The commentators on the brumbies game just said that christian lealiifano is out of contract and has had offers from Japan, France and Ireland.

He did enjoy his time in Ulster.

Maybe he will come back.

Nick Williams and Chris Czekaj to join Tom James at Man City Merthyr RFC.

London Irish to start announcing some more new signings tomorrow. Likely to include Sekope Kepu, Adam Coleman, Paddy Jackson and Waisake Naholo. Loose rumours of Ruan Botha and Steve Mafi as well amongst others.

Wow those are some players that could be lining up for LI.

Official announcements now trickling out .... so far we have confirmed Paddy Jackson, Allan Dell, Nick Phipps, Curtis Rona, Seán O'Brien and Sekope Kepu ...

Heaf wrote:Official announcements now trickling out .... so far we have confirmed Paddy Jackson, Allan Dell, Nick Phipps, Curtis Rona, Seán O'Brien and Sekope Kepu ...

That's a pretty decent spine of a team

Rumours of more to follow including Waisake Naholo, Will Goodrick-Clarke & Adam Coleman ...

Hooper confirmed as Baths coach then. Again no secret. He'll be joined by Hatley and Charteris. Always a player who impressed with his leadership though lacking a little quality. He seems perfect on paper for the role.

Bill Johnson to Ulster.

Pete330v2 wrote:Bill Johnson to Ulster.

The Munster lad? Wasn't he very highly regarded a few seasons back?

carpet baboon wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:Bill Johnson to Ulster.

The Munster lad? Wasn't he very highly regarded a few seasons back?

He was but suffered a number of injuries. If he can get a run of game-time and lives up to his potential he'll be one hell of an acquisition.

Waisake Naholo confirmed to LI ... nice one

Not to drag this thread down the pan but there seem to be a lot of grumbles coming from London Irish fans about their transfer business.

Only really in respect of Jackson and that's just a vocal minority. I think and hope it will blow over.

Guess you mean PJ? Oddly most of the comments seem to be coming from people that have not posted before so makes you wonder how many are actually current supporters ...

Jackson will probably be the best signing of the lot. He is a good player, will not be very expensive and has a lot to prove as a player.

I am less sure on some of the other signings who are big names, will attract big salaries but are very much towards the end of their career. SOB for example could be an expensive, injured luxury.

I did. I was.more thinking on the point for this thread if it takes traction and there s a rethink it puts a bit of pressure on the guys behind the scenes to get someone else in of suitable quality. Guys like Naholo certainly show the ambition.

London Irish must be stacking up some wage bill for next season. Does make you wonder how they are going to be able to afford/sustain it?

What kind of revenues are they predicting from their new groundshare? Their fan base has surely become very diluted from the years in Reading and is going to take a good while to build back up.

They will be pretty much dependant on TV money and sponsorship.

They are taking a huge gamble on staying up next season.

I always rated Jackson, thought he was looking like a real challenger to Sexton at one point. That kind of player, always available and with the experience and quality he has is essential for a promoted club.

Whether relegation will still even be a risk is another question of course!

LondonTiger wrote:Jackson will probably be the best signing of the lot. He is a good player, will not be very expensive and has a lot to prove as a player.

I am less sure on some of the other signings who are big names, will attract big salaries but are very much towards the end of their career. SOB for example could be an expensive, injured luxury.

I heard he was on £450,000 pa and a three year contract

He has hardly managed 10 games in the past 2 seasons for Leinster and they have been wrapping him in cotton wool for years.

I get the value of a marque signing for a club with ambition, but you do wonder about the sense in this one?

BigGee wrote:London Irish must be stacking up some wage bill for next season. Does make you wonder how they are going to be able to afford/sustain it?

What kind of revenues are they predicting from their new groundshare? Their fan base has surely become very diluted from the years in Reading and is going to take a good while to build back up.

They will be pretty much dependant on TV money and sponsorship.

They are taking a huge gamble on staying up next season.

We simply have to be a Premiership side when we start life in Brentford. Relegation or not, it is crucial that we attract fans and so bringing in these big name players will hopefully increase the chances of us staying up (if there is relegation) and, if relegation is scrapped, allow us to build a good fan base in Brentford.

Anecdotally as someone living in London I have already had a lot of conversations with people who say they will come to games once we move.

In respect of revenues, the deal with Brentford has not been revealed in detail, but has been described as a game changer and in a different league to the current arrangement at Reading. My understanding is we will take all match day revenues, compared to Reading, where we take about 15% or something abysmal like that.

BigGee wrote:London Irish must be stacking up some wage bill for next season. Does make you wonder how they are going to be able to afford/sustain it?

What kind of revenues are they predicting from their new groundshare? Their fan base has surely become very diluted from the years in Reading and is going to take a good while to build back up.

They will be pretty much dependant on TV money and sponsorship.

They are taking a huge gamble on staying up next season.

There have been rumours of another sponsor but not much in the way of any details as yet ...

SirBurger wrote:

We simply have to be a Premiership side when we start life in Brentford. Relegation or not, it is crucial that we attract fans and so bringing in these big name players will hopefully increase the chances of us staying up (if there is relegation) and, if relegation is scrapped, allow us to build a good fan base in Brentford.

Anecdotally as someone living in London I have already had a lot of conversations with people who say they will come to games once we move.

I lived in the area for nearly 18 months, there is a strong rugby club culture with the likes of Richmond, Ealing and even little Grasshoppers having a really good family vibe. I could definitely see a lot of those fans heading to LI games when the move happens, if I was still living there I would!

BigGee wrote:London Irish must be stacking up some wage bill for next season. Does make you wonder how they are going to be able to afford/sustain it?

.

Why does it make you wonder how they are affording it?

They can afford it due to the exact same reasons the other teams in he English Premiership and beyond afford their wage bill......because their owner is worth £70m

RugbyFan100 wrote:

BigGee wrote:London Irish must be stacking up some wage bill for next season. Does make you wonder how they are going to be able to afford/sustain it?

.

Why does it make you wonder how they are affording it?

They can afford it due to the exact same reasons the other teams in  he English Premiership and beyond afford their wage bill......because their owner is worth £70m

They cannot afford to exceed income by much based just on Crossan's worth.

In the 2018 Irish Rich List he was assessed to be worth 60mEuro, most of which is tied up in capital stakes in his main business. London Irish made a loss of £2.7m in the year to June 2018. Directly funding that (and perhaps increased) will make a rich man poor very quickly.

Talk is:

Chris Harris to Gloucester on a season long loan
Mark Wilson to Sale on a season long loan.

LondonTiger wrote:

RugbyFan100 wrote:

BigGee wrote:London Irish must be stacking up some wage bill for next season. Does make you wonder how they are going to be able to afford/sustain it?

.

Why does it make you wonder how they are affording it?

They can afford it due to the exact same reasons the other teams in  he English Premiership and beyond afford their wage bill......because their owner is worth £70m

They cannot afford to exceed income by much based just on Crossan's worth.

In the 2018 Irish Rich List he was assessed to be worth 60mEuro, most of which is tied up in capital stakes in his main business. London Irish made a loss of £2.7m in the year to June 2018. Directly funding that (and perhaps increased) will make a rich man poor very quickly.

You've answered your own question there then. That's how they can afford it......because they've got someone rich enough to pay for it.

You're also not factoring in TV income, collateral loans based on wealth and a possible CVC windfall.

I really don't understand this obsession with the Frenglish clubs being "unsustainable" or not "affording their wage bill". They clearly are. The Newcastle Falcons owner is worth £8m and Newcastle lose about £3m a year before tax.

Because it's an additional risk rugby fan. One many want to take but a risk all the same.

Except Crossan is not funding it, because frankly he does not have enough money to fund it. Looking at the accounts loans are funding the shortfall. These will be cleared by the CVC cash injection, but unless Crossan finds the additional investors he is seeking, LI will need to move a lot closer to sustainability.

Falcons issues are why they cut their salary bill by £1m for this season to a level that is lower than most Pro14 teams.

RugbyFan100 wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:

RugbyFan100 wrote:

BigGee wrote:London Irish must be stacking up some wage bill for next season. Does make you wonder how they are going to be able to afford/sustain it?

.

Why does it make you wonder how they are affording it?

They can afford it due to the exact same reasons the other teams in  he English Premiership and beyond afford their wage bill......because their owner is worth £70m

They cannot afford to exceed income by much based just on Crossan's worth.

In the 2018 Irish Rich List he was assessed to be worth 60mEuro, most of which is tied up in capital stakes in his main business. London Irish made a loss of £2.7m in the year to June 2018. Directly funding that (and perhaps increased) will make a rich man poor very quickly.

You've answered your own question there then. That's how they can afford it......because they've got someone rich enough to pay for it.

You're also not factoring in TV income, collateral loans based on wealth and a possible CVC windfall.

I really don't understand this obsession with the Frenglish clubs being "unsustainable" or not "affording their wage bill". They clearly are. The Newcastle Falcons owner is worth £8m and Newcastle lose about £3m a year before tax.

Relying on someone else to foot the bill is sustainable?

No 7&1/2 wrote:Because it's an additional risk rugby fan. One many want to take but a risk all the same.

And far too many now ex premiership clubs have had major financial issues to be too blase.

LondonTiger wrote:Except Crossan is not funding it, because frankly he does not have enough money to fund it. Looking at the accounts loans are funding the shortfall. These will be cleared by the CVC cash injection, but unless Crossan finds the additional investors he is seeking, LI will need to move a lot closer to sustainability.

The investors he is seeking IS the CVC money!

LondonTiger wrote:

No 7&1/2 wrote:Because it's an additional risk rugby fan. One many want to take but a risk all the same.

And far too many now ex premiership clubs have had major financial issues to be too blase.

2 Questions then:

1) What alternative method should London Irish undertake in order to try and safeguard their Pemiership survival?

2) Which PRL clubs have had major financial issues in the last 20 years?

RugbyFan100 wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:Except Crossan is not funding it, because frankly he does not have enough money to fund it. Looking at the accounts loans are funding the shortfall. These will be cleared by the CVC cash injection, but unless Crossan finds the additional investors he is seeking, LI will need to move a lot closer to sustainability.

The investors he is seeking IS the CVC money!

AFAIK he has still been talking about seeking a direct investor into the club rather than just teh league.

LondonTiger wrote:

RugbyFan100 wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:Except Crossan is not funding it, because frankly he does not have enough money to fund it. Looking at the accounts loans are funding the shortfall. These will be cleared by the CVC cash injection, but unless Crossan finds the additional investors he is seeking, LI will need to move a lot closer to sustainability.

The investors he is seeking IS the CVC money!

AFAIK he has still been talking about seeking a direct investor into the club rather than just teh league.

Like most independent clubs then. Always looking for more investment.

I think sadly, when we see some top signings by an English and French club, the envious green eyes come out and call it unsustainable instead of congratulating them on ambition.

RugbyFan100 wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:

RugbyFan100 wrote:

LondonTiger wrote:Except Crossan is not funding it, because frankly he does not have enough money to fund it. Looking at the accounts loans are funding the shortfall. These will be cleared by the CVC cash injection, but unless Crossan finds the additional investors he is seeking, LI will need to move a lot closer to sustainability.

The investors he is seeking IS the CVC money!

AFAIK he has still been talking about seeking a direct investor into the club rather than just teh league.

Like most independent clubs then. Always looking for more investment.

I think sadly, when we see some top signings by an English and French club, the envious green eyes come out and call it unsustainable instead of congratulating them on ambition.

Please feel free to explain how relying on someone to continue to prop up a club and increase debt is sustainable?

Maybe you should speak to Bolton Wanderers fans about how sustainable it is