Pro14 is dead...

by No9 Sat 13 Apr - 13:03

First topic message reminder :

Well we are nearing the end of the normal season and going into the knock out stages, and thanks to Premier Sports I can know say with confidence that my earlier prediction has materialised and the day has killed the Pro14.

They promised 1 game on FreeSports every week. Well unless you follow Zebre or the Kings you’ve not had that game. The Ospreys have not had one game shown on FreeSports. As for free to air coverage on S4C that has also been hit or miss, with them banning the red button English cometary, and again covering games with little interest.

So , since the conception of the league, this is the first season I’ve not been able to follow with interest. No (little) live coverage of games, no magazine show I’ve been able to watch to keep up with the league. I’ve managed to get to minimum Ospreys home games this season, due to family commitments. Basically, only rugby I’ve been able to follow has been the 6 Nations.

Thanks, Pro14, you played a stormer selling out. Enjoy the cash injection it brought, as it won’t last...

furious

by thebandwagonsociety Tue 16 Apr - 16:39

SecretFly wrote:More HD to speed up the game, make the ball appear to go quicker, add identifiable faces that we can prove turned up to support their teams (ban the non attenders.... if that's doable in logic terms).

Standard def lets the viewer believing the pass was flat, the crispness of HD (and especially Ultra HD) only serves to question every call by the officials, how many blades of white painted grass did the ball brush when grounding, is the foot in touch, is the bass forward etc.
Also, I see the quality of the usual attendee at the RDS. I don't wish that HD coverage crowd shot on any home viewer.

by mikey_dragon Tue 16 Apr - 20:14

This thread laughing

by Pot Hale Wed 17 Apr - 0:30

mikey_dragon wrote:This thread

It's even better in LD.

by tigertattie Wed 17 Apr - 9:40

Pot Hale wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:This thread

It's even better in LD.

Low Definition?

by Irish Londoner Wed 17 Apr - 10:00

And as all the "PrO'14" threads have done we come around to the inevitable question "What do the Welsh want?"

Wales can't sustain a professional league of the standard of the PRO14 much less the Gallagher or Top14 internally so that's a non-starter.

The English don't want them, they dropped the AW cup and are moving towards ringfencing the Premiership and bringing in Welsh clubs ahead of any of the English side would cause mayhem.

I agree the "conference system" of the PRO14 as it stands is a bit confusing - I'd rather it became a formal two division competition with promotion/relegation between the two, might be possible when we get to a "PRO16" - two divisions of 8.

It seems that attendances in Wales are reasonably stable, the national team is doing great and there are games on FTA television, certainly a lot more than the Gallagher has, together with coverage of the regional league.

So what would improve things in Wales.

by Guest Wed 17 Apr - 12:03

Irish Londoner wrote:And as all the "PrO'14" threads have done we come around to the inevitable question "What do the Welsh want?"

A successful professional club game. If the regions had mirrored the Irish provinces' success - every team has won the league at least once in 16 years, with two of them winning it and European cups a few times - more fans would be happy, attending games, focusing on rugby instead of football etc.

Reality is, Wales could not sustain the club game, can't even sustain the semi-pro club game now. Regions are flawed, lack identity for the most part etc. etc. we all know the reasons. But even then, had the regions developed a winning identity by continuing the decent success of the 00s in to this decade, they wouldn't be facing the problems they are.

Blaming the Irish is stupid. The Pr14 IS Irish-centric, has been for a long, long time - probably since they started dominating it! But also with the iRB being in Dublin, and the ridiculous refereeing in the league, it's never really felt like a competition of equal footing. Which is extra galling for fans who lost their team when the move from an all-Welsh league happened.

In light of all that, I think Welsh rugby fans are happy as long as the Wales team is still competitive.

by marty2086 Wed 17 Apr - 12:12

miaow wrote:
Blaming the Irish is stupid. The Pr14 IS Irish-centric, has been for a long, long time - probably since they started dominating it! But also with the iRB being in Dublin, and the ridiculous refereeing in the league, it's never really felt like a competition of equal footing. Which is extra galling for fans who lost their team when the move from an all-Welsh league happened.

Blaning the Irish is stupid but spouting conspiracy theories is the height of intelligence? Rolling Eyes

by Guest Wed 17 Apr - 12:17

Go on...

by LordDowlais Wed 17 Apr - 12:27

You've got to love this place. Rolling Eyes

by SecretFly Wed 17 Apr - 12:45

The thing about it never feeling like a competition on 'equal footing'.
How could it be ever considered a competition built on that principle? I assume the meaning of 'equal' infers an equality amongst participating Nations rather than competing teams. - and so again I ask the question, how could it ever be considered equal?
It's a competition for once four and now five distinct rugby nations. Each of these Nations have their own issues and priorities and designs for what they want the Pro14 to accomplish for them...and then that follows through to the individual teams. And that's only right and I'd strongly protest at any other concept. We are not one Nation that has created a League for our professional teams to play in, with one National body to decide down to the most minute detail how teams within the competition should be run, financed, etc. The Pro14 is not a National coordinator, it is an international negotiator. Welsh regional players don't qualify to play for Ireland. Scottish nation decisions made in respect to club and International are only pertinent to their National interests. They don't spread and shouldn't spread to unduly influence National interests of Italian or South African rugby. So some Pro14 Nations have two chances of winning the competition and some Nations have four chances. That's not equal but it's a condition accepted by the participants and it's the natural result of teams from five independent rugby Nations agreeing to play a competition together. Funding methods aren't the same, priorities aren't the same, five year plans aren't the same, ambitions aren't the same. Nothing is equal.

Now take a peak at the English Premiership and nothing is equal there either for any number of reasons particular to that competition. The only equal thing operating in any of the competitions is that fifteen players start a game for both teams, and if they play well enough through 80 minutes they might win.

by Eejit Wed 17 Apr - 13:00

Or if Edinburgh are playing, two sides play for 80 minutes, Edinburgh knock on and the opposition win.

by Irish Londoner Wed 17 Apr - 13:51

miaow wrote:
Irish Londoner wrote:And as all the "PrO'14" threads have done we come around to the inevitable question "What do the Welsh want?"

A successful professional club game. If the regions had mirrored the Irish provinces' success - every team has won the league at least once in 16 years, with two of them winning it and European cups a few times - more fans would be happy, attending games, focusing on rugby instead of football etc.

Reality is, Wales could not sustain the club game, can't even sustain the semi-pro club game now. Regions are flawed, lack identity for the most part etc. etc. we all know the reasons. But even then, had the regions developed a winning identity by continuing the decent success of the 00s in to this decade, they wouldn't be facing the problems they are.

Blaming the Irish is stupid. The Pr14 IS Irish-centric, has been for a long, long time - probably since they started dominating it! But also with the iRB being in Dublin, and the ridiculous refereeing in the league, it's never really felt like a competition of equal footing. Which is extra galling for fans who lost their team when the move from an all-Welsh league happened.

In light of all that, I think Welsh rugby fans are happy as long as the Wales team is still competitive.

Regarding the IRB being based in Dublin, isn't that more to do with the "relaxed attitude" Ireland takes on taxing sports than any grand conspiracy. Rather like when the governance of the ERC was moved from Dublin to that well know rugby stronghold and in no way tax avoiding, numbered bank account arranging country of Switzerland?

by Guest Wed 17 Apr - 14:19

Fly, I agree, and I think that's one of the key points. I also think it's one of the reasons there's so much tension between Irish and Welsh players and fans, moreso than you might expect.

by geoff999rugby Wed 17 Apr - 14:52

miaow wrote:
Irish Londoner wrote:And as all the "PrO'14" threads have done we come around to the inevitable question "What do the Welsh want?"

A successful professional club game. If the regions had mirrored the Irish provinces' success - every team has won the league at least once in 16 years, with two of them winning it and European cups a few times - more fans would be happy, attending games, focusing on rugby instead of football etc.

Reality is, Wales could not sustain the club game, can't even sustain the semi-pro club game now. Regions are flawed, lack identity for the most part etc. etc. we all know the reasons. But even then, had the regions developed a winning identity by continuing the decent success of the 00s in to this decade, they wouldn't be facing the problems they are.

Blaming the Irish is stupid. The Pr14 IS Irish-centric, has been for a long, long time - probably since they started dominating it! But also with the iRB being in Dublin, and the ridiculous refereeing in the league, it's never really felt like a competition of equal footing. Which is extra galling for fans who lost their team when the move from an all-Welsh league happened.

In light of all that, I think Welsh rugby fans are happy as long as the Wales team is still competitive.

I agree with all of that except the implication that the refereeing is biased
I think that is utter nonsense
You do get a lot of Irish referees for games in Wales against Irish sides and I am sure there are plenty of decision that make peoples blood boil.
However that is equally true in reverse we get a lot of Welsh referees in Ireland making dodgy decisions when Irish teams are at home to Welsh ones.
As I have said before the core of the problem here is Scotland and Italy simply don't pull their weight in providing enough neutral refs

by Guest Wed 17 Apr - 16:37

Disagree wholeheartedly about the refereeing. It might not be consciously biased but it's definitely sub-par. The worst ref I ever saw was out in Ulster years ago - maybe 2013/14? Maybe earlier? Middle aged Scottish ref in one of his first games in the league - missed a few absolute howlers, and barely reffed again.

Whenever Irish teams are at home they get very good refereeing decisions. Not sure you can call it 50:50 with Welsh refs there. Nige is generally very fair, if slightly 'ideological' in his interpretations. Whitehouse isn't very good but he's no Clancy and who else is there this year? The little ginger one?

by marty2086 Wed 17 Apr - 16:54

Except the whole bias issue was shown years ago to be bunkum, the win rate for Irish team was less than 50% with Irish refs, as an Ulster fan there was the idea we never did well with Clancy and Lacey yet the stats showed the win rate to be higher with one of them than other Irish refs.

When it comes to 50/50 calls every fan will think their team is on the wrong end if it doesn't go their way, it was George Clancy who bought Niko Matawalus dive though in the semi final a few years ago which turned the game.

by Guest Wed 17 Apr - 17:12

Win rate doesn't mean the referee isn't favouring the Irish teams...

by geoff999rugby Wed 17 Apr - 17:40

Sub par I agree with

As for a bad Scottish referee you are making my point - they are forcing refs through who are worse than the Welsh or the Irish just to make sure there is some Scottish refs on the panel

If you take away the Northern Irish refs who ref under the SRU there has never been a Pro14 Scottish ref who has been remotely good enough

Whenever Irish teams are at home they get very good refereeing decisions. Not sure you can call it 50:50 with Welsh refs there.

Over the years we have had to put up with some truly awful Welsh referees - Nigel obviously an exception
So yes I would call it 50:50
The guy you are thinking of is Ian Davies

by LeinsterFan4life Wed 17 Apr - 17:44

Irish Londoner wrote:And as all the "PrO'14" threads have done we come around to the inevitable question "What do the Welsh want?"

Wales can't sustain a professional league of the standard of the PRO14 much less the Gallagher or Top14 internally so that's a non-starter.

The English don't want them, they dropped the AW cup and are moving towards ringfencing the Premiership and bringing in Welsh clubs ahead of any of the English side would cause mayhem.

I agree the "conference system" of the PRO14 as it stands is a bit confusing - I'd rather it became a formal two division competition with promotion/relegation between the two, might be possible when we get to a "PRO16" - two divisions of 8.

It seems that attendances in Wales are reasonably stable, the national team is doing great and there are games on FTA television, certainly a lot more than the Gallagher has, together with coverage of the regional league.

So what would improve things in Wales.

One thing that could improve the Welsh is if they actually talked about and supported their teams like any other fan instead of spouting tin hat conspiracies on how the Irish are purposefully keeping them down. I'd love to see actual match threads on here instead of "pro 14 is dead".

by mikey_dragon Wed 17 Apr - 19:05

tigertattie wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:This thread

It's even better in LD.

Low Definition?

by Pot Hale Wed 17 Apr - 20:01

mikey_dragon wrote:
tigertattie wrote:
Pot Hale wrote:
mikey_dragon wrote:This thread

It's even better in LD.

Low Definition?

I was leaving it open to multi-interpretation including that one. Smile

by marty2086 Wed 17 Apr - 20:32

miaow wrote:Win rate doesn't mean the referee isn't favouring the Irish teams...

So they favour them but not to the extent they win? Whats the point of favouring them then?

by geoff999rugby Wed 17 Apr - 20:42

What great favouritism - so effective, that the stats show it reduces the win ratio of the teams being favoured.
I repeat it is utter nonsense
What I do suspect we are seeing is referees who are having to referee games with one participant from their home nation;
they feel awkward and it clouds their judgement. This is as likely to be in favouring the other team in an attempt to appear not to be biased.

Again lets be clear about the root cause of the problem - Miteau apart the Italians and the Scots are not pulling their weight - that is unacceptable

What I do have some concern about is touch judges and TMO's
Ulster have been the victim of disgraceful decisions by Welsh Touch judges and Italian TMOs over the years
I am sure other teams can tell the same tale

by Guest Wed 17 Apr - 21:02

marty2086 wrote:
miaow wrote:Win rate doesn't mean the referee isn't favouring the Irish teams...

So they favour them but not to the extent they win? Whats the point of favouring them then?

In terms of Clancy, it's the difference between a job and unemployment... thumbsup

by Guest Wed 17 Apr - 21:04

You can 'logically' discuss this forever. Of course it doesn't make 'sense' when you look at through that lens. But the sense of bias and/or favouritism is there for a reason. It's not just the one-eyed zealots on boards like these. It's a consistent thing that's gone on for at least the last 6-7 years. It certainly didn't feel relevant around the end of the 00s, but since then, it's definitely there.

by marty2086 Wed 17 Apr - 21:09

It's not one eyed zealots but you can't explain why they are biased they just are? picard

by LeinsterFan4life Wed 17 Apr - 21:48

miaow wrote:You can 'logically' discuss this forever. Of course it doesn't make 'sense' when you look at through that lens. But the sense of bias and/or favouritism is there for a reason. It's not just the one-eyed zealots on boards like these. It's a consistent thing that's gone on for at least the last 6-7 years. It certainly didn't feel relevant around the end of the 00s, but since then, it's definitely there.

Yet the welsh continue to win with Irish refs on the pitch... How good must these welsh regions be to be beating teams with the ref biased against them.

by Guest Wed 17 Apr - 23:31

Very good. Were it not for the shocking referees the Dragons would be, oooh, I don't know...a good 2 points better off in the table?

by carpet baboon Thu 18 Apr - 8:16

It wasn't relevant when the regions were winning, now there not it's clearly an issue?
And poor refs ain't exclusive to the pro14. Go have a look at the match threads on the PRL games. Go to the forums of some of the French clubs. Everyone has an issue with refs.

by marty2086 Thu 18 Apr - 9:43

carpet baboon wrote:It wasn't relevant when the regions were winning, now there not it's clearly an issue?
And poor refs ain't exclusive to the pro14. Go have a look at the match threads on the PRL games. Go to the forums of some of the French clubs. Everyone has an issue with refs.

And that points been made but some posters don't grasp that but apparently the Pro14 is the only league with teams from different countries Erm

by **rodders** Thu 18 Apr - 13:35

LordDowlais wrote:Hi pie, I could not agree more with you. The thing is, outside of the Pro14 enthusiasts, the Pro14 is dead. Especially in Wales. The thing is, football is number one, and people will pay for SKY to watch it, they will not pay for both football and rugby.

What has this done ? Well, it's killed off any potential new fans. Anywhere outside of Newport, Llanelli, Swansea and Cardiff, the Pro14 is dead. But there are a lot of enthusiasts on here that will try and tell you different, Oracle, Risca, Phil, they are all talking nonsense.

LD can we please try and be a bit more respectful of other posters views, just because they differ from your own doesn't make them nonsense.

I know the Pro 14 is a polarizing topic, a bit like Brexit but please keep the debate civilized folks...

by LordDowlais Thu 18 Apr - 15:27

OK point taken, but can you please read through this thread and take note where members like Oracle and PotHale have bandied about insults towards me ?

Also, the members I have mentioned certainly do not respect my views, I will remember this warning, take it on board and bring up anything I feel that is disrespectful to me, and I expect it to be acted upon.

by **rodders** Thu 18 Apr - 16:39

LordDowlais wrote:OK point taken, but can you please read through this thread and take note where members like Oracle and PotHale have bandied about insults towards me ?

Also, the members I have mentioned certainly do not respect my views, I will remember this warning, take it on board and bring up anything I feel that is disrespectful to me, and I expect it to be acted upon.

I will. The same point applies to everyone.

by Guest Thu 18 Apr - 18:45

The Pro14 may well be dead: https://twitter.com/owenslot/status/1118918387751514112

I can't see CVC buying up a stake in the Pro14 simply to leave it as it is. A merger in the pipeline at some point down the road?

by Pot Hale Thu 18 Apr - 19:38

LordDowlais wrote:OK point taken, but can you please read through this thread and take note where members like Oracle and PotHale have bandied about insults towards me ?

Also, the members I have mentioned certainly do not respect my views, I will remember this warning, take it on board and bring up anything I feel that is disrespectful to me, and I expect it to be acted upon.

I haven’t bandied about insults towards you in this thread.

by geoff999rugby Thu 18 Apr - 19:42

Having scanned Pots post over the last couple weeks nothing there that could even remotely be described as insults

One very very mild rib take but that is it , so subtle most probably missed it

by Guest Thu 18 Apr - 19:59

LordDowlais wrote:OK point taken, but can you please read through this thread and take note where members like Oracle and PotHale have bandied about insults towards me ?

Also, the members I have mentioned certainly do not respect my views, I will remember this warning, take it on board and bring up anything I feel that is disrespectful to me, and I expect it to be acted upon.

Where was my insult? The joke about waiting for a carpet? Grow up!

Edit:

I’ve only posted twice on this thread so far - here’s the sum total of my comments:

“Tell me about it. I’ve been trying to buy a carpet for the last hour but the shop owner’s too busy tapping furiously at his computer with angry sounds coming from his mouth!”

and

“All I wanted was some shag pile Sad

“

Hardly insults or disrespectful, considering you’ve accused me of talking nonsense, called me a prat, etc.

by LordDowlais Fri 19 Apr - 7:43

I found it offensive, as you were obviously trying to score points on my behalf. You were taking the mickey out of me.

by geoff999rugby Fri 19 Apr - 8:31

LordDowlais wrote:I found it offensive, as you were obviously trying to score points on my behalf. You were taking the mickey out of me.

Found what offensive Headscratch

Neither of these guys posted anything that a reasonable persons could find offensive.
If you are such a sensitive soul maybe this forum is not for you

by LordDowlais Fri 19 Apr - 8:58

geoff999rugby wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:I found it offensive, as you were obviously trying to score points on my behalf. You were taking the mickey out of me.

Found what offensive

Neither of these guys posted anything that a reasonable persons could find offensive.
If you are such a sensitive soul maybe this forum is not for you

He was taking the mickey out of me.

Anyway, if that is the case, how is me saying that somebody is talking "nonsense" offensive ? Is the word nonsense an offensive word now ? Because that is what I have been red penned for.

Anyway, I will say no more on this, as it is derailing the topic.

by Guest Fri 19 Apr - 9:03

Constantly running down the league could be seen as offensive I guess. To those who follow it and have invested time, money, energy into it. Perhaps that’s why nearly every poster (but not all) seems at odds with you, LD.

by LordDowlais Fri 19 Apr - 9:07

The Oracle wrote:Constantly running down the league could be seen as offensive I guess. To those who follow it and have invested time, money, energy into it. Perhaps that’s why nearly every poster (but not all) seems at odds with you, LD.

Please tell me how I am running the league down ? In fact I can show you where I have said I like the Pro14. All I am doing is telling the truth, it is not going well in Wales, and putting it on pay per view TV has contributed to it not doing well.

That is not me running the league down. I am sorry if the truth offends you.

by marty2086 Fri 19 Apr - 9:29

LordDowlais wrote:
The Oracle wrote:Constantly running down the league could be seen as offensive I guess. To those who follow it and have invested time, money, energy into it. Perhaps that’s why nearly every poster (but not all) seems at odds with you, LD.

Please tell me how I am running the league down ? In fact I can show you where I have said I like the Pro14. All I am doing is telling the truth, it is not going well in Wales, and putting it on pay per view TV has contributed to it not doing well.

That is not me running the league down. I am sorry if the truth offends you.

So saying the league is dying yet providing nothing to back it up is truth?

It's very Trumpesque

by LordDowlais Fri 19 Apr - 9:31

marty2086 wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
The Oracle wrote:Constantly running down the league could be seen as offensive I guess. To those who follow it and have invested time, money, energy into it. Perhaps that’s why nearly every poster (but not all) seems at odds with you, LD.

Please tell me how I am running the league down ? In fact I can show you where I have said I like the Pro14. All I am doing is telling the truth, it is not going well in Wales, and putting it on pay per view TV has contributed to it not doing well.

That is not me running the league down. I am sorry if the truth offends you.

So saying the league is dying yet providing nothing to back it up is truth?

It's very Trumpesque

I posted a link and an article from the national media source in Wales agreeing with what I am saying, yet you think that journalist is lying, so I do not know how much more proof I can provide without you saying it's somebody telling lies. Rolling Eyes

by marty2086 Fri 19 Apr - 9:33

miaow wrote:The Pro14 may well be dead: https://twitter.com/owenslot/status/1118918387751514112

I can't see CVC buying up a stake in the Pro14 simply to leave it as it is. A merger in the pipeline at some point down the road?

You mean like all the changes they introduced to Formula 1? Or the changes they made to the Premiership?

by marty2086 Fri 19 Apr - 9:35

LordDowlais wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
The Oracle wrote:Constantly running down the league could be seen as offensive I guess. To those who follow it and have invested time, money, energy into it. Perhaps that’s why nearly every poster (but not all) seems at odds with you, LD.

Please tell me how I am running the league down ? In fact I can show you where I have said I like the Pro14. All I am doing is telling the truth, it is not going well in Wales, and putting it on pay per view TV has contributed to it not doing well.

That is not me running the league down. I am sorry if the truth offends you.

So saying the league is dying yet providing nothing to back it up is truth?

It's very Trumpesque

I posted a link and an article from the national media source in Wales agreeing with what I am saying, yet you think that journalist is lying, so I do not know how much more proof I can provide without you saying it's somebody telling lies.

Someone telling a story isn't proof it's dying, it's just proof of what Oracle is saying about you running the league down

You don't know what proof you can provide of the league dying? I wonder what would prove it? I mean it's not like there are numerous metrics that would show that less people are watching games in different forms or anything like that Rolling Eyes

by carpet baboon Fri 19 Apr - 9:35

LordDowlais wrote:
The Oracle wrote:Constantly running down the league could be seen as offensive I guess. To those who follow it and have invested time, money, energy into it. Perhaps that’s why nearly every poster (but not all) seems at odds with you, LD.

Please tell me how I am running the league down ? In fact I can show you where I have said I like the Pro14. All I am doing is telling the truth, it is not going well in Wales, and putting it on pay per view TV has contributed to it not doing well.

That is not me running the league down. I am sorry if the truth offends you.

Every topic you start is some WOL hit job on the league, with some spurious anecdotal evidence, that is rebuffed by other Welsh supporters on this forum.
It's not the truth your telling LD, it's your own opinion that you believe to be truth, and when others disagree your very quick to whip out the victim card, and play all offended.
It's a little tiresome after all these years.

by LordDowlais Fri 19 Apr - 9:39

carpet baboon wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
The Oracle wrote:Constantly running down the league could be seen as offensive I guess. To those who follow it and have invested time, money, energy into it. Perhaps that’s why nearly every poster (but not all) seems at odds with you, LD.

Please tell me how I am running the league down ? In fact I can show you where I have said I like the Pro14. All I am doing is telling the truth, it is not going well in Wales, and putting it on pay per view TV has contributed to it not doing well.

That is not me running the league down. I am sorry if the truth offends you.

Every topic you start is some WOL hit job on the league, with some spurious anecdotal evidence, that is rebuffed by other Welsh supporters on this forum.
It's not the truth your telling LD, it's your own opinion that you believe to be truth, and when others disagree your very quick to whip out the victim card, and play all offended.
It's a little tiresome after all these years.

You are talking as if I am alone in my views......

Just because it does not fit your narrative it does not mean I am wrong either, very strange it's my opinion of the truth, when I am also being agreed with the national media here in Wales.

I get called all sorts of names and insults on this forum, yet that is OK, I need to stop playing the victim, oh well.

by LordDowlais Fri 19 Apr - 9:41

marty2086 wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
The Oracle wrote:Constantly running down the league could be seen as offensive I guess. To those who follow it and have invested time, money, energy into it. Perhaps that’s why nearly every poster (but not all) seems at odds with you, LD.

Please tell me how I am running the league down ? In fact I can show you where I have said I like the Pro14. All I am doing is telling the truth, it is not going well in Wales, and putting it on pay per view TV has contributed to it not doing well.

That is not me running the league down. I am sorry if the truth offends you.

So saying the league is dying yet providing nothing to back it up is truth?

It's very Trumpesque

I posted a link and an article from the national media source in Wales agreeing with what I am saying, yet you think that journalist is lying, so I do not know how much more proof I can provide without you saying it's somebody telling lies.

Someone telling a story isn't proof it's dying, it's just proof of what Oracle is saying about you running the league down

You don't know what proof you can provide of the league dying? I wonder what would prove it? I mean it's not like there are numerous metrics that would show that less people are watching games in different forms or anything like that

Premier Sports do not show their viewing figures for the Pro14, I have looked. I wonder why ?

by marty2086 Fri 19 Apr - 9:49

LordDowlais wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
marty2086 wrote:
LordDowlais wrote:
The Oracle wrote:Constantly running down the league could be seen as offensive I guess. To those who follow it and have invested time, money, energy into it. Perhaps that’s why nearly every poster (but not all) seems at odds with you, LD.

Please tell me how I am running the league down ? In fact I can show you where I have said I like the Pro14. All I am doing is telling the truth, it is not going well in Wales, and putting it on pay per view TV has contributed to it not doing well.

That is not me running the league down. I am sorry if the truth offends you.

So saying the league is dying yet providing nothing to back it up is truth?

It's very Trumpesque

I posted a link and an article from the national media source in Wales agreeing with what I am saying, yet you think that journalist is lying, so I do not know how much more proof I can provide without you saying it's somebody telling lies.

Someone telling a story isn't proof it's dying, it's just proof of what Oracle is saying about you running the league down

You don't know what proof you can provide of the league dying? I wonder what would prove it? I mean it's not like there are numerous metrics that would show that less people are watching games in different forms or anything like that

Premier Sports do not show their viewing figures for the Pro14, I have looked. I wonder why ?

Why is it then?

by Sponsored content